Carsley to return

[Slash/ED]

Carsley willing to return (http://www.eleven-a-side.com/worldcup2006/irish_soccer_detail.asp?newsid=13625)

September 19, 2004

Lee Carsley’s is willing to return to the international fold having told Brian Kerr that he could no longer play for Ireland just twelve months ago.

The Everton man told Kerr that he was retiring from international football to concentrate on his career with the Premiership club. The former Derby and Blackburn player was only a bit part player at Goodison Park at the time but he has reinvented himself on Merseyside and has started every game this season under David Moyes.

His good form has seen some commentators call for him to return to the international scene and the midfielder has admitted that he would don the green jersey once more if he was required.

“”If Brian Kerr rang tomorrow I’d be available, of course I would,” Carsley told the Star on Sunday.

“I never ruled out coming back to play for Ireland, definitely not.

“I haven’t spoken to Brian for a while but he knew that I needed a break from the Irish scene.

“I have always said that one the highlights of my career was playing for Ireland in the World Cup finals, even if it was just for a few minutes.

“I’d never rule out getting that chance again.”

He's a decent enough player I suppose and is always good cover at the very least, it's always a good thing to have more permiership regulars available espically in central mid field where we were stretched with injuries before.

[Donal81]

I don't know what's in the water at Everton as Carsley has never played well for us. Indeed, he has played terribly whenever he plays for us. He is cover, true, but I don't like the manner in which he can just leave the Irish team. This talk about "needing a break from the Irish scene" is infuriating, you either want to play for us or you don't, it's not as if international football is that great of a burden. I don't want to see him back, to be quite honest.

[drummerboy]

Andy Reid has had a bust up with Joe Kinnear and didn't play at the weekend. He's been told he will have to play in the reserves until January transfer window opens again. With this in mind, and the fact that Miller still seems to be injured, I think Carsley could do a job on the right side of midfield against France. Certainly a short term stopgap solution, but certainly one worth considering. The other options are Finnan who may be needed at full back and Delap, who seems to be losing interest in the Irish team.

[stickyjoe]

carsley might not be the greatest player in the world, but he gets a hell of a lot of unfair and very personal criticism.
he was slaughtered by the crowd in the match against albania last year who all wanted steven reid to come on. and reid was even worse when he came on for the 2nd half but he didn`t get half the stick that carsley got.
anyhow we have enough players that can do a job in there at the moment like keane,kavanagh,kilbane,delap,miller and holland when fit.

[eirebhoy]

This talk about "needing a break from the Irish scene" is infuriating, you either want to play for us or you don't, it's not as if international football is that great of a burden. I don't want to see him back, to be quite honest.
His break didn't do him bad since he's started every game this season.

drummerboy - All Reid has to do is apologise (properly) and he'll be back in the team. Kinnearr knows he won't get much for a player who has been playing reserve football for 4 months.

[Donal81]

carsley might not be the greatest player in the world, but he gets a hell of a lot of unfair and very personal criticism.
he was slaughtered by the crowd in the match against albania last year who all wanted steven reid to come on. and reid was even worse when he came on for the 2nd half but he didn`t get half the stick that carsley got.
anyhow we have enough players that can do a job in there at the moment like keane,kavanagh,kilbane,delap,miller and holland when fit.

You're right in that some of the criticism you hear from fans may be over the top but I don't remember reading anything unfair in the media. If there was anything personal about it, I don't remember it either. Carsley has never performed for us and showed that the Irish team is expendable for him. I'm sure he's a nice bloke and all that but I don't think he deserves a call up. I still think that Kerr's worst decision yet was starting Carsley against Georgia. The man was brutal and seemed to be clueless as to what he was doing there. Calling him up would be a step backwards towards the McCarthy era, it really would. I can see no reason whatsoever for his inclusion. While we need a strong midfield and aren't exactly full of options, we have enough. He's not needed, he doesn't contribute and he clearly isn't that pushed on the team. Leave him where he wants to be - Everton.

[tiktok]

....but I don't like the manner in which he can just leave the Irish team.....you either want to play for us or you don't....

There are times when other aspects of your life have to take priority, It's only a bloody game at the end of the day.
If Lee and Brian Kerr happy enough that he feels he can come back now, I'd be happy to see him in the squad. He's a good player and offers good right side and central cover.

[Peadar]

There are times when other aspects of your life have to take priority, It's only a bloody game at the end of the day.

That's very true and his decision is vindicated by the improvement in his play at club level. I'd prefer a player take a break from international football than burn himself out and drop down the divisions. I like his attitude and would accept the managers decision if he asked him back.

[tiktok]

That's very true and his decision is vindicated by the improvement in his play at club level.

He stepped back at the time to concentrate on club but also to spend more time with his family, it's actually the latter I was referring to :o , having said that, you're spot on Peadar. ;)

[Peadar]

He stepped back at the time to concentrate on club but also to spend more time with his family


I'm always a bit suspicious when I read stuff like that.
Players typically train twice a day and for people like Carsley who aren't often involved European competition and club level they surely get to see their family more than the rest of us.

[Donal81]

Firstly, it's yet to be explained to me how playing for your country is such a drain on your resources. The bloke played in the World Cup, for God's sake, and if that's too much of a burden for him, he can sod off. Exactly how making the trip to Ireland about 6 times a year, one hour on a plane, to play football for less than 2 hours is so consuming is beyond me. He trains and plays matches with the Irish team when he would be doing the same thing with the Everton team so I don't buy that and I never have. As regards to seeing his family more...I don't know the man and I don't know his personal life but if the life of a footballer - a few training sessions a week, two matches a week at most - doesn't give him enough time then I don't know what profession would. When my sister returned home recently having spent a year and a half in Australia, I wasn't able to have a proper conversation with her because of a workload I had at the time which required 9am-9pm for a fortnight. Every working person has weeks like that, I'm just agreeing with Peadar here. I genuinely had no time to see my family due to work. I can't see how Carsley couldn't find the time between training sessions and matches. If it was that bad, maybe he could fly his family over to Ireland for the matches, I'm sure it wouldn't make a dent on his weekly wages. Sorry if that sounds harsh but the plea of the burdened footballer has never rested well with me. I know it's only a game, and maybe I'm old fashioned, but I love football and would give anything to play for Ireland. I don't like players messing with that. Like Tom Humphries wrote a long time ago, the old phrase used to go how we'd walk over hot coals to play for Ireland but that's not true anymore and Carsley is an example of it. Fair play to him at Everton for getting his place back but I don't think he deserves a call-up.

[eirebhoy]

Firstly, we knew all along that Carsley was coming back as he said he just wanted a short break to concentrate on getting back into the Everton team. He never retired from international football so I don't see your problem.


He trains and plays matches with the Irish team when he would be doing the same thing with the Everton team so I don't buy that and I never have.
Maybe his training session's with Everton while the other international's were away has helped him get into the team. Maybe the extra time spent with Everton and commitment to get into the team has made Moyes give him the chance. If he didn't concentrate so much on getting his form back at Everton he could be playing in the same league as Mark Kinsella at this moment in time.

[Donal81]

To be honest Eirebhoy, if you don't see my problem then you didn't read my post. I don't like the manner in which he decided he could just take a break from it. Other players can balance international and domestic football, why should we make an allowance for someone who clearly isn't that motivated to play for us?

[eirebhoy]

To be honest Eirebhoy, if you don't see my problem then you didn't read my post. I don't like the manner in which he decided he could just take a break from it. Other players can balance international and domestic football, why should we make an allowance for someone who clearly isn't that motivated to play for us?
Of course I read your post.

What "manner" is that your talking about? He asked Kerr, just like Roy asked him could he skip those 3 friendlies. He didn't tell him, he didn't presume Kerr would allow him outright.

As I said, if he didn't concentrate 100% on his club career his international career could already have been over so he did the right thing and nothing suggests he wasn't motivated enough to play for us.

[Donal81]

Of course I read your post.

What "manner" is that your talking about? He asked Kerr, just like Roy asked him could he skip those 3 friendlies. He didn't tell him, he didn't presume Kerr would allow him outright.

As I said, if he didn't concentrate 100% on his club career his international career could already have been over so he did the right thing and nothing suggests he wasn't motivated enough to play for us.

Sorry for being flippant, Eirebhoy, no offence intended, it's just a topic that bugs me a hell of a lot. Skipping friendlies is one thing, retiring indefinitely from the Irish team is quite another. I'm not saying the Irish team should have some mafiosi kind of loyalty and exceptions can and have been made - Keane, McGrath - but it just seems that the Irish team was expendable. When you compare his situation to that of Keane and McGrath, two wonderfully gifted players who were at stages of their careers where they simply had to choose what games they could play compared to a workman player, never troubled with a European schedule or serious, career-threatening injury, it doesn't add up. He has had a knee injury but never anything of the sort of Keane's hip problems or McGrath's legendary knee problems. Again, sorry for the flippant remark.

[eirebhoy]

Quote by Kerr in March/April:

"I spoke to Lee before and after the Czech match and he asked not to be selected until he has re-established himself in the Everton team and I have agreed to that request."

Nobody said then that he shouldn't be allowed back then so what has changed?

[Donal81]

Quote by Kerr in March/April:

"I spoke to Lee before and after the Czech match and he asked not to be selected until he has re-established himself in the Everton team and I have agreed to that request."

Nobody said then that he shouldn't be allowed back then so what has changed?

I suppose most of us thought he was more or less retiring. I'm not saying he shouldn't be allowed back. I just don't particularly want him back. If Kerr wants to pick him, I'm sure he won't be consulting me for my opinion on the matter but I would prefer to move on, I don't think he's a loss. I suppose I just don't like this fairly recent phenomemon of international football losing status and being replaced by the dometic clubs around Europe and footballers not taking international football as seriously as they used to.

[TheJamaicanP.M.]

You're right in that some of the criticism you hear from fans may be over the top but I don't remember reading anything unfair in the media. If there was anything personal about it, I don't remember it either. Carsley has never performed for us and showed that the Irish team is expendable for him. I'm sure he's a nice bloke and all that but I don't think he deserves a call up. I still think that Kerr's worst decision yet was starting Carsley against Georgia. The man was brutal and seemed to be clueless as to what he was doing there. Calling him up would be a step backwards towards the McCarthy era, it really would. I can see no reason whatsoever for his inclusion. While we need a strong midfield and aren't exactly full of options, we have enough. He's not needed, he doesn't contribute and he clearly isn't that pushed on the team. Leave him where he wants to be - Everton.

You obviously don't read many newspapers Donal. Carsley has been taking very personal abuse for the past few years. Roy Curtis in the Sunday World regularly referred to him as the donkey who was keeping Liam Miller out of international football. Eveyone knows that world revolves around Cork for Curtis. Even Kerr expressed his disgust at the way Carsley was being treated by the media.
As for Carsley's commitment to Ireland, few have given more time to the Irish cause in recent years. Carsley turned up for all twelve games in the 2002 qualifiers. All he got was a mere 20 minutes against Cyprus in the final group game. Meanwhile, another Irish midfielder with much more talent found it too hard to turn up for international games because he felt he had a right to spend international weeks with his family. If anyone knew anything about Lee Carsley they would know that he has a more difficult family life than any of his Irish team mates.
I'm not sure Carsley's return is a good thing for this Irish team. I'm not a major fan of his footballing ability. However, his commitment can't be doubted. The reason he left the Irish squad earlier this year was because he felt he didn't deserve his place.
A lot of people are talking a lot of nonsense on this site.

[Donal81]

Reading newspapers is part of my job so I read several a day, actually. If some clown in the Sunday World mouths off like that, it wouldn't surprise me as it's a pathetic newspaper that people shouldn't read if they want decent coverage. If Kerr or Carsley are surprised at a tabloid being sensationalist and unfair, I don't know what planet they're living on. I think that stuff is scum but it is unfortunately scum that comes with the territory and is better left ignored. Compared to what they would receive if they played for or managed England, it's small potatoes. Before he left the team, I wouldn't have doubted his commitment but that doesn't mean he deserves a medal for travelling around the world with the Irish team nor does it mean he deserves his place in the team. Being part of a squad and not regularly getting your game is what football is about. This is part of football, from playing under-9s in Tymon Park to playing in the World Cup. If you want to be part of that team, you dig in and wait for your chance. This is football and I don't see why this is always brought up in Carsley's defence. The Keane comparison doesn't really come into it, to be honest, it's a different kettle of fish. Look, I've no huge beef with the bloke and you won't find me calling him a donkey keeping anyone out of the Irish team but I've made it clear what I don't like about this.

[TheJamaicanP.M.]

Fair enough Donal but you stated that you were unaware of any abuse from the media. The tabloids, regardless of what they are, do constitute the media. It must have been difficult for Lee Carsley and his family to read sh!t that got very personal. A lot of the rubbish that was written came after Carsley gave away a penalty against Turkey in the play-offs. Ignoring what the tabloids say is easier said than done. As for Carsley's willingness to travel to all Ireland games as a squad member, there are others who refused to do so. Dean Kiely never took any abuse in the Irish media for his retirement. We keep forgetting that Carsley's decision was made as he felt it was best for himself and best for the team. Sometimes, he is an easy target for the hacks in the tabloids and the broadsheets I might add.

[Donal81]

Fair enough Donal but you stated that you were unaware of any abuse from the media. The tabloids, regardless of what they are, do constitute the media. It must have been difficult for Lee Carsley and his family to read sh!t that got very personal. A lot of the rubbish that was written came after Carsley gave away a penalty against Turkey in the play-offs. Ignoring what the tabloids say is easier said than done. As for Carsley's willingness to travel to all Ireland games as a squad member, there are others who refused to do so. Dean Kiely never took any abuse in the Irish media for his retirement. We keep forgetting that Carsley's decision was made as he felt it was best for himself and best for the team. Sometimes, he is an easy target for the hacks in the tabloids and the broadsheets I might add.

I was unaware of anything that harsh, true, because I don't read rags and expect footballers to get a fair deal in them. I don't think the broadsheets have been too unfair and anything I've ever read about him in the Indo, the Irish Times or the Examiner is always related to his performance. In fairness, the bloke has never performed well for Ireland and, at times, has been terrible. I don't see how this makes him an easy target, more of a regular target as a result of regular poor performances. Like I said before, I don't like the way in which Ireland can appear expendable and people put forward the fact that he travelled with the team without getting a kick as some sort of credit to him and defence for him. Anyone on this forum would give anything just to sit on that bench and, again, that's football. You dig in or you don't. To be honest, Jamaican PM, I think we're going to have to agree to disagree, much as it pains me!