Letter appears to undermine FAI claims regarding integrity of process

[A face]

Soccer Licensing Committee

A Letter from the FAI’s chief executive, John Delaney, and its president, Paddy McCaul, addressed to Independent Licensing Committee chairman Derek Dee in which they suggest the committee should have attached conditions to the granting of Limerick’s licence to participate in the league this year appears to severely undermine the association’s repeated claims regarding the integrity of a process it has always steadfastly insisted it did not interfere with.

In the letter, dated March 20th of this year, which has been seen by The Irish Times, the contribution made by the licensing committee through its work is acknowledged and its independence hailed as a virtue before reference is made to the fact its decisions “have to be managed ultimately by the board on an ongoing basis”. In the case of Limerick, it suggests, this has been made more difficult by the failure of the committee to require the club’s chairman and owner, Pat O’Sullivan, to lodge 50 per cent of his funding for the current season in a non-recourse back account prior to the start of the campaign as it had in 2011.


Read more at www.irishtimes.com (http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2012/0928/1224324534441.html)

[Mr A]

From a report in the Irish Times (http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2012/0928/1224324534441.html)


In the letter, dated March 20th of this year, which has been seen by The Irish Times, the contribution made by the licensing committee through its work is acknowledged and its independence hailed as a virtue before reference is made to the fact its decisions “have to be managed ultimately by the board on an ongoing basis”.

In the case of Limerick, it suggests, this has been made more difficult by the failure of the committee to require the club’s chairman and owner, Pat O’Sullivan, to lodge 50 per cent of his funding for the current season in a non-recourse back account prior to the start of the campaign as it had in 2011.

The letter alleges a number of previous threats by O’Sullivan to withdraw his support for the club and take a legal action against the association’s bank and says Delaney and McCaul “believe that information on both of these issues may not have been presented sufficiently strongly at the decision meeting in February”.

It goes on to suggest the decision not to reapply the sanction: “causes the association some difficulty as there is concern among the board that, given the history of Mr O’Sullivan’s relationship with the association, there is a real and continuing risk that he may follow through on his threat to withdraw support from the club mid-season”.

This, it is pointed out, would likely to lead to the club’s collapse “resulting in major embarrassment and calling in to question of the league, the licensing process and ultimately the association. “The board,” the letter concludes, “would like the committee to take this into account when dealing with Limerick FC in future”.

Nothing really surprising in there in fairness, apart maybe from the alleged threats by O'Sullivan to withdraw, which I'd never heard of before.

[Dodge]

Makes sense. Don't think any of us really though the process was independent

Interesting to see the FAI so pointed about O'Sullivan (and the legal threats)

[A face]

How much is Delaney on now? He took a wage cut alright didn't he but how much is he on now?

[Mr A]

I think it's around the 400k mark. Not sure what relevance his wages are in this context though?

[Dodge]

I think it went from 400k to €360k

[ped_ped]

I think that's completely reasonable.

It does undermine the independence of the process, but in fairness the FAI have an agenda - and the aspect of the agenda that this point seems to be backing up is fairly just, if it's taken at face value. I also think that, while it undermines the independence somewhat, it doesn't entirely remove the independence of the process.

If the FAI themselves are adjudging who fulfils criteria and who doesn't, it's not independent. If they're presenting the independent committee with said criteria, it's still being judged independently.

[Jofspring]

A little surprised at first hear about the alleged threats to pull out by o Sullivan but I wouldn't hold it againat him after the carry on of the FAI. The fact the FAI have interfered in the licensing proccess in our case shows it is not being or at least wasn't being independently run. I'd like to see if the FAI sent anymore letters re: Tralee dynamos and how they would "bring down the standard of the league".

[Longfordian]

Wonder how the letter got out? Been a lot of redundancies in the FAI of late I guess it could be a disgruntled ex employee.

[Dodge]

I was thinking more Limerick lining themselves up for a 2013 premier licence bid

[Longfordian]

They don't appear to have been aware of the letter until contacted by Emmet Malone though.

[Dodge]

I could be way too cynical...

[NeverFeltBetter]

Limerick might have some difficulty with a license application if the Market's Field isn't ready, but I assumed there were plans to avoid such difficulties (ground share, astroturf, etc)? Other than that, is their any problem with a potential Limerick application for a top tier license?

Anyway, yeah, this is just another example of the lack of independence of any licensing committee, right? The FAI clearly has some influence over the process, this is just more confirmation.

[centre mid]

The licencing process has always been flawed & to my mind pretty much a sham. If one club got into trouble then it calls into question the validity of the process but when a number of clubs go out of existence then its about as bent as a €2 note.

It does shed some light on how Delaney runs the FAI though.

[Mr A]

In terms of licensing, we knew the rules can vary according to the situation. Witness the radically different treatment of Derry and Galway when they went under and tried to come back- both were technically too late, but one got in.

[geezer]

If they need you your in, if they want to put manners on you they will, and if they want you out your out, its as simple as. Transparency, integrity and honesty dont matter a jot

[Lim till i die]

Vindication for the FAI's stance could still come.

Three weeks left for Pat O'Sullivan to withdraw funding and initiate legal action.







http://forum.football365.com/images/smilies/spaz.gif

[geezer]

Vindication for the FAI's stance could still come.

Three weeks left for Pat O'Sullivan to withdraw funding and initiate legal action.









http://forum.football365.com/images/smilies/spaz.gif


we need a Limerick side in the top flite of football, the sooner the better.

[thomas72]

Limerick will be playing in thomond park next season the markets field hasn't even been touched so far pitch not even started.

[Spudulika]

Much ado about nothing, I'd have thought. POS would have been within his rights to just walk away after the whole friendly mess, but I would believe he's enough of a club supporter to make sure the club survived. No country has completely independent licencing, there is always influence from the top table.

[Ezeikial]

I am astounded by this report as it indicates that the Licensing Body actually has some degree of independence from the FAI.

[adamd164]

Limerick clearly should not (and you would assume, will not) obtain a PD license while playing in Jackman Park. How much work is actually needed on Markets Field to enable games to be played there? Surely 6 months is time enough to lay a pitch there anyway?

And if money can be pumped into the wages of players like Joe Gamble then why has nothing seemingly been pumped into the Markets Field renovations? I expect if Limerick go up they'll be after another few big earners too.

[Mr A]

Erm- they bought the Market Field, that counts as a lot of investment in itself. Progress has been slow but that's the way with such things in Ireland. Even simple things can take an age.

And traditionally clubs have been given a year on promotion to get their grounds up to standard. That said, Jackman has particular issues such as one small entrance so maybe such a derogation won't be granted in this case..

[bluewhitearmy]

Limerick will be playing in thomond park next season the markets field hasn't even been touched so far pitch not even started.

You have just decided this yourself there has been no word from the club on it and they have plenty of time to get it done....An artificial pitch would take a month to get done in there.


Limerick clearly should not (and you would assume, will not) obtain a PD license while playing in Jackman Park. How much work is actually needed on Markets Field to enable games to be played there? Surely 6 months is time enough to lay a pitch there anyway?

And if money can be pumped into the wages of players like Joe Gamble then why has nothing seemingly been pumped into the Markets Field renovations? I expect if Limerick go up they'll be after another few big earners too.

Because no matter how much money we give Joe Gamble unfortunately he cant get around having to get planning permission and other such red tape. It will start as soon as we possible can i would imagine.


Erm- they bought the Market Field, that counts as a lot of investment in itself. Progress has been slow but that's the way with such things in Ireland. Even simple things can take an age.

And traditionally clubs have been given a year on promotion to get their grounds up to standard. That said, Jackman has particular issues such as one small entrance so maybe such a derogation won't be granted in this case..

That could actually be sorted by the time next season starts as the derelict flats next to the ground are scheduled to be knocked so could put another entrance there if that went ahead. Cant see us getting any favours from FAI with a licence though.

[nigel-harps1954]

Well, even if Jackman was used in application for next season, surely they wouldn't be allowed the grass banks on the side of the pitch in the Premier Division?

Couldn't they build some sort of steps up the back of that anyway and have an entrance at opposite sides of the ground altogether?

[LFC-Zulu]

Well, even if Jackman was used in application for next season, surely they wouldn't be allowed the grass banks on the side of the pitch in the Premier Division?

Couldn't they build some sort of steps up the back of that anyway and have an entrance at opposite sides of the ground altogether?
We can't actually do anything with Jackman. It's the property of the LDMC.

[nigel-harps1954]

Well, with permission obviously.

[Charlie Darwin]

Because no matter how much money we give Joe Gamble unfortunately he cant get around having to get planning permission and other such red tape.
I'm sick of these lazy prima donna footballers.

[NeverFeltBetter]

In regards an entrance on the grassy hill, the back of that is the train/bus station.

[punkrocket]

Sure isn't that what all the best stadia in the world have, direct links with transport infrastructure on their doorstep.

[NeverFeltBetter]

Well, it wouldn't be so much a "link", as a "doorway into the actual bus station". Not really something CIE would approve of.

[SkStu]

Sure isn't that what all the best stadia in the world have, direct links with transport infrastructure on their doorstep.

The fact that there is no direct bus from Tallaght to Phibsboro has been well covered on here before.

[marinobohs]

Much ado about nothing, I'd have thought. POS would have been within his rights to just walk away after the whole friendly mess, but I would believe he's enough of a club supporter to make sure the club survived. No country has completely independent licencing, there is always influence from the top table.

Fully agree. The FAI should bring any concerns they may have to the attention of the licencing committee (it is their remit to manage the league). of course, ideally they should bring it up BEFORE decisions are made not after :rolleyes: but this is Ireland.

Perhaps they wrote last week expressing a slight concern about Monaghan ................

[hotspur]

Erm- they bought the Market Field, that counts as a lot of investment in itself. Progress has been slow but that's the way with such things in Ireland. Even simple things can take an age.

And traditionally clubs have been given a year on promotion to get their grounds up to standard. That said, Jackman has particular issues such as one small entrance so maybe such a derogation won't be granted in this case..

Erm- Limerick FC did not buy the Market's Field,