Brian McDermott

[Chicago AOH]

A couple of interesting articles with reference to his Irish heritage, and his regrets over not representing Ireland. Hints that he wants to be future coach of the National team.

http://www.readingfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10306~2322120,00.html

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2132304/Brian-McDermott-interview-Readings-manager-talks-34-years-football.html#comments

[tricky_colour]

I was just looking at his background, fairly similar to me.
You don't realise you are Irish so much at school because there are a lot of kids from similar
backgrounds, it's only when you leave school you become aware you are Irish when you meet so
many people who are English and have a slightly different culture.

[elroy]

‘I played for England at 17 in a youth tournament but I didn’t really know what I felt. I know now, and it is that one day I would like to make amends for that. My parents are Irish, my grandparents are Irish, my great-grandparents are Irish. I was born in England; my blood is Irish. That’s how I feel. All our street in Slough was Irish.’
By ‘making amends’ McDermott means managing the Republic of Ireland, though not just yet — ‘I’ve got to do my time in club football.’ This is his second full season as Reading manager.


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2132304/Brian-McDermott-interview-Readings-manager-talks-34-years-football.html#ixzz1sngR09ti



Incredible quotes there. Seems like a very nice lad and at a great club, would love to see them do well this year and sign up a few more Irish as well.

[Stuttgart88]

As a kid following Arsenal I remember talk of him being the next big thing but I never heard of him after that. When he came to prominence at Reading I guessed it was the same guy but I wasn't sure until I read Chicago's post above.

Good luck to the man.

[gastric]

The rumour mill has started about Reading's buys for next season. The People reported yesterday that McDermott wants to buy Doyle and Stephen Hunt. While I acknowledge it is probably only gossip, Doyle I can understand, but Hunt seems to be past his best.

[Charlie Darwin]

Hunt's best two seasons were the two before this and this year he's been plagued by injury. To say he's past his best is insane.

[paul_oshea]

I haven't read this article, but read one about 2 months ago in the evening standard/metro....anyway ya he mentioned his father dying young and how if effected him badly especially not being playing for Ireland which he believed his father really wished for but didnt mention because he thought it would further his career playing with England. I got emotional reading that on the Tube!!

[tricky_colour]

He is certainly a great candidate for the Ireland job sometime in the future.
It will be interesting to see how he gets on in the Premiership next season.

[elroy]

Did playing for England at youth level rule him out of playing for Ireland back then?

[DannyInvincible]

Did playing for England at youth level rule him out of playing for Ireland back then?

It would have, yes. It was only in 2004 that FIFA introduced an allowance for players in possession of more than one nationality, but previously tied to an association, to switch once between associations for whom they were eligible before the age of 21. The age-cap of 21 was lifted altogether in 2009.

[theworm2345]

It would have, yes. It was only in 2004 that FIFA introduced an allowance for players in possession of more than one nationality, but previously tied to an association, to switch once between associations for whom they were eligible before the age of 21. The age-cap of 21 was lifted altogether in 2009.
Yep, I believe Tim Cahill's case either drove that decision or he was one of the first to switch. Had it happened a few years earlier there's a good chance he would've played for Ireland.

[Olé Olé]

I remember reading an article with Cahill stating that as a 14 or 15 year-old he played in an under 20 matches for Samoa because the games were held in Samoa meaning he could travel to visit his grandmother, whom he had not seen in quite a while or was sick. He never envisaged that it would rule him out of playing international football for another country he was eligible for i.e. Ireland, Australia or England.

But when that issue was resolved an the door was open to claim for Ireland, I'm wondering why he neglected to do so and instead claimed for Australia. It could well be that Mick McCarthy, a former Millwall player, was the Irish manager around 2002 when Cahill initially stated a desire to play for Ireland and by the time the rules had changed McCarthy was manager of Sunderland.

[SkStu]

It would have, yes. It was only in 2004 that FIFA introduced an allowance for players in possession of more than one nationality, but previously tied to an association, to switch once between associations for whom they were eligible before the age of 21. The age-cap of 21 was lifted altogether in 2009.

The Good Friday Agreement changed all that, right?

[Irwin3]

I remember reading an article with Cahill stating that as a 14 or 15 year-old he played in an under 20 matches for Samoa because the games were held in Samoa meaning he could travel to visit his grandmother, whom he had not seen in quite a while or was sick. He never envisaged that it would rule him out of playing international football for another country he was eligible for i.e. Ireland, Australia or England.

But when that issue was resolved an the door was open to claim for Ireland, I'm wondering why he neglected to do so and instead claimed for Australia. It could well be that Mick McCarthy, a former Millwall player, was the Irish manager around 2002 when Cahill initially stated a desire to play for Ireland and by the time the rules had changed McCarthy was manager of Sunderland.

2004 Olympics probably helped.

[DannyInvincible]

But when that issue was resolved an the door was open to claim for Ireland, I'm wondering why he neglected to do so and instead claimed for Australia. It could well be that Mick McCarthy, a former Millwall player, was the Irish manager around 2002 when Cahill initially stated a desire to play for Ireland and by the time the rules had changed McCarthy was manager of Sunderland.

Think about something else we did during the summer of 2002 and haven't had any luck with since. ;)

[Olé Olé]

Think about something else we did during the summer of 2002 and haven't had any luck with since. ;)

We did have a slight bit of luck with it, sure Roy came back to play under Kerr in 2004!

But seriously, in 2004 we would have been looking forward to World Cup qualification having not qualified for the Euro's. It wasn't to be anyway. Cahill might never have been to Ireland and his connection with Ireland was surely diluted by his father having been born in England and Cahill subsequently being born in Australia (and to a Samoan mother). Still though, he could have been quite a player for us but at least we got Steven Reid from that Millwall team!

[DannyInvincible]

Probably saw a better chance of playing in World Cups regularly with Australia. Sure enough, he's played in both of them since 2002; neither of which we qualified for.

Also, 'Cay-hill' or 'Cah-hill'?

[bennocelt]

Also, 'Cay-hill' or 'Cah-hill'?

How does he pronounce his own name? - curious

[DannyInvincible]

How does he pronounce his own name? - curious

I tweeted him that once but he never got back to me. I assume the Australian accent makes it sound like "Cay-hill" to English listeners previously unaware of the surname and its Irish origin, or does Gary Cahill refer to himself as a "Cay-hill" too?

[Charlie Darwin]

I think he does say it Cay-hill. I've always wondered about Gary Cahill though.

[gastric]

I can confirm it is pronounced Cay-hill over here. The Australians ability to bugger up Irish names is amazing. For example, Mahoney is Ma- hooney and Leahy is Lay. Ignorant people!

[Charlie Darwin]

I always laugh at the yank's pronunciation of Mahoney - phonetically translates as My-arsey.

[tetsujin1979]

I can confirm it is pronounced Cay-hill over here. The Australians ability to bugger up Irish names is amazing. For example, Mahoney is Ma- hooney and Leahy is Lay. Ignorant people!
Friend of mine from Armagh went over there working on a building site, but they couldn't pronounce Aodhan, so they called him Eamon!

[the bear]

i worked with a chinese girl called Xing Xong, she was known as the gay doorbell

[Charlie Darwin]

Would that not be pronounced "Shing Shong"? More like karaoke with Sean Connery.

[paul_oshea]

It depends whethers its cantonese or mandarin. But i'd imagine its "z" instead of "w".

[geysir]

Do the Scots wonder about us butchering the proper pronunciation of McGeddy?

[paul_oshea]

McEachen -> McECCen, like Big ECC
McEachen -> Mc E-ken (like the irish name Eakins)

Ea, seems to be ECC or EH depending what comes after the "a" in scottish English :)

[Olé Olé]

What irritates me are Irish commentators pronouncing it as 'Cay-hill.' I mean, would George Hamilton refer to Des Cahill as 'Des Cay-hill' in the normal course of business up in RTÉ HQ? No, he'd refer to him in the way he knows is the correct pronunciation, not in the Anglicised or Oz-tracised (see what I did there?) manners.

So, when Gary Cahill did a job on his hamstring in the CL the other night, why oh why did I hear George refer to 'Cay-hill''s injury?

Fair enough, it is insisted that James McClean have his second name pronounced 'McClane' but if Gary Cahill kicked up a fuss he wouldn't have a leg to stand on. Not sure how many hamstrings he'd have though (couldn't resist).

[Charlie Darwin]

How do you know how Gary Cahill pronounces his own name? I'd trust George Hamilton over you.

[Olé Olé]

How do you know how Gary Cahill pronounces his own name? I'd trust George Hamilton over you.

My point being that in those instances Hamilton could use his own discretion and pronounce it the "correct" way. Chances are Gary Cahill does pronounce his name 'Cay-hill' but I think it's been established that the Irish name of Cahill is not pronounced in this manner and maybe George could use the Irish pronunciation.

[Stuttgart88]

Tim Cahill definitely pronounces it Cay-hill. Let's just face it, outside Ireland people have their own pronunciations. Ma-ho-ney, Cay-hill, Kee-ow etc. Some names in Ireland are even pronounced differently in different counties, and even within families. I have a friend from Dublin who pronounces his surname (spelt Heneghan) "Hennigan", but his Galway-born and bred dad pronounces his name Hee-na-han.

[Charlie Darwin]

My point being that in those instances Hamilton could use his own discretion and pronounce it the "correct" way. Chances are Gary Cahill does pronounce his name 'Cay-hill' but I think it's been established that the Irish name of Cahill is not pronounced in this manner and maybe George could use the Irish pronunciation.
But Gary Cahill isn't Irish.

[paul_oshea]

no but his grandparents are.

stutts I can confirm the derived *******isation of hennigan and hannigan and the name heneghan are pronounced differently just as you pointed out.its most definitely meant to be pronounced he-ne-han...ne not na.

my surname is pronounced 3 different ways in Ireland....

[tetsujin1979]

no but his grandparents are.

stutts I can confirm the derived *******isation of hennigan and hannigan and the name heneghan are pronounced differently just as you pointed out.its most definitely meant to be pronounced he-ne-han...ne not na.

my surname is pronounced 3 different ways in Ireland....And none of them are right!

[Olé Olé]

But Gary Cahill isn't Irish.


no but his grandparents are.

That's my answer and that's where the name is derived from and where the original pronunciation lies.

[Charlie Darwin]

No, the original pronunciation was O'Cathail. It was probably something else before that. Pronunciations vary.

[SkStu]

But Hamilton is the one he is criticizing Chas (at least I think that's the argument here). Hamilton is Irish and, being Irish, should pronounce the name as he knows it should be pronounced or as he would usually pronounce...

I never heard him succumb to the pressure to say Paul McGraTh or Kevin MorAn... :)

[Charlie Darwin]

But there is not one set pronunciation for the name, obviously, not even in Ireland.

[SkStu]

I would confidently claim that there is one common pronunciation of the name in Ireland. I never heard Martin Cahills name ever *******ized by any crime reporter or media outlet in Ireland.

Hamilton is just being a big jessy.

[geysir]

The importance of being Cahill.

[Charlie Darwin]

Some people pronounce it like 'Kahl,' others will put an emphasis on the 'hill' part. Obviously the convention elsewhere is to say 'Kay-hill.' The pronunciation of your name is often influenced by your environment. I'd trust George Hamilton as the only English-language commentator to correctly pronounce John Carew's name.

[paul_oshea]

chas Michael michaels.

initally I was agreeing with skstu about the name cahill. my ex flatmate is one and I notice when I say it I run the 2 syllables almost as one and it does sound like kahl....but its ka-hill not kay-hill chas Michael michaels.

also osarusan for fear of being wrong abot you saying how x should be pronounced in cantonese was wrong even if you tried to cover your tracks by removing the post and going off topic chas Michael michaels was right its most definitley 'z'...for example bo xilai is bo zilai....incidently a lot of people called bo take the English name 'victor'

[geysir]

It's fine for a commentator to pronounce the name as the player wants it pronounced.

However that practice doesn't apply when it comes to Icelandic names.

[BonnieShels]

So, this McDermott fella...

[theworm2345]

Some of you may remember there was a lad named Adam Maher playing in the Eredivisie whose name was brought up here as a possible recruit, though it turned out he had Dutch and Moroccan heritage -- apparently Maher is also Dutch name which I assume is pronounced "may-her." Would any of you have a problem with a commentator pronouncing that "may-her" as opposed to the Irish way?

[SkStu]

Contrary to my apparent contrariness, I don't actually give a phlegm about how players want to pronounce their names or, really, how commentators want to pronounce names...

I would expect a bit of simple consistency though... I'd like Hamilton to read an article about Martin Cahill out loud and see what he says... The first sign of a Ca-hill as opposed to a Cay-hill and I would probably shake my head in disgust and walk away.

[Charlie Darwin]

Why would you expect consistency though? If I'm mates with both Martin Cahill and Tim Cahill (hypothetically), I'm not going to stick to one pronunciation for both. I'll call Tim Kay-hill and Martin Ka-hill. It's like calling David Ginola Day-vid Gin-oh-la. It might make sense in your local dialect but in general it is completely illogical to call somebody by anything other than their actual name.

I've known Andreas who pronounce their name Andreea and Andreas who've pronounced their name Andraya. It would be insane to insist on a consistent pronunciation when clearly they are different.

[SkStu]

If you hadn't been introduced to them and simply seen their names on a piece of paper, you would have only had one pronunciation though. It's a poor rebuttal.

I would refer, somewhat logically, to the same name in the same way unless it was brought up as an issue. If it was an issue then I would attempt to correct but would invariably slip into default mode from time to time.

[osarusan]

also osarusan for fear of being wrong abot you saying how x should be pronounced in cantonese was wrong even if you tried to cover your tracks by removing the post

I never mentioned anything about the pronunciation being either Mandarin or Cantonese, and you were not specific about it either.

What I did do was ask my head of department, who is this woman, Xiao Rui Zhang (http://www.japanintercultural.com/en/about/Japan_Xiao-RuiZhang.aspx). She told me.

Are you saying that this woman, a native speaker of Mandarin, doesn't know how to pronounce her own name, but you do?

I deleted my post to keep the thread on-topic (ironic, given the posts since).