Skinny little rat at it again...

[legendz]

http://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2012/0301/trapattoni.html

Dunphy blasts 'amateur and arrogant' Trap

[Dunners]

Have to agree with him on McCarthy and McClean - they should have both played 90 mins in my opinion along with Walters - If Trap cant recognise that Walters is the best suited to play his own game tactics then it is time to worry

[tetsujin1979]

"The way (Trapattoni) has the team playing is a disgrace and it is wrong. It is not popular to say this because he managed to qualify for Euro 2012, but if we go to the championship we need, in the interest of the game in this country and the players, to do things differently to the way they are being done right now."
Do things differently to qualifying? As in, not qualifying?

[jbyrne]

while i cant disagree with all he is saying the fact that he has never had a good word to say about any Irish manager ever kinda ruins his credibility

[legendz]

Dunphy was so eager for Trap to be given the job. Had he not got the job, he'd still be ranting about that. Trap has his methods. When the team were a goal down, I think he'd have preferred to have played the same 11 for the whole game to have seen how they would've responded. These details are important. In one of Trap's first game, we were leading 1-0 in a game played in Craven Cottage, early in Trap's reign. For an end of season friendly, many would've expected changes but Trap only brought on one sub very late on. He was testing the team then to hold on to the lead. Before he took over, Ireland had a habit of conceding late goals. A details missed by the hacks but a detail the manager has to consider.

[bennocelt]

while i cant disagree with all he is saying the fact that he has never had a good word to say about any Irish manager ever kinda ruins his credibility

The fact that he supported Trap at the start as well.

[Stuttgart88]

I find it hard to disagree with his views on this occasion, though it's hard to separate the opinion from the opinionator. Credible or not, Dunphy is largely right. Last night was shattering on my morale!

[Uncle_Joe]

He was on Morning Ireland this morning spouting some awful nonsense. It starts at 1hr38m if anyone has a inkling for aural manure
http://www.rte.ie/radio/radioplayer/rteradioweb.html#!rii=9%3A3214508%3A48%3A01%2D03%2 D2012%3A (http://www.rte.ie/radio/radioplayer/rteradioweb.html#!rii=9%3A3214508%3A48%3A01%2D03%2 D2012%3A)

I almost dropped my toast when he said " This coach thinks he knows more about football than we do! He doesn't!" :eek:

[amaccann]

As usual with Dunphy, whatever element of truth he might be speaking is lost & drowned amid the hyperbole & ranting. Only Dunphy would try and interpret a warmup friendly into a make-or-break match.

I may partially share his opinions on the team selections & the manner of football we're playing, but you can pretty much guarantee we'll perform 10 levels beyond what we did last night, when we play those games in the summer.

[IsMiseSean]

I find it hard to disagree with his views on this occasion, though it's hard to separate the opinion from the opinionator. Credible or not, Dunphy is largely right. Last night was shattering on my morale!

Have to agree too.
Seeing Paul Green coming on knowing James McCarthy was sitting on the bench was awful.
Normally I see logic in Traps decisions but this I just cant grasp...

[TrapAPony]

Have to agree with him on McCarthy and McClean - they should have both played 90 mins in my opinion along with Walters - If Trap cant recognise that Walters is the best suited to play his own game tactics then it is time to worry

Exactly how I feel. Green ahead of McCarthy is just insulting, McClean should have been given more game time than 12 minutes or so, Walters is best suited to partner Robbie Keane. Also is Coleman ever going to get a proper run out? added to Wilson, Hoolahan and whoever else should be in the squad.

[geysir]

If any of you had seen Wigan's awful last nil-all draw at home, James had a very poor game, he looked like a little boy lost, it was painful to watch.
If Trap wants to save James for the next campaign, I can see the sense of it.
It's disappointing that he hasn't made it in time, but it's certainly not Trap's fault.

I'd be more curious to see Wilson at CM but that's not going to happen now.

[Nugget]

Amateur and arrogant.....it's so hypocritical it makes my head hurt

[backstothewall]

Who cares? The man is a national joke. He should stick to the politics.

For what it's worth I support Trapattoni's tactical approach. I wasn't pleased to see Green coming on, but I would prefer to have seen Marc Wilson come on rather than McCarthy. His game suits our tactical approach much better.

I thought giving McClean 10 mins was perfect. It was long enough for the crowd to get a look, and for him to get his debut over and done with, without much chance of anything going wrong. If Paul Butler had the luxury of making his debut in the last 10 minutes of a friendly and gradually being introduced into the team he might have got 50 caps. Debuts can go badly wrong if not handled right.

McClean was delighted with the game, and the reception he received, and all concerned were left hungry for more. Perfect start for the lad.

[ArdeeBhoy]

Dunphy's a C*nt. Always has been and always will be.


Trap has many faults, but that eejit isn't one of them.

Next!

[Crosby87]

Why is it James McCarthy is always owed something instead of earning it?

[jbyrne]

Who cares? The man is a national joke. He should stick to the politics.

For what it's worth I support Trapattoni's tactical approach. I wasn't pleased to see Green coming on, but I would prefer to have seen Marc Wilson come on rather than McCarthy. His game suits our tactical approach much better.

I thought giving McClean 10 mins was perfect. It was long enough for the crowd to get a look, and for him to get his debut over and done with, without much chance of anything going wrong. If Paul Butler had the luxury of making his debut in the last 10 minutes of a friendly and gradually being introduced into the team he might have got 50 caps. Debuts can go badly wrong if not handled right.

McClean was delighted with the game, and the reception he received, and all concerned were left hungry for more. Perfect start for the lad.

a lot of sense here i feel particularly in relation to McClean

[elroy]

Dunphy is becoming increasingly annoying. Yes things under Trap arent 100% what we would like but then again that frustration is tempered by the fact we have only lost 2 competitive games in four years!!! that we didnt just play a meaningless friendly the other night before a quiet summer, that we have so much to look forward to this summer, that we are organised and hard to beat, although not very pretty to watch. That as a squad we have far more options now than four years ago...........i could go on.

On balance, clearly Trap wins out. No manager will ever do exactly what everyone wants.

[Dunners]

Crosby

He is not owed anything – He is a regular first eleven EPL central midfielder with more game time than the rest the them put together
I’d say that earns him at least 45mins in a friendly just to see what he can do. Oh and I don’t buy the “he was off his game in Wigan’s
Last outing”. We have had plenty of players over the years that haven’t produced for club but excel for country. The lad has a poor game
so lets leave at home. At least he gets on the pitch every week.

[tetsujin1979]

Crosby

He is not owed anything – He is a regular first eleven EPL central midfielder with more game time than the rest the them put together
I’d say that earns him at least 45mins in a friendly just to see what he can do. Oh and I don’t buy the “he was off his game in Wigan’s
Last outing”. We have had plenty of players over the years that haven’t produced for club but excel for country. The lad has a poor game
so lets leave at home. At least he gets on the pitch every week.eh, no he's not.

[Irwin3]

eh, no he's not.

He has more in the last 2 years in the PL than Whelan, Andrews and Green together. (Thanks to your useful post from other thread):)

[tetsujin1979]

He has more in the last 2 years in the PL than Whelan, Andrews and Green together. (Thanks to your useful post from other thread):)
depends on your definition of "them". If it's just midfielders, and you're not including Walters, Coleman and Hunt in that definition, then yes he does

[Straightstory]

Dunphy is a ranter and becomes somewhat 'over emotional', but I basicall agree with him on this.

[DeLorean]

It's nearly major Championship time, it's tradition that Dunphy should stir it up a bit. Jack Charlton/Egypt game in Italia '90, Mick McCarthy/Saipan in Japan/Korea '02 and now he's completing the hat-trick with our thrid manager to reach a major finals. He's probably making a scene a bit earlier than usual just in case we don't actually embarrass ourselves in an incredibly difficult group. He obviously has his own agenda and should really be enjoyed as a bit of comic relief more than anything else.

Whether he makes some points which aren't totally incorrect is irrelevant. He speaks about it with the same emotion and passion as he does about the country's economic situation, things aren't that serious like!

[third policeman]

Dunphy is a ranter and becomes somewhat 'over emotional', but I basicall agree with him on this.


I have an intense loathing for Dunphy, but I think he is completely right. It was a shameful apology for a performance against mediocre opposition. Trap's entire strategy is prediacted on a conviction that he is working with inferior material. To that end he has a logical preference for the technically limited players like Green who will stick to the plan. We are playing the most brutally primitive and ugly football that I have ever witnessed from an Irish team. To those who argue "it works", we simply dont know that for sure because we have never seen how an alternative Irish team adopting more positive tactics would perform. We were lucky to qualify and will be lucky to come home without abject humiliation. We were better off under Kerr and that is saying something.

[the bear]

I have an intense loathing for Dunphy, but I think he is completely right. It was a shameful apology for a performance against mediocre opposition. Trap's entire strategy is prediacted on a conviction that he is working with inferior material. To that end he has a logical preference for the technically limited players like Green who will stick to the plan. We are playing the most brutally primitive and ugly football that I have ever witnessed from an Irish team. To those who argue "it works", we simply dont know that for sure because we have never seen how an alternative Irish team adopting more positive tactics would perform. We were lucky to qualify and will be lucky to come home without abject humiliation. We were better off under Kerr and that is saying something.


hyperbole
sensationalism
wild accusations
self loathing


third policeman, are you eamo himself? all that was missing was baby at the end

[mypost]

He doesn't know what he wants. Against Armenia, we had just qualified for the playoffs, and he declared "we won't qualify". 20 minutes later on air, he came to his senses. When we qualified and got the toughest group in the finals, he told us that basically Italy and Spain were no good. Now he's telling us after 12 games unbeaten, that we'll be "embarrassed and humiliated" at the finals. He says now that the coach has "very little support" in the country now. 2 minutes later, in the middle of his rant, he declares it's "not popular" to say this, so this is what Trap who has won everything going in the past 35 years is dealing with. He then finishes off by telling RTE how he watched the rival channel's coverage of the Czech Republic game.

It doesn't matter how it looks on tv, it doesn't matter whether we have 10% possession or not, it doesn't matter how "predictable" we are, it doesn't matter that inexperienced players won't be thrown into the deep end in Gdansk and Poznan, or even the odd occasion we are behind at Lansdowne. What matters is the scoreline, and usually we have at least as many, and more than the technically superior opposition. We were going nowhere before he took over and without Trap, we would merely be preparing to fight out third spot in the next qualifiers with Austria to protect the seeding for 2016. Not quite the same, is it?


We are playing the most brutally primitive and ugly football that I have ever witnessed from an Irish team. To those who argue "it works", we simply dont know that for sure because we have never seen how an alternative Irish team adopting more positive tactics would perform.

We know how. Here's a brief resume:

2002: Ireland 2-4 Russia
2006: Ireland 0-4 Holland
2006: Ireland 2-5 Cyprus
2007: Ireland 1-1 Cyprus
2007: Ireland 2-2 Slovakia
2007: Ireland 0-1 Czech Republic

That's what the more positive tactics achieved and where Dunphy and co want us. Entertaining lovable losers, not 12 games unbeaten.

[Real ale Madrid]

Whatever about McClean, I cannot understand the McCarthy situation. McCarthy would do exactly the job Trap wants him to do in midfield - and do it better than anyone we have at the moment.

I can understand the omission of the likes of Hoolahan and A Reid, and I doubt we will be humiliated in Poland, but we would be a better team if McCarthy was playing imo.

McClean would be a good sub to have in Poland - a la Jason McAteer in USA 94. Young kid, bang on form, a bit fearless amd could be very useful. I hope he travels, but I wouldn't count on it.

[Murfinator]

Have to agree with him on McCarthy and McClean - they should have both played 90 mins in my opinion along with Walters - If Trap cant recognise that Walters is the best suited to play his own game tactics then it is time to worry

The point of friendly games is test tactical and personnel alterations that are of interest to the manager. How are you or anyone else in a position to say who or what these changes "should" be. You're not on the training ground or at coaching meetings, you have no idea what trap does or doesn't know about these players. He may have seen enough of them to not need to play them, he may have seen enough of them to not want to play them.

The primary change in this friendly was Keane in a deeper role to try and link with the midfield. Playing a second string side and first cappers would have rendered the results of the tactical pretty irrelevant as there'd be different players playing when using it would actually count.

On the Walters comment, maybe just maybe you aren't at the relevant level of experience to comprehend what is or isn't a sensible tactical selection by a manager of 40 years and 22 trophies. Shocking, I know.

[Murfinator]

Crosby

He is not owed anything – He is a regular first eleven EPL central midfielder with more game time than the rest the them put together
I’d say that earns him at least 45mins in a friendly just to see what he can do.

You sound like a 12 year old who just installed championship manager if you naively think that international selection works this way. Don't let the fact that he's playing for the worst premiership team, doesn't play in a 2 man midfield and is having a dire season sway you from a good rant though.

[backstothewall]

He has more in the last 2 years in the PL than Whelan, Andrews and Green together. (Thanks to your useful post from other thread):)

Rory Delap has played 15 more games than Damien Duff, mainly the same position. I know who I want on the right wing.

[Charlie Darwin]

Whatever about McClean, I cannot understand the McCarthy situation. McCarthy would do exactly the job Trap wants him to do in midfield - and do it better than anyone we have at the moment.
Based on what?

[DannyInvincible]

We were better off under Kerr and that is saying something.

Can't agree with that at all. Trap's record speaks for itself. I was of the opinion we rode our luck a bit in Russia and were too close to capitulating for comfort, but it can't all be a fluke. In two campaigns, Trap's managed to get us to a World Cup play-off (where you might even say we were unlucky to go out in such a fashion) and the Euros. We're ranked within the top 20 teams in the world. Where did Kerr get us?

Even if we are to be humiliated at the finals - and I don't think we will be - I'd honestly rather that than another summer without Ireland at a finals watching games that mean nothing to me. We qualified on merit. We deserve to be there, just like every other team that qualified.

[mypost]

Did we get luck in Russia? We were due it after all the years of no luck away from home. Remember Vaduz? 40 shots at goal, and the ball wouldn't go in. Nobody remembers that, just the result.

We went to Moscow, looked for a point and got what we wanted. It doesn't matter how the game panned out, we got our point. Russia are almost invincible at home, and better teams with better players struggle to get anything out there.

[Real ale Madrid]

Based on what?

Based on my opinion? I think, from what I have seen of him, he is a better player than both Andrews and Whelan. Opinions eh ? they are like @rseholes - everybody has one!



Did we get luck in Russia? We were due it after all the years of no luck away from home. Remember Vaduz? 40 shots at goal, and the ball wouldn't go in. Nobody remembers that, just the result.


Jaysus mypost you are really outdoing yourself on this thread - not happy with referencing friendly defeats in the 80's (although I see they are deleted now!) when cross referencing our "tactics" over the years, - you are now telling us that Russia really was karma for that debacle in Vaduz!

If that's the type of roll Trap is on - then we should get 9 pts in our group - a 1-0 win over Croatia will merely be payback for Davor Sukur's injury time winner against us in 1999.

Our 3-0 win against Spain will be revenge for that playoff in Paris in 65'.

Our final righteous slice of retribution and a 2-1 injury time win against Italy surely is the least we deserve for Gilardino's last minute equaliser in Croker last October 2 years ago!!!!

Things will get really exciting if we get France in the quarters.......

Back to your original point btw - id hardly call 40 shots on goal against an amateur team - and the subsequent failure to score, bad luck! Horrendous finishing maybe.

[amaccann]

It's frustrating that when we discuss the subject of Ireland's quality of football, those who suggest that perhaps we could play with a most positive mindset are almost always met with exaggerated comparisons and arguments. Quoting results under Staunton doesn't prove that Ireland can't play attacking football; it merely proves that an unqualified manager, out of his depth, in charge of a team will invariably result in awful hammerings.

We shouldn't buy into this logic that the only choice is either Trapattoni's & win, or Barcelona's and lose - that there's no such things as a middle ground to be had. Seems like we're buying into Trap's mentality that we're simply not capable of playing with any technical skill or a forceful agenda.

Do I begrudge us being in the Finals? Hell no. Do I wish Trap acknowledge we can do more than simply play ugly? Hell yes.

[AlaskaFox]

Rory Delap has played 15 more games than Damien Duff, mainly the same position. I know who I want on the right wing.

About time someone stood up for Rory!

[IsMiseSean]

Speaking off rats stirring up s**t before a major finals. Anyone read Sadlier in the Independent this weekend?

I want to be the next Dunphy (http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/traps-army-setting-up-to-be-cannon-fodder-in-poland-3038876.html)

[tetsujin1979]

Speaking off rats stirring up s**t before a major finals. Anyone read Sadlier in the Independent this weekend?

I want to be the next Dunphy (http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/traps-army-setting-up-to-be-cannon-fodder-in-poland-3038876.html)
much as I like Sadlier as a pundit on TV, his articles tend to take the form of


current event in football
similar event that occurred at Milwall
conclusion

[Spudulika]

Dunphy lost any respect from me by saying that "we know more about football" than Trappatoni. Hmm, really?

Following on from Mypost, Russia was deserved, the team came to draw, could have won, but got a point. They silenced the home crowd early - who had nothing to add to the occasion except booing the excellent Irish group.

Sadlier is a failed football agent, failed football ceo and is desperately trying to get a media career with out Dunphying Dunphy. Joke.

[mypost]

Jaysus mypost you are really outdoing yourself on this thread - not happy with referencing friendly defeats in the 80's (although I see they are deleted now!) when cross referencing our "tactics" over the years, - you are now telling us that Russia really was karma for that debacle in Vaduz!

If that's the type of roll Trap is on - then we should get 9 pts in our group - a 1-0 win over Croatia will merely be payback for Davor Sukur's injury time winner against us in 1999.

Our 3-0 win against Spain will be revenge for that playoff in Paris in 65'.

Our final righteous slice of retribution and a 2-1 injury time win against Italy surely is the least we deserve for Gilardino's last minute equaliser in Croker last October 2 years ago!!!!

Things will get really exciting if we get France in the quarters.......

Back to your original point btw - id hardly call 40 shots on goal against an amateur team - and the subsequent failure to score, bad luck! Horrendous finishing maybe.

Right so, when we're on the receiving end, it's comprehensively outplayed, lucky, and when we're not, it's "horrendous finishing". Strange. Our football history is littered with ifs, buts, maybes, and heroic failures. Apparantly we don't deserve it when it's the other way round. We won't beat Spain 3-0. There'll be long periods of play when we won't have the ball, but that's what we need to do to get a result.

In any case, many of the conclusions made this week are after one friendly, not 4 years work. Liechtenstein was one example, I could use lots of others.


It's frustrating that when we discuss the subject of Ireland's quality of football, those who suggest that perhaps we could play with a most positive mindset are almost always met with exaggerated comparisons and arguments. Quoting results under Staunton doesn't prove that Ireland can't play attacking football; it merely proves that an unqualified manager, out of his depth, in charge of a team will invariably result in awful hammerings.

We shouldn't buy into this logic that the only choice is either Trapattoni's & win, or Barcelona's and lose - that there's no such things as a middle ground to be had. Seems like we're buying into Trap's mentality that we're simply not capable of playing with any technical skill or a forceful agenda.

It's simple really, no other coach could get a team comprising of Derby, Preston, Stoke, Sunderland, Wigan, West Brom, Wolves, and MSL players out of the last qualification group. It had to be done this way, or else it would be another summer on the sofa. He will do very well to get us out of the group in the summer against the Barcelona, Real Madrid, Milan, and Juventus elite. Even if we don't get out of the group, it's a huge achievement to get this far, considering where we were not very long ago.

[bennocelt]

It's simple really, no other coach could get a team comprising of Derby, Preston, Stoke, Sunderland, Wigan, West Brom, Wolves, and MSL players out of the last qualification group. It had to be done this way, or else it would be another summer on the sofa. He will do very well to get us out of the group in the summer against the Barcelona, Real Madrid, Milan, and Juventus elite. Even if we don't get out of the group, it's a huge achievement to get this far, considering where we were not very long ago.


So what were the great teams that the players of Slovakia, Armenia,Macedonia and Estonia were playing for?:rolleyes:

[geysir]

The Sadlier article is pretty tame compared to the King Rat. In common with Dunphy though, is his repeated theme 'if we play like this against Armenia we won't qualify', 'if we play like this we will be humiliated at the Finals', presumably if we did get through the group they would conveniently forget about all the nonsense they wrote previous, park it for another time.

What Dunphy brings to the table is his 3 card trick, the same 3 card trick he has been playing since 1980.

1. Such and such a player is a fantastic kid, has been treated horribly by the manager.
2. The coach knows nothing about football and he's making grotesque mistakes.
3. The players are fantastic and could play football, if only they were let.

Amazing that this blatantly obvious con still finds a gullible audience, 'yes but Eamon is right' or 'he has a passion for the game'.
I suspect some fans are confusing lunacy with passion and censoriousness with punditry.

What difference McClean, McCarthy (or Wilson at LB) can make to our inability to hold onto possession, is beyond me.
I need that one explained.
What Ward brings is not his defensive skills but a willingness to get forward in support, regarded as a revolutionary act in our team. Wilson definitely can stroke a better pin-pointed hoof to the forwards. Wilson would do grand if we had a flying RB.

[Charlie Darwin]

I wouldn't put Sadlier in the same camp as Dunphy. He has strong opinions on the way the game should be played but that'd make him more like Giles than the contrarian Dunphy. I'd share his exasperation that our midfielders won't get on the ball, but at the same time our tactics are so predictable that they're rarely in a position to receive the ball without a great deal of pressure being applied, and they don't really have the technical skill to work their way out of tight situations consistently.

[geysir]

An occasional ability would do me, just a few glimmers that we could manage to get the ball from goalie to RB to CB to CM then some movement to anticipate what happens next, instead after a bit of pressure on the CM, the ball goes back to the goalie for a hoof.

How was Trap at centre half? I suppose he had personality.

[Charlie Darwin]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rb4jotQTDkc

Check out 4:27 for Trapattoni's typical poise on the ball at centre half.

Also interesting that the Italian goalkeeper Buffon, who had to be carried off unconscious, is a distant cousin of the current Italy #1.

[the bear]

that was a loose one from the left half back

[mypost]

So what were the great teams that the players of Slovakia, Armenia,Macedonia and Estonia were playing for?

Playing regular football for good clubs in top leagues, many of which with significant European club experience. With respect, Derby, Preston, Sunderland, and Wolves won't be getting too much of it in the near future. Yet those players are expected to go out, and "take the game" to Italy and Spain in a couple of months. Not gonna happen.


What Dunphy brings to the table is his 3 card trick, the same 3 card trick he has been playing since 1980.

1. Such and such a player is a fantastic kid, has been treated horribly by the manager.
2. The coach knows nothing about football and he's making grotesque mistakes.
3. The players are fantastic and could play football, if only they were let.

Amazing that this blatantly obvious con still finds a gullible audience, 'yes but Eamon is right' or 'he has a passion for the game'.
I suspect some fans are confusing lunacy with passion and censoriousness with punditry.

He still gets an audience, across, tv, radio and print media, so people want to hear from him.

In 1988, his gripe was about O'Leary. In 1990, it was Brady, in 2002 it was Keane, more recently it was the granny-gate traitor, then Reid, McCarthy, now McClean is the latest drum to bang. A player who he would have dismissed as not good enough to play for Ireland 12 months ago.

I watched his WC 2002 forecasts again last week. Amidst his colours protest, apparantly Ireland had "no chance" of getting out of the group, France were certainties to qualify from theirs, and Brazil couldn't win the World Cup. What happened?

He made sense during Staunton's time in charge. But that was the equivalent of kicking an open door. Even then, he wanted "someone in to do the job", the "best team" available, and an "organised side". We have it now, but still it isn't enough to keep him happy.

[amaccann]

It's simple really, no other coach could get a team comprising of Derby, Preston, Stoke, Sunderland, Wigan, West Brom, Wolves, and MSL players out of the last qualification group. It had to be done this way, or else it would be another summer on the sofa. He will do very well to get us out of the group in the summer against the Barcelona, Real Madrid, Milan, and Juventus elite. Even if we don't get out of the group, it's a huge achievement to get this far, considering where we were not very long ago.

Interesting you mention West Brom, because they're a mediocre team, punching above their weight at the moment under a manager many here had as their favorite to land the Irish job - one Roy Hodgson. I also find it funny you mention Sunderland, who under O'Neill represent the kind of football I think Ireland excel at & could flourish under.

But to be honest, claiming we wouldn't have qualified if not for our dour tactics is as academic as claiming we would have without them. We'll never know for sure either way, but it doesn't stop the legitimate claim that our tactics are sterile. Whatever positives Trap's system brings in shutting down our opponents, it's what we do when we have the ball that frustrates.

I still think we're going to do quite well in the Euros, but I believe it'll be despite Trap's system, not because of it. That we'll just go out there and play with verve ala Paris.

[Yard of Pace]

Would it not be fair to say that our 2002 players were not at big clubs either yet managed to play decent football and put it up to eventual finalists Germany and a good Spanish team?