Goals Can Come From Anywhere [Archive]

pete

27/11/2001, 11:08 AM

I wonder how many of us would trade positions with our Bohs fan Barrys Tea above & their "fulltime" squad?

CCFC can't afford a fulltime setup on the pitch (although could at least attempt off the pitch) so better Gunther takes us through a season or two & bring in a professionla manager if thats what evereyone wants then.

IMO foreign managers haven't worked in the eL. Good local fulltime managers is whats needed & I don't see any alternatives to Gunther at the moment. How could you sack him with his league record to date anyway??? :rolleyes:

We've rode our luck in games this season but also been unlucky on other occasions. If Gunther can teach the team to hold onto a lead there may be no stopping us.

DM record v rovers: 1-4 (away) 1-2 (home)
Gunthers record: 2-1 (away) 2-1 (home)

joe

27/11/2001, 1:01 PM

Originally posted by Barry's Tea
Goals Can Come From Anywhere

clean sheets on the other hand are much harder to come by these days :D

Éanna

27/11/2001, 3:53 PM

lads, i'm not arguing with gunthers record, or his effectiveness- i just think he's bad for the medium-and-long term future of the club. short term he's fine. the sooner we get a replacement who has experience of professionalism-be he english, irish, indian, brazilian or , god help us, even from dublin :D - the better.

Sid

28/11/2001, 8:02 AM

Originally posted by Éanna
i just think he's bad for the medium-and-long term future of the club.

How can yea say he bad for the future of the club, 6 players that played on Sunday were under 21 and 4 are from Cork. If we can keep this group of players together for the next few seasons we'll have some team. Also he hasn't spent a penny since he took charge. Fair enough some fo his decisions are suspect but to wan't him sacked when were joint second is fickle in the extreme.

Éanna

28/11/2001, 6:04 PM

Originally posted by Sid
Fair enough some fo his decisions are suspect but to wan't him sacked when were joint second is fickle in the extreme.
The last thing I can be called in relation to gunther is fickle! I've said I never wanted him to have the job from the start, and that will always be the case- like I already said, it's nothing to do with results at all. May I also say, even if he wins us the champions league he won't have my support- it's as simple as that! If I called for his head and then changed my mind over a few results, that would make me as hypocritical and fickle as you can get- and I'm not.

A face

28/11/2001, 9:05 PM

Well you would have to admit Éanna if he won the champions league, that might sway things just a tad, well for me anyway. For now winning is kinda cool too. There are alot more parties involved for everything else to change aswell. It is not ALL up to Liam off the pitch.

goalside

28/11/2001, 9:11 PM

Don't go and score an own goal. Its great that goals can come from anywhere but to score an own goal by sacking murphy is stupid. Cop yourselves on. We're dam lucky to have murphy.

James

28/11/2001, 9:17 PM

yea i take it all back
Goalside has slow clearly explained to me the error of my ways...thanks goalside :D

:D

isnt it past youre bedtime though goalside

goalside

28/11/2001, 9:51 PM

Sorry dad. Going right now :D . What a stupid reply james. :confused:

Éanna

29/11/2001, 2:38 PM

Originally posted by goalside
......stupid. Cop yourselves on. We're dam lucky to have murphy.
Don't go accusing anyone else of stupid replies when this is the crap you come out with. I'm not gonna say it again- it's nothing to with results: i just think the guy is bad news. end of story. murphy out. I'm not saying he's a BAD manager, i just thing he's the wrong manager for city.
p.s. face- not even champions league would change me- i don't wanna be a hypocrite.

Gerry Desmond

29/11/2001, 4:18 PM

Originally posted by Éanna

it's nothing to with results.....I'm not saying he's a BAD manager, i just thing he's the wrong manager for city.
p.s. face- not even champions league would change me- i don't wanna be a hypocrite.

Just to be clear:

1) The results are OK
2) He's not a bad manager
3) A champion's League success would make no difference
4) You just want him out

Did I pick it up wrong?

Gerry

Éanna

29/11/2001, 5:10 PM

Originally posted by Gerry Desmond

Just to be clear:

1) The results are OK
2) He's not a bad manager
3) A champion's League success would make no difference
4) You just want him out

Did I pick it up wrong?

Gerry
No, you're spot on Gerry. I have my reasons-none of the above- and I've been thru them all before, I'm not dragging it up again and I'm not going to change my mind.

goalside

29/11/2001, 5:37 PM

Imagine the headline - city -champions of curope - sacked by chairman eanna. Not going to change his mind.

Great. with supporters like that who needs rovers fans. you'll be with them on friday no doubt eanna

Éanna

29/11/2001, 6:08 PM

goalside i PMed you re above. I'm fed up of taking flak for what i think- i'm not shoving anyone else's opinion back at them, nor am i asking them to agree with me- i'm certainly not going on about gunther; until someone started this thread, i hadn't mentioned the guy in quite a while! think what you want to think, that's what i do- but just respect what other people think too. it's only fair and decent.

rebel yell

29/11/2001, 6:09 PM

On the subject of goalscorers, does anyone know much about
Mchugh who plays for Finn Harps. I see he's scored 17 goals
this season, which is no mean feat, even in Div1. Can't see why he hasn't been snapped up yet by Premier clubs.

Éanna

29/11/2001, 6:12 PM

carlisle moved for him a few weeks back but he said he wasn't leaving! apparently derby countyare showing some interest- big move:eL div1 to england div1; or are they in the premiershi*- I can't remember?! ah well, don't really care anyhoo!

oh yeah and, he played for the eL U-21 side that lost 6-2 to the full ireland team in a 60-min training match before the 2 playoff games. apparently don givens said he has a better chance of making it at international level than some of the strikers who've played u-21 for ireland over the least 2 years. high praise indeed!

goalside

29/11/2001, 8:29 PM

Eanna - What does "i PMed you re above" mean? I was just saying in my post that i can't understnad how you could still want the manager out even if he lead his team to the top. Thats all.

Éanna

29/11/2001, 10:05 PM

Originally posted by goalside
Eanna - What does "i PMed you re above" mean? I was just saying in my post that i can't understnad how you could still want the manager out even if he lead his team to the top. Thats all.
it means i sent you a personal message- have a look at it. I've already explained that my opposition to murphy has nothing to do with how well the team is doing- i can't and don't deny that it is doing well.

joe

30/11/2001, 12:24 AM

Originally posted by rebel yell
On the subject of goalscorers, does anyone know much about
Mchugh who plays for Finn Harps. I see he's scored 17 goals
this season, which is no mean feat, even in Div1. Can't see why he hasn't been snapped up yet by Premier clubs.

Only seen him once this season when he scored against the Ramblers at St. Colman's Park. He has a really good partnership going with Jonathan Speake and the fans adore him, not surprisingly.

Peadar

30/11/2001, 6:41 AM

Who'll get on the score sheet tonight?
That's the big question.

Devine maybe?
Carey deserves a goal.
Bennett wants another goal.
Ollie likes a long range goal.
Deccie needs a goal!

In truth I fancy Coughlan to pop up for one.
Having said that I'd settle for an own-goal if we won 0-1.

Casegrande

30/11/2001, 9:16 AM

Originally posted by Gerry Desmond

Just to be clear:
1) The results are OK
2) He's not a bad manager
Gerry
This is the big problem with Cork City supporters, especially people who have links to the club. They are happy enough to settle for "OK" results, happy enough to trundle along with a manager that "is not bad"! What a joke!

"Sure we'll get the oul InterToto place again", "Yera the lads deserve another trip to Europe", "Sure as long as we beat the shower from Dublin that's all that matters", "Sure we're only amateur"

There are too many people like this within our club. They make me sick. They can be seen from the top to the bottom of our club and the point Eanna has been trying to make is that Liam Murphy is one of them. Gerry backs up Murphy by saying "1) The results are OK, 2) He's not a bad manager" Sure I suppose it's all we can expect considering we're only amateur.

Michael O'Leary has got to you Gerry. That was his response to every question asked at the recent supporters Club meeting. Why is there not more advertising of games? A few posters even? "Sure we're only amateur"

We're only amateur but the *******s managed to have a fairly 'professional' looking trip to Latvia last year. The rounds of golf at the clubs expense could hardly be described as amateur.
Everything them ****s do is in a professional manner but asked why they don't hang a poster outside Turner's Cross to advertise the next game.. "We're only amateur".

If the people in charge of our club have only dreams of survival I want the priks out. I want people who will make it their business to drag this club off it's arse. I want to see posters, ads on 96fm, a manager who wants his team to train full-time, an assistant manager who doesn't smoke 40 Major, a Chairman who is willing to hang the ****ing poster himself if it means getting a step closer to his dream.

pete

30/11/2001, 9:50 AM

I continue to criticise the Directors (title would suggest some directing required wouldn't it?) but I can't se how all this is Liam Murphys fault.

Murphy is getting the results so whats the problem?
I'm not saying Murphy is the best we could get but why sack him just for the sake of it?

Directors could be removed due to poor performance by a manager but i've never heard of sacking a manager cos of a crap Board! :eek:

Gerry Desmond

30/11/2001, 10:04 AM

Just to be clear, Casegrande:

Those were Éanna's points, NOT mine. You also omitted two of them, btw.
I was merely trying to see if I was picking up his drift correctly.
Apparently I did. Apparently, you didn't read what I was saying.

It seemed bizarre in the extreme to me to suggest a manager could win the CL and still be unsatisfactory...does that NOT seem strange to you? :confused:

Gerry

Peadar

30/11/2001, 10:09 AM

Originally posted by Gerry Desmond

It seemed bizarre in the extreme to me to suggest a manager could win the CL and still be unsatisfactory...does that NOT seem strange to you? :confused:

Gerry

Imagine the fun we'd have! Coming back into town having won the CL and rubbing it in Éanna's face while he stood there unable to celebrate. I remember something my mother used to say about spite, nose, face and some cutting.

Casegrande

30/11/2001, 10:40 AM

Eanna used the CL to make a point, some persons have taken him seriously. Cork City will never in our lifetime win the CL. BUT, we should be looking to progress to a point where we can hope to make the group stages.

Gerry and Mr.T - how do we come to a stage where we can hope to qualify for the CL?

Peadar

30/11/2001, 10:49 AM

Originally posted by Casegrande
Gerry and Mr.T - how do we come to a stage where we can hope to qualify for the CL?

The way we get to qualify for the CL is by going on as Liam Murphy is showing us. Winning the eircom League. Winning three qualifying rounds of the CL and Bob's Your Marley, we're there, in the CL group stages.
It's not beyond belief.

Gerry Desmond

30/11/2001, 11:12 AM

Originally posted by Casegrande
Eanna used the CL to make a point, some persons have taken him seriously. Cork City will never in our lifetime win the CL. BUT, we should be looking to progress to a point where we can hope to make the group stages.

Gerry and Mr.T - how do we come to a stage where we can hope to qualify for the CL?

Don't get me wrong here, Casegrande:

In NL terms, Cork constantly underachieves IMO.
3 league titles in half a century says it all.
Cork Hibs: 1 title - underachievement!
Cork Celtic: 1 title - underachievement!
Cork City: 1 title - underachievement!

It may be easy to target current directors etc. You may be right to criticise them, you may be wrong.
However, it is neither my duty nor my desire to defend them on this MB or elsewhere. But I would say this much about them - they ARE the directors of CCFC because at least they got involved. The question to ask, IMO, about EVERY club in the league, is why are the directors the only people involved with their clubs?

I don't have any simple solutions other than the club obviously needs more people involved, needs positive support from fans, the general public and especially the business community of the city.
I'd love to be a director, for instance, but I ain't got the bobs. It's a problem with the way clubs are set up. Have money and you can get in. Brains are not necessarily required. Quite often people with a passion for their club and a vision for its future are excluded simply because they are in a different financial situation to what is deemed to be acceptable. It always struck me as an apalling waste of resources and talent...Imagine if it were only possible to become a footballer if you had sufficient moolah to get you in.
Barcelona is a people's club. The people built the club, the stadium, everything. Irish clubs generally follow the British model, though there are a couple of exceptions. As a result, clubs too often are merely the playthings of the rich.
There is no simple solution to your answer, Casegrande. A major change of attitude is required.
Gerry

Casegrande

30/11/2001, 2:51 PM

Originally posted by Barry's Tea

The way we get to qualify for the CL is by going on as Liam Murphy is showing us. Winning the eircom League. Winning three qualifying rounds of the CL and Bob's Your Marley, we're there, in the CL group stages.
It's not beyond belief.
You are living in a world of makebelieve. You don't honestly think that with our current set-up we can progress to the CL?!!!

I'd be doubtful that we can win the league (if we do it's because the other teams are the worst in years). We could not even beat a shower of Latvian plodders.

But to me, at any rate, it's more than just winning the league or getting into the CL. It's about structure and ambition. We need good people running our club. We need to start offering younsters the option to follow a professional football team in Cork as a preferance to 'following' ManU or the Dream Team on the telly.

James

30/11/2001, 2:53 PM

damn right Casagrande, but until somebody with both money and a love / ambition for the club comes along to buy out the useless shower we have, then we are stuck with what we have. :mad:

Casegrande

30/11/2001, 3:01 PM

Originally posted by Gerry Desmond

I don't have any simple solutions other than the club obviously needs more people involved, needs positive support from fans, the general public and especially the business community of the city.
But why the **** should the business communities of the City come knocking on the Directors doors offering money when any half-case could see that they are a shower of no-hopers. They have no dream. Would you give money to Cork City FC? So that they could go out and blow it on their Golf-trips and holidays in Latvia.

Where did all the money from the '98-99 league campaign go?

You ask for positive support from the fans:
There is a limit. I have supported City since '89 and in all reality not much has changed since then. How long more do I offer my unwaivered 'positive support'? There are hundreds of others like that. Positive support is nice but covers up the cracks that can ruin a club permanently.

I'm sick of this ****.

Gerry Desmond

30/11/2001, 4:19 PM

Originally posted by Casegrande

But why the **** should the business communities of the City come knocking on the Directors doors offering money when any half-case could see that they are a shower of no-hopers. They have no dream. Would you give money to Cork City FC? So that they could go out and blow it on their Golf-trips and holidays in Latvia.

Where did all the money from the '98-99 league campaign go?

You ask for positive support from the fans:
There is a limit. I have supported City since '89 and in all reality not much has changed since then. How long more do I offer my unwaivered 'positive support'? There are hundreds of others like that. Positive support is nice but covers up the cracks that can ruin a club permanently.

I'm sick of this ****.

You need to chill out, Cas! Take some time to smell the roses, or have a break in Latvia.

You think you are the only frustrated fan that ever walked?

Gerry

James

30/11/2001, 4:26 PM

get off the fence Gerry they are either doing a good job or a bad one?

IMO almost every bunch we had right back to Plonk and his stadium of dreams in bishopstown,( where we were told would be good enough to hold full internationals :D )have been cowboys..in it for a fast buck

how exactly are people to get involved?..its a cosy cartel..the only way in is too buy those already there out..

what more do you want the fans to do besides turning up for games?

Casegrande

30/11/2001, 4:26 PM

Originally posted by Gerry Desmond

You think you are the only frustrated fan that ever walked?

No I don't. But, unlike you, I'm not happy to just plod along pretending everything is just fine! You are an intelligent person - put some conviction behind what you write. Don't always sit on the fence to keep your employers happy.

Gerry Desmond

30/11/2001, 4:48 PM

Originally posted by Casegrande

No I don't. But, unlike you, I'm not happy to just plod along pretending everything is just fine! You are an intelligent person - put some conviction behind what you write. Don't always sit on the fence to keep your employers happy.

Doubt if you know whether I'm happy or not, or plodding along for that matter. I can, however, confirm that I am not pretending EVERYTHING is fine. I'm almost definite I've been attending LOI soccer longer than you (1968), have seen more, experienced more AND suffered more. You don't know what frustration is. I was a member of the Cork Celtic SC in 1978-79. When you go through something like that, then you can whinge. Then you will know what a club can do to its supporters.

You've already misread one of my earlier posts, I would suggest you pay more attention to what I am saying before drawing further incorrect conclusions.
I don't always sit on the fence, and CCFC are not my employers. I edit a programme for them; do you think they confide their decisions/opinions with me? Get a life!

You are asking questions that ONLY the directors can answer. Either ask THEM the questions or else, as I suggest, chill out before you embarrass yourself.

Life is good,

Gerry

James

30/11/2001, 5:00 PM

gerry i'm a little confused by what u are posting so i reread the thread and then read it again to besure...

ok here goes

Originally posted by Gerry Desmond

The question to ask, IMO, about EVERY club in the league, is why are the directors the only people involved with their clubs?

I don't have any simple solutions other than the club obviously needs more people involved, needs positive support from fans, the general public and especially the business community of the city.

Gerry any chance of elaborating on that or explaining it, cause from i know of in CCFC the club is practially held together by one woman, and financed by the hard and valuable work done by loto volunteers who are fans, doing it cause they love CCFC..the supporters club run buses, hold table quizes and support the team as best they can...apart from mountfield when has a city manager turned up, or until recently a director for a supporters club meeting,

and what about the quizes organised to raise money for the club..ie directors back pocket IMO...at least the directors could have the f-ing common courtesy to turn up for them....after the all the hard work thats done by CCFC fans and voluteers to help out the club ..
we all have to work you know, and there are a few people i know that do so much more for the club then any any director has..

now gerry what do you think ?
its off the fence time??-

and i'';; repeat your earlier quote

Originally posted by Gerry Desmond

The question to ask, IMO, about EVERY club in the league, is why are the directors the only people involved with their clubs?

also in longford there was tireless work there by not only the great directors that they have but also the many many volunteers to get flancare ready for europe, as there is in i would suggest every club in ireland.

it's not too much to ask for is it..a director who cares about the club and not what club to hit off the tee on the 17th at fota?

Casegrande

30/11/2001, 5:03 PM

Gerry don't get in a tiz. You offer one of best arguements that can be found here that's why I bug you about it.

I can, however, confirm that I am not pretending EVERYTHING is fine.
Ok, that's a start. But you **** me off because you never say anything against the club and hammer me when I make my opinion about particular things wrong with the club that YOU are afraid to bring up (or agree with, when I do).

I'm almost definite I've been attending LOI soccer longer than you (1968), have seen more, experienced more AND suffered more.
I don't really see what relevance this has to the points I am making about CORK CITY FC and it's owners.

do you think they confide their decisions/opinions with me?
Again, what difference does this make? You can still offer your honest opinion.

You are asking questions that ONLY the directors can answer. Either ask THEM the questions or else, as I suggest, chill out before you embarrass yourself.
I am putting these questions forward here in the form of a discussion among fans. I don't see why YOU are getting up-tight about the allegations I am making against the Board.

rebel yell

30/11/2001, 5:29 PM

James , I don't often disagree with you but I think your well off
the mark to slate the 'Bishopstown affair'. At least those directors
a) Put their money where their mouth is, AFAIK anyway.
b) anyhow had a vision and a least tried to make it come into
reality.
c) Tried to move the club forward.
Contrast that with all the boards since then and the present one admittedly is no worse than that crop- except in their choice of manager. All the above are true of the Longford board which is my
main gripe against our current board. I'd even make allowances
and accept Gunther if they tried at least. So to slag the board who tried to move to Bishoptown is wrong IMHO.

James

30/11/2001, 5:33 PM

why. they gave no thought or consideration to the thousands of fans that 1 had to get there from mainly a city based support ans 2 getting the hell out of there which if you ever tried back then involved a 2 hours wait sometimes and i joke not to get out of the carpark there...the roads to the location werent up to it either..and while directly the roads arent the directors fault...their choice of venue was...

and as for the state of the pitch out there.hhmm
even in the summer it was flooded and waterlogged

lets not re-open the whole bishopstown gate saga...please ...
if youre interested check out some of the old NMPP issues for some insightful comment on the events

James

30/11/2001, 5:37 PM

anyway wasnt all that money got from governemnt grants.. and come on they got money to build the stand a certain hieght and dimensions and then the thing went up the wrong size and had to be redone if i remember correctly..

they were cowboys...

had a vision yes but did they in any way find out if their customers ie fans were prepared to travel to bishopstown..i dont remember them doing so and if they did then they incorrectly choose to ignore it cause i remember being apart of the bishopstwon 400 and wonderiing where the rest of the crowd was manys a time..

just because they have a vision doent mean its a correct one.. i mean didnt hitler have a vision...

Peadar

30/11/2001, 5:46 PM

People come on here like James, Éanna and their online posse giving out about the board and saying how little they do. The club doesn't run itself! Anyone who knows anything about the club will know and agree that a certain lady never stops working for the club but there are jobs that only the board can do. Maybe a programme contributor or editor could do a piece on each member of the board and the role they fulfill. The thing is that last year the board made many daring moves towards becoming a professional club and for various reasons things went wrong. However this wasn't detrimental to the club and we, with the on field guidance of Liam Murphy, are tonight playing in a top of the table clash. All clubs in the eircom League are not living up to their full potential and much of this is down to eircom and the FAI failing to provide any real promotional infrastructure to our league. To be a professional club, you really ought to have a professional board. Not just people with a business background but people who live eat and sleep football. That I'm afraid is very unlikely to happen in Ireland.

Sack the board is a quick fix.
Sack Liam Murphy is a quick fix.

If you lot really want to discuss the issues you have with the board then you may start by suggesting constructive solutions.
I suppose you wouldn't be true Cork men if you didn't knock people at every given chance.

James

30/11/2001, 5:58 PM

Originally posted by Barry's Tea
their online posse
what the hell is that suppose to mean..everyone who posts on this and any board is entitled to their own opinion and unless abuse/racist or otherwise is entitled to voice it, nad indeed they post without any coercision from me eanna or others.

Debate on the other hand about such issues is healthy and what i log into this and other boards for.

No peadar u reread what i wrote and i know full well what that certain lady does and indeed did i not just mention it..and i also know as you do, some of what she has to put up with..

that IMO isnt acceptable

I could write an accurate piece on ewhat the board does
(a) play golf
(b) drink
(c)play golf
and emm (d) play golf

oh yea ..and laugh about how much they screwedcfc supporters for the $eltic game in the horseshoe... and yes i heard this myself..

i am not knocking them at every chance just simply stating IMO the views of the club that i have...if you disagree then fine..offer your points..

dont just revert to the old cork moaning begrudgers moto that you in paticular recycle time and time again..
i'm ****ed off because there are problems at the club that have been there for so long and yet some people (a) chhose to ignore them or (b) are so neive that they believe the brainwashing they get from some people..

Casegrande

30/11/2001, 6:05 PM

I still cannot comprehend that you believe everything is alright!

The thing is that last year the board made many daring moves towards becoming a professional club and for various reasons things went wrong. However this wasn't detrimental to the club and we, with the on field guidance of Liam Murphy, are tonight playing in a top of the table clash.
Here you agree that it was good to see the club attempting to become more professional, but didn't really care then that it failed, just so long as we're having an oul bash at the top of the table.

Your acceptance of second-rate football in Cork is bewildering. I suggest the fact that you do not actually attend games week-in week-out makes it easier for you to stand back and view with your rose tinted glasses.

If you lot really want to discuss the issues you have with the board then you may start by suggesting constructive solutions.
I could sit here all night offering short-term AND long-term ideas, but what good will it do saying it here?

James

30/11/2001, 6:08 PM

peadar its like the film "a few good men"

you want answers, you want the truth

BUT YOU CANT HANDLE THE TRUTH

:D

Casegrande

30/11/2001, 6:09 PM

Originally posted by James

are so neive that they believe the brainwashing they get from some people..
Good point, and perhaps not a coincidence that the two people here standing up for the Board have/had dealings with the club at an official level. I can be corrected on this Peadar?

Peadar

30/11/2001, 6:29 PM

Originally posted by James
i'm ****ed off because there are problems at the club that have been there for so long and yet some people (a) chhose to ignore them or (b) are so neive that they believe the brainwashing they get from some people..

I know better than to get you ****ed off James because you'll get your Pres G.W. Bush to send in the Marines and blow me out of my hiding place killing thousands of innocent koreans in the process.

James this forum is saturated with abuse of the CCFC Board and I for one am sick of it. Some day I'd love to be on the board and have a chance to do something positive for my club.
I don't know if that will ever happen but I'm a fairly ambitious and determined person.
One thing I do know for sure though is that filling threads on this or any other forum will never resolve the issues in the board.
The negative attidude that you and others deploy on this medium will contaminate others and I really do think there's too much negativity here already. What you and I and others need to be doing is showing the positives of Cork City FC to people and let football be the real issue. Do you have anything good to say James?