Cycling 2012

[swinfordfc]

The race at the front has been brilliant entertainment. It's hard to believe that Contador is clean but he's making it a great race.

J Rod is having a fab race and Valverde is doing alright as well ..... Contador is lacking racing in his leg .... you can tell. Froome is gone for the 1st placed fight as he has nothing left in the legs. Roche has dropped to 9th and i think he struggle to stayed now in top 10

[Macy]

The race at the front has been brilliant entertainment. It's hard to believe that Contador is clean but he's making it a great race.
Great racing, if you can suspend the cynicism. Contador probably looks the most believable of the top 3!

I know it's routed so the GC guys are battling every other day anyway, but even if I'm not personally a fan of time bonuses, it does add to the spice each stage.

[passinginterest]

J Rod is having a fab race and Valverde is doing alright as well ..... Contador is lacking racing in his leg .... you can tell. Froome is gone for the 1st placed fight as he has nothing left in the legs. Roche has dropped to 9th and i think he struggle to stayed now in top 10

Roche should hold onto top ten. There's a pretty big gap after the top 10 and he's not too far behind the 7th and 8th, he does seem to struggle a bit on those longer climbs, he was saying in the Independent that he's probably the heaviest of all the top 10 riders so that's why he doesn't have that really quick accelleration on the climbs and he suffers on the really long drags.

[Mr A]

Fabulous racing. Absolutely love the Vuelta.

He'd a bad day yesterday but I think Roche is having a great race when the team is only semi backing him. It'll be very interesting to see what he can do in a team with more powerful riders.

Given the profile it's a pity Martin isn't there. I guess after his first Tour it would have been too much.

Meanwhile, at Green Edge:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eEvX_vKDYEw

[Macy]

You'd hope that Roche will be the saxo guy for the vuelta next year, if (pretty big if) he's to remain GC focused. Whole other minefield he's landed in though with the revelations about Riis in Hamiltons book!

[swinfordfc]

Contador will always ride in the Vuelta so no way will Roche will be leading team in this tour - his only chance is the giro!

[Mr A]

I don't think Contador has rode the Vuelta for the past few years? He's only there this year as he was still suspended for the Tour.

[Macy]

Contador will always ride in the Vuelta so no way will Roche will be leading team in this tour - his only chance is the giro!
Contador has only ridden the Vuelta when he hasn't been allowed enter the tour - this year due to his own suspension, and previously when Astana were suspended from the tour by ASO. I think this is only his second start.

[Dodge]

Yep, he raced (and won) the 2008 Giro and Vuelta when he couldn't race the Tour. He started 2011 Giro too but apart from that he has only raced the Tour before this one

Long, long climb today

[swinfordfc]

Still think he raced Tour and Vuelta from now onwards with Roche in the Giro and back up to Contador in the Tour - time will tell

[Dodge]

Worst day today. Finsihed in 20th on the stage. Down to 10th overall

Purito now leads Contador by 28 seconds. Effectively between the 2 now

[swinfordfc]

Down to 12th now - i think he slip further back as well on saturday. Contador shows who's boss today big time!

[Macy]

Wonder did Contador have steak on the rest day?

In other news JV outs some of his riders (not that we didn't know) http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/vaughters-confirms-past-doping-by-danielson-others-at-garmin

[Dodge]

The good blog/facebook page "Science of Sport" which is decidedly anti-doping (as you could imagine) reckons it was clean. Points out the low output figures for yesterday compared to previously

http://www.facebook.com/#!/pages/The-Science-of-Sport/213103522034028


Very interesting...some stats on power output from Vuelta, using VAM method:

Stage 14 - Puerto de Ancares (last 9 km, 8.2 %, 738 m). Joaquim Rodriguez: 25 min 48 sec, 20.93 Kph, VAM 1716 m/h, 6.09 W/kg

Stage 15: Lagos de Covadonga (Village Covadonga→next 8.0 km ,8.85 %, 708 m). Contador,Rodriguez: 25:01, 19.19 Kph, VAM 1698 m/h, 5.89 W/kg

Then Stage 16: Puerto de Pajares (last 10 km, 7.0 %, 70...0 m [678 m→1378 m]). Contador, Rodriguez: 27:02, 22.19 Kph, VAM 1554 m/h, 5.75 W/kg.

Obviously,we recognize that VAM on climbs is subject to issues around wind, and that once-off climbs are affected by tactics, but the numbers suggest that we're well below what we used to see (note that these are all quite short climbs, not the 40 min + of Galibier, Tormalet & Alp d'Huez), and it's not higher than this year's Tour. If anyone has SRM data to validate, let me know. These numbers courtesy @ammattipyoraily

then in replies


Just a comment on these - if you've watched the Vuelta, you'll have been struck by a) the aggressive nature of the racing. It's attack and counterattack, fast then slow, and b) how different this is from the Tour.

So the numbers you see above are in part a reflection of the aggressive tactics, because it's likely that Contador is raising the power for a minute, and then recovering for a few once Rodriguez bridges that early gap. The Tour was characterized by the solid, "one-paced" tempo of Sky, and OVERALL performance is typically higher with that kind of racing. The stochastic Vuelta is exciting, but if you're time-trialing for best overall performances, it's not the best way to "spend" the energy!

But many people have been struck by the racing and wondered about its "validity". These numbers, to repeat what we said often during the Tour, don't prove no doping, but they do give cause for some hope, particularly because if you transposed the Vuelta into the Tour, it's quite a bit slower, overall. For many reasons, but again, it suggests that all is not necessarily doom for the sport.

Hopefully, we see more of that attacking riding in the Tour next year!

[Macy]

I thought under 6 W/kg was considered to be the max clean, but would no way claim to be expert so happy to have my scepticism knocked back a peg or two.

However, I was being a bit flippant - Purito's non performance was probably the main factor rather than anything particularly out of the ordinary (bar the attacking from distance) by Contador, and then Valverde just played the tactics perfectly. If I heard ITV commentator right, he didn't even go for a spin on the rest day which goes against everything I've ever read from other Pros!

[Dodge]

Yeah, seemed that way.

The 'acceptable' limit for testosterone was changed from 6.0 to 4.0 a couple of year ago.

Vaughters proudly showed that Hydersjel's max output was 6.05 in the Giro's hardest stage in a recent tweet. No way he'd do that if it was dodgy

[Stuttgart88]

I'm glad Gilbert won the Worlds. I always liked his riding style.

[Macy]

I'm glad Gilbert won the Worlds. I always liked his riding style.
Belgium were just so strong, with two great options. Roche and Martin showed well. It's a real pity the move that Dan was in with Nibali didn't stick - they got off the front but just didn't get enough of a gap for everyone to fully commit.

[Dodge]

Dan Martin riding the Tour of beijing this week. 6th in today's stage. means he's 6th overall and wearer of the KOM jersey too

[Dodge]

http://www.usada.org/cyclinginvestigationstatement.html


The evidence shows beyond any doubt that the US Postal Service Pro Cycling Team ran the most sophisticated, professionalized and successful doping program that sport has ever seen.


took tremendous courage for the riders on the USPS Team and others to come forward and speak truthfully. It is not easy to admit your mistakes and accept your punishment. But that is what these riders have done for the good of the sport, and for the young riders who hope to one day reach their dreams without using dangerous drugs or methods.

These eleven (11) teammates of Lance Armstrong, in alphabetical order, are Frankie Andreu, Michael Barry, Tom Danielson, Tyler Hamilton, George Hincapie, Floyd Landis, Levi Leipheimer, Stephen Swart, Christian Vande Velde, Jonathan Vaughters and David Zabriskie.


Lance Armstrong was given the same opportunity to come forward and be part of the solution. He rejected it.

Hincapie has released a statement. I'm sure others will

[Spudulika]

It's very strange to see people still defending him. It just beggars belief. I guess the same people will be claiming Usain Bolt was set up when the time comes.

[Mr A]

All the documentation you can handle. Even if you can handle a lot.

http://cyclinginvestigation.usada.org/

Have not read more than the very start of the summary, but from tweets from people who have, USPS, Bruyneel and Armstrong emerge as absolute scum. Pushing young riders into doping. This is a very good day for cycling.

[Mr A]

This is being covered on Newsnight on BBC2 right now BTW

[Mr A]

Martin up to third in Beijing after coming second on today's stage.

[Real ale Madrid]

http://cyclinginvestigation.usada.org/
.

I wonder does "schumi" post here anymore ? :D

[Mr A]

Bruyneel fired by Radioshack today.

Many other riders are mentioned in the evidence, including Contador. This is going to run and run.

[Schumi]

I wonder does "schumi" post here anymore ? :D
:confused: What am I missing here?

[Mr A]

Schumi was the codeword for Ferrari the doping doctor who received over a million dollars from Armstrong and has been at the centre of doping cyclists for many years.

[Schumi]

Schumi was the codeword for Ferrari the doping doctor who received over a million dollars from Armstrong and has been at the centre of doping cyclists for many years.

Ah I see, I haven't read the report yet. I thought I had been pegged as an Armstrong fan or something!

[Macy]

Ah I see, I haven't read the report yet. I thought I had been pegged as an Armstrong fan or something!
You're not a fan? Cancer lover...

[Dodge]

Levi sacked for his part. Despite them knowing about his part as he's failed a test in the past. Bit mad. Meanwhile Nike stick with Lance.

[Macy]

Levi sacked for his part. Despite them knowing about his part as he's failed a test in the past. Bit mad.
Convenient excuse to clear budget and roster space for Cav? There's still a lot of hypocrisy about, and it without that excuse it does stink of omerta. Very damaging time for Sky for me to - they keep digging, and they're lucky that the english speaking press aren't really questioning them (which is very reminiscent!).


Meanwhile Nike stick with Lance.
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/report-did-nike-pay-dollar-500000-to-verbruggen-to-cover-up-armstrong-positive

And Oakley.
http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/13064/Oakley-standing-behind-Armstrong-for-now.aspx

[Real ale Madrid]

ITV cycling just tweeted that that Lance Armstrong has just stepped down as chairman of the Livestrong foundation.

[Mr A]

Nike "dropped" him too. Oakley and Trek- are you watching?

But Lance is still at Livestrong, just not chair, and Nike still support them. The lines between Lance and Livestrong are very blurred and he has done very well out of them- while they have contributed very little to actual cancer research, mostly they're just about 'awareness'. Note also that while livestrong.org is a charity, livestrong.com that most people go to is very much for profit.

[Real ale Madrid]

Trek have dropped him now as well - add to that Anheuser Busch and Radioshack.

Soon Lance will have more testicles than sponsors.

[Mr A]

But most still support Livestrong and still Livestrong = Armstrong.

There's a lot more to come on Ferrari: http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/gazzetta-reveals-scale-of-doping-and-money-laundering-under-dr-ferrari

Persons from the following teams implicated: Liquigas, Lampre, Colnago, Geox, Androni, Katusha, Quick Step, CSF-Inox, Farnese Vini, Acqua & Sapone, Astana, RadioShack, Vacansoleil, Isd, CSF, LPR, Diquigiovanni, Tinkoff, Rabobank, Gerolsteiner and Milram.

Meanwhile Barredo is going under the bus: http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/uci-request-doping-procedure-against-carlos-barredo

[Macy]

Rabobank pulling out of sponsoring. Considering there's been enough internal issues, seems like it could be a convenient excuse to blame the USADA report. Unless they know something that's coming down the road.

[Real ale Madrid]

Rabobank pulling out of sponsoring. Considering there's been enough internal issues, seems like it could be a convenient excuse to blame the USADA report. Unless they know something that's coming down the road.

Seems a pity to me on a week where a huge amount of the "omerta" was broken, a major sponsor has cut ties.

[Macy]

Seems a pity to me on a week where a huge amount of the "omerta" was broken, a major sponsor has cut ties.
I wouldn't be surprised if it's getting out while the going is relatively good. http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/gazzetta-reveals-scale-of-doping-and-money-laundering-under-dr-ferrari

[Mr A]

Rabobank have plenty of history on this front and with the banks bursting on Omerta there may be more hits coming down the line for them so maybe getting out ahead of the posse made sense.

There'll be a few sighs of relief at AG2R and FDJ mind you!

EDIT: It looks like the team will continue for a year, but will simply wear white rather than Rabobank colours.

[Mr A]

Saxo Tinkoff get their license so Roche will be in the World Tour next year. Katusha surprisingly relegated. Can't say I feel very sorry for them. But do they really have more ethical issues than Astana or Saxo? Hard to fathom.

[Dodge]

Dunno if its ethical. I think katusha make a rider sign a contract that states they owe the team all their wages paid if caught doping. Something's up anyway

Brammeier signed for a pro-continental team called Champion Systems. Said he wants to ride more for himself than just a lead out man

[Mr A]

It is financial apparently. Kinda like getting Capone on tax evasion perhaps.

Meanwhile Scarponi gets 3 months for working with Ferrari. FFS. He also got pinged in Puerto.

[Dodge]

And the 3 months is back dated, so he's free to ride in 18 days time.

[Mr A]

Yeah. A suspension that does not exclude him from a single race. That'll teach him.

[BonnieShels]

David Walsh interview on Newstalk.

Part 2 coming up.