5th place play-off of sorts

[outspoken]

So tomorrow night is a cup final of sorts for 5th place. While there would still be tones of work to do with a win it would still keep us in a very tasty mix till the end of the season.

But a loss would end all hopes of 5th as blues have a game in hand.

After our excellent performance in Monaghan I'm hoping we can put in the exact same work rate and get a draw at least while our home record against waterford could help us push on for the win :)

Really looking forward to the game but I doubt many others will bother to come out and watch which is very disappointing.

Have been thinking about formations a lot since Gillespie came back and maybe its time we went all Barcelona and played with 2 holding midfielders (Gillespie and Hylo) and let the other 3 midfielders (Brady, Salmo, Crawley) at it with aussie up front on his own, a player able to provide a match winning moment.

Then again Waterford will be going all out attack so maybe its not the game to look at that formation, anyway just a thought during what was a long week :)

[Martinho II]

deans wont be playin as hes still servin that 3 match suspension.. hes much missed for being the chief organiser in defence and in givin players rollickings and gee-ups.. I am goin to predict us to lose in the hope that we win..

[outspoken]

While deanzeys orders are missed I have faith in floody and hope! Have hope!

[outspoken]

Fantastic performance all round tonight every single player gave it 110% and they finally got their reward not without the traditional flancare nervous last 10 minutes but we got their with fantastic attacking play in the first and iron defending in the second.

Jeff flood man of the match for me he won every single ball superb! Rouse made a world class save and was excellent in his shot stopping and catching tonight but his kicking needs work but still a 7/10 performance for him.

Brady was stunning again while Crawley gave us a real threat as always, great to have 2 pacy and natural wingers.

Jean worked hard again and I'd love to see him score one as reward for that hard work.

As for Gillespie it was a sending off I'm afraid he stumbled over the ball about 4 times before finally been booked and to clap at that fat pr1ck of a ref was very silly for such an experienced player, he exploded at the lino then so FAIlure will probably give him an extended ban but really they should be banning ten tone tessies from refereeing what a joke of a so called ref. Wouldn't be a town game without a clown in black I suppose.

Anyway 5th place is ours again now and I absoutely can't wait for the funn harps game next week it's another massive test for us

[Acornvilla]

Harps and salthill are the next 2 so 6 points there and that should be enough to get us 5th really given how all over the shop waterford are half the time they shall drop some points, town have a way of stealing defeat from the jaws of victory thou so I wont be counting any chickens. Good to get a win

[outspoken]

Attendance of 101 nearly cried when I saw the attendance last night, heard people using the weather as an excuse but if it's not the weather it's the gaa and if it's Not the gaa it's the game on tv and bla bla bla, awful the way people desert their local team.

[Macy]

Hard to judge the performance, as Waterford didn't look at all interested first half. They must have got a deserved rollacking at half time, and it was more even.

I'm something of a Gillespie defender, as I think his contribution has a tendancy to be underrated (and it's not like his wages would be available for elsewhere), but he was stupid to get sent off. Whether the booking was harsh or not is debatable (probably was justified imo, at that stage of the game), but to get sent off like that was reynolds-esque. Ref wasn't great all night, but clapping a decision like that is a booking. Both bookings justified is my conclusion.

Surprised the attendance reached 3 figures, 101 looks a bit face saving to me. Having said that, was a terrible night and whilst we're looking for progress it was essentially a dead rubber. It's always going to be hard to get the numbers out in those circumstances. I'd be more bothered by the lack of numbers when we were still in with a shout earlier on, tbh.

[outspoken]

Hopefully we can keep this squad together now and add a bit more quality in certain positions and that should see us pushing for a top 3-4 place and hopefully that will intice a few people into coming out.

[Acornvilla]

Hopefully we can keep this squad together now and add a bit more quality in certain positions and that should see us pushing for a top 3-4 place and hopefully that will intice a few people into coming out.
well 3 good teams will be going up and 1 crap one coming down so we should be aiming top 3 at the very least next season if we keep the same squad as the quality of the 1st division will have lowered quite a lot.

[Cabs88]

great to get a win, it was getting very dis heartening heading out and seeing us being performing badly week in week out! We took both our goals well but still Waterford had plenty of chances in the second half to get somethin out of the game. Very impressed by Crawley since he has arrived, he always gives 100%, always closing down and likes to be involved in the play, he would definately be one of the first players we should keep along with Sammo.. Though Flood was very good last night, wasnt sure of him before but he really stepped up last night and won everything in the air.. Gillespie deserved to be sent off, was stupid what he did, I do think he adds to the team, but he hasnt played for us often enough between injuries and suspensions.. Hopefully we see out the season with a couple of results would be nice to hit the winter break as the best of the rest

[Acornvilla]

I assume Mr. Gillespie will be off at seasons end?

[Martinho II]

delighted with the result. dowling took his header well from a super cross from gillespie it had goal written all over it.. I think that we have a serious chance of gettin fifth but it all depends on waterford's run-in. I am not sure who they are playin.. At least we have more points than last season.. I think we will beat Harps away as we have won every game there this season and Salthill at home. We wont get anythin from Cork.. but I am very happy with the way we are endin the season after our awful blip.. btw i agree with Macy that Gillespie deserved to be sent off for clappin at the ref.

[outspoken]

I assume Mr. Gillespie will be off at seasons end?

Depends if anyone else wants him, I think we should sell him to some aisan club for a few millon haha they obbesed with former united players they'd pay anything for them :)

[Acornvilla]

Depends if anyone else wants him, I think we should sell him to some aisan club for a few millon haha they obbesed with former united players they'd pay anything for them :)

well more does he need the money badly enough to keep playing was my thinking, and do we really want/need him, and will munnely still be happy to stump up the cash

[Macy]

well more does he need the money badly enough to keep playing was my thinking, and do we really want/need him, and will munnely still be happy to stump up the cash
If he's available on the same basis, imo, we'd be nuts not to keep him on.

[Martinho II]

If he's available on the same basis, imo, we'd be nuts not to keep him on.
based on the quality of his corner for graham dowlings goal I would keep him.. people tend to forget that he was unlucky not to score earlier in the season in gortakeegan from his cracker of a freekick..theres also the PR aspect too..

[Cabs88]

based on the quality of his corner for graham dowlings goal I would keep him.. people tend to forget that he was unlucky not to score earlier in the season in gortakeegan from his cracker of a freekick..theres also the PR aspect too..

I think any pr spin we may have received from signing him is long since gone to be honest, I do think he is a useful addition, but then again he hasnt played often enough between injury and suspension and i think the money could be spent better and pump the money into keeping Sammo and dotsy in particular rather than 'sponsoring' gillespie.. I dont think we can justify keeping him by two set pieces... If we were to sign him on squad wages (and i know that wont happen) by all means keep him

[outspoken]

I think any pr spin we may have received from signing him is long since gone to be honest, I do think he is a useful addition, but then again he hasnt played often enough between injury and suspension and i think the money could be spent better and pump the money into keeping Sammo and dotsy in particular rather than 'sponsoring' gillespie.. I dont think we can justify keeping him by two set pieces... If we were to sign him on squad
wages (and i know that wont happen) by all means keep him

fantastic post totally agree.

[Longfordian]

I saw an interview with Cathal Brady on extratime, he was saying TC has been chatting to him about next season and he says he's happy to stay on. Training is handy for him, he knows Tony well and he likes the club. So hopefully we'll keep most of those we want to keep. The manager's working on it anyway which is important. Gillespie has made a contribution when he's played but as has been said if the money has to be found to keep some of our best players then I'd rather do that.

[Macy]

If we don't keep Gillespie will his wages be available for the general squad budget? If no, we'd be better with him than without, imo.

[Longfordian]

Honestly don't know how exactly his wage situation works but from what I've heard there'll likely be less money coming in from Munnelly next year in general. A certain amount of Gillespie's wages are coming out of the original club budget I believe. We'll see I guess, a lot will depend on how much Cousins wants to keep him too. I wouldn't be averse to keeping him in the right circumstances either.

[L.T.F.C.]

Honestly don't know how exactly his wage situation works but from what I've heard there'll likely be less money coming in from Munnelly next year in general. A certain amount of Gillespie's wages are coming out of the original club budget I believe. We'll see I guess, a lot will depend on how much Cousins wants to keep him too. I wouldn't be averse to keeping him in the right circumstances either.
I've heard that more money was going in!

[Longfordian]

Really? Could be the case, it would surprise me but I've only heard second hand reports to be honest. He's already paying a large amount relative to the value of what he gets out of it.

[Acornvilla]

Thing is he is also going to be what, 37 odd next season, so dunno how much use hes going to be after a few months break and being that age. Most importantly thou has anyone any idea if this question has been put to him or more importantly Tony yet?

[outspoken]

Well like the lads said it's much more important we keep the likes of dotsy and salmo, while it's great to say Keith Gillespie plays for us I'd much rather keep the current squad together and add some really quality up front for next season and in the back 4 too, next season can be our season without sounding cocky I say that.

[L.T.F.C.]

I hope it isn't. We're not ready.

[Longfordian]

I'd be happy enough to be challenging next season really. Improvement year on year is what we should be aiming for. If we did go up we'd struggle but to be honest I'm not sure when we'd be in a position to do anything else in the medium term whilst still operating on a sustainable budget. Promotion has to be the aim at some point though, the club isn't going to develop much outside the Premier Division.

[Martinho II]

I thought Munnelly was paying Gillespies wages if he played.. I wouldnt be surprised if he would be kept on especially if he has any tendencies towards coaching ,managin. I am pretty confident that he will be at the dinner dance as I believe he loves it down here.. we will soon know but it was very encouragin readin dotsy's interview as for the first time in seven long years a lot of players could be gettin into their third season with us . Its four years since a town player made over 100 appearances and that was Dessie Baker and Sean Prunty.

[Cabs88]

would I be right in saying gary cronin would have made more than 100 appearances this being his second stint with the club?! A last point on Gillespie is that I dont think I saw him at many (if any) of the games he was unavailable for... thats just an aside...

As mentioned above if we improve year on year we should be all pleased with that. I do think promotion should be the ultimate ambition and although we may not be ready for it financially, should we hold on to players and keep a sensible budget, a year in the premier would still be more lucrative than a year in the first division.. Who knows another Don might arrive and we make a bit of profit on him, and might keep the show on the road for another few weeks at a time. We just have to be glad there are clubs in a lot worse situations than we are at the moment.

[Martinho II]

no Gary Cronin definitely hasnt made 100 appearances Cabs.. Till the start of the season he had only made 62 appearances in his two spells.. This season is goin to be the first season that he played the majority of appearances as any other season he only had a bit part to say.. If he stays for next season he will definitely get it as I am not sure if Mick Lee will stay or not and he will find it hard to get his place back..

[L.T.F.C.]

We need another couple of seasons in the First Division. Maybe a proper cup run next season to encourage more people to come out. Then the following season we can really challenge with some more people paying in. With a good basis such as this, we would be a better option for sponsors and players.

[Macy]

I'd be hoping we'd be challenging next year, at least for a play off (assuming it's a similar system), given who's probably going up. 4th place (assuming 1 up, and 2-4 in the playoff), shouldn't be an unrealistic target.

[outspoken]

We need another couple of seasons in the First Division. Maybe a proper cup run next season to encourage more people to come out. Then the following season we can really challenge with some more people paying in. With a good basis such as this, we would be a better option for sponsors and players.

I wouldnt agree with that notion at all. I think the lads are right when they say 1 season in the Premier would be much better than one in the First Division. Yes we have a small budget and crap attendances but surely a promotion run would get a few more out and a promotion would have the same effects as a cup run in terms of attendances.

The only way for young players especially to develop is to play at a higher level so even if we went up and came straight back down with some heavy beatings it would only show the lads how much work we have to do to become just a midtable premier side so lets hope we get their sooner rather than later because one thing is for sure if we continue with the attendances of last saturday night we wont be going far.

[Acornvilla]

I've heard that more money was going in!

Just been told the same, and some other things.., (But i'm not telling till the club or someone else does!)

[L.T.F.C.]

I wouldnt agree with that notion at all. I think the lads are right when they say 1 season in the Premier would be much better than one in the First Division. Yes we have a small budget and crap attendances but surely a promotion run would get a few more out and a promotion would have the same effects as a cup run in terms of attendances.

The only way for young players especially to develop is to play at a higher level so even if we went up and came straight back down with some heavy beatings it would only show the lads how much work we have to do to become just a midtable premier side so lets hope we get their sooner rather than later because one thing is for sure if we continue with the attendances of last saturday night we wont be going far.

How is one season in the Prem a better job than another season in the First, building up on a squad and re-building the fan base?
A season in the Premier would put us back down in the First Division for another four years. We neither have the money or players to last more than one season. We're running a stable club at the moment, and doing quite well in the division we're in. A decent promotion run next year, and a cup run, maybe getting to the semi-finals or something would bring more people out, get more money in and encouraging the players we want to stay.
Do you think the lads would stay after getting relegated? One player stayed after 07 and that was Daire Doyle.

[outspoken]

How is one season in the Prem a better job than another season in the First, building up on a squad and re-building the fan base?
A season in the Premier would put us back down in the First Division for another four years. We neither have the money or players to last more than one season. We're running a stable club at the moment, and doing quite well in the division we're in. A decent promotion run next year, and
a cup run, maybe getting to the semi-finals or something would bring more people out, get more money in and encouraging the players we want to stay.
Do you think the lads would stay after getting relegated? One player stayed after 07 and that was Daire Doyle.

so what are you saying? TC should say to his players listen lads were not ready for premier division football so go out and get us into a promotion place and at the end wel give it to someone else?

Small successes such as cup runs and top half finishes are not enough to bring out the sunshiners, they will only come out for cup finals and promotion deciders.

Shamrock rovers, bohemians, Sligo rovers, st pats coming to town on a regular basis that is what brings the crowds out and you said players won't stay after a relegation but their hardly going to stay year after year with a midtable first division club.

[Macy]

How is one season in the Prem a better job than another season in the First, building up on a squad and re-building the fan base?
A season in the Premier would put us back down in the First Division for another four years. We neither have the money or players to last more than one season. We're running a stable club at the moment, and doing quite well in the division we're in. A decent promotion run next year, and a cup run, maybe getting to the semi-finals or something would bring more people out, get more money in and encouraging the players we want to stay.
Do you think the lads would stay after getting relegated? One player stayed after 07 and that was Daire Doyle.
Whilst accepting your caveat about a promotion run, without going up, I think it's very hard to genuinely build in the 1st. This season has been much more encouraging than the last few, and we struggled to 3 figures the last home game. I don't see why promotion, even if it turned out to be just one year, should effect the stability of the club. Once there's realistic expectations, there's no need to blow the budget or come down too hard on the manager/ players. What is a competitive budget nowadays is way less than it used to be, but once we are sensible there wouldn't be anything wrong with being something of a yo yo club for a few years. Whether we go up or not is a different matter, but that should be the amibition if we have a similar standard squad, and it could only be good for the club (with proper off field management).

[Longfordian]

Fully agree with all of that. There's been a lot of lessons learned as regards off the field matters since we were last up and I'd be confident they'd run things properly no matter what division we're in. As you say wages throughout the league are much lower. Cousins seems to have an eye for good, young players and I'd be confident that even if we ended up going down we wouldn't embarrass ourselves by any means.

[Martinho II]

One player stayed after 07 and that was Daire Doyle.

wrong. Seamus Kelly stayed on and so did Alan O 'Riordan plus Daire Doyle. I should know I have compiled all of the stats since 84-85 so I know what I am talking about!

[outspoken]

wrong. Seamus Kelly stayed on and so did Alan O 'Riordan plus Daire Doyle. I should know I have compiled all of the stats since 84-85 so I know what I am talking about!

Aye, your right there but Shay didn't last long after that unfortunately. We never really replaced him but I think this season we have been far more stable between the sticks than years gone by. I've been really impressed with Rouse in the last 3 games he looks really solid in terms if handling, catching, organisation and sweeping, his kicking would be his weakest attribute but he is improving on it.

[L.T.F.C.]

I don't know what you mean about TC saying to his players that push for promotion, but give it to someone else. The fact is, our squad isn't good enough for the premier. We need to spend another while down here. This is the first year we've assembled some form of squad that is challenging the better teams in the division. That took four years. Being thrown into the premier will put us back down where we are, and being left with a few players(Sorry Marty). Cousins gone then and another few years of rebuilding. Next thing you know we're a solid First Division team. We need to have patience and take our time. Outspoken, you need to check what a sunshiner is. They'll come out when thats happening be it Champions League or promotion decider. We've worked very hard in the First Division, we shouldn't throw it away!

[Acornvilla]

well we are going to be in the 1st division for another season at least, and if we are good enough to get promoted we (the players) deserve to be up there in 2 years time, this discussion is a bit stupid

[outspoken]

well we are going to be in the 1st division for another season at least, and if we are good enough to get promoted we (the players) deserve to be up there in 2 years time, this discussion is a bit stupid

Ye it is stupid I can't imagine any fan of any team saying oh sh1te we just got promoted damn it anyway???? If we go up it will be a brilliant day no matter what follows, as long as we have a club to follow I'm pretty happy.

[L.T.F.C.]

Ye it is stupid I can't imagine any fan of any team saying oh sh1te we just got promoted damn it anyway???? If we go up it will be a brilliant day no matter what follows, as long as we have a club to follow I'm pretty happy.
"A brilliant day"? What good is one day? Useless is what it is.

There is precedence here. The precedence being: we were relegated. Three years of mediocrity. This season we have been playing well enough. If we go up next season, we'll more than likely come straight back down and loose all of our players and probably Cousins. We have neither the money, fans nor Premier league standard players to compete. If we did get promoted it would be a bittersweet day for me anyway.

[Longfordian]

There's another precedent, Bray Wanderers. For a number of years they were a bit of a yo yo club but they ran their club well and didn't run into any major financial difficulties, keeping a solid nucleus of players. We lost most of our players in 2007 but other clubs were spending much more money then. The difference between what they'd get elsewhere these days and what the Town could pay them wouldn't be that big and there's only a limited number of clubs that would suit them in terms of location, training etc. If they get destroyed in the Premier Division as you seem to think they would why would any of the other clubs be fighting over them? Every club needs ambition and as long as things are run smoothly off the field then promotion can be a good thing.

[outspoken]

There's another precedent, Bray Wanderers. For a number of years they were a bit of a yo yo club but they ran their club well and didn't run into any major financial difficulties, keeping a solid nucleus of players. We lost most of our players in 2007 but other clubs were spending much more money then. The difference between what they'd get elsewhere these days and what

the Town could pay them wouldn't be that big and there's only a limited number of clubs that would suit them in terms of location, training etc. If they get destroyed in the Premier Division as you seem to think they would why would any of the other clubs be fighting over them? Every club needs ambition and as long as things are run smoothly off the field then promotion can be a good thing.

summed up pretty much everything I was going to say there. Have to say I've never heard anyone say it would be bittersweet to see their team promoted.

[Macy]

There is precedence here. The precedence being: we were relegated. Three years of mediocrity. This season we have been playing well enough. If we go up next season, we'll more than likely come straight back down and loose all of our players and probably Cousins. We have neither the money, fans nor Premier league standard players to compete. If we did get promoted it would be a bittersweet day for me anyway.
To focus on the relegation as the cause of our problems is totally unrealistic. The reality is, even if we'd survived we'd have lost that many players because of the financial issues of the previous few seasons (overspending/ imploding attendances). It's like when looking at where we are as a State and blaming it on the auld lehmans, and ignoring the previous 5 years governmental feck ups.

[outspoken]

To focus on the relegation as the cause of our problems is totally unrealistic. The reality is, even if we'd survived we'd have lost that many players because of the financial issues of the previous few seasons (overspending/ imploding attendances). It's like when looking at where we are as a State and blaming it on the
auld lehmans, and ignoring the previous 5 years governmental feck ups.

well said.

[L.T.F.C.]

While taking all of your points on board, and admitting that thinking about relegation as a detrimental to us is kinda wrong I still think that the club as a whole isn't ready for the Premier. We had a fairly good squad in 2007. We had the league's top scorer! When we go up, we want to stay there. Going up and down isn't what we need. I'd much rather be competitive in the First Division , than getting hockeyed every week in the Premier Division!

[Acornvilla]

Well we were competitive this season, next season we push on and improve, so if we do achieve promotion we are well worth our place up there in 2 years time, it is a long way away you must remember :)