If we were at Euro 2004?

[tricky_colour]

How would we do?

We have beaten the Dutch and the Czechs and are miles better than England.

Quarters, semis runners up or winners? :)

[brine2]

In fairness, Ireland were knocked out by the two teams that have so far failed to score in 360 minutes of Euro 2004 football between them.

[carnstien]

In fairness I don't think that it really matters that we were knocked out by two ****e teams because the Irish team has come a million miles since the disgraceful display in Basle. The difference Miller, Ried, King Roy, O'Brien and playing Duff in his proper position make to the Irish team is massive.

If we were there and the team was properly selected and orginised I think we would do very well. When it comes to our 1st eleven I genuinly think we are as good, player for player, as the Czech Republic, Portugal, Holland or Germany, all sides who were tipped to win the tournement.

We may still be a level below the likes of Spain, France or Italy but I see no reason why we couldn't have made the Semi-Finals.

[nlgbbbblth]

I know for a lot of people it's preferable to see England lose at Euro 2004 and have Ireland not qualify [I know a few Celtic fans who think like this]

rather than England win at Euro 2004 and Ireland qualify

but if we were there we would make QFs anyway

[lopez]

I know for a lot of people it's preferable to see England lose at Euro 2004 and have Ireland not qualify [I know a few Celtic fans who think like this]

rather than England win at Euro 2004 and Ireland qualify

but if we were there we would make QFs anywayLiving in England myself, you don't know how tempting that offer is. What was it I read about Barcelona fans? In a poll 55% said they enjoyed watching Real Madrid lose than watching Barcelona win. Sad.... :( but that's not the face I'll have if Croatia win tommorrow night!! :D :D

However these Celtic fans don't need Ireland to qualify when they've got their own interpretation of Ireland (see pro/anti Celtic posts for other opinions). :rolleyes:

[1MickCollins]

By and large there isn't much between all of the teams and no one team has really stood out after two rounds. The "weaker" teams like Greece and Latvia have been able to work hard and use neagtive tactics to even the contest.
We wouldn't be out of place there but not easy to predict how we would do, maybe 2, 3 or 4 points out of 6 given previous participation in EC/WC.

[gmani]

By and large there isn't much between all of the teams and no one team has really stood out after two rounds. The "weaker" teams like Greece and Latvia have been able to work hard and use neagtive tactics to even the contest.
We wouldn't be out of place there but not easy to predict how we would do, maybe 2, 3 or 4 points out of 6 given previous participation in EC/WC.

your absolutely rite.....yeh it would be hard to see how we would do, and it really is all about how hard you work...which is what GREeCE in particular has showed

[tiktok]

In fairness I don't think that it really matters that we were knocked out by two ****e teams because the Irish team has come a million miles since the disgraceful display in Basle. The difference Miller, Ried, King Roy, O'Brien and playing Duff in his proper position make to the Irish team is massive.

yeah, but would those changes have come about if we'd won in Basle, IMO they wouldn't.

[Bowsy]

yeah, but would those changes have come about if we'd won in Basle, IMO they wouldn't.

Very good point. What would our team look like if we had won in Basle. RMK wouldn't be there. Duff would proabably be playing through injury and miss the all the opening world cup qualifiers. Reid, Miller, Barrett, O'brien, etc would never have been given the chance to prove themselves. Obviously the point of playing is to reach Championship finals but i think our team has improved as a result of not qualifying.

[eirebhoy]

Very good point. What would our team look like if we had won in Basle. RMK wouldn't be there. Duff would proabably be playing through injury and miss the all the opening world cup qualifiers. Reid, Miller, Barrett, O'brien, etc would never have been given the chance to prove themselves. Obviously the point of playing is to reach Championship finals but i think our team has improved as a result of not qualifying.
I made all those points in another thread a couple of weeks ago. I think it's for the very best that we didn't qualify for the Championships. Since Brian took over midway through the qualifiers he didn't have a chance to build his own team. If we did qualify he would have been picking all the experienced players for the pre-comp friendlies and would have had no time to build a new team.

[Junior]

I made all those points in another thread a couple of weeks ago. I think it's for the very best that we didn't qualify for the Championships. Since Brian took over midway through the qualifiers he didn't have a chance to build his own team. If we did qualify he would have been picking all the experienced players for the pre-comp friendlies and would have had no time to build a new team.

I can never agree with those type of sentiments. As a fan its killing me watching this championship on tv, wishing I was there following my team. Yeah I know we didn't deserve to qualify, but I don't agree with the 'its for the best' type arguments.

The experience gained in being at a major championships far outweighs that of a few friendlies.

Though I take the point about it being more difficult to introduce youngsters while in a competitive situation.

Out of interest will those teams that are partaking in euro04 play any friendlies before the wcq start in Sept??

[eirebhoy]

Out of interest will those teams that are partaking in euro04 play any friendlies before the wcq start in Sept??
We play Bulgaria in August, so yes.

We could be going through torture watching Ireland getting beaten in every match with the likes of Kinsella in the starting lineup. We wouldn't have a hope of beating France without the likes of Duffer and Keane. A half fit Kilbane, Holland, Kinsella and probably an inexperienced Miller or Carsley would be our midfield for the championships. Brian needed these 9 friendlies to build a new team and he wouldn't have done so if we qualified for the EC. I mean there has been 5/6 changes to the starting lineup since our last competitive game. We also always do our best in qualifiers when we hadn't qualified for the previous tournament plus we have a newfound confidence after beaten the Czech Republic and Holland. The championships are nearly over so you should be thinking of the future.

[Junior]

We play Bulgaria in August, so yes.

The question posed concerned those teams that HAD qualified for Portugal, however, I'll asume that all teams will play friendlies in August.



We could be going through torture watching Ireland getting beaten in every match with the likes of Kinsella in the starting lineup. We wouldn't have a hope of beating France without the likes of Duffer and Keane. A half fit Kilbane, Holland, Kinsella and probably an inexperienced Miller or Carsley would be our midfield for the championships. Brian needed these 9 friendlies to build a new team and he wouldn't have done so if we qualified for the EC. I mean there has been 5/6 changes to the starting lineup since our last competitive game. We also always do our best in qualifiers when we hadn't qualified for the previous tournament plus we have a newfound confidence after beaten the Czech Republic and Holland.

Would rather go through torture watching my team IN the championships than not at all, for ****sakes we haven't been in a european championship since '88!!!!

If you think that we now have a team that is more capable of qualifying for the wc06 than we would have if we had taken part in euro04, then you have a lot of faith. I still think participation in euro04 plus the 1 or 2 friendlies we would have squeezed in would have been better for the team AND the fans of course.

Previous experience tells me we generally play above ourselves in these tournies anyway, so doubt we would have been embarassed even if we didn't qualify for latter stages.



The championships are nearly over so you should be thinking of the future.

Are you drunk? :confused: :confused:

[finlma]

The question posed concerned those teams that HAD qualified for Portugal, however, I'll asume that all teams will play friendlies in August.



Bulgaria did qualify for Portugal or have I picked up your point incorrectly?

[Junior]

Bulgaria did qualify for Portugal or have I picked up your point incorrectly?

Nope you did pick up my point correctly, I am a doughnut wearing green tinted specs. doh!!!!!!!!

[eirebhoy]

Are you drunk? :confused: :confused:
I was pointing out what I felt were the long term benifits of failing to qualify for the EC. The players would have got 3/4 matches of experience by qualifying and the FAI a few million euro, nothing much IMO. I don't know why you had to make a personal insult like that and I still can't figure out what I said to make you say it. We deservedly failed to qualify for the championship's 8 months ago and us Irish have been disapointed since than, the final is on Sunday week. If you don't think that they are nearly over I think you should direct your own comment at yourself.

[Plastic Paddy]

Nope you did pick up my point correctly, I am a doughnut wearing green tinted specs. doh!!!!!!!!

But not green-and-white tinted, oh no. I can't believe you forgot Bulgaria are at Euro 2004 with Stan Petrov captaining them an' all! :eek: :p

:D PP

[Junior]

I was pointing out what I felt were the long term benifits of failing to qualify for the EC. The players would have got 3/4 matches of experience by qualifying and the FAI a few million euro, nothing much IMO. I don't know why you had to make a personal insult like that and I still can't figure out what I said to make you say it. We deservedly failed to qualify for the championship's 8 months ago and us Irish have been disapointed since than, the final is on Sunday week. If you don't think that they are nearly over I think you should direct your own comment at yourself.

apologies if I offended, I was only pulling yer leg.

To be fair the group games are still being played + quarters + semis + final - its hardly nearly over is it?? It was only this comment I was referring to.

[Junior]

But not green-and-white tinted, oh no. I can't believe you forgot Bulgaria are at Euro 2004 with Stan Petrov captaining them an' all! :eek: :p

:D PP

I'd say if you asked Stan , he'd deny all knowledge of ever being there :D

[eirebhoy]

apologies if I offended, I was only pulling yer leg.

To be fair the group games are still being played + quarters + semis + final - its hardly nearly over is it?? It was only this comment I was referring to.
NP, I left my sarcasm detector in work. ;)

I was comparing the 8 months of disapointment and jealousy to the 2 weeks that are left if you know what i mean.

[Littlest Hobo]

come on lads, quit the small talk.
Its been painful watching them lot beat the croats tonight :(
We need to stick together and encouage our boyz through the next dozen or so matches. We have to make Germany.
Lets all wait our turn for the passion and pain of it all. And when we get that chance lets take it.
Duffer please get fit, Robbie you can do it for us all over again :)
Belief is half the battle. And I believe we can :)

[Jon'o]

come on lads, quit the small talk.
Its been painful watching them lot beat the croats tonight :(
We need to stick together and encouage our boyz through the next dozen or so matches. We have to make Germany.
Lets all wait our turn for the passion and pain of it all. And when we get that chance lets take it.
Duffer please get fit, Robbie you can do it for us all over again :)
Belief is half the battle. And I believe we can :)

bring on the war :confused: :D

[Bowsy]

come on lads, quit the small talk.
Its been painful watching them lot beat the croats tonight :(
We need to stick together and encouage our boyz through the next dozen or so matches. We have to make Germany.
Lets all wait our turn for the passion and pain of it all. And when we get that chance lets take it.
Duffer please get fit, Robbie you can do it for us all over again :)
Belief is half the battle. And I believe we can :)

That's fightin' talk, i like it. :)

All this talk is academic now. If any of us wouldn't want to see Ireland at this championship they wouldn't be on this forum. We have to focus on positives now, i.e the good the friendlies have done us, emergence of several young players and the ordinariness(if that's a word) of Switzerland and to a lesser extent France in Euro 2004. Bring on the qualifiers.

[concanta]

This might be a bit maverick but I think it would be even better if France were our first game - then we could really catch them on the hop

[Closed Account 2]

Most optimistic prediction - might have got to the semis (like the Greeks), least optimistic prediction - got one win (like Russia), IMO were are miles better than the Swiss who are a team that can only do stuff at home (or if they have the opposition doing bizzare substitutions). It would have depended on lots of things :-

- Injuries / suspensions (esp with key players, the Keanes and Duff)
- Group I'd have fancied being in most groups bar the Dutch, Czech and the Italian, Dane and Swedish gps.
- Time of games - 2 5:00pm kick offs, (esp in places like Faró) and the heat would have cost us.

There are probably others but I cant think. Certainly the big boys arent up to much so far, which makes me think we would have had a chance.

Anyway WC2006 is more important (as its a World Cup, and thanks to Blatter probably the last one in an easily accessable place for 12 years), I'd rather see us do well in that. Personally I'd love it if we won the World Cup (wow one sentence and ive managed to mix an understatement and day dream into one) in Germany. Imagine being able to silence all the Brits who havent done diddley squat for (now effectivly) 40 years, especially in Germany that would top the lot...

... of course we probably wont even get there, but ah well.

[Duncan Gardner]

Imagine being able to silence all the Brits who havent done diddley squat for (now effectivly) 40 years, especially in Germany that would top the lot...


Diddley squat apart from the World Cup semi-final and European semi-final you mean? :)

[Littlest Hobo]

Diddley squat apart from the World Cup semi-final and European semi-final you mean? :)

**** off Gardner :mad: Try the BBC, where you'll find all the ****ing T*ns, banging on about two world wars and '66.

[carnstien]

**** off Gardner :mad: Try the BBC, where you'll find all the ****ing T*ns, banging on about two world wars and '66.
Why don't you **** off to IRA.com so you misguided fool. If you were from the north you'd probably be either the leader of the Orange Order or of the real IRA the way you are going on, why don't you get a clue.

[Closed Account 2]

Diddley squat apart from the World Cup semi-final and European semi-final you mean? :)


Well who remembers 4th in 1990 and 3rd= in Euro 96 ? Lets face it winning the world cup is great, and even if you get beat in the final well at least your runners up. But no-one remembers teams that go out in the semis, the English record in those tournaments is much the same as in 2002, 98 or this year... not good enough to get to important stages. No-ones going to remember the teams that go out on this wednesday or thursday.

[Duncan Gardner]

Thank you Hobo, but I hope to be around a while yet :)

Apart from the mindless abuse (Hobo) and obsession with others' nationality (Dav), what's your point? That England disappoint their more realistic fans, let alone the tabloid media? Fair enough. That they've done nothing since 1990? Only if you agree with Edmundo that reaching the final's the only measure of success.

[Closed Account 2]

well theyve qualified for 3 more tournaments than us since 90. They got to 92 we didnt, (-1), we got to USA 94 they didnt (0), Euro 96 doesnt count as they didnt have to qualify, they got to 98 (-1), 2000 (-2), both at 2002, and then they got this one in Portugal (-3). So in terms of getting to all competitions their record is better. But if you look at just World Cups, we've missed one and theyve missed one (98, and 94). In 98 they scraped thru the group stage and were knocked out next match, I guess similar to us in 94. In 2002 they got one round futher than us, but they had an easier group with Sweden (who we beat easily in 2002), Nigeria (who had a stinker of a world cup that year) and a below par Argentina. In that time they only scored 2 goals, which by anyones reckoning is pretty shoddy. Then they hammered a weak Danish side, who Robbie Keane and Duffer also demolished, and the Brazilians beat them without breaking sweat. We got one round less but we had a harder group. We drew with the African champions, drew with the eventual runner ups (and totally outplayed them), and beat the Saudis (who werent up to much). We scored 5 (3 more than the English) in those games and let in 2 (only one more). We then drew 1-1 with the Spaniards (who were top class oposition), and went out on pens. The teams' records in WC2002

Us W1 D3* L0 (*lost 1 on pens)
The English W2 D2 L1

Pretty similar. Anyway theyve got a much bigger potential number of players (49 million population against about 4 million), if you take into account our population size then weve got one of the best records in international football.

[eirebhoy]

While we're talking about this, here's both Ireland's and England's record in Euro Championships qualifiers and finals from 1960-2000. (From http://www.rsssf.com/tablese/euro-ranktot.html)

country Pl W D L GF GA GD 2W Pt 3W Pa

England 81 43 23 15 156- 60 + 96 109 116 152 (10)
Ireland 80 31 22 27 116- 97 + 19 84 94 115 (11)

Pl matches played
W matches won
D matches drawn
L matches lost
GF goals scored
GA goals conceded
GD goal difference
2W points obtained, based on 2/win
Pt points obtained (2/win pre-1994, 3/win post-1994)
3W points obtained, based on 3/win
Pa number of participations

Not bad considering they would have been at least one seeding above us in most groups.

[Littlest Hobo]

Why don't you **** off to IRA.com so you misguided fool. If you were from the north you'd probably be either the leader of the Orange Order or of the real IRA the way you are going on, why don't you get a clue.
What are you on about :confused: Whats the IRA and the Orange Order got to do me having a dig at gardner, who was reminding us of past achievements by the T*ns :confused:
Cop on there boy :rolleyes:

[1MickCollins]

Pretty similar. Anyway theyve got a much bigger potential number of players (49 million population against about 4 million), if you take into account our population size then weve got one of the best records in international football.

This is the key point, given our resources our record has been FANTASTIC and the the way football is going we have every right to think that we could get to a semi-final or even a final with a bit of luck. If Latvia can qualify for the finals and Greece can get to the semis, anyone can. And as we don't expect to win the tournament we enjoy it all the more, if your expectations are too high then you are going to be disappointed as only 1 team can win, we have fond memories of EC88, WC90 and WC94 - do England, they bitch and moan about Cameroon. They bitch and moan they bitch and moan....

Could 1 Irish person in a 1000 have named 1 Greek player prior to EC2004? Could they even now? If so could they correctly pronouce the name?

[eirebhoy]

Could 1 Irish person in a 1000 have named 1 Greek player prior to EC2004? Could they even now? If so could they correctly pronouce the name?
I'm sure most of the people who watch premiership football would have know Stelios Giannakopoulos of Bolton and Dabizas of Leicester. Other players I knew before Euro 04 were Karagounis and Dellas. I'd be really suprised if anyone with an interest in British or european football wouldn't know any of those 4 players before euro 2004.

[Duncan Gardner]

Hobo: I think you're the one off the point, since you react to a reference about England qualifying for the odd semi-final with a rant about the Anglo-Irish war. Why?

Mick: aye, if Greece and Croatia can make the semis of course Ireland can.

Karagounis is playing for Inter in Italy, though he only got nine games last term.

[concanta]

I know thsi sis a bit off subject BUT is there a third place play off in this tournement

[hellas]

yasou boyz im greek, ive been readin tha site for about a day and i came across this link..........cmon seriously bro u think that if greece can make the semis u guys can? how do u come to that conclusion? u think were ****?

[Plastic Paddy]

cmon seriously bro u think that if greece can make the semis u guys can? how do u come to that conclusion?

Yes, without question. Don't forget we were a penalty shootout away from the World Cup quarter finals two years ago, while you didn't even qualify. We've changed managers and a number of key players since, hence we didn't qualify for Euro 2004, but I expect us to put up a much better showing in the World Cup 2006 qualifiers.


u think were ****?

No, far from it. We just think that we'd be a match for you (don't forget that we've beaten the Czechs and Holland in the last couple of months), and since you've reached the final, we think we could have done too.

The best of luck, by the way. I'd love you to win it.

:) PP

[tiktok]

yasou boyz im greek, ive been readin tha site for about a day and i came across this link..........cmon seriously bro u think that if greece can make the semis u guys can? how do u come to that conclusion? u think were ****?

Yes we seriously think that if Greece can do it, so can we. No-one said you were sh!t, just that we're probably as good as you on our day.

You've had a very good tournament, with a solid if uninspiring team, and credit where it's due, you've left Spain, France and The Czechs in your wake.

[lopez]

yasou boyz im greek, ive been readin tha site for about a day and i came across this link..........cmon seriously bro u think that if greece can make the semis u guys can? how do u come to that conclusion? u think were ****?WERE (past tense) ****. Not anymore, although I saw the writing on the wall in the tan game in Manchester two years ago! If you can improve from a team that had been to just two finals and had one draw (against Holland in 1980 was it?) to show, then there is hope for everyone.

[carnstien]

yasou boyz im greek, ive been readin tha site for about a day and i came across this link..........cmon seriously bro u think that if greece can make the semis u guys can? how do u come to that conclusion? u think were ****?
Lads obviously this is a **** take, cool name thought!

[lopez]

Lads obviously this is a **** take, cool name thought!Possibly el siete secretos again? Anyway I think he's implying that we're sh*te ourselves for thinking we could ever apsire to such lofty heights as European championship semi-finalists. BTW anyone remember Gelsenkirchen 1988? Eight minutes to go, flukey bounce from Kieft, Van Basten off-side, semi - final waiting if we drew. :(

[Closed Account 2]

looking at Greece winning it... that could have been us.

If we had been there, in the words of a late actor, "we cudda 'ad class... we cudda been contenders".

[lopez]

looking at Greece winning it... that could have been us.

If we had been there, in the words of a late actor, "we cudda 'ad class... we cudda been contenders".Sorry, but I'm still in shock!!! :eek: :eek:

[Jon'o]

fair play to greece. :) :ball:

just wait for the hard done by ingurland fans.... '' could have been us... we woz robbed... no one likes us'' type @rse tommrow.... oh i can see and hear it now more sulking :mad: :rolleyes:

[Closed Account 2]

just wait for the hard done by ingurland fans.... '' could have been us... we woz robbed... no one likes us''

well to be fair the last one is true

[tricky_colour]

Well I fancied Greece, they beat us at home in a friendly in 2000 and
not many teams do that.

Also they had already beaten Portugal in their group and they had
knocked out the mighty French and the fancied Czech's yet they were 4-1 to win the match which I though was ridiculously long odds

Anyway I didn't think they would concede a goal cos they defend well
so I went for a 1:0 win at 8-1.

My £2.50 made me £20 and put my online acount back into profit :D

I did have to sweat it out from the 58th minute though.

I was also gonna have a bet on Sharapova for the tennis but
unfortunately I didn't get on her on time (so to speak) :p

[lopez]

well to be fair the last one is trueOuuuuch!! Anyone see Tom Humphries in the Observer Sports mag? No great fan of 'five dinners' after the sh*t he caused with you-know-who, but he was excellent about In-ger-land. Claimed that when Argentina knocked out the tans in France 98 he jumped up in the press box in St Etienne and 'discgraced myself'. He didn't shout 'Las Islas Malvinas Argentinas' but it was what he was thinking. :D He blames the police for all the hooliganism over the years: 'Beery and xenophobic, given to urinating in public places and completely unaccustomed to sunshine, they are trained to have hair trigger tempers. It's in their make-up to 'over react' and become 'heavy handed'. Those pesky police. No matter where they go their reputation precedes them. It's a minority, of course, because most of them are good police, but that's little consolation when they start breaking windows and urging local women to get their tits out for the lads.' Priceless! :D