Republic of Ireland V Macedonia - Saturday, 26th March 2011 - Euro 2012 Qualifier

[geysir]

Lets not forget Mick Martin who was the scout who did the reports on Macedonia.

[geysir]

McGeady goal, typical type of shot from him, sacrificing that bit of extras power for accuracy. He deserved it, we deserved it.
Kingdom scored a 4/1 double there, McGeady goal and Ireland to win.

[paul_oshea]

well lads i said 2-1 as usual i was right.we never make it easy.great save by westward.we never make it easy.don't know how Duff got man of Kathy.mcgeqdy class

[geysir]

Beglin took 1 second to name motm, no discussion needed, none necessary.

[Crosby87]

What about O'Dea POSH? :cool:

[drummerboy]

Thought McGeady should have got Man of the Match. Duff done a great job and had his hands full with Popov. Delighted to see the new lads doing so well, Westwood, Foley and especially O'Dea.

[paudie]

dunne suspended for the away game but don't forget he gave away the goal. Pandev outpaced him easiy for the yellow as well. O'Dea did well. hopefully O'shea and /or St Ledger will be back for it.

Thought we played well in the last 15 minutes after starting the second half poorly.

[Predator]

O'Dea was grand I thought. Good decision to play him :)I like how he's willing to go straight through attackers. Similar stature to Dunne physically; a brute. Playing next to Dunne obviously helped him.

McGeady had a good game. I'm happy for him finally getting his first international goal, but his desire to beat men and run into trouble frustrates me, especially when there are men in the box waiting on a cross. Westwood also showed that he's a reliable back-up and option for the future.

[geysir]

Giles tried to make out of milage out McGeady not being as good as he should be and using that wayward pass (after trapping the ball from the sky) as an example. For my part I thought McGeady was excellent overall. Duff was against a big tough skilled defender and took him on. Duff was a tireless engine all through the game, winning back possession and just a class priceless act. He looks like he hasn't eaten in 3 months. I'm sure his mother just wants to give him a proper meal.

[cestlavie]

Westwood done himself no harm great save and good kickouts, Foley was solid, good tackling from O'Dea although he is abit suspect positionally but will let him away with that, Gibson done quiet well apart from a few missed placed passes, Long is a great little terrier and will always show for the ball just like Doyler, Fahey controlled things when he came on and McCarthy not on long enough but will be a class act for us if given the chance. Have to say McGeady and Duff were 1st class but overall Im happy to take the points but we were pretty average on a whole.

[Stuttgart88]

sh1te tackle gibson... not impressedI'm guessing that was the one from behind. He took one for the team there. Good foul.

[Stuttgart88]

Brady gets in a knockout punch before Bill could deliver :DWhat did he say?

[endabob1]

Thought McGeady was excellent tonight, despite Beglin calling for him & Duff to swap I think he would have left Foley very exposed which is why the move wasn't made.
Long too ran his guts out and got nothing from a very poor ref.

The real initiative was lost about 10 minutes before their goal, we couldn't keep the ball Gibson & Whelan had a lot to do with it by ont showing for the full backs who then hit long balls that we inevitably lost.

I echo the sentiment that given our track record with Macedonia I'd have taken 2-1 if ou offered it to me this afternoon, especially with the Russia result

[Stuttgart88]

I'm tired of saying this, but not much wrong with this team that a good CM wouldn't sort out.

Curate's egg tonight. Good in parts. I think we're lacking a bit of Giles' "moral courage". We're too happy to let them have the ball, no matter who "them" is. We need a guy hungry for the ball. Barcelona have shown us that the modern way is to win it back when you lose it, we seem happy to line up behind the ball without challenging for it. When we do we're more competitive.

I'm sure Gibson will come in for criticism, but I think if he had a genuine ball winner anchoring midfield he'd shine. Just for the record: look who won the header that set up McGeady's goal. Gibson.

Just heard that Doyle is out for at least a month. Just typical that when Best & Walters don't make the trip, Doyle gets injured. Walters has no excuse for not coming over for Tuesday.

Fair play O'Dea. Textbook tackle in the first few minutes. Dunne looked ropey but not O'Dea.

Joint top, half way through. New caps making their presence felt and McCarthy getting capped. I'm not saying that there's not a lot that needs to be ironed out, but I'll take tonight's outcome all day long.

Edit: Forgot to say. Credit to Fahey. We were better where it counted when he came on.

[legendz]

A win is a win, good result. Impressed enough with Westwood, Foley and O'Dea. I know RTE like to see themselves as being the opposite to UK TV and more open in their criticisms. They go way over the top though, there is no need for so much negativity. After the game I just turned it off as usual, it's a waste of time to listen to them.
After Westwood's save, I thought Ireland stepped things up a gear and finished the game very well.

[geysir]

What did he say?
You can imagine that Liam was bit raw after listening to the criticism - but fair play to Dunphy he accepted to be roped back by Liam on much of it.
Bill then went all prepared to point out that the stadium was just over half full, as if to say that proves the punters don't like the way Ireland play.
Liam rubbished him and shouted over him saying 'thats the economy thats effecting the people who would be turning up' ' and 'many people just cant afford it'. Bill vainly tried to claim that he was asking a fair question but he had to concede, yet still as dumb as he was before he asked the question.

[shaneker]

The place I was in had useless internet, so my stream was basically non-existent, but from what I saw O'Dea was great and Trap should be given credit for the call, Whelen was pretty poor and needs to be replaced by our newest recruit - just great to see him get on and great to hear the reception he was given.

Long could have a lengthy career at the top level if he continues his rate of improvement, he's not there yet, but I'd almost (not quite yet) have him ahead of Doyle at this stage.

Glad for Robbie, still well off his best but he scored and some of the link-up play with Long was very promising. His job is to score and he did that well.

We're scoring goals in this group, more than anyone else, McGeady and Duff are giving us a real threat down the flanks but I wish one of our CMs would push up just a few yards to try and provide an option for them, it would keep defences in two minds and free up a little more space for the wingers. Again, maybe McCarthy can be the man here.

Couldn't say much more based on what I saw, but it's been a good day for us in Group B. Halfway there, but beating Macedonia away will be tough and if we don't manage that we'll probably need to win in Russia - which we won't. Still, a good performance from team and manager. Things are beginning to look up, let's hope it continues with some different options against Uruguay.

[gastric]

Gibson did okay tonight. Some good tackles, shouted at this team mates and argued with the opposition. Good to see some passion from him. With roughly 6 changes ( including Long) from our normal starting line up, it wasn't a bad result despite many heart stopping moments.

[Stuttgart88]

I like Whelan but he's the one I was disappointed with tonight. You need to be more than just tidy. You need to be hungry and assertive and I just didn't see enough (any?) of that from CM.

Tuesday will be interesting if approached correctly.

[ped_ped]

- - - - - - - - - - Westwood - - - - - - - - - -
Coleman - St. Ledger - Dunne - O'Dea - O'Shea
Lawrence - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Hunt
McGeady - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Duff
- - - - - - - - - - - Doyle - - - - - - - - - - - -

We've far too many wide options, we need to fit them into a system . . .

. . . and remove the need for a sh!tty central midfield :p

EDIT: In before "O'Shea can't play LB"

[Crosby87]

Also why is it we play so much worse with the lead?

[boovidge]

If they'd got a lucky late equaliser we'd all be laying into the team and ranting about its obvious deficiencies but as it happens, we won. so well done Ireland and the moaning can wait for another day.

[Charlie Darwin]

Gibson did okay tonight. Some good tackles, shouted at this team mates and argued with the opposition. Good to see some passion from him. With roughly 6 changes ( including Long) from our normal starting line up, it wasn't a bad result despite many heart stopping moments.
RTE's post-game analysis was very unfair to him. Highlighted three or four bad passes but neglected to mention that they were all within the first 5 minutes and his passing was calm and collected from that point on. I did feel he was quieter than he needed to be though. Whelan had a very nervous game, particularly in possession, which is disappointing since he's just won his place back at Stoke and is playing some decent football.

[geysir]

As good and vital as that tackle was from Gibson, you can't say it was a trademark Gibson tackle.

RTE panel differed slightly in opinions. Giles thinks the players could be encouraged to be more positive and it's the manager who stunts their natural game.
Dunphy who appears to have forgotten about Andy Reid these days, although he is pretty much the same player as he was a year ago, anyway he wants a CM of Fahey and Clark (which is an interesting theory), but then he wants Coleman in for McGeady.
Brady thinks that the players are not there, who can play the way that the others would like us to play. That yes we could play better with say an overlapping full back, but we could also get caught out and be losing games and what then?
The CM is a conundrum and pretty much at the heart of the way forward.

[Charlie Darwin]

Dunphy also wants Clark to replace Kilbane at left-full and be the second centre-half. I think Clark is a very promising player but I really don't think we'd be able to put up much of a challenge with 9 players.

[Crosby87]

Good article up on Soccernet already. Trap saying Doyle will miss rest of the prem season 1-2 months with ligament damage but hopeful of him playing in June. That should thrill MM.
Also Trap "lashing out" at those who questioned his selection of Foley.
http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story/_/id/899152/giovanni-trapattoni:-kevin-doyle-injury-%22very-serious%22?cc=5901

[Charlie Darwin]

I wonder if the state of the pitch had anything to do with Kevin's injury. Even allowing for the rugby international last week, it was in absolutely abysmal shape. Tough break for Wolves, but I think Ebanks-Blake is marginally more suited to their passing style. Doyle's aerial ability encourages them to play long balls when really they don't need to.

It's a pity for Doyle because, even if Wolves had been relegated, good end-of-season form would have suitors lining up for him in the summer.

[Crosby87]

You know Charlie you may have a point as he clearly had gotten hurt or tweaked something a few minutes before he went down, staying in and tweaking it again. The second time he was like "Thats it I'm out Im out..."
I thought it was a torn ACL but seeing him walk off changed that... Also he didnt seem to be in the pain you usually see them in when they tear the ACL MCL or god forbid the PCL.
TBH being it is MM who manages Wolves, thought Trap could have been a little more sensitive with his comments. Not that he is thinking that in a post game interview being conducted in a language he hasn't quite mastered but yet.....

[tricky_colour]

I seem to recall Doyle having a bit of trouble with his knee earlier on, so maybe it was not in great shape when he started the match?

[the bear]

decent performance, did enough although the danger was there that we would get caught out. shouldn't sit on a lead so much
foley, o'dea westwood all very good. mcgeady and duff did well. gibson was ok i thought better than ive seen of him before. whelan wasnt great though.

can anyone explain this to me? they said that in the event of teams tieing on points it goes down to records in matches against each other. so if us russia and slovakia all finish on equal points. but russia have a better record against us, slovakia have a better record against russia and we have a better record against slovakia who comes first , second and third?

[Crosby87]

Yeah Tricky great point, hard to say right?
I mean, at first he seemed to kind of reaggravate something so you may very well be right. I hate to try to read too much into it but he seemed to kind of expect it. Second time he seemed to realize it just wasn't happening.
I doubt he was 100% going into today. And I mean I hope that is the case. I would hate to blame England/EIRE rugby on a 4 month ligament issue. (Or 1-2 as Trap says.)

[Colbert Report]

decent performance, did enough although the danger was there that we would get caught out. shouldn't sit on a lead so much
foley, o'dea westwood all very good. mcgeady and duff did well. gibson was ok i thought better than ive seen of him before. whelan wasnt great though.

can anyone explain this to me? they said that in the event of teams tieing on points it goes down to records in matches against each other. so if us russia and slovakia all finish on equal points. but russia have a better record against us, slovakia have a better record against russia and we have a better record against slovakia who comes first , second and third?

I'd like to know this too.

[Crosby87]

Bear is goal differential the tie break?
PS dont worry the table will be all different when all is said and dunne.
Dont waste your time. Arent you to come out of hibernation and eat your young anyway?

[Murfinator]

My Player ratings

Westwood - 7.5 (Kicked well, commanded well, dealt with the 1v1. Promising show)

Foley - 6 (Nice passing and seemed composed but his positioning seemed very very flat, saw Duff looking over his shoulder countless times looking for him in support and he was never there. Filled in fine but won't worry JOS)

O'Dea - 5 (Quiet and seemed to let Dunne romp around and sweep any danger rather than command his own area like St Ledger would)

Dunne - 6 (Commited and in charge. Made a "mistake" for the goal but not an unforgivable one. Would blame Kilbane moreso for letting him cut in and run at Dunne.

Kilbane - 6 (Lively, caught out for the goal but otherwise felt played reasonably well. Assured in possession, had infinitely better delivery from his crosses than McGeady and probably justified his selection)

Whelan - 2 (Woeful, supposedly a DM yet happily let Macedonia control possession and run rampant through the centre. Didn't tackle, didn't get involved in attacks and only reminded people he was on the pitch when he got involved in some keep-ball towards the end of the game)

Gibson - 7 (Reasonably pleased with his showing and represents an infinitely better midfield option than green. Got stuck in defensively a reasonable amount and did seem to have a great commanding presence in the middle than we're used to. Passed well but never got in shooting range.

McGeady - 7 (Lucky goal, great running and tricks, mixed end product. The usual story but he is steadily getting better)

Duff - 9 (MOM but then he is in most of our matches anyway. Passed well, ever getting something positive out of possession and put in a massive shift in defence to cover for the at times wayward Foley)

Keane - 7 (Some clever touches, good reactions for the goal. Worked with what he was given.

Long - 1 (Dreadful, everytime he got the ball the move broke down. His decisions were poor, his positioning was poor, his temperament was questionable. Perhaps all justified by a kick to the head by nonetheless a poor performance)




Overall I didn't understand why our gameplan consisted of so many high balls into the box considering Macedonia dominated us in the air. I could understand it while Doyle was on the pitch as he's a semi-decent jumper but when Keane and Long were in the box every cross broke down and we seemed clueless how to attack them.

The wingers were often doubled up on to stop them cutting infield and the centre midfield didn't offer support so I wonder how exactly they planned to make breakthroughs without the Doyle route.

[Murfinator]

decent performance, did enough although the danger was there that we would get caught out. shouldn't sit on a lead so much
foley, o'dea westwood all very good. mcgeady and duff did well. gibson was ok i thought better than ive seen of him before. whelan wasnt great though.

can anyone explain this to me? they said that in the event of teams tieing on points it goes down to records in matches against each other. so if us russia and slovakia all finish on equal points. but russia have a better record against us, slovakia have a better record against russia and we have a better record against slovakia who comes first , second and third?

It works on a mini-table excluding other results. For example right now Slovakia are on 4 points as they've beaten Russia and drawn to us, Russia have 3 from beating us and we have 1 from the Slovakia draw. If we all ended up on equal points in that regard it'd go to goal difference making it incredibly unlikely goal difference will be worth anything.

[Charlie Darwin]

I think you may be a little sensationalist in your ratings, Murf...

[Crosby87]

Holy Christmas, Thank God Murf, we were all eagerly awaiting your player ratings.
Whew.
:clock::yin-yang:

[ArdeeBhoy]

Would mainly agree with the Murf. We were generally mediocre, but luckily they played like a crap Sunday side in the first half. Though we toook our goals very well.
2 moments of class in a sea of sh*te.

A fitful performance at best.

And if McCarthy's a 'wunderkid' then many of the rest of the team need to improve by 200% to carry the poor sod.

[the bear]

Bear is goal differential the tie break?
PS dont worry the table will be all different when all is said and dunne.
Dont waste your time. Arent you to come out of hibernation and eat your young anyway?

ill prob just rob a few pick-a-nick baskets

[tricky_colour]

Also why is it we play so much worse with the lead?

Inexperience. :p

[Spudulika]

Also why is it we play so much worse with the lead?

Is it not a case of the opposition playing better? It's the same in most sports, favourites are expected to do the job and have the pressure to get it done, underdogs start off to do their best and disrupt the oppositions flow. Macedonia were let off the leash at 2-0 down and while leaving gaps at the back were out to attack. Croatia lost last night to a decent Georgia team because they were expected to win but despite their pressure conceded a goal against play and then couldn't pull one back. Croatia would be considered better than us against a far weaker Georgian side but just couldn't do it.

Macedonia let loose at 2-0 having been cautious in counter attacks before.

[mypost]

If they'd got a lucky late equaliser we'd all be laying into the team and ranting about its obvious deficiencies but as it happens, we won.

The team has always had deficiencies. Remember 1999?


It works on a mini-table excluding other results. For example right now Slovakia are on 4 points as they've beaten Russia and drawn to us, Russia have 3 from beating us and we have 1 from the Slovakia draw. If we all ended up on equal points in that regard it'd go to goal difference making it incredibly unlikely goal difference will be worth anything.

It's a load of rubbish imo, as nobody has played each other twice yet. When and if the teams are all level on October 11th at 8pm, we can go through the results with a fine tooth comb and look up who won what, where, and why.

We got the result we needed. Played well in the first half, scrapped it out in the second. With just 1 of the next 4 games at home, if we get a few results on the road, we'll still be in a strong position going into the final weekend.

[Murfinator]

I think you may be a little sensationalist in your ratings, Murf...

I think media scales aren't sensational enough to be honest, usually ranging from 5 (poor) to 8 (brilliant).

I thought our attacking game went wayward when Long came on and he contributed nothing to the system we were playing. All his shots were wide, all his passes, mislaid, he was dominated aerially and bar once didn't make any worthwhile runs into space.
Whelan's one and only job is to be a strong presence off the ball, hassle and harry the opposition in midfield, dispossess them and generally interrupt and disrupt their rhythm. He didn't do this in the slightest and let them pick their attacks with ease.

Both had their poorest game in an Irish shirt and deserve their rating.

[Stuttgart88]

A few things in perspective - well, from my usual glass-half-full viewpoint:

* Central midfield is still a problem & has been for a decade more or less. All of the justifiable criticisms of the performance boils down to this issue. We need an Alex Song type player - an athlete who can anchor midfield. Gibson would thrive with one of these, and McCarthy too I reckon.
* We're not good enough at catenaccio - Bulgaria, Norway, Macedonia and others have shown us that when we cede initiative in games we're not good enough to rely on being able to keep the opposition away.
* We won a "banana skin" game without Given, JOS and SSL, with a not-match-fit Keane and Dunne, with a makeshift left-back, a 4th choice CB, without Kevin Doyle for most of the game and without both of his natural replacements (Best & Walters).
* There were some very good individual performances and some decent ones.
* The McCarthy issue has been put to bed
* Duff is invaluable
* We actually saw out the last 10 quite well
* Dunne's absence from Macedonia necessitates JOS and SSL being back I reckon.
* Clark, Coleman, McCarthy, Wilson, Best, Walters are all pressing hard for a place in the next few months. Cunningham may well be come the autumn. Westwood, Foley, Fahey can all expect to keep theirs. O'Dea did well last night and if that's what we can expect from our 4th choice CB then that's OK by me.

edit: of course we also have Stephen Hunt to come back into the reckoning. He's no Duffer but we all know that he brings something important.

I think we may see a 4-5-1 including McCarthy in Macedonia, though with our injury record making any team predictions or recommendations at this point would be daft.

[Stuttgart88]

Special mention to Tardelli - great celebrations.

[Fixer82]

I'm guessing that was the one from behind. He took one for the team there. Good foul.

I must agree. I definitely think he took one for the team when they were really threatening. And at a time in the game when they were really confident.
Thought Fahey should have come on for Whelan to be honest. He's asimilar player but Whelan a bit off the pace. Fahey very neat and tidy.

Westwood did really well and, dare i say, he's looked more comfortable between the sticks than Given has in a long time. If I'm being honest, I shudder every time Given gets a back pass these days.

Foley did really well I thought.

Duff and McGeady were excellent throughout

[osarusan]

* We're not good enough at catenaccio - Bulgaria, Norway, Macedonia and others have shown us that when we cede initiative in games we're not good enough to rely on being able to keep the opposition away.

This is the only thing that really concerns me about the Irish team. We try to play a system that we're clearly not able to play. It's like we invite the opposition onto us, which is fine if you can handle it, but teams no better than average are able to cause us real problems when they get at our defence. It's frustrating to see us give the ball away so easily when it's clear we can be hurt defensively.

Other than that, a good night apart from Doyle's injury. Central mid struggled as always, but we looked good up front (I thought Long did ok when he came on), McGeady and Duff did well, and no mistakes by Foley or O'Dea, both of whom had good individual moments also.

[Supreme feet]

A few things in perspective - well, from my usual glass-half-full viewpoint:

* Central midfield is still a problem & has been for a decade more or less. All of the justifiable criticisms of the performance boils down to this issue. We need an Alex Song type player - an athlete who can anchor midfield. Gibson would thrive with one of these, and McCarthy too I reckon.


David Meyler would be my suggestion. Big, strong lad, very aggressive, but a good footballer too. Hopefully he can come back from his injuries... he's actually due back soon so maybe he'll get a run-out in May. Trap actually included him in the Paraguay/Algeria squads last year before his cruciate injury.

[Fixer82]

Yes the days of 'put 'em under pressure' are long dead. It seems when opposition have the ball we just fall back to the edge of our box and say 'have a go there lads'....

[danonion]

Watched the match on RTE player this morning. The cameras probably didn't do justice to how abysmal Gibson was. When watching live, its obvious that his off the ball movement is just shocking. Particularly with the two wingers cutting inside, he needed to be available for a pass.

Some other thoughts

1) McGeady has improved. He was successful going inside and outside the left full. I think the wingers should occasionally swap flanks. Duff isn't as devoid of pace as we thought, and I think on the left side he can put in much better balls.

2) Midfield was shocking. Aside from one or two good tackles and the free kick, Gibson was poor. Whelan gave the ball away constantly. He failed to complete a pretty simple one-two with McGeady. Now if they were providing a good cover for the back four, the bad ball playing could be excused. But they are not even doing that. I hope that McCarthy is capable of playing CM in a 4-4-2 system, as both Whelan and Gibson aren't up to par

3) McCarthy issue sorted, and in spite of only being on for 4 minutes or so, showed that he could be a serious footballer. Some nice passes and a tackle in our 3rd.

4) Fahey looked composed and is a better CM option than the two startes.

5) Westwood was excellent today

6) I was disappointed that Kevin Kilbane started, however he had a fairly decent game. This could free up Clark to fill in at centre-half or in midfield, depending on whats required.

7) Long looked better live than on TV, but still wasn't a good shift. He's pacy and he's a finisher, but he isn't going to be much use in the Kevin Doyle role.

8) Panel jumped down Bill's throat and claimed that the bad football was the reason for the bad crowd. The boys took up the working man's cause saying the recession is the reason. While I think that's a contributing factor, I think the success of the Rugby team (The Irish are class-A event junkies) and the lack of success of the football team (not the on-pitch style) also add to this problem. I'm sure there are 10 times more corporate seats in the Aviva than there were at Lansdowne Road, which also probably leads to empty seats.