Shane Ferguson

[cestlavie]

Young Derry footballer, Although he has played at all levels for Northern Ireland he still hasnt played in competitive game for the north. Defo a star off the future, great feet, huge potential and apparently he would love to play for the Republic. Was on Newcastle team yesterday, made a great run, took on few players.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shane_Ferguson

[TrapAPony]

This must be the run you were talking about :

http://i170.photobucket.com/albums/u242/supersewelly/ferguson.gif?t=1300629735

Played a bit of gaelic football too I hear.

[cestlavie]

You got it, mind you I see that one of the lads he skins is Wilson.

[Colbert Report]

What do you mean by "apparently he would love to play for the Republic"? Where did you read this? According to that wikipedia link he played a match for the Northern Ireland senior team back in 2009, although it doesn't say if it was a competitive match or not.

[cestlavie]

He hasnt played competitive football for the North at senior level, trust me. This lad is similar to Duffy, he is a Derry City boy,think he comes from Limavady, wants to play for the Republic, he has supported the Republic all his life, Dont know the lad personally but I have talked to people who do have really good idea of his intentions. He isnt just going to declare for the Republic if he destroys he chance of playing international football.

[tetsujin1979]

What do you mean by "apparently he would love to play for the Republic"? Where did you read this? According to that wikipedia link he played a match for the Northern Ireland senior team back in 2009, although it doesn't say if it was a competitive match or not.
It was a friendly against Italy, they lost 3-0.
It was the same game Shane Duffy was on the bench for

[cestlavie]

That was the game alrite, I Suppose we have to be realistic, we cant have everybody and we can only pick so many players at any one time but he will defo be one too look out for in the future, p[erhaps he will get senior game for the North and that will put a end to it, who knows.

[Serb]

This lad is similar to Duffy, he is a Derry City boy, he wants to play for the Republic, he has supported the Republic all his life, Dont know the lad personally but I have talked to people who do have really good idea of his intentions. He isnt just going to declare for the Republic if he destroys he chance of playing international football.

I really don't understand how someone who supported the Republic all his life would go as far as playing a full senior international for a team which would be his second choice from the sounds of things. I think the FAI should at the very least agree to not pick players who have a non-competitive full cap for Northern Ireland. This refers more to the Adam Barton situation I suppose since Shane Ferguson hasn't actually switched, but I think it would be a bit ridiculous if he does eventually decide to make the switch.

[cestlavie]

I agree with you, Paddy McCourt would have loved to play for the Republic but at the end of the day,he got a senior call up for the North, didnt hurt his career.

[boovidge]

http://foot.ie/threads/139829

previous discussion, including the inevitable "debate" with the NI posters.

[SkStu]

I really don't understand how someone who supported the Republic all his life would go as far as playing a full senior international for a team which would be his second choice from the sounds of things. I think the FAI should at the very least agree to not pick players who have a non-competitive full cap for Northern Ireland. This refers more to the Adam Barton situation I suppose since Shane Ferguson hasn't actually switched, but I think it would be a bit ridiculous if he does eventually decide to make the switch.

totally agree with the bit in bold.

[boovidge]

On the other hand we need talented players so as long as we abide by the FIFA laws perhaps we shouldn't impose further limitations. No one seemed to care when Duffy switched and he had been called up for the NI senior team and played for the U21s IIRC. That said, a senior cap should tie you to that association imo.

[awec]

If he has always wanted to play for the Republic then more fools the IFA for wasting their time with him.

If it were me I'd have told him to sling his hook long ago and he wouldn't have got anywhere near our underage squads.

[DannyInvincible]

He hasnt played competitive football for the North at senior level, trust me. This lad is similar to Duffy, he is a Derry City boy,think he comes from Limavady, wants to play for the Republic, he has supported the Republic all his life, Dont know the lad personally but I have talked to people who do have really good idea of his intentions. He isnt just going to declare for the Republic if he destroys he chance of playing international football.

I've also heard he'd be very willing to play for us if we were interested in him. Has he been in the Northern Ireland squad since playing in the Italy friendly?

[Gather round]

I really don't understand how someone who supported the Republic all his life would go as far as playing a full senior international for a team which would be his second choice from the sounds of things

Come on, plenty of precedents. NI, RoI, Wales and even Scotland have had many players who were English, and presumably supported England. Some of whom have made this fairly obvious in their later media careers ;)


If he has always wanted to play for the Republic then more fools the IFA for wasting their time with him.

If it were me I'd have told him to sling his hook long ago and he wouldn't have got anywhere near our underage squads

Given that he a) doesn't seem to have said this in public, and b) has always turned up for our teams when picked, you can see why others might give him the benefit of doubt?


I've also heard he'd be very willing to play for us if we were interested in him. Has he been in the Northern Ireland squad since playing in the Italy friendly?

Don't think he has been in the full squad.

Who knows. He may be weighing up c) the high likelihood of playing for the NI side in Euro 12 qualifiers against d) the RoI's U-21 team, realistically, for the foreseeable future.

[drummerboy]

The FAI are not unaware of Shane Ferguson. They have known about him for quite a while now.

[ArdeeBhoy]

I think the FAI should at the very least agree to not pick players who have a non-competitive full cap for Northern Ireland.

I think given the fuss that was made in certain quarters, they're more likely to adhere to the C.A.S. ruling, which applies equally to all. In the context of competitive games or is it all really so confusing?

Or perhaps someone would like to put a negative spin on this, yet again??

[geysir]

On the other hand we need talented players so as long as we abide by the FIFA laws perhaps we shouldn't impose further limitations. No one seemed to care when Duffy switched and he had been called up for the NI senior team and played for the U21s IIRC. That said, a senior cap should tie you to that association imo.
The rule as it stands is fair enough. A competitive cap is the serious cap. There are plenty of dual nationals around europe who would be barred (under the old rule) from playing for their second country because of some friendly senior cap they received before being discarded. The rule is there to give those players a chance of playing international football. The rule is not there to disadvantage the country who caps the player in a senior friendly.
As for us and them, according to CAS hearing, the FAI were willing to reach a compromise with the IFA on the eligibility of playing assets. The 2 associations were given permission by FIFA to workout the terms of the cooperation similar to one the 4 UK associations have. The agenda of such an agreement was left up to the 2 associations. As we now know, the IFA refused all cooperation, preferring to argue that the existing rules supported their case.

Perhaps something can be worked out in the future. The first step is the IFA need to understand and accept the rules as they stand now. Something tells me they still haven't a clue.

[Gather round]

I think given the fuss that was made in certain quarters, they're more likely to adhere to the C.A.S. ruling

I think given the past, current and likely future fuss, the FAI are actually a bit less likely to pick players who've already played for the full NI side. Simply because every time it happens, there's likely to be a sh*t-storm in the NI media. That probably isn't an issue for someone like Adam Barton, who's never lived in Ireland and probably won't during his playing career. But it might be for a kid from Limavady or wherever.

In other words, FIFA's rules allow the FAI to pick such players. But that doesn't necessarily mean that they will.


In the context of competitive games or is it all really so confusing? Or perhaps someone would like to put a negative spin on this, yet again??

No, it's not confusing. It just involves a few more factors than the one you suggest.


The rule is there to give those players a chance of playing international football. The rule is not there to disadvantage the country who caps the player in a senior friendly

Indeed. Specifically, it was introduced after a lobby of French-speaking countries in West Africa who wanted to pick dual-qualified guys living in France who'd already played youth representative football there.

Of course whatever the rule's global intent, its local effect is to disadvantage NI (as many of our fans, media etc. see it). Which is largely why the sh*t-storm persists. They're hoping that the FAI will either just stop picking the players, or reach some local agreement.


Perhaps something can be worked out in the future. The first step is the IFA need to understand and accept the rules as they stand now

Agreed.

[OwlsFan]

The guy is barely out of nappies and we're fighting about him already. Showed some lovely touches though I have to say.

You gotta love Wikipedia (probably changed by now I expect):

"Shane is waiting for a call up from Republic of Ireland U-21 manager Noel King." :)

[Newryrep]

He hasnt played competitive football for the North at senior level, trust me. This lad is similar to Duffy, he is a Derry City boy,think he comes from Limavady, wants to play for the Republic, he has supported the Republic all his life, Dont know the lad personally but I have talked to people who do have really good idea of his intentions. He isnt just going to declare for the Republic if he destroys he chance of playing international football.

:confused: surely something wrong here

[Not Brazil]

I'm surprised Worthington didn't name Ferguson in the squad for the forthcoming matches against Serbia and Slovenia, and then played him for a few minutes.

That's the way to test his desire (or otherwise).

Maybe time for a call up yet.

[DannyInvincible]

I think given the past, current and likely future fuss, the FAI are actually a bit less likely to pick players who've already played for the full NI side. Simply because every time it happens, there's likely to be a sh*t-storm in the NI media. That probably isn't an issue for someone like Adam Barton, who's never lived in Ireland and probably won't during his playing career. But it might be for a kid from Limavady or wherever.

In other words, FIFA's rules allow the FAI to pick such players. But that doesn't necessarily mean that they will.

I suppose we'll have to see, although Noel King had no reservations in calling up Barton only last week.


They're hoping that the FAI will either just stop picking the players, or reach some local agreement.

The FAI agreed to a "local agreement" proposed by FIFA, as geysir mentions, but alas the IFA were obstinate enough to reject it. Indeed, it makes current IFA grumbling look infantile.

[Gather round]

The FAI agreed to a "local agreement" proposed by FIFA, as geysir mentions, but alas the IFA were obstinate enough to reject it. Indeed, it makes current IFA grumbling look infantile

Aye, obstinate and foolish. They'll need to try a new tack now. I'd prefer that it involved only gentle feelers to the FAI, but I think you can see why they continue to stir it in the media, as I mentioned above.

[Not Brazil]

The FAI agreed to a "local agreement" proposed by FIFA, as geysir mentions, but alas the IFA were obstinate enough to reject it. Indeed, it makes current IFA grumbling look infantile.

Are you alluding to the "local agreement" proposed by FIFA on 7th March 2007, namely?:

"every player born on the territory of Northern Ireland, holding the UK nationality and being entitled to a passport of the Republic of Ireland or born on the territory of the Republic of Ireland and holding the Irish nationality could either play for the [FAI] or the [IFA], under the condition that all other relevant prerequisites pertaining to player’s eligibility for a specific Association team are fulfilled”.

If so, thank goodness the IFA were "obstinate" enough to reject it.

[DannyInvincible]

I'm surprised Worthington didn't name Ferguson in the squad for the forthcoming matches against Serbia and Slovenia, and then played him for a few minutes..

I'm surprised myself. Why wasn't he called into the squad for the Faroe Islands game after the Italy friendly (assuming he was fit)? I assume that if he'd rejected a call-up from the IFA in wait of a call-up by the FAI it would have made the media, unless the IFA would seek to keep such a story quiet for fear things never transpired as hoped for Ferguson with the FAI at first and the criticism garnered after having had shady dealings with the Beggars would put him off reconsidering playing for Northern Ireland in future. Is that a bit far-fetched?

[geysir]

Media rumbles in the North don't mean jack shít down South.
Anyway that BT survey indicates that 63% are in favour of things continuing as they stand now for the players :D

[DannyInvincible]

Are you alluding to the "local agreement" proposed by FIFA on 7th March 2007, namely?:

"every player born on the territory of Northern Ireland, holding the UK nationality and being entitled to a passport of the Republic of Ireland or born on the territory of the Republic of Ireland and holding the Irish nationality could either play for the [FAI] or the [IFA], under the condition that all other relevant prerequisites pertaining to player’s eligibility for a specific Association team are fulfilled”.

If so, thank goodness the IFA were "obstinate" enough to reject it.

Beggars can't be choosers and all that. I'm sure it didn't harvest any sympathy from FIFA anyway.

[Not Brazil]

Why wasn't he called into the squad for the Faroe Islands game after the Italy friendly (assuming he was fit)?

The Faroes game was following the qualifier versus Italy.

The friendly Ferguson appeared in was back in June 2009.

[DannyInvincible]

The Faroes game was following the qualifier versus Italy.

The friendly Ferguson appeared in was back in June 2009.

Ah, apologies. My mistake. Even more reason to question why he hasn't been thrown on for the last minute or two of a competitive game since though, no?

[ArdeeBhoy]

Simply because every time it happens, there's likely to be a sh*t-storm in the NI media.

In other words, FIFA's rules allow the FAI to pick such players. But that doesn't necessarily mean that they will.
I'm sure the average person living in the North really gives two fecks about who mainly journeymen footballers play for...

And it may not mean they will, but no need why not either.


No, it's not confusing. It just involves a few more factors than the one you suggest.

No, the C.A.S. criteria is competitive games, criteria even certain people in W.London can understand.

[Not Brazil]

Ah, apologies. My mistake. Even more reason to question why he hasn't been thrown on for the last minute or two of a competitive game since though, no?

I agree.

[Not Brazil]

No, the C.A.S. criteria is competitive games, criteria even certain people in W.London can understand.

It's FIFA criteria actually.

[Gather round]

I'm sure the average person living in the North really gives two fecks about who mainly journeymen footballers play for...

The media coverage suggests that quite a lot of people there do care, does it not?


And it may not mean they will, but no need why not either

Time will tell.


No, the C.A.S. criteria is competitive games, criteria even certain people in W.London can understand

Let me explain this to you again. The FIFA rules/ CAS criteria, straightforward as they are, are not the only factors which might determine whether FAI pick players from NI, particularly those who've already played for the full NI team.

[Predator]

The media coverage suggests that quite a lot of people there do care, does it not?I don't doubt that a fair few people are still unable to accept the situation, but the only real media coverage I've seen has come from the Belfast Telegraph. It doesn't seem to be considered truly newsworthy stuff anymore and rightly so.

[Gather round]

I'm no fan of the Tele, but it does still have quite a wide circulation locally.

[Predator]

I don't think the circulation of the Belfast Telegraph shows a general consensus among the local population; rather that the editors and journalists (or friends of theirs) at the newspaper care about the topic and wish to see it remain an unresolved issue, despite the CAS case. Aside from the sudden flurry of articles in the Belfast Telegraph, there was seemingly little fuss elsewhere, which tells me that it's not that newsworthy (i.e. people don't particularly care anymore). At least this time UTV didn't do a spotlight programme looking into the matter.

I've said previously that I didn't think that Ferguson would change to the FAI considering the fact that he'd been capped at senior level, but the Adam Barton scenario shows that it's not impossible. If he did change, I'd welcome him, if not then I wish him the best in his career representing the IFA.

[Gather round]

I don't think the circulation of the Belfast Telegraph shows a general consensus among the local population; rather that the editors and journalists (or friends of theirs) at the newspaper care about the topic and wish to see it remain an unresolved issue, despite the CAS case

Newspaper content does reflect the bias/ interests of its owners. editors and writers, as you say. But it also has to reflect the interests of its readers (or what they're interested in). If it didn't, readers would drift away.


Aside from the sudden flurry of articles in the Belfast Telegraph, there was seemingly little fuss elsewhere, which tells me that it's not that newsworthy (i.e. people don't particularly care anymore). At least this time UTV didn't do a spotlight programme looking into the matter

It's not as newsworthy as the tsunami or the war in North Africa. But it remains newsworthy in NI's biggest circulation newspaper, while people like Nolan at the BBC can be relied to use it on a slow local news day. I think you're understating it.


I've said previously that I didn't think that Ferguson would change to the FAI considering the fact that he'd been capped at senior level, but the Adam Barton scenario shows that it's not impossible. If he did change, I'd welcome him, if not then I wish him the best in his career representing the IFA

It's certainly not impossible, but I agree it's unlikely.

[awec]

Ah, apologies. My mistake. Even more reason to question why he hasn't been thrown on for the last minute or two of a competitive game since though, no?

Good question!

[DannyInvincible]

Aside from the sudden flurry of articles in the Belfast Telegraph, there was seemingly little fuss elsewhere, which tells me that it's not that newsworthy (i.e. people don't particularly care anymore).

Hell, they even got rid of the "Football Apartheid in Ireland" forum over on OWC!

[Not Brazil]

Hell, they even got rid of the "Football Apartheid in Ireland" forum over on OWC!

They haven't.

[DannyInvincible]

They haven't.

Ah yes, I see it now. With difficulty, mind, considering it's fallen from the top of the main forum page and become a sub-forum within a minor sub-forum, "All The Rest", at the very bottom of the main page. And protected too. For good reason, I hope.

[EalingGreen]

The FAI agreed to a "local agreement" proposed by FIFA, as geysir mentions, but alas the IFA were obstinate enough to reject it. Indeed, it makes current IFA grumbling look infantile.Having read the CAS ruling in its entirety, it is my firm belief that FIFA was sympathetic towards the IFA in principle, but (very late in the day) decided that their Rules, as drafted, did not permit them to prevent NI-born players from representing the FAI.

My reason for thinking this is threefold. First, they had not long before had to rewrite the Rules (in an emergency, btw), in order to forestall the Qatari/Brazilian situation etc. Second, almost up until the verdict, all the "background noises", from BOTH Associations, suggested that the IFA would "lose the battle, but win the war" (as per John Delaney to RTE at Dublin Airport). Third, the offer to the IFA that they might be permitted to select ROI-born players was their attempt at "compensation" for a ruling which was unfairly working against the IFA. (Otherwise why would they make such an unprecedented offer, applicable, however, only in Ireland?)

Of course, from the comfort of Zurich, such an offer might have seemed to FIFA like "fair" compensation. That is, they likely will not have understood that it was effectively offering the IFA a "cheque which could never be cashed".

Anyhow, not only was there nothing* in it for the IFA, but acceptance of such an offer would actually have been completely contrary to the IFA's interests. For if both Associations were completely free to select players from each others territories etc, it would inevitably (and correctly, imo) prompt the question further afield as to why the island should have two national teams and two Associations in the first place.


* - Realistically, how many ROI-born players who were not good enough to play for the FAI, would, however, be both good enough and willing to play for the IFA? Quite honestly, selecting such players, even if only a handful, would only serve to damage morale amongst those NI-born players whose place they might be threatening.

[EalingGreen]

Ah, apologies. My mistake. Even more reason to question why he [Ferguson] hasn't been thrown on for the last minute or two of a competitive game since though, no?I strongly suspect that for whatever reason, NW has not up until now (at least) considered Ferguson to merit consideration for the senior team.

Nor should anyone be misled by the fact of his having capped Ferguson in that friendly vs Italy. For iirc, it was actually arranged somewhat late in the day, for a date where the NI team was inevitably going to be obliterated by withdrawals. In fact, such was the size of appearance fee being offered by Italy, I have no doubt that it was all the IFA's doing, rather than arranged at the behest of NW.

Consequently, there were players capped there (eg Carson, Garrett, Lawrie) who have not since been considered, nor won't ever be (imo):
http://www.skysports.com/football/match_facts/0,19762,11065_3126032,00.html

As for the suggestion that NW should just give these players a couple of minutes in a competitive game just to tie then etc, I strongly disagree, as follows:
(a ) Friendlies are one thing, but competitive games are something else - such a ruse could backfire;
(b ) Certain posters already consider NW to be devious enough, without his giving them some substance to their imagination;
(c ) Such a policy could not be concealed, from the actual players at least, thereby leading to discontent amongst players who themselves are completely committed, but see less-committed players getting preferment/special treatment;
(d ) Even if the above could be ignored, it is always open to a player to "play the system" for all it's worth i.e. U-19, U-21, B Team, Senior Friendlies etc, then withdraw last minute from a competitive game with a "groin strain" or "back injury" etc.

As for Ferguson, unless/until I hear otherwise from the player himself, then I must assume he's committed to playing for NI. For considering he'll be 20 in July, he's old enough and mature enough etc to know his own mind. Otherwise the honourable* thing to do would be to stop wasting the IFA's time and let everyone know. If nothing else, this would at least release a place in our U-21's for someone who would dearly love to have it.


* - Speaking of "honour", at least eg Paul George declared for the FAI reasonably early, unlike eg Shane Duffy or (seemingly) Adam Barton...

[Stuttgart88]

Quite honestly, selecting such players, even if only a handful, would only serve to damage morale amongst those NI-born players whose place they might be threatening.Or English born :)

[Qwerty]

I saw him play against Everton and he is quite a skillful player, another midget mind you but definitely skillful and obviously has lots of potential. He could be quite a useful player for club and country.

[geysir]

Having read the CAS ruling in its entirety, it is my firm belief that FIFA was sympathetic towards the IFA in principle, but (very late in the day) decided that their Rules, as drafted, did not permit them to prevent NI-born players from representing the FAI.
If only you had read the few quotes coming from FIFA legal dept. on the matter and digested them properly. FIFA though their legal dept had stated their sympathy for the IFA publicly, that the one way situation was unfair on the IFA . And that's how our own expert Paul accurately predicted the compromise.
The rules were the rules and FIFA did not have a problem with the rules, the compromise was to address the one way nature of the effect on Irish football.

First, they had not long before had to rewrite the Rules (in an emergency, btw), in order to forestall the Qatari/Brazilian situation etc.
This is nonsense speculation.
FIFA did not rewrite the rules in 2003, they annexed a document to the rules. A mere bit of paperwork
However in 2008 FIFA spent 6 months completely overhauled how the rules were written.
A year later FIFA were not too tired to change one of the rules again, taking away the age 21 years barrier.


Second, almost up until the verdict, all the "background noises", from BOTH Associations, suggested that the IFA would "lose the battle, but win the war" (as per John Delaney to RTE at Dublin Airport)
I have stated and argued the point to perfection that you got that quote out of context and wrong. At the time I also posted a link to an interview JD (just after he arrived back from Zurich) did on Sat morn Marion Finucane show on RTE, where he was very confident that FIFA would throw out the IFA objection. None of that war/ battle nonsense that you have conjured.


the offer to the IFA that they might be permitted to select ROI-born players was their attempt at "compensation" for a ruling which was unfairly working against the IFA. (Otherwise why would they make such an unprecedented offer, applicable, however, only in Ireland
I have already referred to this. Herrera the FIFA legal head in Sept 2007 was quoted, that the eligibility rules were being correctly interpreted and applied, however this was having an unfair effect on the IFA.

[Predator]

Second, almost up until the verdict, all the "background noises", from BOTH Associations, suggested that the IFA would "lose the battle, but win the war" (as per John Delaney to RTE at Dublin Airport).What "background noises" do you speak of? This is the RTÉ article you refer to: 'Pressure mounts on Staunton' (http://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2007/1023/stauntons.html)(23rd Oct 2007)
"Meanwhile, though, the FAI have won the Darron Gibson battle with Northern Ireland - but lost the war over future qualification regarding the eligibility of players."
Note that there is no quote from Delaney. Indeed, not long after that report, RTÉ ran this story:'FIFA propose solution to eligibility row' (http://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2007/1106/fifa.html) (6th Nov 2007)



Third, the offer to the IFA that they might be permitted to select ROI-born players was their attempt at "compensation" for a ruling which was unfairly working against the IFA. (Otherwise why would they make such an unprecedented offer, applicable, however, only in Ireland?)Why, if the so-called "background noises" were pointing to a victory for the IFA, (as the seemingly conclusive RTÉ article erroneously reports), would FIFA decide to write a letter to both associations asking them to find a compromise?


* - Speaking of "honour", at least eg Paul George declared for the FAI reasonably early, unlike eg Shane Duffy or (seemingly) Adam Barton...You talk of honour as if you're an authority, when you are not one. In fact, you're the kind who stoops to the lows of defaming the character of both players and their families without foundation. Shane Duffy attempted to declare for the FAI aged 16/17 and actually attended a training camp with Sean McCaffrey, but Worthington singled the kid out for 'carrot caps', even putting the kid in the senior squad. Duffy declared for the FAI aged 18. That's right EIGHTEEN. You should let it go - you don't want to come across as being petty or bitter, do you?

[EalingGreen]

If only you had read the few quotes coming from FIFA legal dept. on the matter and digested them properly. FIFA though their legal dept had stated their sympathy for the IFA publicly, that the one way situation was unfair on the IFA . And that's how our own expert Paul accurately predicted the compromise.
The rules were the rules and FIFA did not have a problem with the rules, the compromise was to address the one way nature of the effect on Irish football.

I have already referred to this. Herrera the FIFA legal head in Sept 2007 was quoted, that the eligibility rules were being correctly interpreted and applied, however this was having an unfair effect on the IFA.That is my point! FIFA accepted that the IFA would be hard-done-by if the FAI were allowed to select NI-born players, but not vice versa. Consequently both Association delegations considered that FIFA would come down on the side of the IFA. However, something/someone "brought them up short" at the last minute and they conceded that the Rules as written would not allow them to favour the IFA.

(Which was why during the whole process, I consistently argued, both here and elsewhere, that it could go either way. Not that, despite several reminders, you have had the integrity to acknowledge that, btw, preferring instead to misrepresent my position by alleging that I had always argued that the IFA would win etc.)


This is nonsense speculation.Why? Because you say so?


FIFA did not rewrite the rules in 2003, they annexed a document to the rules. A mere bit of paperwork
However in 2008 FIFA spent 6 months completely overhauled how the rules were written. I am not basing my argument on any amendment to the Rules in 2003 etc.

It was some years later (can't be arsed to dig out the exact docs), that FIFA suddenly realised that Qatar and Cape Verde were going to grant some Brazilians plying their trade in Europe a Passport etc, in such a way as would permit them to circumvent the existing (2003?) Rules. Consequently, FIFA issued an emergency diktat preventing this, later incorporated formally in their Articles.


A year later FIFA were not too tired to change one of the rules again, taking away the age 21 years barrier.That was only because the change was (entirely unexpectedly) forced upon them by a majority vote from the Floor by the Associations at FIFA's Annual Convention in 2009. (That is, a number of African Associations realised they could benefit from being able to select from their diasporas in Europe who had passed 21, but not actually gained a senior competitive cap, and lobbied the other non-European Associations. From what I gather, Blatter and the FIFA Executive had not known about it in advance).


I have stated and argued the point to perfection that you got that quote out of context and wrong.Wow, "to perfection"! I must say, you wear your modesty very lightly...


At the time I also posted a link to an interview JD (just after he arrived back from Zurich) did on Sat morn Marion Finucane show on RTE, where he was very confident that FIFA would throw out the IFA objection. None of that war/ battle nonsense that you have conjured.On the Saturday, eh? Delaney flew back early from Zurich in order to attend to overriding businesss at home i.e. the sacking of Stan Staunton the following day. And although I could be wrong, I seem to recall that his flight back was at the beginning of the week (Monday?).
Therefore with the apparent "u-turn" by FIFA coming very soon after his return to Dublin, it is conceivable that he got wind of it in time for Ms. Finucane.

So how about this for a deal: If you look out a transcript/reference to the Finucane show, I'll try to dig out same for the interview Delaney gave to RTE "on the hoof" at Dublin Airport.

[geysir]

On the Saturday, eh? Delaney flew back early from Zurich in order to attend to overriding businesss at home i.e. the sacking of Stan Staunton the following day. And although I could be wrong, I seem to recall that his flight back was at the beginning of the week (Monday?).
Therefore with the apparent "u-turn" by FIFA coming very soon after his return to Dublin, it is conceivable that he got wind of it in time for Ms. Finucane.

So how about this for a deal: If you look out a transcript/reference to the Finucane show, I'll try to dig out same for the interview Delaney gave to RTE "on the hoof" at Dublin Airport.
Delaney did not give an interview on the hoof to RTE at the airport. And it is simply astounding that you did not listen to the linked interview I provided at that time.
scroll to 26-10-2007 (http://www.rte.ie/radio1/marianfinucane/1182059.html)
Your contention that Delaney said "we won the battle but lost the war" is as baseless now as it was years ago when you first manufactured it.
You simply refuse to grow up, cop on and move on.
You were a fraud then and still a fraud now