Dublin Super Cup

[Eminence Grise]

Years ago I was on a show in Torquay and a guest in my hotel

Is that you, Basil?

[born2bwild]

Despite the 'lose, lose, lose' theme of the last few days' European football, I'm happy to say that I managed to avoid the Super Cup completely and I am therefore not as miserable as I might otherwise be.

I actually had to avert my eyes at one stage over the weekend as they played a clip of one of the matches on a Ukrainian football programme.

I hope this farce never takes place again, but as a fairly recent follower of the LOI I'm beginning to see that hope is a dangerous thing, and so I guess there will be another installment.

Well I'm 'hoping' for a decent game in Cork tonight.

[Spudulika]

Is that you, Basil?

You know, it almost was :-)

[marinobohs]

Everton were the traditional Irish-Catholic club in a city where the orangemen marched freely. Years ago I was on a show in Torquay and a guest in my hotel, from Liverpool, asked me where I was from. I told him and he laughed, and told me he was from the capital of Ireland - Liverpool. I didn't take it on board but heard the same thing back home afterwards.

What we don't realise fully in Ireland is that for hundreds of years Irish people have moved over and back to GB - going back to late medieval times - for work or simply to survive. I know Magicme will support me in the case of Monaghan folks who ended up massively in one province in Canada who went via Glasgow. In the winter they worked in Glasgow and the West of Scotland, in summer they worked their small holdings in the drumlins. Eventually they got the call to head to a place called Prince Edward Island in Canada where to this day they consider themselves "real" Irish. I never had any problem with that, if it helps them sleep at night so be it. It's better that we tap into this diaspora than looking down our noses on them.

In Ireland we're more British than the British, so no surprise we still follow goings on on the mainland.

Another "Irish" myth there Spud. Everton originated (as a club) from a Methodist church club (St Domingo's I think) in the suburb of Everton. The suburb was far from a catholic area and once hosted its own Free Presbyterian Church - not usually something assosiated with Irish catholicism.
Everton were favoured by early Irish "day trippers" (circa 1950's) as at that time they had a couple of Irish Internationals playing for them and were a first division team (glory hunting even then :o) . Goodison also hosted Irelands famous 2-0 win over England which I think was first oversees team to win in England.

Liverpool FC was formed in 1892 when Everton had a row with their landlord over rent and moved from their then home - Anfield. The owner of Anfield set up a new team and Liverpool FC came into being.

Anyway,apols for the EPL nature of this post I am away to wash the stench off myself :p

[TiocfaidhArmani]

I heard Liverpool was set-up by an Orangeman. Not sure how true that is mind you, don't really care but thought I'd throw that out.

[marinobohs]

I heard Liverpool was set-up by an Orangeman. Not sure how true that is mind you, don't really care but thought I'd throw that out.

John Harding (I think) was his name. Owner of Anfield and landlord of Everton. When he put up the rent they (Everton) left and he formed Liverpool FC. Liverpool initially sourced a lot of players in Scotland where Harding had extensive business interests.

As Harding -founder of Liverpool FC - was formely involved with Everton any political/religious allegiance he may have had would likely be common to both clubs

[Macy]

Just as Liverpool has a large Irish diaspora
And Manchester (which had an area called "Little Ireland", cos that matters). And Leeds. And London. And Brum.

[sullanefc]

Soooo, what we have learned from all of this is that Irish people got around back in the day. Maybe the New York Yankees have some Irish connection in their foundation. Maybe I'll start supporting them. Only if they're a good team and they win a lot mind.

[Eminence Grise]

It's worth remembering, too, that for a great many Irish people who moved to Britain before 1922, and for some afterwards, it was migration rather than emigration. Adopting a club in Britain was as much an act of assimilation in a new region as it was a statement of being Irish.

[Macy]

Soooo, what we have learned from all of this is that Irish people got around back in the day. Maybe the New York Yankees have some Irish connection in their foundation. Maybe I'll start supporting them. Only if they're a good team and they win a lot mind.
Correct - sure wasn't that franchise formed in Baltimore, which is named after a place in Bornacoola on the Leitrim/ Longford border, and it had an area known as "Little Mohill". And anyway everyone knows that the Mets are a protestant club (they even have orange in their colours ffs!) and the real catholic club in New York is the yankees.


FACT (well some is..)

[marinobohs]

And Manchester (which had an area called "Little Ireland", cos that matters). And Leeds. And London. And Brum.

New York city has "Little Italy" and "Chinatown" - how ethnically confused must they be :rolleyes: Whatever about Manchester (city return ?) no one has mentioned teams from Leeds, London or Brum competing in next seasons Dublin Super Cup. Liveerpool was mentioned as playing hence the Liverpool reference. Do keep up now,there's a good lad :)

Most cities in England and Scotland saw some immigration from Ireland. Bigger Industrial centres, especially on/near west coast of UK more likely destination for Irish seeking work. Fortunately most of them did not import the sectarian bile (or nowhere near the same extent) we have seen so evident in Glasgow.

[TiocfaidhArmani]

Soooo, what we have learned from all of this is that Irish people got around back in the day. Maybe the New York Yankees have some Irish connection in their foundation. Maybe I'll start supporting them. Only if they're a good team and they win a lot mind.

In fairness, I'm not saying because there's an Irish diasporic community somewhere that makes the clubs there Irish in any way. Not at all.

[born2bwild]

In fairness, I'm not saying because there's an Irish diasporic community somewhere that makes the clubs there Irish in any way. Not at all.

How else can you say that a club is 'Irish' without reference to the diaspora and migration? Unless, of course, they're actually on this island.

[TiocfaidhArmani]

How else can you say that a club is 'Irish' without reference to the diaspora and migration? Unless, of course, they're actually on this island.

I really can't be bothered getting into all this again mate, I think I've commented enough on why Celtic is partly Irish and has a dual identity. Look at the history of the club and how it is today. That defines Celtic, not just that there happens to be a big Irish community. No club on the planet has a history similar to Celtic's. Not that I know of anyway.

[A N Mouse]

I really can't be bothered getting into all this again mate, I think I've commented enough on why Celtic is partly Irish and has a dual identity. Look at the history of the club and how it is today. That defines Celtic, not just that there happens to be a big Irish community. No club on the planet has a history similar to Celtic's. Not that I know of anyway.

Hibs? Dundee Utd?

[TiocfaidhArmani]

Hibs? Dundee Utd?

Hibs have an Irish past. It's just that - firmly in the past.

[DannyInvincible]

Correct - sure wasn't that franchise formed in Baltimore, which is named after a place in Bornacoola on the Leitrim/ Longford border, and it had an area known as "Little Mohill". And anyway everyone knows that the Mets are a protestant club (they even have orange in their colours ffs!) and the real catholic club in New York is the yankees.


FACT (well some is..)

That made me laugh. :D


And Manchester (which had an area called "Little Ireland", cos that matters). And Leeds. And London. And Brum.

Of course, Manchester United considered going by the alternative name of Manchester Celtic when adopting a new title from their previous one, Newton Heath. Indeed, not that it matters a huge deal, as you point out. The thing about Celtic, though, is that they overtly celebrate their Irish heritage and style themselves almost as an Irish social club of sorts. Clubs like Liverpool or Everton in other cities with significant Irish diasporas don't, at least to my knowledge. Indeed, that's not to say that Celtic styling themselves as such and playing up their purported Irishness is not motivated primarily by commercial interests, but if people want to define their Irishness (even if misguidedly) through supporting Celtic, fair enough. It's not strictly how I would define my Irishness, but then, people are different and there's no strict definition as to what constitutes "Irishness".

[A N Mouse]

Hibs have an Irish past. It's just that - firmly in the past.

Surely that would mean they have a history similar to celtic's?

[Jofspring]

Dublin Super Cup is over and hopefully forever. Can this thread just be locked (as it has gone pretty much off topic) and we get back to what matters here, LOI football is back tonight.

[Acornvilla]

Surely that would mean they have a history similar to celtic's?

Theres afew irish lads playing for them as well

[TiocfaidhArmani]

Surely that would mean they have a history similar to celtic's?

Celtic was set-up primarily as a charity to largely help the poor Irish. Hibs were not. I don't know a club who were set-up on those principles.

[TiocfaidhArmani]

The thing about Celtic, though, is that they overtly celebrate their Irish heritage and style themselves almost as an Irish social club of sorts. Clubs like Liverpool or Everton in other cities with significant Irish diasporas don't, at least to my knowledge. Indeed, that's not to say that Celtic styling themselves as such and playing up their purported Irishness is not motivated primarily by commercial interests, but if people want to define their Irishness (even if misguidedly) through supporting Celtic, fair enough. It's not strictly how I would define my Irishness, but then, people are different and there's no strict definition as to what constitutes "Irishness".

It's the fans that dictate what the club is, not the board. The songs played over the tannoy are the songs the fans sing. The tri-colour flys because the fans want it there, they wouldn't dare take it down. It's the fans who keep the traditions alive and are militant in defending it.

I get people abroad who feel Irish, obviously most of this forum don't. It's a black and white issue for them. I think it does a disservice to Ireland to ignore the diaspora and its importance. I'm bias though, my son was born in Scotland but his passport says he's Irish and he's being raised that way and feck anyone who says different :D

[Macy]

I get people abroad who feel Irish, obviously most of this forum don't. It's a black and white issue for them. I think it does a disservice to Ireland to ignore the diaspora and its importance. I'm bias though, my son was born in Scotland but his passport says he's Irish and he's being raised that way and feck anyone who says different :D
You have no idea about posters history, nevermind to jump to conclusions on their views on the diaspora, based simply on the fact they don't accept celtic's marketing strategy.

[WoodquayBoy]

Hibs were actually set up first by the Irish community in Edinburgh, and Celtic were modelled on them to some extent 13 years later

[Hitman]

Celtic was set-up primarily as a charity to largely help the poor Irish. Hibs were not. I don't know a club who were set-up on those principles.

I'm pretty sure Sporting Fingal were set up on the same lines.

[TiocfaidhArmani]

Seems like its the last Dublin Super Cup to be celebrated at the Lounge.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2011/0802/playerslounge.html

It's bar is opening this weekend for the Celtic v Dundee United game, with rebel band The Players Brigade on after. First pint is free if you wear a Celtic hooped top.

Bar open permanently in three weeks. Lounge opening in 4-6 weeks. It appears you shot your load too quickly there comrade :D

[BonnieShels]

I think I said in a previous post that I have had the pleasure of the players.
It's Celtic I hate.

;)

[bullit]

Free shots for anyone in any celtic shirt i say !!

;)

[TiocfaidhArmani]

I think I said in a previous post that I have had the pleasure of the players.
It's Celtic I hate.

;)

Fair enough :D

I see there's a charity game a few weeks ago in Tolka, gutted there's no fans v legends game this year, that would have raised more. Wasn't fit last year and was wrecked after 10 minutes. Play for a GAA and soccer team now and am super fit and there's no fecking game! Even Bobby Brown was out running me last year desperate to make amends :D

[TiocfaidhArmani]

Free shots for anyone in any celtic shirt i say !!

;)

Feck that, give me a good old fashioned pint :D

I don't actually have a home strip don't wear jerseys just have a polo phirt :(

[outspoken]

Sorry to bump such an old thread but what's the craic with the 2012 super cup it's all very quiet in terms of dates, teams etc I know they signed a 10 year deal and a 3 year deal with sky but after such a poor showing last year will they maybe scrap it? Or with the euros on this year leave it for a year?

[TiocfaidhArmani]

Sorry to bump such an old thread but what's the craic with the 2012 super cup it's all very quiet in terms of dates, teams etc I know they signed a 10 year deal and a 3 year deal with sky but after such a poor showing last year will they maybe scrap it? Or with the euros on this year leave it for a year?

I was told they made a profit with the TV money and Liverpool and Celtic are being lined up. That would be a sell-out no doubt.

[El-Pietro]

I was told they made a profit with the TV money and Liverpool and Celtic are being lined up. That would be a sell-out no doubt.
i imagine thousands of fans would be torn as to who to support in that game, thankfully i shoudl be out of the country when this is on this year

[outspoken]

Even though the games were pure sh1te last year I still enjoyed going up to the Aviva and seeing all the big names that's why I was wondering have they any date in mind so I can free myself up for it, as for a sell out can't see the fai managing that anyone else yes but that lot nota hope

[ger121]

My Sister is a big Liverpool Fan, so would probably go along with her as she goes to a lot of Bohs games with me.

[outspoken]

My sisters a barstooler so she wants to go too, as ever il be one of the aliens supporting the Irish lads, imagine

[outspoken]

Looking at the calender august 5th and 6th is the bank holiday weekend so prob the likely date.

[Dodge]

There's league fixtures that weekend.

[Trainee]

Think I read in some paper a few months ago, that the Dublin super cup will be scraped due to poor attendances, and the Fai will have to pay Compensation to Endemol as they signed up for 10 years

[outspoken]

You know the fai don't give a ---- about the league.

[Charlie Darwin]

10 years?!

[outspoken]

Ye they signed a 10 year deal, 3 with sky to broadcast the games. You think a more clever route would be see how the first year went and take it from there.

[Dodge]

Its run by endemol. So if it doesn't happen, presumably the FAI can sue (rather than the other way around)

[colonelwest]

Endemol have pulled out, still going ahead though this year. 10 year deal wasn't it with Endemol? I'd say the FAI saw a few bob for that.

http://www.extratime.ie/newsdesk/articles/7347/

The FAI and Iconic Worldwide Events have teamed up to run this year’s version of the Dublin Super Cup, with the news announced today that the previous partners Endemol Sport have ended their involvement in the competition by mutual agreement.

The new partnership ensures fans in Ireland will have the opportunity to see some of football’s current starts do battle in this pre-season affair.

Manchester City were the first side to lift the trophy, which ran from the 30th – 31st July 2011, as they overcame the challenge of Inter Milan by 3-0. The high profile event also attracted Scottish outfit Celtic along side an Airtricity League XI managed by Damien Richardson.

The Airtricity select propped up the bottom of the table, failing to score during the 180 minutes of play. Celtic finished second in the table thanks to a 5-0 drubbing of the Irish side on the second afternoon. Inter Milan lost out to the eventual winners City, thanks to goals from Mario Ballotelli, Edin Dzeko and Adam Johnson.

Iconic Worldwide Events are responsible for the creation of Football’s Next Star, the Sky One show which awards one young player with a professional contract with Inter Milan. The company were involved in the creation of last year’s competition.

Whilst no team’s have been confirmed to participate in the 2012 competition as of yet, an announcement is expected in the near future to include some high profile clubs from Britain and Europe.

[nigel-harps1954]

I hope to god theres no LOI select and they just opt for a league team in itself.

[outspoken]

I hope to god theres no LOI select and they just opt for a league team in itself.

Ye totally agree it would be a lot better but how would you detirmine which team to enter and then you have to remember it's bang dead center in the middle of a hectic time in the calender so it would be very tough for a LOI team to play world class opposition back to back then throw in the fact our best teams and players are away in Europe it's just an awful headache. I hate to say don't put a LOI 11 in it because I'm sure the lads that do get picked cherish that but it's not looking good right now.

On the tournament as a whole I think the fact Endamol have pulled out says it all really.....poor attendances, poor football (it is pre-season in fairness) with last years tournament only been saved by the fantastic Celtic fans and Skys excellent coverage of the tournament which seemed to bring in a few Bob.

Spurs, barca, Celtic and Longford Town my dream (a wild one at that) line up.

[sullanefc]

Maybe the team that finishes just outside the Euro spots could play in it. Who would that be this year? Bohs? I suppose you'd have to make sure that the team taking part could field two teams two days in a row also. Give them a free week in the league by postponing whatever league fixture they have and it should be no problem.

[Dodge]

Maybe the team that finishes just outside the Euro spots could play in it. Who would that be this year? Bohs? I suppose you'd have to make sure that the team taking part could field two teams two days in a row also. Give them a free week in the league by postponing whatever league fixture they have and it should be no problem.
They don't postpone games for European team, never mind friendlies...

[Nah Nah Nah Nah]

Maybe the team that finishes just outside the Euro spots could play in it. Who would that be this year? Bohs? I suppose you'd have to make sure that the team taking part could field two teams two days in a row also. Give them a free week in the league by postponing whatever league fixture they have and it should be no problem.

Doesn't the league take a break for the "super" cup?

[bennocelt]

Ye totally agree it would be a lot better but how would you detirmine which team to enter and then you have to remember it's bang dead center in the middle of a hectic time in the calender so it would be very tough for a LOI team to play world class opposition back to back then throw in the fact our best teams and players are away in Europe it's just an awful headache. I hate to say don't put a LOI 11 in it because I'm sure the lads that do get picked cherish that but it's not looking good right now.



League cup or setanta winner perhaps?