Russia wins 2018 rights, Qatar to host 2022

[BonnieShels]

Well its masking the outrageous decision that was Qatar over here.

[Metrostars]

I love football but there are times like Henrygate and now this that it sickens me so much, I feel like I can't watch another game. Last year, I didn't expect the game to be replayed or for us to be given a 33rd spot. No, I had hoped that FIFA would do something to prevent this from happening in the future. At least to consider the option of goal line technology or a system to review such incidents. But no, nothing. It was laughed off by Blatter and co.

And here we are 12 months later with some more farcical decisions by the most corrupt sporting organization in the world. England, Spain/Portugal, USA and Austrailia, I sure tried to "buy" votes on the FIFA Executive Committee. It's just that they didn't offer as much as Russia and Qatar. England should not have to resort to having to play friendlies in the summer in Trinidad or have Beckham open an academy there to secure the vote of Jack Warner (who turned on them in any case). It's all about power and money. 'What can we do to secure your vote?' should not be a criteria to securing the World Cup.

And it's easy to bash Anson and co when they are now saying they should not even bother to apply anymore under these circumstances. Of course they knew the game of politics and money and they tried to play. It's just that Russia and Qatar are better at it since that it what they are good at.

There is no easy way to fix this either e.g. for the US bid for 2022, it is rumored over here that it's quite probable that Warner, the Concacaf President did even vote for the US in the first round. But with 30 something island countries in the Caribbean who are a lock for Warner when his term is up next year, there is little that US and Mexico, who bring in the vast majority of the money to Concacaf can do.

And as for 2026, logic suggests it should go to a non-Asian, probably non-Euro country, maybe the US again. But if China comes knocking, it will be handed to them on a platter by Blatter so he can continue his "legacy".

As I said, I love the sport, but I loathe FIFA.

[pineapple stu]

Blatter will be gone in eight years' time when 2026 is awarded. You'll hope. (He's 74 now)

Whatever about England, the Yanks (and Japan and South Korea) shouldn't have gotten 2022 purely on the basis that they've had it quite recently (1994 and 2002).

[Dodge]

Whatever about England, the Yanks (and Japan and South Korea) shouldn't have gotten 2022 purely on the basis that they've had it quite recently (1994 and 2002).

The 2022 vote came down to USA, Qatar, Australia, Japan and Korea. 3 of them have (co-)hosted a World Cup in that last 16 years. Australia couldn't even guarantee that stadiums/pitches would be available (and had significant objections from some state governments). There's no doubt that all that helped Qatar. Throwing billions at it probably helped a small bit too


And as for 2026, logic suggests it should go to a non-Asian, probably non-Euro country, maybe the US again. But if China comes knocking, it will be handed to them on a platter by Blatter so he can continue his "legacy".


Blatter actually inserted a clause in the FIFA statutes that prevents a continent holding it twice in a row. So it definitely won't be China in 2026

[shakermaker1982]

I think the thing that pi$$es off the English fans and media is that their bid scored the highest mark out of all the other 2018 bids yet it counted for nothing. I think the document cost 3 million to put together.

Qatar is the strange one though and it has to be down to £. The journalists moaning should be out there finding the money trail.....

This is from yesterdays Observer. David Hill's always cracks me up. A good read....

2018 - The timeline

How Sepp's big decision was made easier:
1) Leaked US cable describes Russia as "a rampantly corrupt, autocratic kleptocracy" run by a leader who has "amassed a massive secret fortune" by running a "mafia state" based on "personal enrichment, protection for gangsters, extortion and kickbacks, suitcases full of money, a parallel tax system and bribery estimated at $300bn a year".
2) Sepp: "Congratulations to Russia! Clearly, I am a satisfied man."
The highlights

Highlights from the last three months as Sepp set about shaping his legacy ("I'm working to make football a school of life, bringing hope, bringing emotions!"):

• Best individual performance: Executive Committee member Amos Adamu – caught in the bribery sting four months after telling colleagues facing separate fraud charges how they should behave. "The public sees every football administrator as corrupt, and I cannot explain why it is so. We must always be transparent to prove them wrong!"

• Runner-up: Former ExCo member Ismael Bhamjee – caught in the same sting, four years after his first one: exposed in 2006 for touting World Cup tickets at three times face value to supplement his £270 daily Fifa expenses. "I got myself in a mess," Bhamjee said at the time. "This was out of character."

• Best award: Former ExCo member Viacheslav Koloskov – travelling to Asunción in October to lobby current ExCo member Nicolás Léoz for Russia's bid. Léoz (accused by Panorama of taking £450k in bribes) honoured Koloskov (who received an unauthorised £65k payment from Sepp in 2002) with an award for "services to football and its principles".

• Best analysis: also from Koloskov – greeting the publication of the bids' expensive technical reports in November: "I know from my own experience that ExCo members work with little information. The inspection reports are enormous, so no one reads them."

• Best timing: October – Russia's sports minister Vitaly Mutko attacks the British press for "obsessive" analysis of Russia's racism record. Also that month: Russian football agent Vladimir Abramov gives an interview to Sport.ru about how Nigerians ruin Russian cities with "their drugs, and ultimately, their Aids". Abramov: "Teams shouldn't have more than one dark-skinned footballer. When there's more than one they are aggressive"; plus: "I am very respectful towards blacks, but Russia isn't ready for them." FIfa's view: "Racism will not be taken into account in the bidding process … It is not an operation matter".

• Best outrage: Mutko again, on why attention from the English press left him exasperated. "No matter what we say we are portrayed by them as a hotbed of corruption. It is not true." Later that week: Russian authorities launch a criminal investigation into alleged fraud at Mutko's ministry, including Mutko's own expenses claim for 97 breakfasts eaten during a 20-day trip to Vancouver.

• Best defenders: Fifa ExCo members on the "slanders" against Sepp's process:

1) Jérôme Valcke (sacked in 2006 for "lying repeatedly" to potential sponsors and reappointed by Sepp in 2007): "We have done everything we can to make sure this process is fair and transparent."
2) Chuck Blazer (called a liar "without credibility" by a US judge in 2006): "You can't say the system is bad just because one newspaper created a scam, a trap."
3) Jack Warner (totally clean): "We preach equity… we live by our principle of fair play!"
4) Plus: Angel María Villar Llona – making an epic address to colleagues in Zurich: "I love Fifa dearly but those I love the most are my colleagues in the ExCo. Recently we have been criticised by certain media, but unfortunately for them, Fifa is a clean institution. We have heard enough slander. This process is clean – whatever they say!"

• Proudest media campaign: The Sun, writing an open letter to Sepp on the eve of voting, attacking Panorama's "sabotage" of England's bid. "Today The Sun makes this plea to Mr Blatter and Fifa: don't be put off by the BBC's rehashing of ancient history. Despite BBC muckraking, The Sun trusts Fifa to put football first." (3 Dec, The Sun: "FIXED! FIFA BUNGS RUSSIA THE WORLD CUP … Calls for corruption probe …")

• Plus: the best single assessment of why England lost – seven weeks before the vote: former ExCo member Ahongalu Fusimalohi, also caught in the Sunday Times sting, warning that England must offer bribes. "England don't strike deals. It's sad but it's true." Fusimalohi explained: "It is corrupt – but only if you get caught."
Clean break: moving on

Next for Sepp after a tough few months: a chance for some clean PR in the build-up to Brazil 2014. Overseeing the tournament: Fifa ExCo member Ricardo Teixeria – due in court this week in Rio over alleged money laundering, tax evasion and "other economic crimes". Teixeria, who denies wrongdoing, was due in court last week, but secured a postponement so he could vote in Zurich.
And finally: why England really lost

The Daily Mail on why England's bid failed: "Was it the video that cost us?" The Mail says the film shown during England's bid presentation in Zurich was "un-English", too "multi-cultural" and relied on "a range of ethnically diverse figures".
(Online comments on the story from Mail readers: • "It makes me sick when we have this 'multicultural' rubbish rubbed in our faces" • "This country is dying" • "You couldn't make it up, we Brits have to put up with this nonsense every day" • "Fools! Multi cultural idiots!!!" • "Well done Daily Mail for having the courage to speak up" • plus: "If only Diana were here to see what this nation has become.")

[Dodge]

I think the thing that pi$$es off the English fans and media is that their bid scored the highest mark out of all the other 2018 bids yet it counted for nothing.

it scored highest in some of the technical areas but its rarely down to that (as Russia can build it stadia and upgrade its plans)

[shakermaker1982]

it scored highest in some of the technical areas but its rarely down to that (as Russia can build it stadia and upgrade its plans)

Number of FIFA Executive voters who read the English 2018 document? 3. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/england/8180418/World-Cup-2018-only-three-Fifa-executive-committee-members-requested-Englands-bid-book.html

Russia had it in the bag months ago.

[Dodge]

Thats BS as they were all handed each bid. Whether they read it or not is down to your own beliefs but the Telegraph is printing rubbish.

And of course the decision was made months ago. As it should've been according to the various assesments. Typical fecking English media thinking that Beckham and Prince Willy could swing it for them.

[Metrostars]

The 2022 vote came down to USA, Qatar, Australia, Japan and Korea. 3 of them have (co-)hosted a World Cup in that last 16 years. Australia couldn't even guarantee that stadiums/pitches would be available (and had significant objections from some state governments). There's no doubt that all that helped Qatar. Throwing billions at it probably helped a small bit too

It would have been 28 years for the US at 2022. Germany hosted in 2006, 32 years after their last time. Not much of a difference there.




Blatter actually inserted a clause in the FIFA statutes that prevents a continent holding it twice in a row. So it definitely won't be China in 2026
They have no problem in breaking their own rules when it suits them. Now, what happened to that Rotation Rule they had?

[Dodge]

IT wasn't a rule. The new 'rule' is about the continents.

And yeah, of course FIFA is corrupt and can break whatever rules they make.

My point is that people can't pick and choose when they think FIFA were bing corrupt and when they weren't. You can't say that Germany or Brazil was the right decision but Russia or Qatar isn't, based solely on corruption.

[Metrostars]

IT wasn't a rule. The new 'rule' is about the continents.
OK, it was a "Principle":

The FIFA Executive Committee has expressed a clear opinion in favour of some form of rotating the FIFA World Cup among the six continental confederations, as from the year 2010.

The Committee, meeting in Zurich under the chairmanship of the FIFA President, Joseph S. Blatter, unanimously backed Blatter's suggestion to ensure that all continents be given an equal opportunity to host the World Cup.
http://img.fifa.com/aboutfifa/federation/news/newsid=73722.html
Then abandoned when it after South Africa and Brazil were assured of their World Cups:

As from 2018, the hosting of the FIFA World Cup™ will cease to be rotated. Under the chairmanship of President Joseph S. Blatter, the FIFA Executive Committee today - 29 October 2007 - unanimously passed a decision to abandon the principle (originally introduced in the year 2000) of rotating the men's World Cup from continent to continent. The confederations whose associations have hosted the two preceding World Cups will not be eligible to bid, however. Consequently, all the associations from Asia, North and Central America and the Caribbean, Oceania and Europe may bid for the 2018 FIFA World Cup™.
http://www.fifa.com/aboutfifa/federation/administration/releases/newsid=625122.html


And yeah, of course FIFA is corrupt and can break whatever rules they make.

My point is that people can't pick and choose when they think FIFA were bing corrupt and when they weren't. You can't say that Germany or Brazil was the right decision but Russia or Qatar isn't, based solely on corruption.
It was nicely set up for Brazil for 2014 with the "Rotation Principle" and noone else from Conmebol competing. So, according to this rule:
The confederations whose associations have hosted the two preceding World Cups will not be eligible to bid, however. noone from AFC or UEFA can apply for 2026 which leaves just Concacaf(USA/Mexico) or Conmebol(Argentina) and Oceania(noone, Australia are in AFC).

Let's check back in this thread in 8 years to see if FIFA will change this bid eligibility rule anyway.

[Closed Account 2]

2030 is the centenary of the first World Cup, and I think I read somewhere that Argentina and Uruguay are targeting a joint bid for that.

[BonnieShels]

2030 is the centenary of the first World Cup, and I think I read somewhere that Argentina and Uruguay are targeting a joint bid for that.

If there was justice that's where it SHOULD be. however... I hear Liechtenstein could be in for this one.
Sure they don't need stadia, they can use Austria's and Switzerland's. :)

[Closed Account 2]

Now you're being silly, Lichtenstein ?

They have far too much international pedigree, draws with Slovakia and Portugal, wins over Latvia and Iceland, I think Djibouti would be a better bet.

[Stuttgart88]

Just a few points on England's reaction:

- I thought their bid was very credible & deserved to have run Russia close.
- However their indignation at FIFA's practices are misplaced / hypocritical, because
- the football regulators in England have virtually ignored every well considered request for regulatory reform; the FA is toothless and the EPL rules the roost. The EPL has TWO people on its board, one of whom has a very patchy track record in business. The EPL has shown contempt towards the international game and has little interest in developing grass roots (unlike the FA).
- The EPL is a marketing phenomenon but a regulatory disaster (serially loss making, the rogues gallery of club owners - "fit & proper" my ar3e, huge tax arrears, takeover structures that would be illegal in other industries...).
- the EPL destabilised the bid ages back. In fact, despite the strong late finish from the English bid, their bid was a shambles from the start with internal bickering totally undermining it.
-whereas other countries have influence in UEFA & FIFA England have none. Their figureheads are temporary cheerleaders or mascots - other countries have proper "football politicians". It mirrors the UK's tendency towards the EU: stand on the outside complaining about its structure and moan about maybe withdrawing
- Cameron can't complain about being lied to - he's a politician.

In light of most of the above, what did they expect? A shame really because they'd have done a great job hosting it.

[bennocelt]

Maybe, just maybe, the best bids came from Russia and Qatar? Seeing as not one of us have seen all the bids...

Exactly, even though I would have preferred if Spain/portugal got it, but Russia deserve a chance, why not?

As for Qatar, wasn't unexpected and as i have said at the start of this thread - they put up a bloody good show, and in fact it might just work in a small country. Less meaningless travelling for fans and the chance to actually get to attend 3 games in on a day - which is perfect for fans.

Delighted England didnt get it - their Euros were a flop.
Seb Coe "As a football fan Im gutted" - yeah right!!!!

[OwlsFan]

I see Blatter is accusing England of being sore losers. I agree with him and also the bit about the arrogance of Western Europe (not sure why he should add "Christian" on there though.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/england/8189550/World-Cup-2018-Fifa-president-Sepp-Blatter-says-England-are-bad-losers.html

I also agree with this bit by the English bid head:

"England bid chairman and Fifa ExCo (Executive Committee) member Geoff Thompson said on Wednesday that Fifa should have clarified its priorities at the start of the process. “We are moving into new territories. If that was in their mind, they should have said that in the bidding documents. I don’t think it was anti-FA,” he told Sky News. “I think clarification was needed.” "

[Dodge]

I also agree with this bit by the English bid head:

"England bid chairman and Fifa ExCo (Executive Committee) member Geoff Thompson said on Wednesday that Fifa should have clarified its priorities at the start of the process. “We are moving into new territories. If that was in their mind, they should have said that in the bidding documents. I don’t think it was anti-FA,” he told Sky News. “I think clarification was needed.” "

Em, he was on the fecking committee that decided it. He had a fecking vote!! Was off making tea when the rest of them supposedly decided this?

[Closed Account 2]

I see Blatter is accusing England of being sore losers. I agree with him and also the bit about the arrogance of Western Europe (not sure why he should add "Christian" on there though.

Can only think the "Christian" comment is an attempt to justify the er... eccentric choice for 2022.

[Closed Account 2]

Looks like the talk of moving the WC2022 to January is gaining momentum, Platini has now said it could be possible:

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5jGJ-NVK_BcQPusbsJX5vB9dxMDZw?docId=4ec3bf5de1964bae9f9 f31bbe79f7a29

[BonnieShels]

Looks like the talk of moving the WC2022 to January is gaining momentum, Platini has now said it could be possible:

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5jGJ-NVK_BcQPusbsJX5vB9dxMDZw?docId=4ec3bf5de1964bae9f9 f31bbe79f7a29

Now there's our reason to keep summer soccer.

[thischarmingman]

He's a moron. An utter moron.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2010/dec/14/blatter-gay-fans-qatar-world-cup


The Fifa president, Sepp Blatter, has attempted to laugh off the problems which gay supporters may face at the 2022 World Cup in Qatar.

[BonnieShels]

Heard the audio yday. He's easily the biggest non-Irish plonker I've come across in an age.

[ArdeeBhoy]

He's a moron. An utter moron.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2010/dec/14/blatter-gay-fans-qatar-world-cup

Amen to that. The sooner the clown goes the better. He almost makes certain Irish politicians seem credible by comparison.

[BonnieShels]

Amen to that. The sooner the clown goes the better. He almost makes certain Irish politicians seem credible by comparison.

To be replaced by...

another moron... ah FIFA... why can't they act more like the IOC. :)

[Spudulika]

He's a moron. An utter moron.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2010/dec/14/blatter-gay-fans-qatar-world-cup


At every major championships we hear the usual talk of wives and partners being banned from hotels and sex bans for players - everybody smiles and just gets on with it. During the last but one World Cup German cities had "brothel zones" to service fans, apart from a few liberal outlets it went past the public and there was no major outrage. At Olympic and Commonwealth games they distribute free condoms (including Arab Games) and it passes unnoticed - even when it's reported that "condoms" are blocking poorly constructed sewerage systems. Blatter was asked an unpalatable question and responded in a decent manner that was from a sporting point of view and it was asked to provoke a storm - no matter what he said he was going to lose. However why the need for clarification, as is standard in Arabia, what goes on between grown adults in hotel rooms has a blind eye turned to it. Reporters know this. Why not bring up the fact that relations between non-married adults are against the law? Or that Dubai and other tourist destinations have flights to odd destinations that are simply used to traffic women in and out?

Trust the leftie homosexual centric rag that is the Guardian to spin this out of control. Oddly they've been very pro-active on the anti-english front of late.

[DannyInvincible]

'French Football Magazine Claims Qatar Bribed Their Way To Being 2022 World Cup Hosts': http://www.balls.ie/football/french-football-magazine-claims-qatar-bribed-their-way-to-being-2022-world-cup-hosts/#sthash.cMl1cuBJ.IFo6qC32.dpbs


French Football magazine France Football published a 15-page article today titled ‘Qatargate’ in which it claims that FIFA executive committee officials accepted bribes to vote for the Qatari bid for the 2022 World Cup. Australia, Japan, USA and South Korea were the other contenders to be hosts.

They allege that President of the African Confederation Issa Hayatou of Cameroon along with Jacques Anouma of Ivory Coast both accepted $1.5m to vote for Qatar. It is also claimed that Qatar patronised the 2010 African Confederation Congress to the amount of $1.25m in order to gain access to it’s members.

The article also details a meeting between French President Nicolas Sarozy, UEFA President Michele Platini and Qatari crown prince Sheikh Tamim bin Hamad bin Khalifa Al-Thani in 2010. It was thought at the time that Platini would vote for the USA bid but later opted for Qatar. According to the article Nicolas Sarkozy asked Platini to vote for Qatar due to geopolitical reasons.

The Qatari crown prince bought French club Paris St. Germain in 2011 and has since made massive investments in the club buying players such as Zlatan Ibrahimovic, Ezequiel Lavezzi and Thiago Silva. He also established a new French sports televisions network named beIN Sports. France Football say that both of these investments were influenced by the talks he had with Sarkozy and Platini in 2010.

France Football will be submitting their evidence to FIFA for further review.

[BonnieShels]

No way? Bribes. I didn't think that at all.

I mean as a giant in world football and with such superb infrastructure they were nailed on. I hope it never gets there.

We have to ask why 2018 and 2022 were announced at the same time. Clearly it was so Blatter got the benefit of announcing the 2022 bid himself as by the time the real announcement date comes round (usually 7 years isn't it, ie. 2015) comes about he'll be out of teh job.

Very serious implications though if it is proven that the political process (Sarkozy asking Platini to vote for Qatar) influenced the decision.

Woo. Bye bye Platini. :)

And we can get rid of that awful Euro 2020 plan.

[Dodge]

This article puts a bit of context on it. Basically the article breaks no new ground and just aggregates all the rumours without really backing them up with hard facts;

http://mondialblog.tumblr.com/post/41778888466/qatargate


I think it’s fair to say that few people came out of the bid race with much credit and while it may have been more palatable for England, the US or Australia to have won hosting rights, they lost out to healthier resourced opponents who played to the margins better than they did.

Every bid that was in serious contention sought to exploit loopholes in the bid guidelines and played to the line.
He goes on...

[BonnieShels]

"Exploit loopholes"

Wonderful phrasing.

Here's hoping he's holding over the details for teh Authorities. :(

[Dodge]

But what could they do if that's all that happened? Read the article. its more than that quote, and not really a defence of Qatar

[BonnieShels]

But what could they do if that's all that happened? Read the article. its more than that quote, and not really a defence of Qatar

Bugger all.

That's why I had a sad face. :(

[geysir]

every bid that was in serious contention sought to exploit loopholes in the bid guidelines and played to the line.
Loopholes kinda implies that the bid guidelines were a shodddy piece of work, exploited by crafty bidders.
We need a definition of what loophole actually means by Sir Humphrey of Yes Minister, something that covers a well crafted piece in a document, purposely designed to allow all sorts of shenanigans.
It will be interesting to see how UEFA FFP handles the Qatar Investment Authority advertising deal with PSG for €200m p/a, not including shirt or stadium naming rights.
Probably just an aside, but Platini's son works for QSI the owners of PSG.

[BonnieShels]

Loopholes kinda implies that the bid guidelines were a shodddy piece of work, exploited by crafty bidders.
We need a definition of what loophole actually means by Sir Humphrey of Yes Minister, something that covers a well crafted piece in a document, purposely designed to allow all sorts of shenanigans.
It will be interesting to see how UEFA FFP handles the Qatar Investment Authority advertising deal with PSG for €200m p/a, not including shirt or stadium naming rights.
Probably just an aside, but Platini's son works for QSI the owners of PSG.

Yeah. I heard that when the sponsorship was announced.

[Spudulika]

Qatar sponsor Barce, buy clubs and do lots of charitable things - like buy weapons from America to supply al Qaeda fighters in Syria. It's all for a good cause - oh, and sure aren't the Frogs pushing for Syria after Assad and supplying and backing the al Qaeda loonies there too, while opposing them in Mali - oddly un/barely tapped oil and gas riches in Mali have absotively nothing to do with intervention by them and their cousins across the channel in the UK.

David Conn (who I'd normally respect) had a piece in the grauniad today about migrant workers in Qatar, which was screamingly hysterical, yet the UAE is one of the worst areas for criminality, human rights abuses and trafficking in the world - but it's not important right now.

There is a definite agenda to go after Platini, probably set in motion by Herr Blatter and his buddies in the English FA, the same English FA who gave away the future of English football to a bunch of half-heads to set up the sky league and who (only now) have stopped cribbing about Russia getting the 2018 World Cup. One wonders what deals are being done to silence them and calm down the little englanders in the meeja so that Russia gets a free pass and Qatar (and France) gets a battering.

[geysir]

It's interesting when you read the Mondial blog (linked earlier) on the France Football investigation.
It's pretty much saying that, yes Qatar lashed the cash at the bid, but in the same way everybody else was, just that they had more of it. And that there's nothing new in the France Football's allegations that paints Qatar blacker than the others, because already there has been a high standard of blackness established and all within the loopholed ridden, bid guidelines.

[Spudulika]

The English were the first to get caught doling out gifts (expensive handbags amongst other things) and they were certainly not clean. In order to get any sort of event hosted there needs to be stimuli.