Republic of Ireland V Norway - Wednesday, 17th November 2010 - Friendly

[Brendan 82]

Norway were turd tonight.

[theworm2345]

You can hear the unrest around the stadium

[sligoman]

No Seamie once again, well done Trap.

[TrapAPony]

That was so easy. And they are so average. Mightily disappointing.

Just like Slovakia and Russia. We are not going anywhere under Trap IMO and that's not a kneejerk reaction.

[Maroon 7]

All over. Only a friendly but still a poor defeat. Norway offered very little and still won.

[Olander]

I could see him withdrawing Long for Coleman and sticking McGeady in behind yet. Disappointed not to see him by this stage myself but he'll get his chance, too good not to.

The decrepit old fool has made a liar of you, unfortunately.

[ken foree]

reflects very poorly on us that they were that bad, and we were at home.

[SwanVsDalton]

Just like Slovakia and Russia IMO.

You're nuts if you think Russia are anywhere near that level. Slovakia maybe, but they have some gears. That crowd we're rubbish.

McGeady back to his bad old tricks there in the last 5, aimless stuff.

[Stuttgart88]

We are totally one paced. Slow. No flippin tempo whatsoever.

[SwanVsDalton]

The decrepit old fool has made a liar of you, unfortunately.


Bit unclear but when I said 'get his chance' I met some point in the near future as opposed to this match.

[geysir]

That's how Norway play, hold deep, rope a dope. And they did it well.

[SwanVsDalton]

We are totally one paced. Slow. No flippin tempo whatsoever.

We were good in the first 20 of both halves. Just didn't maintain it at all.

[Paddy Garcia]

Disappointed that neither Wilson or Coleman got on the pitch. Does not make sense - wasting time with Whelan!

[TrapAPony]

You're nuts if you think Russia are anywhere near that level.

An average Slovakia could beat them in Russia. Slovenia knocked Russia out to qualify for the World Cup and they are average. Belgium beat them 2-0 tonight in Russia (friendly). Are they really that good? I personally don't think so. Anyway back to the match.

[boovidge]

First 20 minutes we looked really good then it became the usual. No idea why we didn't try Coleman, or switch anything round in the middle of the park. i know injuries restricted things but still..

[SkStu]

i hope nobody comes on here and tries to defend the team selection, tactics and mindset of Trappatoni after that display. Overpaid, lazy has-been. What a waste of 90 minutes.

[elroy]

I hope the Nations cup games are alot better than this. Friendlies appear to becoming more and more less relevant for fans and players alike.

Did we learn anything significant tonight???!? Maybe that Fahey might be worth a go at centre midfield. Shane Long developing into a useful option up front. But anything more?? Particularly wouldve like to have some more of Foley and also Wilson and Coleman.

[Stuttgart88]

I'd be perfectly happy if we played negative stuff but did it well. We play negative stuff badly.

[SwanVsDalton]

I actually don't think the central midfielders did all that badly (Whelan played a lot better than he did in previous games) but they were clearly gassed towards the end. Never mind Coleman, how Wilson didn't get on the pitch I do not know...

[Predator]

No Seamie once again, well done Trap.
Where was he going to come on after O'Dea had been replaced by Foley? McGeady had already come on and Hunt and Treacy were the natural replacements for Duff.

Overall I'm disappointed with the result. We didn't play much in the second half compared to the first (tiredness?). Walters did not impress me and McGeady was useless. I thought Fahey's passing was quite poor at times, which is worrying for a player whose main strength in his repertoire is his passing.
I was impressed with Long - that kid's a terrier. Cunningham played well enough before he was caught out for the second goal and Whelan put himself about well.
On O'Dea; I wonder is this recurrent injury going to continue throughout his career? If so, it's a shame, since he'll never be considered a reliable option or backup for centre half - something we desperately need. I was also puzzled as to why Trap didn't put Wilson in there.

[ifk101]

Thought Cunningham did really well tonight and certainly is a viable option for LB.

A few individual good performances (JOSH, Long, Fahey in flashes) but tactically were too predictable and Trapattoni needs to show some flexibility. Tactics rather than individuals is the reason we lost.

O'Dea unfortunately isn't an option for future internationals.

[tricky_colour]

1.5 Mb apparently, but that drops real quick once you connect outside China. Game doesn't seem to be getting shown on any Chinese stations. Got that Yolasite one working reasonably well through a proxy, so hopefully I'll get these last 15 mins!

Nope there goes that one. I've had enough play-pause-play-pause, off to bed, hopefully can find a torrent of it tomorrow. Thanks for all the help everyone, hopefully I'll be luckier next time!




I used to get channels from here a long while back, however as I don't understand Chinese I have no idea what I am doing,
but they did have some football on sometimes.

http://epg.tvsou.com/programys/TV_1/Channel_1/W4.htm

I expect there will be a torrent available, however it was not a great match, so you didn't miss much.

[TrapAPony]

Cunningham was about the only good thing that came out of tonight's match.

[geysir]

Hunt was well off his game and possibly Coleman could have come on to the right and McGeady switch to the left.

[FarBeag]

Yep. Himself and Long i think

[SwanVsDalton]

Long was excellent as well, JOSH made a great case for moving CB freeing up RB and - shoot me - I thought Whelan played well. But yeah other than that there's not much coming from tonight. Considering the opposition and some decent play in patches, this friendly defeat is more irritating than most. I guess at least we played quite well in periods but out we drop intensity so easily. Frustrating.

[Predator]

Hunt was well off his game and possibly Coleman could have come on to the right and McGeady switch to the left.Was thinking that too, but Trap doesn't appear to consider him a winger. Either that or he didn't trust him enough.

[geysir]

Long was excellent as well, JOSH made a great case for moving CB freeing up RB

We already know Josh can play at CH, he doesn't have to make a case for that. It's up to a RB to come on and make a case so Josh can be in the centre.

I thought Josh was sloppy at times. Definite sloppy pass which led to their 2nd goal. He is not made out to be the main man at CH, but best choice with Dunne

[tricky_colour]

Was thinking that too, but Trap doesn't appear to consider him a winger. Either that or he didn't trust him enough.

But this was the time to find out, that's is what friendlies are for, now he has learned nothing about what he can do
in a green shirt.

[Predator]

Would you say that Coleman is ahead of Foley for the right back spot? Or ahead of McGeady or Hunt for the spot on the wing? I would have liked Coleman to come on, but the circumstances dictated that Trapattoni play it safe as it were, by sticking with his more experienced heads. He probably felt that having Cunningham, and Coleman in a defence with O'Shea and Kelly in the middle would have been too inexperienced. Saying that, if Trap had put Wilson in CB he could have replaced Kelly with Coleman later on in the game. Or alternatively, he could have stuck Coleman on for Duff and put McGeady out on the left, but Trap has said that he doesn't see Coleman as a winger. Strange enough.

[SwanVsDalton]

We already know Josh can play at CH, he doesn't have to make a case for that. It's up to a RB to come on and make a case so Josh can be in the centre.

I think you're underestimating how much Trap rates Sledge.

[backstothewall]

Only got seeing parts of the game out of one eye (moving house next week), but I am glad to see Foley get a chance. He always shows up and letting Coleman move past him in the pecking order at this stage would have been a slap in the face. Coleman will certainly get a chance, and being around the squad will benefit him tremendously. Hopefully this means the end of McShane.

Wilson not getting on beggers belief. What on earth is there left to learn about Glenn Whelan (not knocking him for a second, he's a super player, but what if something happens to him).

[MariborKev]

backtowalsall,

Irrationally I dislike Foley due to his "I deserve to be in that team" comments from last year. However one can't argue that he has seen plenty of game time for Wolves this season and he deserved a go. I did feel that he always tucked in though and left the Norwegian too much space.Like everyone else, the performance of Cunningham was the standout for me. Worrying the number of times we were caught with a flat ball down the middle though. Can't see O'Dea being part of the centre of defence anytime soon.

I thought Fahey and Whelan were much too static in the first half, though Fahey did improve and look to dictate it a bit more in the second. I thought Hunty was a shadow of his former self when he came on, he didn't appear to have that electric pace over a couple of yards that we would have seen from him in the past. Lawerence was Lawerence, Duffer was lively in the first and then tired. I thought McGeady was a threat at times, and then as frustrating as normal at times.

Long did well but faded badly in the second as the game wore on. Dunno what to make of Walters, a decent bustling striker with the odd nice touch. But will he ever be anything more than a Doyle understudy. Time will tell.

It would have been nice not to lose it, but I'll not be throwing any toys out of the pram over this one.

[the bear]

complete waste of time.. very frustrating. . traps just goin through the motions. id say he has his retirement date set in his head and couldnt give a fiddlers about bringin players in for the future.

what did we learn? long can play as well as he did last month. mcgaeady can still do stepovers. hunt still needs a haircut.

in fairness was glad to see fahey offer something different in the centre, but that wouldnt of happened had green been fit

cunningham did well , but how he merits a place and coleman doesn't is beyond me. and if trap doesn't see coleman as a winger he obviously just doesn't watch the club matches. weather it's his best position i don't know, but he's prooved he can do a good job there

[Crosby87]

Didn't see a second of the game but it sounds like i should be happy about that.
Gun to your head, if you had to say right now at this second, do we qualify for Euro 2012. Yes or no.

[tommy_c12000]

Didn't see a second of the game but it sounds like i should be happy about that.
Gun to your head, if you had to say right now at this second, do we qualify for Euro 2012. Yes or no.

Don't think so

[tommy_c12000]

Would you say that Coleman is ahead of Foley for the right back spot? Or ahead of McGeady or Hunt for the spot on the wing? I would have liked Coleman to come on, but the circumstances dictated that Trapattoni play it safe as it were, by sticking with his more experienced heads. He probably felt that having Cunningham, and Coleman in a defence with O'Shea and Kelly in the middle would have been too inexperienced. Saying that, if Trap had put Wilson in CB he could have replaced Kelly with Coleman later on in the game. Or alternatively, he could have stuck Coleman on for Duff and put McGeady out on the left, but Trap has said that he doesn't see Coleman as a winger. Strange enough.


Trap doesn't see Coleman as a winger - Has he ever been to watch him play? No. Coleman has been the only stand out Irish player in the premiership this season, making headline after headline, oddly enough playing as a winger.

Trap definitely doesn't see Ciaran Clark as a defensive midfielder, he is a centre back period he tells us - Has he ever even seen him in the flesh? No. Funny that Houillier an accomplished manager who works with him day in and day out feels he can play as an accomplished defensive midfielder.

Is Trap an absolute out and out bluffer? Yes.

[Predator]

Trap doesn't see Coleman as a winger - Has he ever been to watch him play? No. Coleman has been the only stand out Irish player in the premiership this season, making headline after headline, oddly enough playing as a winger.Headline after headline? Surely that's hyperbole? He's played 11 games out of 13 in the Premiership, 4 of which were from the bench and he has played well. At the same time he has had the odd moment where it's obvious that he's still very much a raw talent and Moyes has indicated that Coleman is not the long-term answer to their right wing problem - he's filling in for the injured Leon Osman. But all of a sudden he's the new Gareth Bale (another player whose brief magnificence has been overblown in my opinion). I hope Coleman keeps up his good work and I'd love for him to become a top player for Ireland, but I can see why Trap didn't put him on. I don't know whether or not Trap has seen him in the flesh, but I'd guess that his scouts and coaches have and if not, I hope that he has at least seen footage. Either way, he's seen him twice now in training, so he's in a better place to make the judgement than you are or I am.


Trap definitely doesn't see Ciaran Clark as a defensive midfielder, he is a centre back period he tells us - Has he ever even seen him in the flesh? No. Funny that Houillier an accomplished manager who works with him day in and day out feels he can play as an accomplished defensive midfielder.

Is Trap an absolute out and out bluffer? Yes.Trap said that we needed defenders and not midfielders, hinting that he would rather Clark played defence.
I almost think that Trapattoni's English makes him seem less clued in, but I have no doubt that he is.

[SwanVsDalton]

Trap definitely doesn't see Ciaran Clark as a defensive midfielder, he is a centre back period he tells us - Has he ever even seen him in the flesh? No. Funny that Houillier an accomplished manager who works with him day in and day out feels he can play as an accomplished defensive midfielder.

Playing Clark at DM was a gamble which worked. If he's a long term DM or not remains to be seen - his CB potential, the position he's played in all his life, is far clearer. Bit of a theatrical comment considering Trap merely saw him as CB long term. If Clark proves a DM option I'm sure everyone, manager included, would be very happy.

[Predator]

Earlier, in response to outrage over Coleman not getting on, I said:

I would have liked Coleman to come on, but the circumstances dictated that Trapattoni play it safe as it were, by sticking with his more experienced heads. He probably felt that having Cunningham, and Coleman in a defence with O'Shea and Kelly in the middle would have been too inexperienced.
Seems I wasn't far wrong. Trap values balance and consistency; when asked about it, Trap said:
“In this moment we had a good balance on the pitch. I thought we had changed many situations. The draw satisfied us because in the second half we played well.

“I wish to focus on the team,” he added when pressed again.

“I could also have left out Duff but it’s important on the pitch to have a team with balance. It’s not easy in two days to change a player’s habit. We can play with (Keith) Treacy or Coleman and another team and you could lose two or three-nil."

[SwanVsDalton]

Seems I wasn't far wrong. Trap values experience and consistency; when asked about it, Trap said:
“In this moment we had a good balance on the pitch. I thought we had changed many situations. The draw satisfied us because in the second half we played well.

The only thing that really bothers me about tonight is this. Usually I don't have a problem with friendly results but the biggest benefit Trap brought to the Irish set-up, in my mind, is a winning mentality - or at least a do-not-lose-at-all-costs-mentality. After the last few results we have to start building momentum to the crucial Macedonian games as quickly as possible. And tonight, despite all the withdrawals, was a great opportunity to do that.

We shouldn't have been satisfied with a draw - that attitude always leads to the sucker punch, the late goal, the hammer blow. We should've been looking to win at home against a very, very mediocre outfit. I'm really quite cheesed off we lost. Long term I think it's bad news to the team mentality. I mean Norn Iron dug out a draw tonight against Morocco with a team they scraped together. A late equalising peno perhaps, but that team headed home feeling chuffed. Our side, with quite a few new faces, could be feeling quite discouraged.

There are positives from tonight, and maybe this is a little dramatic, but I can't help but feel all these missed opportunites and half performances are going to cost us long term.

We're actually quite fortunate to have these Celtic Cup games - fairly competitive fixtures which should be played at a good pace - to fine tune the team and get our confidence and mentality right for the qualifiers. It hasn't been the best half a year but at least we have a few games to get some consistency back.

[rebelmusic]

Lads, anyone record the game who can upload it? In India so the time difference was too much to stay up for it. Would appreciate it! Sounds from the post-match reaction that a Whelan-Fahey midfield could be the future

[Colbert Report]

Lads, anyone record the game who can upload it? In India so the time difference was too much to stay up for it. Would appreciate it! Sounds from the post-match reaction that a Whelan-Fahey midfield could be the future

Desperate for a recording of the match. Not readily available in Canada, they matches are on at 12:45pm local time for me so I'm always at work when they're on and I have no way to record it as it's not on television here. Thanks.

[shakermaker1982]

What have we learned from that game last night?

Cunningham is good enough to start at LB next year.

Shane Long would be in my starting 11 now. I love his enthusiasm, pace and ability to make something out of nothing.

John O'Shea has an obsession with lumping it long, even when under no pressure. STOP ******* GIVING THE BALL AWAY. He needs to be pulled up about this. The team clearly lacks leaders because he keeps doing it and nobody is going ape at him or pointing out to him that every time he does this we lose the ball.

McGeady? Most frustrating player in world football after Nani? Why pass the ball to your mate 5m to your left/right when you can try and dribble past 3 players, lose the ball and then put your team on the back foot.

Whelan/Fahey is a slight improvement on Whelan/Green. Fahey seems to get frustrated too often and will then force a hollywood style forward pass. Whelan did look a lot fitter than when he played against the Ruskies. I still don't think we have enough decen central MF to keep on playing 4-4-2.

Gutted for Coleman and Wilson. The two players I wanted to watch.

[ifk101]

My ratings :bigsmile:

Given - 6; Probably a little bit rusty but got the job done.
Cunningham - 7; Some very encouraging signs from a young player growing in confidence. I've certainly change my opinion on him after last night's performance.
JOSH - 7; Comfortable on the ball, leader in defence, a few sloppy long balls but clearly should be played at centre half from now on.
O'Dea - 5; Too slow and laboursome for the international game.
Kelly - 6; Expected more from him as this was his chance to make the RB position his own.
Duff - 6; Little bit off the pace but looked good in the early exchanges.
Whelan - 6; Did what he was told to do.
Fahey - 6; Did what he was told to do. I think he played a few sloppy passes but these passes were forced on him due to our style of play. Otherwise showed some nice touches that allowed a continued flow in our play and helped tidy up loose balls.
Lawrence - 5; He has played better. Thought his touch and general play was quite poor.
Doyle - 6; Wasn't involved enough for my liking.
Long - 7; Another energetic performance from an improving player.

Subs:
McGeady - 6; I think he is improving as a player as he slowly learning how to make better use of the ball. Still a strong tendency to put the head down and dribble when he gets the ball but there are signs he is improving his game.
Walters - 6; Won a few balls in the air and that's why he has been drafted in.
Hunt - 5; He's not fit. I think his crossing of the ball is of a high standard.
Foley - 5; Wasn't really involved tbh. Needs to be given more game time to grow into the RB role and feel he has Trapattoni's trust in his abilities. Only then will we see what he is capable of.


Trapattoni - 4; Our tactics are too static and inflexible. We're too easy to read - teams playing a 4-5-1/ 4-3-3 formation can open us up.

[tommy_c12000]

Headline after headline? Surely that's hyperbole? He's played 11 games out of 13 in the Premiership, 4 of which were from the bench and he has played well. Trap said that we needed defenders and not midfielders, hinting that he would rather Clark played defence.
I almost think that Trapattoni's English makes him seem less clued in, but I have no doubt that he is.

Fair enough it is exaggerated but Coleman is the only Irish player to collect a man of the match award in a premiership game this season and has been playing exceptional well. He has made the odd headline in the papers and has certainly been making headline after headline on this forum. Game time in a frivolous friendly against Norway was the very least he deserved.

I read in a couple of papers that he said Clark certainly isn't a defensive midfielder, he was a centre back, which I certainly don't think Trap was in a position to comment about considering he had never even met the guy.

[Kingdom]

Playing Clark at DM was a gamble which worked. If he's a long term DM or not remains to be seen - his CB potential, the position he's played in all his life, is far clearer. Bit of a theatrical comment considering Trap merely saw him as CB long term. If Clark proves a DM option I'm sure everyone, manager included, would be very happy.

There are clear parallel's with John O'Shea here. O'Shea was an outstanding centre back (in the Ferdinand mould rather than Vidic) all through his underage and reserve career and was played at full back out of necessity and other positions, but the only position he has excelled in for us has been the 6 months he played CB. It's his main position, the one he's most comfortable in, and the position where he would ideally suit Ireland alongside Dunne. Unfortunately he's been plugging a gap for us the past 18 months and we've been lucky to call on Ledger.
Clark could suffer the same, as he's unlikely to dislodge Dunne and Collins at Villa, but could get utilised elsewhere. I wouldn't fawn at Houllier's idea of where a guy can play either, this is the man that spent some 18m on Salif Diao and the Spitter, as well as plenty of moolah on Sean Dundee etc etc.

[dr_peepee]

cunningham did well , but how he merits a place and coleman doesn't is beyond me. and if trap doesn't see coleman as a winger he obviously just doesn't watch the club matches. weather it's his best position i don't know, but he's prooved he can do a good job there

I'd say the depth in their respective positions was as much a factor as anything else.. Coleman is competing with Kelly and Foley at RF and McGeady and Lawrence at RM. At RF any one of Kelly Foley and Coleman could justifiably feel aggrieved had they been left out. I would argue that what could possibly have been learned from Lawrence and McGeady at this stage, but Trap has spoken of the importance of balance given the other withdrawels. All in I'm not too bothered about Coleman's omission.

[tetsujin1979]

was played at full back out of necessity and other positions, but the only position he has excelled in for us has been the 6 months he played CB. It's his main position, the one he's most comfortable in, and the position where he would ideally suit Ireland alongside Dunne. Unfortunately he's been plugging a gap for us the past 18 months and we've been lucky to call on Ledger.Could the emergence of Coleman, Kelly and Foley see O'Shea move back into centre half alongside Dunne?

[Superhoops]

My ratings :bigsmile:

McGeady - 6; I think he is improving as a player as he slowly learning how to make better use of the ball. Still a strong tendency to put the head down and dribble when he gets the ball but there are signs he is improving his game.


I havent posted on here for ages but read regularly. However when I read the likes of this I dispair.

'improving', 'still learning' ??? Could understand that being said of a player with a half a dozen appearances. Last night was McGeady's 37th cap ffs. If he hasnt learnt by now or improved by now he never will.

IMO the most overrated player ever to wear green, a one trick pony who will never be international class.

Last night was no different to any other night with him. A simple pass on? No, beat 2 or 3 players and lose it. Track back when our attack breaks down? No, doesnt know who he should be picking up.

So frustrating to have to watch that and not get the opportunity to see Coleman or Wilson.

Seriously think after more that 30 years of going to giving it up.