Stephen Nolan's All Ireland team (BBC) [Archive]

nifan

04/05/2004, 2:20 PM

Most NI fans have not seen it, as we had just got out of the match and had not got home yet. therefore the majority of the time was given to people to insult the fans and claim there was sectarian chanting etc - which was in fact denied by nolans reporter at the game. Dougan agreed with all this - including the sectarian bit, but later admitted he had not been in years as he doesnt watch a lot of football anymore.

Sanchez and Kate Hoey stuck up well for NI - and for our part comes out with great credit.

Text messages went across the bottom - usual lot - NI is a micky mouse team. all fans are sectarian etc.

Sheridan

04/05/2004, 2:25 PM

I believe I caught some of this. Typical mindless phone-in nonsense, Lawrie Sanchez was on the panel, along with Kate Hoey. The host, like so many of his colleagues on programmes like these, didn't begin to grasp the issue at hand and kept asking the most ridiculous questions in a manner which suggested that he was the very paragon of perspicacity.

They interviewed several muppets at the hub of our great footballing nation, the Submarine Bar. Arch-muppet Alan Hunter was amongst those interviewed, and called for - guess what? - a referendum on the issue.

The programme had absolutely nothing worthwhile or original to add to the debate, apart from Lawrie Sanchez sneering at the FAI (he basically said that, since they broke away, they'd have to ask permission to come back.)

deadman

04/05/2004, 2:26 PM

re: wednesday's NI match - i was at it myself and the atmosphere was excellent. i've never seen anything like it at any friendly international .... hats off to Michael Boyd and co.

deadman

04/05/2004, 2:44 PM

would anyone happen to have a copy of this program itself. i think its called "Nolan Live" --- there was something of specific interest to me and i college project i'm involved in at the moment --- and the BBC NI will only distribute copies of any program to contributors .... unless you're willing to deal with long arduous process of application and a long wait

Junior

04/05/2004, 3:29 PM

Footie_Fan

04/05/2004, 9:47 PM

I saw that programme. Usual rubbish about an all-Ireland team. They went to the "Home of Irish Football" The Submarine Bar and guess who... Alan Hunter got himself and his cardigan on the box... again. He demanded a referendum etc.

ElSieteSecretos

04/05/2004, 9:51 PM

what is this crazy talk about one futball team for two countries ? I hope it is swept under the carpert with the simliar funny seasons stories

1MickCollins

05/05/2004, 2:25 AM

What 2 countries are you talking about? One island, one nation. It's only a matter of time until the bigots are defeated.

Duncan Gardner

05/05/2004, 7:20 AM

Not quite as willing to compromise as your namesake, then, Mick? :(

Sheridan- I didn't see it, but I'm afraid the entire point of the programme- from the timing onward- was to 'sneer' at NI fans, the team and Sanchez himself. Most accounts suggest he looked embarrassed throughout, but I think we can forgive that quip.

He's (deliberately) missing the point, of course. The FAI would run a mile from any united Ireland team, for reasons discussed here ad nauseam. And your pal Hunter doesn't get it either- the only people really enthusing for this are your fans in NI. Numerically, they're a minority within a minority. And anyway, nothing stops them supporting your team, and seeing/ hearing it in the NI media. A Roy Keane story is ALWAYS the lead on BBC Belfast. Live and let live I say.

From John Laverty in the Belfast Tele:

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/story.jsp?story=518043

lopez

05/05/2004, 9:18 AM

What 2 countries are you talking about? One island, one nation. It's only a matter of time until the bigots are defeated.One island and one state denied by the threat of physical force. But one nation? Hardly.

...the only people really enthusing for this are your fans in NI. Numerically, they're a minority within a minority. And anyway, nothing stops them supporting your team, and seeing/ hearing it in the NI media. A Roy Keane story is ALWAYS the lead on BBC Belfast. Live and let live I say.I wouldn't say it's a minority in a minority. It's possibly a minority (debateable) that will have absolutely nothing to do with the Northern Ireland team. However most nationalists - if they have any interest in football - would certainly support the Republic just as much as the North, even if Windsor Park became the most tolerent place on earth next to Shangri La.

drummerboy

05/05/2004, 9:49 AM

They may be a minority but the same community are producing a fair percentage of young footballers in Northern Ireland, some of whom are opting for their southern cousins. Surely this must be very worrying for the IFA.

Littlest Hobo

05/05/2004, 12:00 PM

Don't need the north and their second class players. The republic is doing just great by itself.

Duncan Gardner

05/05/2004, 5:53 PM

Lopez- by "minority within a minority" I meant that nationalists are a minority in NI (ca 42%) which is itself a minority within Ireland (ca 28%). In other words, they're about 12% of the total. I'll readily admit that most of them who like football support the Republic. I have no problem with that per se.

Drummerboy- aye, though the numbers aren't great so it's disappointing if not a big worry.

Littlest Hobo- this contrived argument has nothing to do with how good our players are. It's crude party politics. Saying that Aaron Hughes is the best full back from Ireland at the moment, Johnson and Taylor also worth a call in their positions?

deadman

05/05/2004, 6:57 PM

i wonder if those from the south who supported the idea of an all-ireland team would still support it if it were to based solely in Belfast ... plausible suggestion ... as the ifa were the original organisation and belfast the first home.

if you use the IRFU as a comparison - it's the geographical location of its offices that makes Dublin our Rugby HQ.

brine2

05/05/2004, 7:01 PM

I reckon Cork should team up with the IFA. Home matches could alternate between Turner's Cross and Belfast. Let McAteer, the FAI and the rest of the Merrion Square shower whinge away by themselves.

How about it then? I can just see Roy leading Miller, Healy and the rest of lads out at Windsor Park... Err...

eoinh

05/05/2004, 9:46 PM

The perfect all-ireland team? (http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/features/story.jsp?story=517088)

1MickCollins

05/05/2004, 11:48 PM

[QUOTE=Duncan Gardner]Not quite as willing to compromise as your namesake, then, Mick? :(
QUOTE]

Michael Collins being the pragmatist he was believed it made sense to accept the 26 counties as a starting point, he believed that in time once the Unionists saw that the Free State represented no threat to their identity they would come onboard. Unfortunately, he died and we were stuck with Dev.

When I say one island, one nation - I think perhaps I have a broader definition of a nation than you do. To quote Heaney quoting Joyce: ( the fictional character Leopold Bloom was a Jew )

MacMorris gallivanting
round the Globe...'What ish my nation?"

And sensibly, though so much
later, the wandering Bloom
replied, "Ireland", said Bloom,
"I was born here. Ireland".

My Irish nation has room for Catholic, Protestant, Dissenter & Jew. I think this would be the big fells opinion as well.

eoinh

06/05/2004, 10:18 AM

We are supposed to live in a secular republic after all not a religious republic. Irish people are not defined by their religion.

Most of Kilkenny, Carlow and Tipperarys population are descendants of Catholic immigrants - not that they know it.

You mention Bloomsday and Joyces quote - funny the referendum will be held on that day. How ironic

lopez

06/05/2004, 12:33 PM

i wonder if those from the south who supported the idea of an all-ireland team would still support it if it were to based solely in Belfast ...Is Belfast in Ireland? :confused:

My Irish nation has room for Catholic, Protestant, Dissenter & Jew. I think this would be the big fells opinion as well.Well the likes of Davros (Nationalist protestants) are Irish in an ethnic sense. However there is no way that you are going to compel someone like DG to give up his Britishness no more than you'll make me give up my Irish citizenship because I was born in Britain. What you can aim for is a rapprochement: A multi-cultural Irish state which will undoubtedly be federal.

BTW, not completely sure, having not read Ulysses, but wasn't Bloom technically not Jewish as his mother was Irish: That I think was part of the irony of his character.

eoinh

06/05/2004, 1:02 PM

BTW, not completely sure, having not read Ulysses, but wasn't Bloom technically not Jewish as his mother was Irish: That I think was part of the irony of his character.

Judaism is a religion not a nationality. You can be jewish and irish as you can be any religion and irish.

lopez

06/05/2004, 4:47 PM

Judaism is a religion not a nationality. You can be jewish and irish as you can be any religion and irish.That's the way it should be. Tomorrow I decide it's for me and I go see a rabbi about a little operation. But many Jews don't see it like that. Firstly, many Jews - not all orthodox - see the religion as being carried by the mother and not the father. Secondly, Hitler's race laws have muddied the waters of Judaism where a Christian convert is deemed still a Jew 'by race'. Ironically, Israel still bases its 'law of return' on Hitler's criteria of Jewishness.

Finally I'm not arguing that a Jew can't be Irish. Just whether Bloom was strictly Jewish if he didn't practice the religion.

1MickCollins

07/05/2004, 12:19 AM

Finally I'm not arguing that a Jew can't be Irish. Just whether Bloom was strictly Jewish if he didn't practice the religion.

That's a valid point about not being Jewish if not born of a Jewish mother, but there is no reference to Bloom's mother not being Jewish that I am aware of. He did convert to Catholicism to marry Molly. But he had a Jewish sensibility which makes him Jewish, being Jewish is definitely more than practising your religion. I consider myself Christian though I don't practise.

Anyhow I think we'll beat Israel home and away.

Duncan Gardner

07/05/2004, 9:29 AM

Mick- if you want to include me, unionists generally, uncle Tom Cobbleigh and all in your Irish nation, fine. But actually your idea of nationhood is quite narrow. We have to give up our British nationality and anyone who argues otherwise is by definition a bigot. Yawn...

Lopez- the present situation is broadly acceptable to unionists. You (ie nationalists) say we can join you if we like, but by and large we don't like. Thanks for asking, anyway.

Davros- this has nothing to do with gerrymandering. Fans in the South show little sign of wanting an all-Ireland team, with all its inevitable hassles. Show evidence this is changing, and we can discuss it. Nationalist fans in NI do want such a team because it's a party political issue there. Nationalists in NI are 12% of the population of Ireland. Fact.

PS did our mutual friend Tommy F remember to tell the Poles what a great team they'd have if they reunited with the Russians/ Germans etc...?

Duncan Gardner

07/05/2004, 9:58 AM

The problems are

a) there really is very little evidence that your fans want such a team, for the oft-stated reasons. You would have to play a large proportion of the matches in Belfast, U-21s in Ballymena or Coleraine. Unionist opposition would create far worse tension than at present. We have few good players to add to your pool. The FAI would effectively have to dissolve itself;

b) if you genuinely think the tricolor is a third representative of unionism no-one will take anything you say on the subject seriously!

Duncan Gardner

07/05/2004, 10:40 AM

I don't ignore your fact. I consider it irrelevant to this argument. I am not really interested in rugby union, but if that sport wants to be more inclusive, what about a six nations game at Ravenhill?

The orange in the tricolor is also irrelevant because unionists don't want to be part of your country. Nice and simple!

eoinh

07/05/2004, 11:09 AM

Davros is right most fans would love an all irish side. The reason its not mentioned much is because there isnt much chance of it happening.

drummerboy

07/05/2004, 12:52 PM

I think that if ROI were to fail to qualify for the next two major championships, there will be far more interest in an All-Ireland team. However the main stumbling block down here would be the blazers. These guys would lose their trips to international matches. People forget that these blazers and their apprentices travel free of charge to hundreds of the schoolboy, underage and amateur international matches throughout the continent.

lopez

07/05/2004, 3:13 PM

Lopez- the present situation is broadly acceptable to unionists. You (ie nationalists) say we can join you if we like, but by and large we don't like. Thanks for asking, anyway.The door's always open, in case you change your mind (like the Turkish cypriots! :eek: )

1MickCollins

07/05/2004, 6:13 PM

[QUOTE=Duncan Gardner]Mick- if you want to include me, unionists generally, uncle Tom Cobbleigh and all in your Irish nation, fine. But actually your idea of nationhood is quite narrow. We have to give up our British nationality and anyone who argues otherwise is by definition a bigot. Yawn...
QUOTE]

Unionism is a sham, it was born out of anti-Catholicism not love of England/Queen.

Unionists haved prefered to dominate ( and they needed Britain to do this, if they didn't need Britain they wouldn't be unionists ) their artificial statelet rather than being a minority in an united Ireland, which was understandable certainly up until the last few years and maybe still is, and I have no argument with the current wishes of the people of NI. But today with an expanded EU it seems an almost comical dispute. Try explaining the problem to an American not of Irish ancestry.

Do you think the English in 2004 reciprocate your loyalty to the Queen\England\UK? None of the English people I know and work with understand the "loyalty" of Ulster protestants with the exception of those of the pre-WW2 generation who still remember the empire.

brine2

07/05/2004, 7:57 PM

I think Northern Ireland should become an independent state, free from Blair and Bertie.

lopez

07/05/2004, 8:29 PM

I think Northern Ireland should become an independent state, free from Blair and Bertie.Last time I looked, an independent NI had about 2% of the NI population's electoral support, including the Rev. Hugh Ross (leader of the Ulster Independence Party) who wanted this state to be called Ulster and include Donegal, Cavan and Monaghan. The fact that such a nine-county state would, democratically, vote itself into an all-Ireland republic is of no importance to someone with an 'unorthodox' past like Ross. Good luck with your campaign!

Duncan Gardner

08/05/2004, 8:53 AM

Lopez- of course any rigid political attitude can change- but as I'm sure you noticed, the proposed compromise deal in Cyprus achieved majority Turkish support only with the loss of a majority of Greeks! Ironically though, the latter are into the EU, the former not...

Mick- there's an obvious answer to the 'sure the border's irrelevant now, with the EU and everything' argument. We could stop arguing about the border, but I think I'll wait until the French/ Germans, Spanish/ Portuguese, Italians/ Austrians and Dutch/ Belgians abolish theirs first. Foreigners may find Ulster politics (especially the summer-long fancy dress parade) hilarious, but I think they recognise that at heart it's about nationality. Just like many of their own disputes.

Brine- if that ever happened NI would be like a bigger, poorer Andorra. Their joint head honchos are Chirac and a Spanish bishop.

lopez

08/05/2004, 1:16 PM

Lopez- of course any rigid political attitude can change- but as I'm sure you noticed, the proposed compromise deal in Cyprus achieved majority Turkish support only with the loss of a majority of Greeks! Ironically though, the latter are into the EU, the former not...Which may soon be the case viz a viz the two parts of Ireland. Just remembered how many farmers of good presbyterian stock were keen to have their cows listed as 'Irish' during the 'foot and mouth' fiasco.

It is of course interesting to see certain people down south scoff at the idea of an all-Ireland team because the North have ATM cr*p players. Have they never heard about a little thing called the future?

Duncan Gardner

09/05/2004, 10:27 AM

Davros- I don't see that unionist rugby union fans are being hypocritical. They're broadly happy with an all-Ireland side, though they'd prefer more Ulster players in it and the occasional game at Ravenhill. And maybe a few cosmetic changes to flags, anthems etc.

Those I know who also support NI in football generally give more allegiance to the Ulster side. With its high profile locally and reasonable level of success, maybe they're less bothered about O'Driscoll's boys now being effectively a RoI team.

But, if the above was to change, and Ulster rugby was to break away from Dublin, you'd be the first accusing them not merely of unionist bigotry, but probably also of hypocrisy? ;)

I know the argument that 'all other sports are united, why not football?' Very briefly,

a) football's popularity distinguishes it from every other sport in Ireland bar GAA

b) without getting into the rights and wrongs of GAA's rulebook, they have effectively excluded unionists (18% of the population of Ireland) for decades. Personally I'm glad thisis changing, but it can't be ignored in the past

c) some lower profile sports, most notably boxing, have been organised on partition lines. This partly explains why someone like McGuigan fought out of Belfast as a professional, while northern amateurs have represented the Republic in the Olympics etc.

Lopez- a fair point, but this argument isn't really about playing strength. The Republic have established themselves in UEFA's top 10 over the last ten years, but adding Damien Johnson or big Aaron isn't suddenly going to let them take the next step to World domination :rolleyes:

It's all about headcounts. And from a nationalist point of view, they're always likely to outnumber the unionists in Ireland by four or five to one. For the unionist answer, see threads passim.

1MickCollins

09/05/2004, 6:06 PM

b) without getting into the rights and wrongs of GAA's rulebook, they have effectively excluded unionists (18% of the population of Ireland) for decades. Personally I'm glad thisis changing, but it can't be ignored in the past

Duncan, why would a unionist want to join the Gaelic Athletic Association and what bearing does that have anyhow on a A-I soccer team?

The GAA was formed for the purposes of creating ( or recreating ) a sense of Irishness and was political from the start, I am no fan of the GAA and no fan of sporting orgs which are political.

Rule 21 says: "Ineligible to join the G.A.A. are members of the Britih armed forces and Police . And a member of the GAA participating in dances, or similar entertainment, promoted by or under the personage of such bodies shall incur suspension of at least 3 months".

Which is in line with how I always have seen the GAA primarily nationalist, Catholic and conserative, even today after they voted 3 to 1 to remove this rule that is still how I see the GAA.

A unionist joinging the GAA is like a man joining the ICA or a loyalist joining the Sinn Fein.

The GAA welcomes protestants with open arms as we all know, but wasn't this rule was more of a problem for Catholics/nationalists/protestants serving in the RUC than for unionists?

I think an A-I socccer team will happen when the time is right, Maybe 20 - 30 years from now. But if there were to be an A-I team then wouldn't they have to merge the EL and IL? If that happened today I think that would be a violent disaster!

I think the hearts and minds of a lot of people will have to change first, I have more faith in future generations than the present ones.

Duncan Gardner

11/05/2004, 7:43 AM

Mick- why shouldn't a unionist join a GAA club if he wants to be a hurler, or just socialise with his friends? In practice some do, but it's generally difficult for them. In Northern Ireland, the ban on 'British security forces' extends effectively to their civilian staffs and contractors- quite a large proportion of the population. In practice, there it's come to mean a euphemism for unionists.

This is all relevant to the argument that football could adapt to all-Ireland organisation like every other sport. In practice, GAA doesn't have that because unionists in NI feel excluded.

Your saying "a unionist joinging the GAA is like a man joining the ICA or a loyalist joining the Sinn Fein" is negative and exaggerated. I've been in plenty of GAA clubs in both Dublin and London and never felt unwelcome. Unfortunately, not yet in Belfast...

lopez

11/05/2004, 10:51 AM

Fair point,DG......but ever thought why your average GAA member in the osc.might be none too keen on making members of the puppet state government or agents thereof,especially welcome in the first place......a tad paranoid of unionists to assume they're all labelled with the same brush,but with this collective mindset & typical of their arrogance in this respect!Dav, you don't have to be a 'planter', 'puppet' etc to infiltrate. E.g.: Gypo Nolan O'Callaghan and the bloke that got a bath.

1MickCollins

11/05/2004, 6:07 PM

Duncan Gardner

12/05/2004, 8:03 AM

Thanks for that, Mick. I hadn't realised you were a expert on decent Ulster unionism. How do I become one?

lopez

12/05/2004, 9:11 AM

Thought you already had plenty of credentials....though your main interest in union is that of your oral orifice & ice-cream;If you're struggling......think tired old,bigotted,prejudiced views,with a large dose of hypocrisy.....Ahhhh!!! Love across the political divide. Now that's where the real 'struggle' is. :rolleyes:

beano

10/02/2005, 12:14 AM

Before I say anything let me say this. More of my friends are Catholic/Nationalist than not. This includes my girlfriend. I think the sh1te being spouted here by davros among others would make them all sick.

1. The GAA's ban on the security forces, their staff, etc etc, alienated Unionists not just because they couldn't play, but because it demonstrated the attitude of the GAA towards Britain and by proxy, the British - ie them. To coin a phrase from the MacPherson report, the GAA is "Institutionally Sectarian".

2. Not all NI rugby fans are happy with the All Ireland team and the playing of the militaristic and anti-British Soldier's song at "home" games. I support Ulster (or the Lions in rugby league), but not Ireland. Come the six nations I'd usually side with Scotland or England. (Incidentally weren't the AI rugby team originally supposed to alternate home matches between Belfast/Dublin? If it didn't last in rugby what makes any of us believe it would last in football?)

3. According to the Ulster Independence Movement they want independence for the 6 counties (I'm sure you're no happier with this since you still won't get your way) and according to the NILT Survey (2003) (http://www.ark.ac.uk/nilt/2003/Political_Attitudes/NIRELAND.html) the concept of an independent Northern Ireland has 7% support. However I'm sure if the option of unity with the UK was removed we'd soon see that rise. I'm curious - once that happened the former loyalists would be "freedom fighters" and a "separatist movement" seeking "minority rights". I wonder would this help their cause the way it has the IRA in their propaganda? Oh - the UIM have asked this too...
We are convinced that the IRA is afraid that an independent Ulster would rob it of its claim to be fighting imperialism (http://www.ulsternation.org.uk/ulster_nationalism%20an%20IRA%20view.htm)

4. Regards your mention that the Orange in the tricolour represents Protestants, my countryman is right, this is a joke and shows that we can't take your views on constitutional issues seriously at all. It's possibly the biggest hypocracy in Ireland's history as a nation (except possibly Mary McAleese's branding of UNIONISTS as Nazi's - that really is a joke considering your pal dev's letter of condolence sent to the German embassy on Hitler's death and the beloved statue of a Nazi sympathiser in Dublin city). Having the Orange to "represent" protestants after the ethnic cleansing that went on in the South the 20s * and the discrimination against protestants that, even today, is still enshrined in Irish law is an insult. Besides, the Cross of St Patrick is one of three components of the Union Jack - yet I'm sure you don't feel any particular affinity towards that particular flag.

* before you say it happened in 'da nort' too, yes it did. However the difference is that we acknowledge and in fact apologise for it, rather than sweep it under the rug.

EireBadBoy

10/02/2005, 1:05 AM

Most NI fans have not seen it, as we had just got out of the match and had not got home yet.

Cracking timing for this programme then!! :rolleyes:

This notion is a serious distant fantasy. The Setanta Cup has yet to kick off and the BBC see fit to throw money at a stupid programme like this at a time when N.I fan's can't either (A) see it and (B) stick up for themselves!!

Eire06

10/02/2005, 8:27 AM

An All Ireland team is not gona happen unless certain political issues get resolved and all of Ireland becomes offically the Republic. which is not gona happen any time soon....

If people born in Northern Ireland want to support\play for Ireland then they are very welcome to do so, I would actualy encourage it...

If Northern Ireland had a better team and were doin ok this would never be brought up....

AND I'm sorry but does anyone remember Neil Lennon and how he was FORCED to quit international football...

Hibs4Ever

10/02/2005, 8:34 AM

[

Text messages went across the bottom - usual lot - NI is a micky mouse team. all fans are sectarian etc.[/QUOTE]

Northern Ireland ARE a mickey mouse team :D

Eire06

10/02/2005, 8:38 AM

Text messages went across the bottom - usual lot - NI is a micky mouse team. all fans are sectarian etc.

Northern Ireland ARE a mickey mouse team :D
Quite true

SÓC

10/02/2005, 8:41 AM

Not all NI rugby fans are happy with the All Ireland team and the playing of the militaristic and anti-British Soldier's song at "home" games. I support Ulster (or the Lions in rugby league), but not Ireland. Come the six nations I'd usually side with Scotland or England. (Incidentally weren't the AI rugby team originally supposed to alternate home matches between Belfast/Dublin? If it didn't last in rugby what makes any of us believe it would last in football?)

Two points

1. Not all fans of the the Irish Rugby team are happy with God save the German lady being played at Ireland matches when they do play in the North. Usually A games or underage. Personally I dont have a problem with it. Seems fair enough, play the song of the state(let) that you are in. Are you aware that this happens?

2. The IRFU would be shooting themselves in the foot if they were to play matches in Belfast. There is no stadium big enough. Or would you and your mates be happy to pay £80 for a ticket to cover the IRFU's losses for switching the venue?

lopez

11/02/2005, 8:29 AM

...Having the Orange to "represent" protestants after the ethnic cleansing that went on in the South the 20s * and the discrimination against protestants that, even today, is still enshrined in Irish law is an insult...Examples (evidence) please!

beano

11/02/2005, 8:49 AM

Sorry davros, hadn't even noticed the dates on the posts tbh.

1. Not all fans of the the Irish Rugby team are happy with God save the German lady being played at Ireland matches when they do play in the North. Usually A games or underage. Personally I dont have a problem with it. Seems fair enough, play the song of the state(let) that you are in. Are you aware that this happens?

No I wasn't actually aware of this, but I am now. I have to admit to being surprised, but see no reason not to believe you as you seem to know more about it than me.

2. The IRFU would be shooting themselves in the foot if they were to play matches in Belfast. There is no stadium big enough. Or would you and your mates be happy to pay £80 for a ticket to cover the IRFU's losses for switching the venue?

Does this mean that if NI get a new national stadium then they will return to the practice of playing alternate matches in Belfast and Dublin? I somehow get the feeling that if they did it would be reluctantly, but I suppose only time will tell.

I do have one last question... when they play in NI do they still fly the tricolour? I presume they wouldn't fly the NI flag but I couldn't see they flying of the tricolour being very popular among the rugby fans up here. I've always wondered why they don't use some sort of neutral flag - eg the cross of St Patrick? I know in table-tennis they use the 4 provinces flag, but personally I find that little different to flying a tricolour.

(please tell me if this is too political, but IMHO it's definitely relevant to the topic)

gspain

11/02/2005, 8:50 AM

Two points

1. Not all fans of the the Irish Rugby team are happy with God save the German lady being played at Ireland matches when they do play in the North. Usually A games or underage. Personally I dont have a problem with it. Seems fair enough, play the song of the state(let) that you are in. Are you aware that this happens?

2. The IRFU would be shooting themselves in the foot if they were to play matches in Belfast. There is no stadium big enough. Or would you and your mates be happy to pay £80 for a ticket to cover the IRFU's losses for switching the venue?

Anthems are only played at senior level in rugby. GSTQ hasn't been played for an Ireland rugby team since 1954.

Thomond Park has hosted Italy and Romania in recent years. Ravenhill could easily do likewise for a Mickey Mouse game obviously not a 6 Nations game.

when the new NI stadium is built it will have to get some games maybe even Italy in the 6 nations.