Red Bull sponsorship discussion (split from Bohs thread)

[Sean South]

Apparently there was a provisional meeting between the FAI, a certain soft drinks company who “sponsor” an Austrian and an MLS club, and a financially struggling LOI club from outside Dublin. It took place last week, the soft drinks company want to invest a substantial figure in this club. But it all depends if they stay up and they are currently just outside the bottom three. I guess if they go down Bohs could try and persuade them to invest in Bohs instead:p

[Charlie Darwin]

Red Bull own the Salzburg and New York teams, don't they?

[dcfcsteve]

Red Bull own the Salzburg and New York teams, don't they?

You mean 'Red Bull Salzburg' and the 'New York Red Bulls' ?

No - there is absolutely no connection at all...

[Charlie Darwin]

I mean they own them as opposed to just sponsorship

[punkrocket]

a financially struggling LOI club from outside Dublin....just outside the bottom three

So is that Dundalk or Galway then?

[legendz]

You mean 'Red Bull Salzburg' and the 'New York Red Bulls' ?

No - there is absolutely no connection at all...

Red Bull own both Salzburg and New York, also: RB Leipzig and Red Bull Brasil. Be great for a club if the got their backing. Maybe there could be Red Bull challenges!?

[SkStu]

So is that Dundalk or Galway then?

i wish it would be Red Bull Drogheda coming at us live from Hunky Dory Park... :)

[mrtndvn]

Red Bull own the Salzburg and New York teams, don't they?

Some information on the subject here: http://tinyurl.com/237qy4r

[passerrby]

could be red bull dundalk and complete bull bohs

[avvenalaf]

could be red bull dundalk and complete bull bohs

Can I have a pint of Red Bull McArdles please?

[legendz]

A worrying article for Bohs fans indeed. The most chilling sentence, in my view is:
"Members have been asked to pay for home games,"
I remember last year the general outrage at Derry's board when they announced a "leave your season ticket at home" initiative. The writing is really on the wall whenever the club insults it's best fans by suggesting they should pay doubly for their loyalty. This was followed by pre-paying next year's season ticket which 400 of us did to the tune of £180 each in order to "save" the club. That money disappeared down the financial black-hole that was the board's incompetence, albeit that the new board/club honouredthe tickets, they didn't have to and at one stage it looked as if our money had been lost.
My advice to anybody at Bohs is not to throw any of your own money at this problem as in all likelihood it will end up in the hands of administrators when/if the club goes bust.
Hi, good to see you have re-located. Good to see Derry doing well, can't see ye being the Red Bull sponsored club though.

[dcfcsteve]

I've asked a friend at RB who, let's just say, would 95% know about any advance for an Irish club.

Their response was "no way".

Apparently RB already own clubs in brazil, usa, germany, austria and ghana, and have no more planned at the moment. Considering the size of the Irish market, not to mention the standing of the league, I'd be surprised if they saw much brand value in a club here to be honest.

They did have a serious look at buying an English club 3-4yrs back, but chose not to.

[peadar1987]

I wouldn't say Red Bull would be interested in buying an existing Irish side. Starting up a "Red Bull Dublin" and entering them in the English leagues would probably be more up their street.

[Dodge]

I wouldn't say Red Bull would be interested in buying an existing Irish side. Starting up a "Red Bull Dublin" and entering them in the English leagues would probably be more up their street.

You've absolutely no basis for this though. They didn't move the salzburg team to the German league...

They'd pick up Galway for buttons so cost isn't an issue

[passerrby]

They'd pick up Galway for buttons so cost isn't an issue

overpriced at that

[Dodge]

Not a full packet. just a couple of the broken ones that have stuck together after a child sat on them

[peadar1987]

You've absolutely no basis for this though. They didn't move the salzburg team to the German league...

They'd pick up Galway for buttons so cost isn't an issue

I never said I did, I just reckon that the League of Ireland wouldn't be glamorous enought for Red Bull to want to buy one of the teams in it, so if they ever did want a team in Ireland, they'd be more likely to want to enter it in the English system.

As far as I know, Red Bull is an Austrian company, and we all know the Austrian league is significantly bigger than the LOI anyway.

[Dodge]

But they already deem the irish market big enough to advertise in (from radio, tv and cinema spots to a monthly magazine with the Indo)

So the market is there, adn it'll cost very little to do.

Its down to them if they want to go ahead with it

[legendz]

Don't RB own a fifth division German League side, they've plans to bring them to the top. I think Galway of the clubs outside Dublin would be the likeliest for sponsorship if it was to happen.

[dcfcsteve]

But they already deem the irish market big enough to advertise in (from radio, tv and cinema spots to a monthly magazine with the Indo)

So the market is there, adn it'll cost very little to do.

Its down to them if they want to go ahead with it

You're suggesting that Red Bull would be interested in buying an Irish football club primarily or solely for 'use' in the Irish market.

The questioon still stands - why ? Sure, it wouldn't cost much to buy. But to make such a club anything like a success they'd need to spend money on the team and stadium, which would costs a lot. And why would they buy a team without wantign to make them a success ?

As for the observation that RB advertise in Ireland - of course they do ! And the price they pay for that reflects the size of the market. They advertise here in order to build their brand and drive sales. So the question is - what would owning an LOI club do to build their business ?

If anything - given the low standing of the LOI it would probably do more damage to Red Bull to buy some hick Irish team with a fairly basic stadium. Unless, of course, they had big plans for the club. But that would take big money.

I just can't see any angle for a 'cool' brand like Red Bull to want to own an Irish football club.

[dcfcsteve]

I never said I did, I just reckon that the League of Ireland wouldn't be glamorous enought for Red Bull to want to buy one of the teams in it, so if they ever did want a team in Ireland, they'd be more likely to want to enter it in the English system.

As far as I know, Red Bull is an Austrian company, and we all know the Austrian league is significantly bigger than the LOI anyway.

If Red Bull wanted to pick up a team outside of England with a view to moving them to the English system, why would they look to Ireland rather than Scotland or even Wales ?

A number of Welsh clubs already play in the English system. And if they wanted a team on the cheap Scotland has dozens of them. We're much more likely to see a Scottish team in the English league system again (ref Gretna) than an Irish one, and I doubt Red Bull would fancy their chances on either. They're into brand building, not speculating.

[Dodge]

Calm down steve, I suggested nothing of the sort.

I just pointed out that RB do see Ireland as a viable market and that owning a LOI side would cost less than their current advertising spend here

[dcfcsteve]

Calm down steve, I suggested nothing of the sort.

I just pointed out that RB do see Ireland as a viable market and that owning a LOI side would cost less than their current advertising spend here

I can assure you Dodge - as I tuck into my KFC Fillet Tower meal and Maltesers Krush'em whilst typing, I am indeed very calm.... :D

Owning an LOI side MAY cost them more than their current spend in Ireland, but so would halving their spend in Ireland or building a castle made out of lego. But neither would do much to build their brand, which is the key point. It's all about the impact of their spending, and an LOI club just wouldn't deliver.

They could do also what culchies do - buy an old Datsun, paint it up in Red Bull colours and drive it to the All-Ireland final. That would also cost less than their current marketing spend..... ;)

[Mr A]

I blame the outrageous anti-Rovers bias on this forum for entirely derailing the thread from its topic.

http://www.motifake.com/image/demotivational-poster/0903/derailed-train-derailed-thread-demotivational-poster-1237346157.jpg

[Charlie Darwin]

Owning an LOI side MAY cost them more than their current spend in Ireland, but so would halving their spend in Ireland or building a castle made out of lego. But neither would do much to build their brand, which is the key point. It's all about the impact of their spending, and an LOI club just wouldn't deliver.
The short term impact would be huge, but like you I don't think there's enough sustainable interest in Irish soccer for them to bother in the long term. If anyone could do it, though, Red Bull could. They'd certainly show the rest of the teams in the LOI how to properly promote a football club.

[**FrOsTy**]

Well thinking about it in another light. Atleast one Irish team has come so close to qualifying for Europa League/ Champo League every year fr the last few seasons. A RB investemnt in an Irish club could work out financially. It would cost pennies to take over a club. It doesn't take HUGE wages to attract the best players or even some good League 1/ Championship players who'd be interested in the money. So for a small cost they would take an Irish club to the champions league proper and earn a fortune from that?

Just another way to look at it.

[dcfcsteve]

Well thinking about it in another light. Atleast one Irish team has come so close to qualifying for Europa League/ Champo League every year fr the last few seasons. A RB investemnt in an Irish club could work out financially. It would cost pennies to take over a club. It doesn't take HUGE wages to attract the best players or even some good League 1/ Championship players who'd be interested in the money. So for a small cost they would take an Irish club to the champions league proper and earn a fortune from that?

Just another way to look at it.

Ahhhh - the mythical golden land of the Champions League. It always sits just over the horizon for those intrepid enough to sale for it, and most end up well and truely grounded on the rocks before they get anywhere near it.

The money to be made out of Champions League qualification is overstated. And they'd still have to fund an Irish club through the mundane and unattractive domestic calendar every year to get there, which would cost a bucket load as well. And there would be no guarantee to making the CL groups more than infrequently anyway.

Besides - Red Bull exist to sell soft drinks, not to try to speculate on sports. That's not why they've bought the clubs they have.

[dcfcsteve]

The short term impact would be huge, but like you I don't think there's enough sustainable interest in Irish soccer for them to bother in the long term. If anyone could do it, though, Red Bull could. They'd certainly show the rest of the teams in the LOI how to properly promote a football club.

Red Bull would not be a good thing for any Irish club they bought. They tend to effectively erase the clkub's previous history and change its name, colours etc.

Some may think that being turned into a marketing tool would be a good thing for a football club. Fans of a club with any sort of history and fanbase would probably disagree. Football should be first and foremost about the game - not trying to sell soft drinks.

[fionnsci]

Not that I think this is likely to happen but I would hate to see a Bohemian Red Bulls or Red Bull Shelbourne in the league. Too much history in the names. However a Red Bull Fingal side would be fine for me. It's probably better than their current name! (not a swipe at your club, Fingal fans, just the name).

[Charlie Darwin]

Red Bull would not be a good thing for any Irish club they bought. They tend to effectively erase the clkub's previous history and change its name, colours etc.

Some may think that being turned into a marketing tool would be a good thing for a football club. Fans of a club with any sort of history and fanbase would probably disagree. Football should be first and foremost about the game - not trying to sell soft drinks.
Well that I can agree with - I just mean the company knows how to generate publicity and LOI clubs generally don't. Even when they do, it's usually Platinum One that's behind it.

[Ceirtlis]

Well thinking about it in another light. Atleast one Irish team has come so close to qualifying for Europa League/ Champo League every year fr the last few seasons. A RB investemnt in an Irish club could work out financially. It would cost pennies to take over a club. It doesn't take HUGE wages to attract the best players or even some good League 1/ Championship players who'd be interested in the money. So for a small cost they would take an Irish club to the champions league proper and earn a fortune from that?

Just another way to look at it.

Only one league of ireland team has made it to the last qualifying round of the Champions League and got beaten 3-0 on aggregate.

They have also put alot of money into Salzburg in a much more established league than the League of Ireland and they have still not qualified for the Champions League after 5 years.

[WexCar]

If this does happen then RB can only buy a max of 49% ownership of the club as dont UEFA have rules on club ownership for clubs that compete in UEFA competitions. Basically stating that if clubs have the same majority shareholder then both cannot play in the same UEFA sanctioned competition.

The most recent examples I can think of are the UEFA Cup tie between Tottenham and Slavia Prague a few years ago, also wasn't there an issue with Abramovich ownership of Chelsea and his 'interest' in CSKA Moscow.

[passerrby]

Well thinking about it in another light. Atleast one Irish team has come so close to qualifying for Europa League/ Champo League every year fr the last few seasons. A RB investemnt in an Irish club could work out financially. It would cost pennies to take over a club. It doesn't take HUGE wages to attract the best players or even some good League 1/ Championship players who'd be interested in the money. So for a small cost they would take an Irish club to the champions league proper and earn a fortune from that?

Just another way to look at it.
you could not be more wrong there is no such thing as a small cost in running any LOI club espically if you want to qualify for the CL and if you spend money in the hope of making a fortune in the CL then sadly you will be dissapointed like so many LOI clubs

[Rasputin]

What Red Bull done to Salzburg is an abomination.
If they took over your club you would effectively be supporting a soft drinks corporation and well that just doesnt do it for me.

[sean r]

a few things. a loi club is cheap to buy so no large amount of cash to spend. anyone remember wimbeldon? the dublin dons? i dont think an irish club can play in the english league. it is a diffrent association and wont be allowed so i think a red bull team will be a loi team. and a few league 1 players and the red bulls will win the title it wont take much for them to win the loi with this new 25 man rule in england now i bet if the price was right a few decent players would come over to play. bellamy dropped down a division so why not a championship player coming to the red bulls for say 8000 week? this 25 man rule can be a good thing for the red bulls players will be desprate to play football i think it is worth a shot

[MMVIII]

This is an absolutely disgusting idea and I hope no fans of any club would want anything of the sort to happen to their own club. If anything like this did happen to SRFC, which I'm sure it never would, I would never set foot inside the Showgrounds again.

[dcfcsteve]

a few things. a loi club is cheap to buy so no large amount of cash to spend. anyone remember wimbeldon? the dublin dons? i dont think an irish club can play in the english league. it is a diffrent association and wont be allowed so i think a red bull team will be a loi team. and a few league 1 players and the red bulls will win the title it wont take much for them to win the loi with this new 25 man rule in england now i bet if the price was right a few decent players would come over to play. bellamy dropped down a division so why not a championship player coming to the red bulls for say 8000 week? this 25 man rule can be a good thing for the red bulls players will be desprate to play football i think it is worth a shot

a) Red Bull exist to market soft drinks. They're not a sporting franchise, so would have no interest in spunking money up a wall in a small market like Ireland, as the returns wouldn't make sense.

b) More importantly, they have no interest in buying an Irish football team.

[fionnsci]

a) Red Bull exist to market soft drinks. They're not a sporting franchise, so would have no interest in spunking money up a wall in a small market like Ireland, as the returns wouldn't make sense.



Yes they wouldn't make as much but they would also have to invest much less. That's like saying there's no point advertising in Ireland because there aren't many people.

Not that I think Red Bull are going to do this.

[dcfcsteve]

Yes they wouldn't make as much but they would also have to invest much less. That's like saying there's no point advertising in Ireland because there aren't many people.

Not that I think Red Bull are going to do this.

It wouldn't matter how much money Red Bull could or couldn't make out of an Irish football club - they're not interested in football for making money. Their motivation is brand building.

And you've interpreted my use of the word 'returns;' as meaning financial. I was referreing to soft drinks sales - which is their primary business and the thing that drives all their other activites.

So it doesn't matter if they could make money out of an Irish club - it's unlikely the effort would deliver a sufficient incremental uplift in their drinks sales to make it even close to worth the effort, pain and risk.

[Spudulika]

If this does happen then RB can only buy a max of 49% ownership of the club as dont UEFA have rules on club ownership for clubs that compete in UEFA competitions. Basically stating that if clubs have the same majority shareholder then both cannot play in the same UEFA sanctioned competition.

The most recent examples I can think of are the UEFA Cup tie between Tottenham and Slavia Prague a few years ago, also wasn't there an issue with Abramovich ownership of Chelsea and his 'interest' in CSKA Moscow.

Spurs and Slavia had a difficulty where the same company owned substantial shares in both (ENIC), in England it is not allowed for a company or person to own shares in 2 different clubs, the Maxwells got aroudn this by different family members holding shares of each club.

The Abramovich issue was a non-issue, lots of rumours went around though he had more of an "interest" in Spartak and Krylia Sovetov than CSKA. One of his Russian companies were told to sponsor CSKA (this was a use it or lose it deal with Putin, for whom Abramovich was a pet and former KGB colleague), it also meant his 2nd business, arms exports, went along nicely and he got the requisite licences.

Getting a team into the CL does take substantial investment, however it has to be put in over a prolonged period - anyone who has been to Cypriot League games can see that the standard is mostly lower than our own, though local wealthy elite made use of the closing window for tax avoidance to make money. It was proved last season with a 3million euro investment in wages and expenses being covered by more than 6.5million in income from the CL. Would this work in Ireland, maybe by throwing in a couple of million a year for 4 years and developing a strong youth structure, there is a chance, but a Europa League Group spot is more realistic.

[punkrocket]

if soft dinks have to get involved I'd like to see C&C sponser Cork

[SkStu]

and Schweppes sponsor Schligo.

[Spudulika]

Sporting Fanta Fingal has a nice ring to it.

[poster]

if soft dinks have to get involved I'd like to see C&C sponser Cork

Did they not go busht? (C&C)

[Lim till i die]

Now they are C&C Friends Of Rotten Apples Society Co Op

[osarusan]

Finn Harp

[eelmonster]

Finn Harp

v Perry City in the Northwest derby.

[eelmonster]

Shamrock Shandy Rovers v Water United, a spiritless affair. I'll get my coat.

[fionnsci]

It's a shame Limerick 37up are no longer involved.

[the-blue-harp]

if it does happen (which i seriously doubt) it may attract other international companies to come in with investment also. God knows the league can do with any attention or investment it can get at the minute.