The Drogheda thread - budget being revised [Archive]

tiktok

20/01/2010, 10:04 AM

Really sorry to hear that, if it's true.

They seemed to cut their cloth after examinership and I know a lot of the guys up there were putting in a huge amount of work to get the Claret and Blue club off the ground. They had a decent enough season on the pitch too, considering where they were at this stage last year.

Everyone has been looking at galway, but maybe Drogs are the reason Bray and Shels were reportedly told to get their Premier licences ready. Apparently Cobh have been told to get their first division licence sorted too.

One thing is for sure, there are going to be many twists and turns in the weeks to come.

Hairy Bowsie

20/01/2010, 10:05 AM

2 things. Firstly, with the FAI now placing so much emphasis on tax clearance certs, with regards to giving licences, have the revenue been keeping track of that and played a very smart, trump card? Or is it just coincidence?

Secondly, i'm in no way suprised by this revelation.

John83

20/01/2010, 10:10 AM

If you're just joining us, this is not a repeat from 2008.

pineapple stu

20/01/2010, 10:25 AM

Also it seems unlikely that DUFC could have a tax clearance cert is this is true.
You'd imagine they'd have budget problems too, which would lead to problems signing players.

There were enough rumblings out of Drogheda towards the end of last season too (Hoey saying that finishing teh season out was their immediate priority); you'd imagine there's no smoke without fire and all that.

Fr Damo

20/01/2010, 10:29 AM

.

Also it seems unlikely that DUFC could have a tax clearance cert is this is true.

Would agree.

Maybe this is just way too OT but does Alan Mathews not have a duty of care to himself and the club as a Financial Advisor/Banker, albeit I know he is not employed in that capacity with drogs. You'd imagine he'd see this sort of thing coming?? After all his budget (playing staff and exp) would be the single biggest expenditure item.

Feel really sorry for the fans on this.

shep

20/01/2010, 10:30 AM

You'd imagine they'd have budget problems too, which would lead to problems signing players.

There were enough rumblings out of Drogheda towards the end of last season too (Hoey saying that finishing teh season out was their immediate priority); you'd imagine there's no smoke without fire and all that.

They trumped our wage offer(though that wouldnt be hard according to reports) for Michael Daly recently by offering 600 per week part time.If this is true then is it any wonder they are in trouble?? Also whatever Sean Connolly goes near seems to end in disaster so was his departure the sign that all was not well.

pineapple stu

20/01/2010, 10:36 AM

Maybe this is just way too OT but does Alan Mathews not have a duty of care to himself and the club as a Financial Advisor/Banker, albeit I know he is not employed in that capacity with drogs. You'd imagine he'd see this sort of thing coming?? After all his budget (playing staff and exp) would be the single biggest expenditure item.
Bit harsh, I think. He's given a budget and - we'll assume - kept within it. There's no reason that he'd know the entire club budget, and whether the wage budget was reasonable. If he asked questions, you could easily lie about what the shirt sponsorship was worth, for example.

What does this mean for Drogheda and the 65% rule?

chatterbox

20/01/2010, 10:40 AM

They trumped our wage offer(though that wouldnt be hard according to reports) for Michael Daly recently by offering 600 per week part time.If this is true then is it any wonder they are in trouble?? Also whatever Sean Connolly goes near seems to end in disaster so was his departure the sign that all was not well.

Thats not true. When we offered Daly a contract it was the only offer on the table for him. He agreed to accept and when Dundalk offered him terms he couldn't take it because he had already accepted Drogs offer.

Connolly wanted the budget increased for this year. He didn't get it.

Tbh I'm absolutely furious about this. It was well known (and possible announced IIRC) to the fans that we had a debt built up at the end of last year. They were very vague even then about how it would be cleared. Obviously it wasn't. I doubt very much that the FAI knew about this because AFAIK nobody in Drogheda knew (apart from certain people in the club). I'm very sure that heads will roll over this farce. The more I think about it the angrier I get...

pineapple stu

20/01/2010, 10:45 AM

If this is true, at what stage does Hoey get lynched?

shep

20/01/2010, 10:47 AM

Thats not true. When we offered Daly a contract it was the only offer on the table for him. He agreed to accept and when Dundalk offered him terms he couldn't take it because he had already accepted Drogs offer.

Connolly wanted the budget increased for this year. He didn't get it.

Tbh I'm absolutely furious about this. It was well known (and possible announced IIRC) to the fans that we had a debt built up at the end of last year. They were very vague even then about how it would be cleared. Obviously it wasn't. I doubt very much that the FAI knew about this because AFAIK nobody in Drogheda knew (apart from certain people in the club). I'm very sure that heads will roll over this farce. The more I think about it the angrier I get...

Apologies Chatterbox...u are right that Daly had not recieved a proper offer from us and felt messed about...however the figure quoted is correct,and was a warning signal that someone was losing the run of themselves in terms of wages being offered.

Is Daly signed and sealed at this stage???

Mr A

20/01/2010, 10:51 AM

A Drogheda forum post indicates this has also been on LMFM and that a club meeting has been called for tonight.

Longfordian

20/01/2010, 10:57 AM

Wonder how much it is? I know Revenue are making no allowances for anyone these days . You won't get a TCC if you owe them money doubly so if your track record is poor. Looks like they'll have to get it paid before the 30th.

pineapple stu

20/01/2010, 10:58 AM

E50k and since paid, according to a poster on the Drogs forum.

Though if it's paid, it seems strange to arrange a meeting so quickly.

Longfordian

20/01/2010, 11:00 AM

If it is paid they probably want to placate any angry members.

tiktok

20/01/2010, 11:07 AM

Though if it's paid, it seems strange to arrange a meeting so quickly.

Maybe they're going mole hunting?

chatterbox

20/01/2010, 11:08 AM

If this is true, at what stage does Hoey get lynched?

I'd be truly shocked if this is what has happened. I can't believe it would have come to this already. Apparently its already been cleared and the revenue didn't mention anything about a winding up order. Sensationalist journalism?

Celdrog

20/01/2010, 11:14 AM

If this is true, at what stage does Hoey get lynched?Word up in Drogheda is that this is nonsense.
Tonights meeting is about volunteers for the coming season and was organised a while ago. Vincent Hoey supposedly cleared the Drogs tax bill a while ago. I didn't think the revenue told journalists who they were coming after.
Mind you FS Drogheda Ltd is facing a winding up order. They are a hairdresser in the town. Now a journalist couldn't be mistaken could they???
Notice here (http://insolvencyjournal.ie/notices/10-01-18/Petition_to_Wind_Up_F_S_Drogheda_Limited.aspx)

Ah I'm sure time will tell.

Macy

20/01/2010, 11:14 AM

If this is true, at what stage does Hoey get lynched?
He'll be made Life President before they blame him for anything.

Celdrog

20/01/2010, 11:21 AM

He'll be made Life President before they blame him for anything.He already is Life President and has been for may years.
Don't criticise a man whom you know nothing about, nor have you any concept as to what he has done for football in Drogheda. Vincent Hoey has saved the club countless times over the last 40 years.
Same to you Stu ....

pineapple stu

20/01/2010, 11:24 AM

No, I think I'll criticise him if it's all the same to you. You can do great work for a club and still deserve criticism for nearly killing it, like Ollie Byrne.

Fair point on the meeting tonight being already arranged though. Although newspapers - even tabloids - don't make stuff up about the LoI for the hell of it. Still think there's no smoke without fire, but sure we'll see what happens. The implication on the Drogs forum is that the amount has been paid, which again implies it was owing and is at odds with the whole story being made up.

Article from the Drogs forum -

Drogheda United have until Friday to settle and outstanding tax bill or risk facing a winding-up order. The 2007 LOI champions, who only came out of examinership 15 months ago, have already paid half of a 5 figure sum owed to the revenue. Drogheda are the latest club to come onto the taxman's radar, following Galway and Cork. Without an up-to-date tax clearace cert, clubs won't get a premier division licence for 2010.

The FAI have been critical of Cork City's arrears and it remains to be seen how thy deal with the plight of drigheda, who are tenants on FAI property, United Park, a ground that does not meet Premier Division standard. With on-going doubts over Cork City's ability to clear their tax liabilities, it is understood that FORAS, comprised of Cork City supporters, have been given approval for a licence to play in the First Division next season.

And Sligo Rovers, who finished 6th last season, have been put on standby to fill a possible vacancy in the Europa League. Meanwhile, Bohs must re-submit their budget for the new season after the FAI rejected their proposal yesterday. A club source said last night that there was nothing unmanageable in the changes that were required for the champions but as things stand, Bohs can't register their signing for the new season.

shep

20/01/2010, 11:25 AM

He already is Life President and has been for may years.
Don't criticise a man whom you know nothing about, nor have you any concept as to what he has done for football in Drogheda. Vincent Hoey has saved the club countless times over the last 40 years.
Same to you Stu ....

Have to agree with this,i worked in Drogheda for many years and its well known he has dipped deep into his own pockets on many occasions to help the Drogs...slate oters but i know for sure that you would be hard pressed to find a man who loves Drogheda United as much as this guy.

Mr A

20/01/2010, 11:28 AM

It's all well and good putting your hand in your pocket to help the club, but the question must be asked as to why this is necessary so often?

Above all, how can the club have ended up with a substantial revenue debt so soon after examinership, and despite a decent season on the field?

Buile Shuibhne

20/01/2010, 11:28 AM

.......The FAI have been critical of Cork City's arrears and it remains to be seen how thy deal with the plight of drigheda, who are tenants on FAI property, United Park, a ground that does not meet Premier Division standard.

Did the FAI ever carry out the requiired improvements to their ground, on which premise they gave Drogs a Prem Div licence last season?

chatterbox

20/01/2010, 11:33 AM

Did the FAI ever carry out the requiired improvements to their ground, on which premise they gave Drogs a Prem Div licence last season?

Planning permission for 1100 seats had been lodged (poss. granted by now not sure). They basically award themselves a license so the ground isn't an obstacle from the clubs point of view.

Must apologise for my misunderstanding about the meeting. I jumped to a conclusion there.

osarusan

20/01/2010, 11:35 AM

Did the FAI ever carry out the requiired improvements to their ground, on which premise they gave Drogs a Prem Div licence last season?

Wasn't the licence being awarded on the grounds that planning permission for improvements had been applied for - planning permission which has been turned down?

Or am I mistaken?

pineapple stu

20/01/2010, 11:39 AM

Don't think PP has been turned down?

osarusan

20/01/2010, 11:52 AM

Don't think PP has been turned down?

Isn't there something going on whereby the FAI are using the planned improvements as a way to allow United Park to be used in the premier when everybody knows the improvements won't happen?

Or am I just wrong and confusing the situation with something else?

Macy

20/01/2010, 12:02 PM

Don't criticise a man whom you know nothing about, nor have you any concept as to what he has done for football in Drogheda. Vincent Hoey has saved the club countless times over the last 40 years.
Yes, it is from the outside, but I'd share the view that it's amazing he was let back near the club after the whole debacle that lead to examinership. If there is another winding up order, and he still escapes criticism, then the pope must be jealous of his infallibility.

total hoofball

20/01/2010, 12:03 PM

Celdrog

20/01/2010, 12:12 PM

Don't think PP has been turned down?
Decision due this Saturday (http://www.droghedaboro.ie/ePlan/InternetEnquiry/rpt_ViewApplicDetails.asp?validFileNum=1&app_num_file=09144)
For this season its irrelevant what the decision is. It will be appealed if turned down and the licence will be awarded. If its approved the licence will be awarded.
Who knows if they will do any improvements? Nobody in Drogheda for sure.

If the ground isn't up to scratch by November we should be relegated (probably should have been 2 years ago).

weecountyman

20/01/2010, 12:22 PM

It's all well and good putting your hand in you pocket to help the club, but the question must be asked as to why this is necessary so often?

Above all, how can the club have ended up with a substantial revenue debt so soon after examinership, and despite a decent season on the field?

I kind of agree and disagree at once. The man is a genuine character and totally committed (in every sense) to his club. However to plough so much money into the club and still end up wobbling can be put down to poor management. Maybe, as was mentioned already, he is too much in the mould of Ollie who just couldn't let go of all the reins.

WoodquayBoy

20/01/2010, 12:50 PM

I didn't think the revenue told journalists who they were coming after.
I think you are bang on, Revenue would never comment on individual cases, so not sure the story holds too much water, unless the journo has a pal in Revenue who leaked him info

WindmillWarrior

20/01/2010, 1:02 PM

Yes, it is from the outside, but I'd share the view that it's amazing he was let back near the club after the whole debacle that lead to examinership. If there is another winding up order, and he still escapes criticism, then the pope must be jealous of his infallibility.

Bullsh*t about Hoey escaping criticism from Drogs. Hes got plenty.
This whole story would appear to be bullsh*t as well

Doomofman

20/01/2010, 1:06 PM

Just when I though most clubs were starting to get their stuff together :( sigh...

shantykelly

20/01/2010, 1:08 PM

I think you are bang on, Revenue would never comment on individual cases, so not sure the story holds too much water, unless the journo has a pal in Revenue who leaked him info

dont know how it works in the south, but if ye do that in the north its considered a breach of the official secrets act, which is a pretty big stick to beat a leaker with. i'd imagine that youse have similar legislation at work, although they'd probably just charge ye under the offences against the state act.

very odd with the timing though. story comes out, and the bill's apparently already paid. are there any other independent sourcrs, or is it all feeding off the back of that paragon of journalistic integrity, the daily mail?

chatterbox

20/01/2010, 1:16 PM

They also trumped Pats' offers for Harris, Kenna and McNally

Are you sure about all that? I would be surprised if Kenna/McNally left for Pats tbf even on better terms. As for Harris, I would struggle to believe that Harris left Pats for a club he was very clear that he didn't want to join a few years ago.

pineapple stu

20/01/2010, 1:22 PM

I think you are bang on, Revenue would never comment on individual cases, so not sure the story holds too much water, unless the journo has a pal in Revenue who leaked him info
Surely someone in Drogheda United could leak the story too?

Also, I've added a question mark in the thread title just for a bit of clarification!

all drogged up

20/01/2010, 1:32 PM

If you don't know anything about the situation then forget about posting a definitive conclusion on the issue.

I would say drogs fans are the most shocked about this - I know I am.

Seems to be cleared up so panic over.

Stadium situation is a joke but that's the league all over.

Last year we cut our cloth to suit our budget. Cork went bust almost immediately after exiting examinership having kept all of their players. That shouldn't have been allowed. We dug deep and started from scratch - only a week or two before start of season. We deserve to be in top flight - on the field matters. It's football not monopoly.

If we did breach or miss a tax bill it'll be small fry compared to Derry Cork - Bohs etc. We've learned our lesson but it's not like everything falls into place immediately - you don't get a cash binus for being wise after the fact - our club like all others will still have to fight hard for every penny we need to run the club and it looks like, for a while at least there, we migth have come up a bit short. Would still rather not have seen that story all the same.

Finally on Hoey, he's a legend, and has done tremendous things over the years. He's hands off since exiting Examinership last year so none of this his fault. A figurehead these days rather than an organiser.

mr.untitled

20/01/2010, 2:38 PM

good post!

dong

20/01/2010, 2:40 PM

Gotta love all the UCD brigade's jubilant comment on any financial misfortune befalling other clubs in the league.:D
You could almost hear the collective groan as they came in their trousers when this thread opened up....

DmanDmythDledge

20/01/2010, 2:43 PM

All the UCD brigade? Before this post I only see posts from pineapple stu (and one from John83 which didn't really add anything to the thread).

pineapple stu

20/01/2010, 2:46 PM

And I don't see any of us jubilant either.

SMorgan

20/01/2010, 2:54 PM

Did the FAI ever carry out the requiired improvements to their ground, on which premise they gave Drogs a Prem Div licence last season?

They don't need to carry out improvements. They've a planning application in, that'll do for the FAI!!

ndrog

20/01/2010, 4:28 PM

Just returned from the clubhouse and there was no panic and no sense that anything is wrong , no more than usual . Was also told by a club offical today that the story was nonsense and all is in hand with monies owed . Meeting tonight thats been organised for a week will tell us more .

peadar1987

20/01/2010, 8:22 PM

We deserve to be in top flight - on the field matters. It's football not monopoly.

I'll have to disagree with you there. The rules are in place for a reason, and all clubs will have signed a participation agreement before entering the league. If any one club breaks the rules relating to off-the-field matters, this, in my opinion, is just as serious, if not more so, than breaking the rules on the pitch.