Televise the Euro Qualifiers

[wedwood]

Now that Ireland are not going to the World Cup this year, we've no Irish interest on the international football stage this summer.

Hang on, there's four League of Ireland teams going to compete in the two biggest club competitions in the world this summer, but instead RTE, TV3 Setanta are all killing each other to see who'll get to screen England's games.

We should be demanding that Irish football teams competing on the international stage are shown here, rather than the usual hopping on the band wagon if one of them get on a roll.

If I'm paying big money for my TV license to the National broadcaster as we all are, then we're entitled to demand and get to see our Irish club sides representing our country.

[SkStu]

it would be interesting to see how many of the countries involved in the early qualifying rounds for the CL and Europa League had the away/home/both legs of the games broadcast on national TV.

Though i have no idea where to check for that id imagine that we are not the exception. Though possibly a good few of the games elsewhere were broadcast on local TV which Ireland doesnt really have a lot of.

World Cup, Ireland or not, is of far greater "national importance" to the Irish "soccer mad" public. Even though the World Cup and euro qualifiers dont coincide with each other thats really where the issue lies. RTE have to provide what the public wants and all 3 are essentially businesses, so i dont object to them all wanting to screen the WC. That said, in an ideal world, they would and should be broadcasting the euro qualifier games involving all Irish teams (maybe not Fingal).

Im just playing devils advocate a bit - purely personally, as long as they are available online (and they often are) then im alright.

[dcfcsteve]

Reality check required people.

The great sports-loving Irish public would stay up until 4am to watch Costa Rica play Greenland in a World Cup group game in larger numbers than they would one of our club teams against a relative European minnow in an evening kick-off.

RTE follow demand, and the World Cup is a big draw no matter who's playing in it. England World Cup games will doubtless draw a bigger TV audience in Ireland than all the FAI cup finals for the last decade have combined.

We're in no position to "demand" anything here....

[A N Mouse]

Reality check required people.

The great sports-loving Irish public would stay up until 4am to watch Costa Rica play Greenland in a World Cup group game in larger numbers than they would one of our club teams against a relative European minnow in an evening kick-off.

RTE follow demand, and the World Cup is a big draw no matter who's playing in it. England World Cup games will doubtless draw a bigger TV audience in Ireland than all the FAI cup finals for the last decade have combined.

We're in no position to "demand" anything here....

Am I missing something, or have you changed your tune since the summer when, despite paying a tv licence in london, you expected the irish national broadcaster to show european club games involving irish teams?

[thischarmingman]

RTE have to provide what the public wants and all 3 are essentially businesses, so i dont object to them all wanting to screen the WC.


Reality check required people...

RTE follow demand, and the World Cup is a big draw no matter who's playing in it. England World Cup games will doubtless draw a bigger TV audience in Ireland than all the FAI cup finals for the last decade have combined.

We're in no position to "demand" anything here....

Obviously the World Cup is a sporting event of massive interest and should be broadcast live as a matter of course, regardless of the teams that qualify for it but that doesn't mean the LOI European matches shouldn't be broadcast live also in July, August and (hopefully) September. I'm not sure what the two have to do with one another to be honest. Broadcasting these domestic European matches is something I feel quite strongly about and I think conflating them with the World Cup is slightly disingenuous.

What's of more relevance is the fact that you can bet RTE will be tripping over themselves to broadcast the latest meaningless bore fest between Liverpool and Rubin Kazan or Chelsea and Schalke come the autumn- if they can do this then they should be able to outlay enough to cover every Irish team in action.

Appealing to the masses isn't an argument that should be relevant in this case. RTE's remit is not to appeal to the masses- that's TV3's. I'm sure most people in the country don't care about the Angelus at six anymore, but that doesn't stop it being broadcast. RTE aren't supposed to only care when you become a majority- their charter explicitly states: "RTE commits to...sports programming that reflects the demands for national, regional, minority, amateur and local sports in Ireland today.

[SkStu]

i respect that standpoint TCM and agree with it but im beyond getting outraged by it at this stage. Its been like this for years and its not right but its not going to change anytime soon either.

By the way, it was the original poster that connected the WC to RTEs failure to broadcast the euro qualifiers. I was saying that they are not, that this failure to broadcast is nothing new but that its also probably not a situation that is unique across the smaller European nations and unless the public demands it, RTE wont show it. When it comes to football the public demand Liverpool, United, Celtic, Premiership, Internationals and major tournaments. Only a reasonably small percentage are demanding Bohs v. Salzburg or Pats v. Hertha Berlin or Shels v Deportivo (and theyre the bigger ties) - a lot less are demanding the earlier ties (even A.Dolan a Sligo fan has no interest in any of Bohs, Rovers or Fingal) so despite the wrongs of it, its not going to change. I blame the sporting public.

[weecountyman]

It's a tough call for RTE, while they get a fair bit from licences, ads, government and EU handouts they are pulled a number of ways. One simple way for them is to transfer such matters to TG4. There has to be a solution as though many European countries don't bother to broadcast the earliest rounds, others do, especially those like Ireland who aren't exactly blessed with teams in the later rounds. Even a highlights show would suffice for a bit.

[pineapple stu]

Facepalm stuff moved as requested.

[dcfcsteve]

Am I missing something, or have you changed your tune since the summer when, despite paying a tv licence in london, you expected the irish national broadcaster to show european club games involving irish teams?

The point here wasn't about the Euro games in isolation, it was about them in relation to/competition with World Cup games and the lack if Ireland in them. Hence I replied in that context.

Do I think RTE should show LOI Euro games ? Yes. Do I think they should turn their back on the world cup to do so ? Regardless of whether I'd like them to or not, it is completely unrealistic to expext them to do this.

[wedwood]

I think the least RTE in particular should do is to send cameras to all of the League of Ireland teams competing in Europe this year and have a series of MNS specials later that evening.

They could also select particular matches to be shown live in the same way they choose which Champions League game to televise.

Is that too much to expect ?

[Schumi]

The either/or situation presented in the first post is wrong. The World Cup will get big viewing figures on RTE and the ad revenue will cover the outlay. Not showing the World Cup wouldn't make it any easier to cover clubs' European matches. Like everyone else here, I'd like to see European games on TV but it's got nothing to do with the World Cup.

[MickeyEvans]

Yes, spot on Schumi.

The issue of Euro qualifiers shouldnb't be related to the World Cup. The World Cup transcends all football and, forgive me, but the original argument appears to be just another cheap go at the Irish "soccer-loving public" for the sake of furthering an LOI argument. Not showing the World Cup would be like not showing the 100m race in the Olympics, just because there's no Irish involved. A ludicrous suggestion.

The Euro qualifiers should of course be shown... and showing the World Cup should, at least if you add up the numbers, help that process since it brings more money to RTE.

[Murfinator]

Don't pull out the "watch England" bull****, its been should world cup after world cup that Brazil and Spain games attract the highest audience because they play the most attractive style. People would rather watch the best players in the world face off in the biggest sporting competition on the planet then watch some part timers who'll be eliminated by the 2nd qualifying phase, this thread is utter bull****.

Most of us don't follow a sport sheerly out of local interest you know, it'd be nice of Ireland were there to support but there's more to enjoying a sport than just cheering on your preferred team.

[SkStu]

Despite acknowledging the fact that you just posted to have a dig at the "part timers who'll be eliminated by the 2nd qualifying phase", i think youll find that thats what most of the posters have said. :rolleyes:

[Murfinator]

I think the least RTE in particular should do is to send cameras to all of the League of Ireland teams competing in Europe this year and have a series of MNS specials later that evening.

They could also select particular matches to be shown live in the same way they choose which Champions League game to televise.

Is that too much to expect ?

I don't get this attitude where people act like RTE have an obligation to show LOI stuff because they're the national broadcaster. They have an obligation to show things based on ratings and nothing else. RTE don't show coverage of the Irish volleyball team or cricket team or handball team or any other lesser sport nor will carry more than the audience demands for LOI. Do you honestly expect them to take a dip in ratings just because they might gain some partriotism points?

Try blaming the league for not presenting itself as being entertaining to the masses, don't blame the audience and certainly don't blame the broadcasting medium.

[pineapple stu]

I recall seeing a live basketball qualifier from Denmark screened. I'm sure there's other examples.

[pineapple stu]

They do, yeah. I picked the one in Denmark because it was an away qualifier. At least with the hockey finals, you could put up a pretence of an argument by saying it was only up the road (Montrose to UCD).

And obviously I've no problems with them showing those games either.

[dcfcsteve]

I don't get this attitude where people act like RTE have an obligation to show LOI stuff because they're the national broadcaster. They have an obligation to show things based on ratings and nothing else. RTE don't show coverage of the Irish volleyball team or cricket team or handball team or any other lesser sport nor will carry more than the audience demands for LOI. Do you honestly expect them to take a dip in ratings just because they might gain some partriotism points?

Try blaming the league for not presenting itself as being entertaining to the masses, don't blame the audience and certainly don't blame the broadcasting medium.

Whilst I broadlty agree with what you're syaing here, you're completely wrong on RTE's obligations here.

They DO have obligations as a public broadcaster, and if you read the thread from the start you'll seen those obligations listed by another poster.

[Riddickcule]

Why just RTE?

Why not hassle TV3 and Setanta to get on board?

[ped_ped]

We should. But the argument doesn't hold through for them as they are completely ratings-based, not national broadcasters.

[weecountyman]

RTE do have representation of other sports but while TV3 is ratings driven and Setanta also, TG4 has a public obligation and last season covered the LOI very well, from what I saw, including the Shamrock Rovers-Bohemians end of season match. They could follow at least one of the clubs, RTE would get decent figures covering Shamrock Rovers and Setanta could get good numbers with Bohs, but one question that should be asked, do Sky or one of the continental providers hold rights for Irish teams?

[Murfinator]

I think you could say RTE have an obligation to give priority to local games and teams over others but as I said ratings are still the most important factor in deciding what gets aired and what doesn't which is way games in less popular sports get little or no broadcast coverage despite being of national significance.

What I'm saying here is it isn't only LoI teams that aren't broadcasted frequently on RTE, it isn't being victimised as some posters would have you believe. RTE lost the rights for the Heineken Cup as they weren't willing to pay, I don't think they ever had the Celtic League rights, Setanta do, in recent years they've lost a lot of GAA rights, TV3 have some exclusives, Setanta have access to all the games although not live. So regardless of your chosen sport you're not going to be fully satisfied with what RTE show thanks to their budget limitations. The only saving grace with GAA is that it is of no interest to foreign broadcasters so it'll always be available on terresterial tv unlike soccer and rugby.

[A N Mouse]

No.

IIRC RTE have the CL rights and its open bid on the Europa Cup.

RTE have CL and Setanta/TV3 have Europa league. But these centralised rights are from the group stages (possibly final qualifying round) on. Clubs are still free to negotiate rights to their home fixtures for the preceding rounds. However the broadcaster is obliged to show teams from their own country first.

[osarusan]

I think you could say RTE have an obligation to give priority to local games and teams over others but as I said ratings are still the most important factor in deciding what gets aired and what doesn't which is way games in less popular sports get little or no broadcast coverage despite being of national significance.

What I'm saying here is it isn't only LoI teams that aren't broadcasted frequently on RTE, it isn't being victimised as some posters would have you believe. RTE lost the rights for the Heineken Cup as they weren't willing to pay, I don't think they ever had the Celtic League rights, Setanta do, in recent years they've lost a lot of GAA rights, TV3 have some exclusives, Setanta have access to all the games although not live. So regardless of your chosen sport you're not going to be fully satisfied with what RTE show thanks to their budget limitations. The only saving grace with GAA is that it is of no interest to foreign broadcasters so it'll always be available on terresterial tv unlike soccer and rugby.
I agree with you when you say that there is no victimisation of the LOI in RTE not showing games, as there are other other sports which get even less exposure on TV.

Whether ratings are all that determines what RTE show and don't show is something I'm not sure about. I'd be surprised if they didn't have commitments to broadcast things which get lower ratings but are considered "important".

The agrument that any RTE decision not to show LOI games or LOI teams in Europe is based on budget constraints is madness though. It would cost next to nothing to broadcast a game from Dalymount, for example.

[CarrickFan]

I think you could say RTE have an obligation to give priority to local games and teams over others but as I said ratings are still the most important factor in deciding what gets aired and what doesn't which is way games in less popular sports get little or no broadcast coverage despite being of national significance.

What I'm saying here is it isn't only LoI teams that aren't broadcasted frequently on RTE, it isn't being victimised as some posters would have you believe. RTE lost the rights for the Heineken Cup as they weren't willing to pay, I don't think they ever had the Celtic League rights, Setanta do, in recent years they've lost a lot of GAA rights, TV3 have some exclusives, Setanta have access to all the games although not live. So regardless of your chosen sport you're not going to be fully satisfied with what RTE show thanks to their budget limitations. The only saving grace with GAA is that it is of no interest to foreign broadcasters so it'll always be available on terresterial tv unlike soccer and rugby.


And it never will be...judging by crowds last summer its becoming of little interest to the Irish public also..:)

[Ceirtlis]

The year gone by was actually the first in a good number of years where they didnt show a game. The thing I found strange though was that Austrian and Romanian tv showed games from Dublin and they didnt even pay to piggyback the coverage. I would say that the sports department are very sore about the budget on MNS, they were moaning about it before, and decided absolutley no more money was going to the LOI this year.

[marinobohs]

I agree with you when you say that there is no victimisation of the LOI in RTE not showing games, as there are other other sports which get even less exposure on TV.

Whether ratings are all that determines what RTE show and don't show is something I'm not sure about. I'd be surprised if they didn't have commitments to broadcast things which get lower ratings but are considered "important".

The agrument that any RTE decision not to show LOI games or LOI teams in Europe is based on budget constraints is madness though. It would cost next to nothing to broadcast a game from Dalymount, for example.

fair point there, crowds at AIL rugby games are tiny yet the league gets extensive coverage. Likewise club GAA games are not usually major crowds yet TG 4 (part of the RTE stable) give them massive coverage.

while I would not critisise RTE or any broadcaster for showing "minority" sports it is a bit rich for them to quote ratings when it comes to LOI

[sheao]

Why just RTE?

Why not hassle TV3 and Setanta to get on board?

Setanta showed Pats away game against Hertha Berlin in the uefa cup last season . Yeah but your are right, all the Irish stations should be trying to show LOI teams in european action as they are representing the country no matter how good or bad they are.

[Acornvilla]

Setanta showed Pats away game against Hertha Berlin in the uefa cup last season . Yeah but your are right, all the Irish stations should be trying to show LOI teams in european action as they are representing the country no matter how good or bad they are.
id say theres a good chance we will see rovers games on rte becase of the clubs history and shiny new home and all that

[weecountyman]

Marinobohs, I disagree on tiny crowds at AIL games and not major crowds at GAA club matches, both would make our LOI 1st Division, and some Premier, clubs very jealous. Plus advertising revenues come into play too, there are/were bigger companies interested in plugging products via rugby and GAA and local soccer. Plus the viewing figures for TG4's (from what I've read) GAA club finals coverage is more than respectable.

I wonder about the budget for MNS as it seems to be a fairly tight run ship, with minimal coverage of the LOI (Premier only) and a tight time slot. I don't know if there's any truth in the claim that Roddy was on a hundred grand a year from RTE, because then Rico would be on the same. If that was the case then the show might look a bit rich. Con Murphy (in spite of his allegiance :-) ) is a stalwart for radio and Tony O'Donoghue likewise for TV. So I don't know why RTE would complain about the show, unless the wages were mental.

[Schumi]

Marinobohs, I disagree on tiny crowds at AIL games... would make our LOI 1st Division, and some Premier, clubs very jealous.
Really? Any AIL games I've been at have had first division sized crowds at them at best.

[marinobohs]

Marinobohs, I disagree on tiny crowds at AIL games and not major crowds at GAA club matches, both would make our LOI 1st Division, and some Premier, clubs very jealous. Plus advertising revenues come into play too, there are/were bigger companies interested in plugging products via rugby and GAA and local soccer. Plus the viewing figures for TG4's (from what I've read) GAA club finals coverage is more than respectable.

I wonder about the budget for MNS as it seems to be a fairly tight run ship, with minimal coverage of the LOI (Premier only) and a tight time slot. I don't know if there's any truth in the claim that Roddy was on a hundred grand a year from RTE, because then Rico would be on the same. If that was the case then the show might look a bit rich. Con Murphy (in spite of his allegiance :-) ) is a stalwart for radio and Tony O'Donoghue likewise for TV. So I don't know why RTE would complain about the show, unless the wages were mental.

disagree, heiniken Cup or that Celtic League games only rugger matches I have seen with antway decent crowd similarly a lot of GAA club games do not cause traffic dissruption.

I would be amazed if Roddy orc any panelist was on that kind of money at MNS - what a waste. I like Com Murphy (despite .....) and tony O'D but personally would prefer 1st Div highlights to a load of guff from Roddy or Rico (money better spent). Still finding its feet to be fair and a lot better than 2 minute "highlights" at 10.30 on a sunday night (sometimes showed only some of the goals in the "featured match" :D)