We Draw France, Russia or Portugal

[Noelys Guitar]

How do we beat them over two legs? I feel our best chance of winning is actually away from home. Not necessarily winning the match but scoring to match our opponents on their turf. And then taking them back to Croker for a 0-0. We can do this against any European opponent.

[seanfhear]

An away goal is vital in these games (2 would be better:))

[Duggie]

ive had a feeling for weeks that were going to get portugal..:(

[bogwarrior]

How do we beat them over two legs? I feel our best chance of winning is actually away from home. Not necessarily winning the match but scoring to match our opponents on their turf. And then taking them back to Croker for a 0-0. We can do this against any European opponent.

Agree completely with this. I feel we can hold anyone to a draw while going out and beating them is an entirely different matter. An away score draw followed by a 0-0 at home. I'd take it now! What if we draw Greece and they do the same as us?! Be prepared for the most horrendous two games in playoff history!

[galwayhoop]

ive had a feeling for weeks that were going to get portugal..:(

same as... don't know why but convinced we will.

[Drumcondra 69er]

We'll get Russia, I'm convinced of it.

[geysir]

But as Bill would ask, are we haunted to get Russia?

[Duggie]

id take russia. dont think there as good as everyone thinks. is people's perception of arshavin clouding a lot of judgements ? look at pavleuchenko cant get near the spurs line up. so what about the cold in moscow, not as if we aint used to it. i think we could do well againt them.

[Yard of Pace]

Why does no one want Russia?? Apart from Arshavin, Zhirkov and Pavyluchenko (the latter two would hardly fill you with the fear of God), they're a team of "unknowns" who mainly play in Russia, so there'd be little fear factor there. I appreciate the Hiddink and Moscow things but they'd be my second choice after Greece for sure.

[Duggie]

Why does no one want Russia?? Apart from Arshavin, Zhirkov and Pavyluchenko (the latter two would hardly fill you with the fear of God), they're a team of "unknowns" who mainly play in Russia, so there'd be little fear factor there. I appreciate the Hiddink and Moscow things but they'd be my second choice after Greece for sure.

exactly my point. id take russia as i said.

[tetsujin1979]

Why does no one want Russia?? Apart from Arshavin, Zhirkov and Pavyluchenko (the latter two would hardly fill you with the fear of God), they're a team of "unknowns" who mainly play in Russia, so there'd be little fear factor there. I appreciate the Hiddink and Moscow things but they'd be my second choice after Greece for sure.
Unknowns does not mean "weak". Russian sides at international and club level have been steadily improving over the last few years
Russia were semi-finalists in Euro 2008 after qualifying unseeded. Lost their opener to Spain, and scraped past Greece 1-0 before Arshavin's return inspired wins over Sweden and the Dutch, before losing again in the semi's to Spain.
Zenit St Petersburg were UEFA Cup winners in 2008, and finished third in their group in the Champions League in 2008/2009 containing Real Madrid and Juventus. In the UEFA Cup they knocked out Stuttgart before losing to Udinese 2-1 over 2 legs.
I really don't fancy going to Moscow in the middle of November to play on a plastic pitch needing to get a result, look at England's result there in the last campaign, completely outplayed andlost

[Drumcondra 69er]

Unknowns does not mean "weak". Russian sides at international and club level have been steadily improving over the last few years
Russia were semi-finalists in Euro 2008 after qualifying unseeded. Lost their opener to Spain, and scraped past Greece 1-0 before Arshavin's return inspired wins over Sweden and the Dutch, before losing again in the semi's to Spain.
Zenit St Petersburg were UEFA Cup winners in 2008, and finished third in their group in the Champions League in 2008/2009 containing Real Madrid and Juventus. In the UEFA Cup they knocked out Stuttgart before losing to Udinese 2-1 over 2 legs.
I really don't fancy going to Moscow in the middle of November to play on a plastic pitch needing to get a result, look at England's result there in the last campaign, completely outplayed andlost

....what he said.

Plus it'd be sh1t to get to, was a horrible trip in 2002 from all accounts with gangs going round battering Irish fans and people ended up being restricted to their hotels. Add the Hiddink factor to the snow, freezing temperature and plastic pitch and it's clear that it would be a nightmare draw.

[Yard of Pace]

Unknowns does not mean "weak".

I know that. But at least we won't have all the "Benzema v St. Ledger" or "Ronaldo v Kilbane" stuff that's spouted everytime we play a strong nation. Or maybe that inspires the players, I don't know.

[Wolfie]

Personally, I'd like to avoid Russia - in part, due to the fact that Hiddink will have them very well prepared for whoever they will face.

Secondly - has to be considered that their plastic pitch could be difficult to adapt to.

[wexfordman]

are most people who are planning on attending the away leg going to fly out the day before the game, two nights accomadation and fly home the day after the game.

would it be fair to say if the game is in france or portugal the above should be attained for est €250-€300

Grecce €350

Russia €600

then the price of match tickets and alcohol and food added. Iam definatley going if we draw anyone except russia just try to convince a few of more lads to come on board and if someone could post estimated price for the above. thanks

[Scram]

We'll get Russia, I'm convinced of it.

I've thought that for ages. Not exactly the topic of a football forum, speculating about who we might get based on a feeling, but I think we’ll get Russia away first leg!

1-0 Russia first leg and 0-0 second leg :(

What odds Paddy Power?!

[Duggie]

lads it portugal...i am certain. dont know why but felt it for weeks. i think it cause i want to avoid them the most.

[SuperDave]

Why does no one want Russia?? Apart from Arshavin, Zhirkov and Pavyluchenko (the latter two would hardly fill you with the fear of God), they're a team of "unknowns" who mainly play in Russia, so there'd be little fear factor there. I appreciate the Hiddink and Moscow things but they'd be my second choice after Greece for sure.

All right ... all right ... but apart from better sanitation and medicine and education and irrigation and public health and roads and a freshwater system and baths and public order ... what have the Romans done for us?

I fear Russia more than any of the others. The fact we don't know them should make us fear them more, no?

[EalingGreen]

Secondly - has to be considered that their plastic pitch could be difficult to adapt to.
Tbh, I don't know why FIFA permit synthetic pitches for international matches. Here is a quotation from last night's London evening Standard:

[Tottenham] Club medics are waiting to assess striker Roman Pavlyuchenko after he picked up a muscle problem playing as a second-half substitute against Germany on a plastic pitch in Russia at the weekend. He said: 'I have lost the habit of playing on synthetics - the pains in my muscles told me that'

Quite honestly, if you don't draw Greece, then I personally think you'd be better off with Portugal, who are struggling under Quiroz (a coach rather than a manager), or France, similarly struggling under Domenech (barking).

Whereas Russia have got some excellent players (both abroad and domestically), the country is a genuinely "hard place to get a result", and in Hiddinck, they have got arguably the canniest manager in international football.

[Murfinator]

Why does no one want Russia?? Apart from Arshavin, Zhirkov and Pavyluchenko (the latter two would hardly fill you with the fear of God), they're a team of "unknowns"

Are you a british soccer pundit by any chance? :eek:

They are not a team of "unknowns", what nonsense. They made the semi finals of the last euro's, have only been outdone by a strong german side in qualifying and have a strength all over the pitch. Zenit has won the UEFA cup and the super cup. While CSKA have consistently been relatively strong in the champions league.

- Akinfeev is one of the best young goalkeepers in the game. World class.
- Semak and Semshov have valuable experience at the top level.
- Sychev is a lethal finisher
- Their side is for the most part at a very good age, on the early side of mid twenties.

We have ever reason to be very, very afraid of these guys, they've argubly got better strength accross the pitch than either portugal or france who excel in just a couple of positions.

[briancool21]

there are a vey good side outside of the stars in the team some fine players likes of zryanov,semshow,pogrebniak,that fella at everton is handy aswell don't ask me to spell his name, keeper is solid despite the odd howler here and there, I think as a team they are the biggest threat..Then again Wales only lost 2-1 in moscow and probaly could of got a result

[back of the net]

keeper is solid despite the odd howler here and there,

he can hardly be called solid if he does howlers here and there surely!!!

[briancool21]

well same can be said of david james overall 99% of the time solid good keeper but there's always that 1% that's what i meant

[Den Perry]

Tbh, I don't know why FIFA permit synthetic pitches for international matches. Here is a quotation from last night's London evening Standard:

[Tottenham] Club medics are waiting to assess striker Roman Pavlyuchenko after he picked up a muscle problem playing as a second-half substitute against Germany on a plastic pitch in Russia at the weekend. He said: 'I have lost the habit of playing on synthetics - the pains in my muscles told me that'

Quite honestly, if you don't draw Greece, then I personally think you'd be better off with Portugal, who are struggling under Quiroz (a coach rather than a manager), or France, similarly struggling under Domenech (barking).

Whereas Russia have got some excellent players (both abroad and domestically), the country is a genuinely "hard place to get a result", and in Hiddinck, they have got arguably the canniest manager in international football.

I actually can't understand why they allow them for any top class football. I believe the pitches do cause injury and offer a distinct advantage to the team who regularly use the plactic pitch.

The team it would give me most pleasure to knock out would be Portugal. I cannot stand Quiroz and would love to hear his excuses after they dumped. That said,they are the team I would fear most if Ronaldo was fit and if the ref is i any way weak

[Crosby87]

Is Ronaldo likely to be healthy? Maybe he will come back and aggravate that ankle. Tricky injury.

[Emmet7]

To be honest, on our day, we can match any of the seeded teams.

Russia were beaten twice by Germany and Germany are no great shakes. Obviously Arshavin is the danger man.

France are only half a team without Zidane.

Portugal are a team of average players apart from Ronaldo.

Greece are long ball merchants. Dunne and O'Shea should deal with that.

[MeathDrog]

To be honest, on our day, we can match any of the seeded teams.

Russia were beaten twice by Germany and Germany are no great shakes. Obviously Arshavin is the danger man.

France are only half a team without Zidane.

Portugal are a team of average players apart from Ronaldo.

Greece are long ball merchants. Dunne and O'Shea should deal with that.
Dunne wasn't too convincing under the high ball against Montenegro. Often let the ball bounce after going up for it, assuming that there was no one behind him. Did that a lot in the 1st half, and eventually you will get caught out doing that. could be an issue to be addressed if they play a team like Greece.

[Emmet7]

All the seeded teams have struggled with form, that's why they finished second. Yes if they were playing well we might fear them. But I don't think they are.

The French manager is something of an idiot and unpredictable. Ronaldo is hardly ever as good at international level as club level. The Russians couldn't beat the Germans which should give us belief. On paper they look like tough games as on paper any game against France Russia or Portual should.

But we beat the Portuguese before with a Roy Keane goal and if anything that was a much better side with Figo and all those players. We ran the French close under Kerr. And we have beaten the Russians before.

If we go in fearing the worst, we probably won't do ourselves justice. We cannot be beaten before we leave the dressing room. And we have the players. Damian Duff isn't afraid of any defence and has played with Chelsea. Robbie Keane has done it time and time again against the big countries. Dunne, Given, O'Shea, won't be phased by the big countries.

[MeathDrog]

All the seeded teams have struggled with form, that's why they finished second. Yes if they were playing well we might fear them. But I don't think they are.

The French manager is something of an idiot and unpredictable. Ronaldo is hardly ever as good at international level as club level. The Russians couldn't beat the Germans which should give us belief. On paper they look like tough games as on paper any game against France Russia or Portual should.

But we beat the Portuguese before with a Roy Keane goal and if anything that was a much better side with Figo and all those players. We ran the French close under Kerr. And we have beaten the Russians before.

If we go in fearing the worst, we probably won't do ourselves justice. We cannot be beaten before we leave the dressing room. And we have the players. Damian Duff isn't afraid of any defence and has played with Chelsea. Robbie Keane has done it time and time again against the big countries. Dunne, Given, O'Shea, won't be phased by the big countries.
That was a 1-1 draw.

[Crosby87]

Again though, what do you think they are saying about us? We beat Georgia and Cyprus only and got pummeled by Kangaroo ranchers in a friendly. I mean Im all for us coming out on top but they are definitely licking their chops for a crack at the Irish. When was the last time we beat a good team? I dont even know.

[tetsujin1979]

But we beat the Portuguese before with a Roy Keane goal and if anything that was a much better side with Figo and all those players.That game finished 1-1. You might be thinking of Andy O'Brien's goal that beat them 1-0. But Figo wasn't in that game

We ran the French close under Kerr.We drew 0-0 and lost 1-0. Repeat those results and we're out

And we have beaten the Russians before.
Yes we have. Once. In 6 encounters.
And we've never beaten them in a competitive game.

[Closed Account 2]

Against France I would think playing a similar approach to the Italian games would be the right idea. At home I think we would need to set the game to a high tempo to start with. Even though McGeady and Duff dont have as much end product (crossing) as I'd like I think them running at the French full backs could generate set pieces for us. It's likely thei full backs will be a combination of Evra, Clichy, Abidal, Squillaci. These are reasonable players but they are not brilliant at tracking back and defending. Similarly the center backs will probably be Gallas and Escude, looking at some of their previous games a big physical striker might cause the French problems (Zigic of Serbia certainly did) so having the option of throwing Folan on might be good. The French goalkeeper is (in fact all of the seeded goalkeepers are) a weak link. Mandanda and Llloris are not anything like as good as Coupet. Llloris has a tendancy to rush out and either conceed a pk or get lobbed, Mandanda is not good at positioning and often is making last gasp dashes back to tip shots over. Ribery and Gourcouff are the danger men but if we can be disiplined and tell our full backs to stay tight would could restrict them. Henry is a danger upfront but Domenech doesnt seem to rate Benzema and plays Gignac and Babfemi Gomis instead, they are ineffectual and this is good news for us. Domench could be our saviour, there was a feeling that the French were finished 4 years ago but Zidane galvinised the dressing room and performed heroics on the pitch, without him they've stuttered and stumbled across in most matches. We have a real chance against the French and I'm confident Trap will play an effective system should we play them.

Against the Portuguese we would need Ronaldo's injury to keep him out of the first game (seems likely) and restrict his mobility in the second. Should this happen we would need to keep shackles on Simao. Danny is badly out of form at Zenit and we should be able to contain Deco (not the force he was at Barca) and Nani. Eduardo, Beto and Quim are all poor keepers and again the wing backs are very attacking (Pepe, Bosingwa etc). They can be beaten tactically, as Sweden and Denmark proved i know Sweden drew 0-0 in each game but that was down to profilgate finishing rather than good Portuguese defence.

Russia would be a game of immense magnitude. Hiddink would be a much tougher match for Trap than the other 2 coaches discussed. Arshavin in the finest player amongst the play off teams (esp given Ronaldo is now probably missing for at least one of the games). Strikers like Pogrebnyak have a lot of pace and are monsters in the air. Their wingers (Torbinsky, Denisov - sometimes operates on the wing, Shemshov and Bystrov) have pace and tricks in abundance. Dzagoev is a very creative player and always tracks back. In the holding, defensive role, they can play Semak or Zyrianov, both of whom are very good at reading the ebb and flow of a game - they have a knack of making that deadly run into the box at just the right time. If there is a weakness to Russia it's at the back, the Berezuitski twins and Sergei Ignashevitch are strong hardmen but they are prone to lapses, Kolodin is probably their best center back but even then there is a mistake in him. Akinfeev is inconsitent one day superb the next prone to the occasional error (like Baku the other night), I'd like to see the likes of Whelan and Duffer try him from long distance to test him out early on. Russia would the game I would dread, but sometimes you have to climb the mountain early on.

[tetsujin1979]

wonderful post cfdh_edmundo
well researched, thought out and backed up.

[Emmet7]

That game finished 1-1. You might be thinking of Andy O'Brien's goal that beat them 1-0. But Figo wasn't in that game
We drew 0-0 and lost 1-0. Repeat those results and we're out

Yes we have. Once. In 6 encounters.
And we've never beaten them in a competitive game.

The 1974 3-0 win was a competitive match. And while it's a long time ago, hopefully it will inspire the current crop of players.

If the Irish management team are worth their salt they will be studying videos of previous games of the team they are playing and identify their weaknesses and vulnerabilities.

[Duggie]

interesting view from the french media

http://soccerrepublic.eircom.net/News/Press-Review-France.aspx

[Drumcondra 69er]

Yes we have. Once. In 6 encounters.
And we've never beaten them in a competitive game.

Beat them as the USSR 1-0 at Lansdowne in 84. Mickey Walsh scored a cracker.

[endabob1]

Great post cfdh_edmundo;

I like the optomism for France & I agree that they are badly managed and less than the sum of their parts, that said Henry & Benzema are match winners on their own, as we seen in Lansdowne when we looked pretty comfortable, 1 chance and it's good night. Can we contain them for 180 minutes..probably not, can we score twice... possibly...
Similar for Portugal but they appear to have found their form at the right/wrong time, I can't see us winning over 2 legs. Russia would be a disaster, infact basically if we don't get Greece I will be writing off our chances.

[Den Perry]

Great post cfdh_edmundo;

I like the optomism for France & I agree that they are badly managed and less than the sum of their parts, that said Henry & Benzema are match winners on their own, as we seen in Lansdowne when we looked pretty comfortable, 1 chance and it's good night. Can we contain them for 180 minutes..probably not, can we score twice... possibly...
Similar for Portugal but they appear to have found their form at the right/wrong time, I can't see us winning over 2 legs. Russia would be a disaster, infact basically if we don't get Greece I will be writing off our chances.


what exactly has Domenech done to be labelled a c*** manager?

Wasn't he in charge when they got to the last World Cup Final?. I'm not saying he's not s hite but what's gone on?

[bennocelt]

what exactly has Domenech done to be labelled a c*** manager?

Wasn't he in charge when they got to the last World Cup Final?. I'm not saying he's not s hite but what's gone on?

You dont watch much international football then:(

[Closed Account 2]

His squad/team selection is bit bizzare. Benzema has only started both Austria matches and the home match vs Serbia, apart from that he's just been a sub, coming on in the last 15 mins home to Romania, (Gignac started that match), sub in both games with Lithuana (Luyindula was starting). Ribery was benched for the Faeroes (away) and Romania (away) matches. I would guess most coaches would play these players if they were in charge of France. He doesnt seem to have the ability to change things if France are struggling, I know they came back from 2 down in Bucharest to draw with Romania and 1 down to draw wither Serbia in Belgrade, I didnt see the former but watched the latter and France never really changed their rythm and were very lucky to get a 1-1 draw, by all accounts it was the same in Romania.

There are also reports of problems with the players (http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/internationals/henry-turns-on-domenech-1783437.html) also the French press was saying there are problems between him and Diarra / Real Madrid over releasing players. I think he is poor coach who makes bizzare decisions, and only the strength of the squad has saved hime so far, France have enough quality to put in a good performance despite being hamstrung by Domenech, but I would argue that Italy are significantly stronger and we matched them so there is no reason why we should be too fearful of the French.

[Den Perry]

His squad/team selection is bit bizzare. Benzema has only started both Austria matches and the home match vs Serbia, apart from that he's just been a sub, coming on in the last 15 mins home to Romania, (Gignac started that match), sub in both games with Lithuana (Luyindula was starting). Ribery was benched for the Faeroes (away) and Romania (away) matches. I would guess most coaches would play these players if they were in charge of France. He doesnt seem to have the ability to change things if France are struggling, I know they came back from 2 down in Bucharest to draw with Romania and 1 down to draw wither Serbia in Belgrade, I didnt see the former but watched the latter and France never really changed their rythm and were very lucky to get a 1-1 draw, by all accounts it was the same in Romania.

There are also reports of problems with the players (http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/internationals/henry-turns-on-domenech-1783437.html) also the French press was saying there are problems between him and Diarra / Real Madrid over releasing players. I think he is poor coach who makes bizzare decisions, and only the strength of the squad has saved hime so far, France have enough quality to put in a good performance despite being hamstrung by Domenech, but I would argue that Italy are significantly stronger and we matched them so there is no reason why we should be too fearful of the French.


thanks for that Edmundo.

[paul_oshea]

whatever about swine flu, if we draw russia and we get chestikov we could be in a seriouslly bad way.

[tetsujin1979]

Beat them as the USSR 1-0 at Lansdowne in 84. Mickey Walsh scored a cracker.


The 1974 3-0 win was a competitive match. And while it's a long time ago, hopefully it will inspire the current crop of players.
sorry guys, I was going on this page on soccerscene:
Results VS Russia: http://www.soccerscene.ie/sssenior/opponent.php?opp=42

but I should have included this page as well
Results VS USSR: http://www.soccerscene.ie/sssenior/opponent.php?opp=44

Overall our record vs Russia/Soviet Union/USSR/Glorious Communist Paradise Under The Benevolent Rule Of Beloved Leader Lenin reads
Played 13
Won 4
Drawn 3
Lost 6

[paul_oshea]

Press Review: France
08:21, 16 Oct 2009
Mark Rodden


The French press have been focusing on their possible play-off opponents ever since the country’s slim hopes of catching Serbia were ended last Saturday.

In reality though, France will have been thinking about November’s matches after their 1-1 draw in Serbia in September, a result which left them four points off the group leaders with two games to play.

However, that scoreline doesn’t tell the full story. According to both the players and the media, the week of their double-header against Romania and Serbia represented a massive turning point for the team.

Shortly before their game in Serbia, Le Parisien newspaper reported that during a team meeting before the 1-1 draw with Romania at the Stade de France, Thierry Henry had strongly criticized the French manager Raymond Domenech.

Just a few days later, Henry turned out to be France’s saviour in Belgrade. After watching his side go a goal and a man down within 10 minutes, the Barcelona striker scored his 50th goal for his country to drag France level. That weekend’s L’Equipe Magazine told how “the captain saved his coach” and said that “the real boss” was Henry, not Domenech.

By salvaging a point with a stirring, backs-to-the-wall performance, France had more or less assured themselves of a place in the play-offs – something that would have been far from certain had they lost. It was a game that saw a fragile but undoubtedly talented French side rediscover their confidence, self-belief and swagger. A team-defining moment similar to… their 1-0 defeat of Ireland in 2005.

All that serves to give an idea of why France are suddenly confident of qualifying for the World Cup, despite a largely uninspiring campaign that saw them lose in Austria early on and barely scrape past Lithuania on two occasions.

“Les Bleus are good to go” read the headline in French sports daily L’Equipe on Thursday, after France’s comfortable 3-1 win over Austria in Paris. “The fine win against Austria yesterday confirms the revival of a French team that will be big favourites in the play-offs,” it continued.

In Monday’s edition, Vincent Duluc had already been busy running the rule over France’s possible rivals. “The worst draw would probably be to meet Ireland, with the second leg in Dublin,” he wrote. “Without doubt the best draw would be Slovakia or Slovenia, with the second leg taking place in the Stade de France.”

Further on in his more detailed analysis of each of opponent, Duluc had this to say about Giovanni Trapattoni’s side: “Not everything is rational when it comes to Ireland. There’s the imagery of a night at Croke Park, some intense moments forecast, the prospect of seeing the Stade de France taken over by Irish supporters, and there is a little bit of superstition linked to the curse that comes when anything Italian faces Raymond Domenech. And the Irish manager is “Trap”, Michel Platini’s former coach.”

Aside from the external influences, Duluc also had praise for the current crop of Irish players.“The Irish are all the more difficult to play against because, as well as their extra athletic power, their passing ability is better than they may have shown in the 20th century. (Excuse me, Liam Brady)”


He obviouslly hasn't seen us play. We cant pass the ball at all!!

[Duggie]

nice to see the french worrying about us. everyone is in the same boat for the play offs.

[finbarrk]

whatever about swine flu, if we draw russia and we get chestikov we could be in a seriouslly bad way.
Whats chestikov?

[Duggie]

Whats chestikov?

it kinda like arshavincoughvvvvv

[irishfan86]

I've been reading some articles on Queiroz, and it seems that he's been mixing and matching throughout the campaign, and never really settled on his best team (over 40 players called up in all). In addition, it seems that he has been playing players in positions that are unfamiliar for them (defenders in midfield, wingers as forwards, centre-mids as wingers, etc.).

Now, despite this, they may have the quality to beat us, but looking at the teams so far, it seems to me:

Portugal: Poor manager, good individuals, poor team.
Russia: Top manager, decent individuals, good team.
France: Poor manager, good individuals, poor team.
Greece: Top manager, poor individuals, average team.

I think each team has its weak points, and even if we go up against Portugal or France, we'll have a chance with Trap at the helm. We've seen he can go toe to toe with Lippi with a much weaker pool of players to choose from, so I think this playoff situation is really where having a manager like Trap is going to be very important.

[seanfhear]

Would'nt it be nice to knock out one of those big names that Sepp Blatter is trying so hard to keep in.

[Duggie]

Would'nt it be nice to knock out one of those big names that Sepp Blatter is trying so hard to keep in.

ya all the top seeds id love to see knocked out. sicken them.