View Full Version : Portugal, Greece, France or Russia
SuperDave
12/10/2009, 3:57 PM
I'm trying to forget Greece are in the draw, because we won't get the most favorable of the bunch. Preparing for France, Portugal, or Russia. If there's a consensus so far it seems to be to avoid Russia. Then again, Russia could be the least experienced of the "big 3."
Without Ronaldo I'd probably say Portugal. With him, hard to choose between Portugal and a talented yet underperforming French side. Will the playoffs turn out to be the straw that breaks Domenech's back or, like Italy, will they turn it on just enough to get over the finish line?
I've butterflies already thinking about the draw, nevermind the ties. Going to be a long month of anticipation. Soak it in boys, cuz there's a lot of countries around the world would give their right arm to be in our boots, and that was us 4 years ago!! Very grateful we have a playoff to direct our attention to, really takes the edge off that bloody equalizer.
Surely they would work better if the gloves were off the other foot?
Arnold Layne
12/10/2009, 4:24 PM
i can't afford russia, but any of the other three i'll do.
Getting to Russia isn't that expensive. You'll get flights there for 250-300. Do you think you'll get a flight to France or Portugal for that price should Ireland get there?
The Visa cost and hassle adds to it though, but if they lift that for this game it won't be as expensive as you might think.
noddy102
12/10/2009, 4:58 PM
can someone tell me what date the playoff draw will be taking place??
http://foot.ie/forums/showpost.php?p=1247819&postcount=40
L37Ultra
12/10/2009, 5:05 PM
Over two legs I am 100% confident of beating any of the sides that could possibly finish 2nd in the other groups.
My first point would be, if they were anything to seriously fear then they would have finished top of their respective groups.
Secondly, we are unbeaten in our group so far and over two legs Trappatoni should have his team organised to bring a good side to at least extratime in the second leg.
magnumpi
12/10/2009, 5:28 PM
Getting to Russia isn't that expensive. You'll get flights there for 250-300. Do you think you'll get a flight to France or Portugal for that price should Ireland get there?
The Visa cost and hassle adds to it though, but if they lift that for this game it won't be as expensive as you might think.
FRANCE - not an issue, i live in paris.
PORTUGAL - i imagine there'll be cheap flights
GREECE - easyjet fly to athens, probably get a return for 100/150.
RUSSIA - have looked at Moscow from Paris, minimum 500 return. maybe i'm looking in the wrong places.
holidaysong
12/10/2009, 5:38 PM
I really hope Switzerland don't mess up against Israel on Wednesday night and end up in the playoffs instead of Greece.. I'm sure none of us want to see the Swiss for a long long time!
Arnold Layne
12/10/2009, 5:42 PM
Don't know about Paris, but from Dublin - Moscow for the dates of the second leg the cost is 261.31
Sure you could drive from Paris to Moscow ;)
dynamo kerry
12/10/2009, 8:20 PM
Don't know about Paris, but from Dublin - Moscow for the dates of the second leg the cost is 261.31
Sure you could drive from Paris to Moscow ;)
it's been tried.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_invasion_of_Russia
Razors left peg
12/10/2009, 9:55 PM
I really hope Switzerland don't mess up against Israel on Wednesday night and end up in the playoffs instead of Greece.. I'm sure none of us want to see the Swiss for a long long time!
Well if it was a posibility that the Swiss would be one of the top 4 seeds I would love to get them.I will never forget being out in Dublin after the nil nil draw which meant that they made the playoff ahead of us.Their fans were the most miserable bunch Ive ever come across anywhere.There didnt seem to be any emotion from them at all and I remember thinking at the time (while severely depressed and having consumed a number light ales) that I couldnt imagine a bunch of fans that were so undeserving of success. I said to my mates at the time that if we had beaten them they would have been acting in exactly the same manner so Id like to test if my theory is true:)
Closed Account 2
12/10/2009, 9:58 PM
I really hope Switzerland don't mess up against Israel on Wednesday night and end up in the playoffs instead of Greece.. I'm sure none of us want to see the Swiss for a long long time!
Au contraire mon ami! Few things in life would give me more pleasure than giving them the mother of all hidings. I would have to be sedated if we drew them as I would derive so much joy from a victory against them. They are a poor side, beaten by Luxembourg at home in a result that will live long in the memory (well my memory anyway) we would have nothing to fear from them except nepotism from FIFA/UEFA in terms of refs.
Feech
12/10/2009, 10:03 PM
Au contraire mon ami! Few things in life would give me more pleasure than giving them the mother of all hidings. I would have to be sedated if we drew them as I would derive so much joy from a victory against them. They are a poor side, beaten by Luxembourg at home in a result that will live long in the memory (well my memory anyway) we would have nothing to fear from them except nepotism from FIFA/UEFA in terms of refs.
A poor side which beat Greece twice this campaign...
Closed Account 2
12/10/2009, 10:16 PM
They were probably the poorest side in the weakest Euro 2008 group*, being defeated by Czechs and Turkey and only winning the dead rubber match with an already progressed Portugal. Pretty dire in the previous competitve match before Euro 2008, 0-0 with the Ukraine in Cologne and missing all of their penalties. Even in this campaign they've drawn away in Israel and Latvia, I'd say they are probably a touch poorer than Greece and would grab them with both hands if we got the chance to be drawn against them in the play offs.
*Austria, France and Greece ran them close too but at least they had harder groups.
craig7042
12/10/2009, 11:15 PM
thanks... hope its a home tie for the second leg in croker... Don't care who we have then because no team in that play off will put day light between themselves and us in the first leg.
Absolutely. A second leg at home is the priority for me. Bring it on!
newrynyuk
12/10/2009, 11:16 PM
Weighing up the options in terms of probability of victory and ease of travel, I'd hope we get Portugal just ahead of France.
The Portuguese will struggle without Him. Their recent revival has come against weak sides after failing to get the better of Denmark and Sweden. And it's been mentioned somewhere the curse of the 3rd/4th Place Play-off will keep them out of the 2010 finals. So long as we don't concede last minute goals again, we can win this.
Getting to Portugal won't be too hard either, but France would be better in terms of travel. Another 30,000+ at the Stade de France for sure and I can see French parallels with the Dutch team of 2001; Some of the best players in the world, but not playing together as a unit, coming up against an organised Irish side.
As pretty much everyone has pointed out, Russia is the team to avoid. Yes they lost twice against Germany, but were unlucky to do so. Plus they won all their other matches. Getting visas will be a nightmare. Moscow in November on a plastic pitch will be grim. And it's the most expensive city in the world. And seem to recall some Irish fans being beaten up by Russian gangs in 2002?
Greenforever
12/10/2009, 11:48 PM
As pretty much everyone has pointed out, Russia is the team to avoid. Yes they lost twice against Germany, but were unlucky to do so. Plus they won all their other matches. Getting visas will be a nightmare. Moscow in November on a plastic pitch will be grim. And it's the most expensive city in the world. And seem to recall some Irish fans being beaten up by Russian gangs in 2002?
Moscow in 2002 was an experience alright.
The night before the match ended up drinking with local down and outs at a chip van and had great crack, fantastic tour of Red Sq the day of the match and returned to our hotel to find out a gang of skinheads had attacked a group of Irish fans (men in their 60s) INSIDE the hotel.
Trying to get taxis after the match was a disaster like Xmas in Dublin prederegulation, and that was after been held back for almost an hour by the Russian cops.
The day after the match we couldnt leave our hotel due to the smog and then chaos at the airport where fans were fined for their Visas having expired ( the Visas were due to expire that night but as the Russian Cops said your Visa will have expired before you leave if you dont pay!!)
And it was cold in September
Closed Account 2
13/10/2009, 1:07 AM
It will have improved since then, but I would advise caution at all times. Wearing team colours is a bit risky on the way to and from the ground. Nine times out of ten there will be no problems, but there are real problems with gangs of feral youths who think every Western European football fan is a cross between Danny Dyer and Ray Winstone. Also, especially amongst the youth, there isn't an understanding that Ireland and England are different countries - much in the way young people here mightnt understand that there is a difference between say Belarus and the Ukraine.
It's well worth avoiding the cops, even Moscovites strive to avoid them. There are special tourist police who speak English (sort of) now, and they have only introduced them recently. If you get hassle off them (and I never have despite being there a few times) your best bet is to say "Jah pozvohnyu posol-stvo Irlandii" - I will call the embassy.
If there are groups of you staying all in the same hotel arrange for a coach pick up and wait, most hotels can arrange this. Taxis are bizzare there, most people hail local traffic (it's the done thing). You could walk to the Luzhniki from Central Moscow, it's a fine walk along the river takes about 1 hour at a slowish pace, but on a November evening that would be suicide. Also what ever you do, don't get totally wasted - if you want to do that stay in the hotel, or have at least 2-3 people in the group who will stay sober. Every year a lot of (well some) tourists die by getting drunk then lost, then not being able to speak the language and ask for directions / taxi etc. Sitting on a bench at night can mean you never wake up due to the cold. Write down the cyrillic address of where you are staying on bits of paper so you can give it to a taxi driver if you are stuck (get front desk to do this).
Some people say it's cheaper to fly to Eastern Europe (Tallinn, Kiev, Riga) etc and get a night train to Moscow, probably true but its more hassle and aviod going thru Belarus or you will need another visa (in advance) to transit.
Put the in date on your visa 1-2 days before you intend to travel (to avoid a mess in case there are problems with flights) and exit date 3-4 days after you intend to leave.
If anyone has questions or needs (bad) translations for phrases let me know and I'll try and help. You need health insurance to go into Russia, sometimes they check - not too often - and usually you can show them a debit credit card and say it has health over. If you have any illness (like diabetes, or are on anti biotics) get the relevant medical words in cyrillic.
Also in terms of expense it's not that bad, just try and keep outside of the inner metro ring as beyond there stuff is cheaper.
mypost
13/10/2009, 3:00 AM
Moscow in 2002 was an experience alright.
The night before the match ended up drinking with local down and outs at a chip van and had great crack, fantastic tour of Red Sq the day of the match and returned to our hotel to find out a gang of skinheads had attacked a group of Irish fans (men in their 60s) INSIDE the hotel.
Trying to get taxis after the match was a disaster like Xmas in Dublin prederegulation, and that was after been held back for almost an hour by the Russian cops.
The day after the match we couldnt leave our hotel due to the smog and then chaos at the airport where fans were fined for their Visas having expired ( the Visas were due to expire that night but as the Russian Cops said your Visa will have expired before you leave if you dont pay!!)
And it was cold in September
Moscow was an experience, but in fairness 25c minimum during that weekend wasn't cold. It was a good deal warmer than here.
Managed to avoid all the aggro in the city, but then again, I didn't wear any colours except at match time.
You're probably right though on the visa scandal.
They were probably the poorest side in the weakest Euro 2008 group*, being defeated by Czechs and Turkey and only winning the dead rubber match with an already progressed Portugal. Pretty dire in the previous competitve match before Euro 2008, 0-0 with the Ukraine in Cologne and missing all of their penalties. Even in this campaign they've drawn away in Israel and Latvia, I'd say they are probably a touch poorer than Greece and would grab them with both hands if we got the chance to be drawn against them in the play offs.
*Austria, France and Greece ran them close too but at least they had harder groups.
In other words they finished with 3 times more points than France at Euro 08 and also shared in the Silver Boot. While in the previous World Cup they became the first team ever to go out while undefeated. (That same tournament they won as many games as Ireland ever have in 3 World Cup participations, finishing top of their group).
But your most bizarre statement has to be that they are poorer than Greece, a team they beat home and away and are currently 3 points clear of...
Stuttgart88
13/10/2009, 7:08 AM
I see Feech is back with his persecution complex. Welcome back.
mypost
13/10/2009, 7:24 AM
From a travelling point of view, Switzerland would be a good bit better than Greece, so getting them would be a good draw, and for the football as well.
endabob1
13/10/2009, 8:27 AM
In other words they finished with 3 times more points than France at Euro 08 and also shared in the Silver Boot. While in the previous World Cup they became the first team ever to go out while undefeated. (That same tournament they won as many games as Ireland ever have in 3 World Cup participations, finishing top of their group).
But your most bizarre statement has to be that they are poorer than Greece, a team they beat home and away and are currently 3 points clear of...
Sorry to be a pedantic ar$e but Cameroon went out in 82 undefeated 3 draws with Italy, Poland & Peru. They went out to eventual finalists Italy on goals scored.
Stuttgart88
13/10/2009, 8:41 AM
Switzerland would be interesting opposition just as a real test of our improvement since they got the better of us under Kerr.
magnumpi
13/10/2009, 9:14 AM
Switzerland would be interesting opposition just as a real test of our improvement since they got the better of us under Kerr.
2 trips to basle is quite enough thanks.
ok, we have improved massively, but still.
lets hope luxembourg do greece and israel get into the play-offs, now they are sh1te, and are a team that we truly deserve revenge over.
Kingdom
13/10/2009, 10:03 AM
Erm, didn't we go out of WC2002 undefeated?
eaststand85
13/10/2009, 10:15 AM
Erm, didn't we go out of WC2002 undefeated?
And Euro '92 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UEFA_Euro_1992_qualifying_Group_7)
Tipp Townie
13/10/2009, 10:16 AM
The record the Swiss set at WC 2006 was the first team to ever go out without conceding a goal.
Tipp Townie
13/10/2009, 10:20 AM
lets hope luxembourg do greece and israel get into the play-offs, now they are sh1te, and are a team that we truly deserve revenge over.
I just had a look at the current world rankings - when did Israel get so high?! They're currently at 22nd.:eek:
I was going to suggest that, were Greece to fall by the wayside, Ukraine would have a decent chance of becoming the 4th seed, but now i'm not so sure.
Probably totally irrelevant though, virtually no chance of Luxembourg beating Greece. So maybe i should just stop rambling on now..:o
Drumcondra 69er
13/10/2009, 10:26 AM
Sorry to be a pedantic ar$e but Cameroon went out in 82 undefeated 3 draws with Italy, Poland & Peru. They went out to eventual finalists Italy on goals scored.
Pretty sure Scotland went out in 74 undefeated as well with 2 draws and a win. Missed out by a goal to Brazil on goal difference.
Yard of Pace
13/10/2009, 10:37 AM
Switzerland would be interesting opposition just as a real test of our improvement since they got the better of us under Kerr.
They beat Greece twice. I'd rather our improvement was tested at the WC next summer and we play Greece instead!
geysir
13/10/2009, 10:41 AM
It's fantasy talk about Switzerland being in the play offs.
Still, it might be a good game if the Israelis get a goal
Polster
13/10/2009, 10:57 AM
Absolutely. A second leg at home is the priority for me. Bring it on!
Personally I'd prefer a 1st leg at home. Get a 1 goal lead and hang on for dear life away. We are well accustomed to picking up 'credible' draws away to top teams - Holland, France, Italy
back of the net
13/10/2009, 12:20 PM
Sorry all - if this was posted already - i just didnt want to go through all the prev posts - comment from arshavin:
"It is a pity Greece is one of the seeded teams. Talking about our possible opponents I can say that I have enough of British football that is why I don’t want to meet Ireland."
Duggie
13/10/2009, 12:54 PM
Personally I'd prefer a 1st leg at home. Get a 1 goal lead and hang on for dear life away. We are well accustomed to picking up 'credible' draws away to top teams - Holland, France, Italy
it all depends. id prefer the 1st leg at home aswell only if we dont concede an away goal. even a 0-0 is ok and try and get the away goal yourself in the 2nd leg. if were at home 2nd and havent managed to get an away goal then it could be curtains.
Closed Account 2
13/10/2009, 1:08 PM
Sorry all - if this was posted already - i just didnt want to go through all the prev posts - comment from arshavin:
"It is a pity Greece is one of the seeded teams. Talking about our possible opponents I can say that I have enough of British football that is why I dont want to meet Ireland."
I think ourselves (maybe along with Bosnia) will be the two unseeded teams that France, Russia, Greece/Swiss and Portugal want want to play. I'm sure they will be hoping for a match vs Slovenia/Slovakia.
Kingdom
13/10/2009, 2:08 PM
Yes Slovenia Slovakia would be the draw the big boys would want.
I'm not sure they'd be crapping themselves at the prospect of facing us over two legs, but they'd prefer it less to the Slovenians I'm sure.
Under the system Trap plays I think we would be best playing Greece or France. Portugal on their day can be very good and I dont think our system would work so well against them. I know they havent played well recently but over a two legged play off they just have way too many skillful individuals and our record isnt great against them either.
France have a strong team but I think we could frustrate them and their manager. I certainly would back Trap to win the tactical battle there.
Greece, for obvious reasons the poorest of the four, but somehow I think we perform better against teams that we are the obvious underdogs. I think the games against Greece would be dour but who cares if we get through.
Russia, the away trip would be tough, I would be fearful of Arshavin. They looked quite impressive at Euro 2008, although a bit porous at the back. If we could come away from Moscow undefeated then we would have a chance. Id def prefer to play the first leg away in this tie over any other of the potential ties.
I do not want Russia....MY PREDICTION IS WE GET RUSSIA
Arnold Layne
13/10/2009, 5:07 PM
We won't get Greece, Ukraine will. Sepp won't won't to risk Ukraine coming up against France, Portugal or Russia.
Feech
13/10/2009, 10:12 PM
I see Feech is back with his persecution complex. Welcome back.
Thank you. Good to see you respond so thoughfully and intelligently to the points raised.
(Apologies for getting the undefeated thing messed up, the corrected version sounds even better though!)
Closed Account 2
13/10/2009, 11:44 PM
They didnt conceed a goal in the World Cup by playing the most negative football I've ever seen - and I've seen 2nd division matches in Armenia. It was a total misery to watch them stagnate every game they played in, a trait which they resumed at Euro 2008. I think Benaglio is a good keeper but apart from that I would fear no one in their squad. If Luxemburg can beat them 2-1 away we should relish the chance to dish out revenge should it arise. They are reeling out Hakan Yakin again at 32 and with dodgy knees, he can only last about 45 mins.
mypost
14/10/2009, 12:17 AM
Russia, the away trip would be tough, If we could come away from Moscow undefeated then we would have a chance. Id def prefer to play the first leg away in this tie over any other of the potential ties.
Wales thought that too in 2003. Having got a draw in Moscow, they lost the return leg.
Football wise, they aren't that fearful, they've just come out of a much easier group than ours. Climate and travel wise, presents a far more difficult challenge.
I still hate playoffs though, not just in the WC, but in every competition. It should be the top 2 guaranteed qualification in European groups, finishing in November. If it means bigger groups, that's fine.
They didnt conceed a goal in the World Cup by playing the most negative football I've ever seen - and I've seen 2nd division matches in Armenia. It was a total misery to watch them stagnate every game they played in, a trait which they resumed at Euro 2008. I think Benaglio is a good keeper but apart from that I would fear no one in their squad. If Luxemburg can beat them 2-1 away we should relish the chance to dish out revenge should it arise. They are reeling out Hakan Yakin again at 32 and with dodgy knees, he can only last about 45 mins.
I'd balance that though by saying the football under Charlton was terrible stuff to watch too, and is a period most people on here hark back to.
Yakin only plays a minor role these days but is still a very good player. You'll find the majority of the others play in a top European league, it wouldn't do to dismiss them so quickly - esp. based on past results!
Anyway, hopefully the Swiss will qualify tonight and Ireland will meet Greece....
endabob1
14/10/2009, 7:16 AM
I thought the FIFA seeding meant the seeds would be at home in the second leg, to gain an advantage if it was to go to extra-time?
irishfan86
14/10/2009, 7:20 AM
I thought the FIFA seeding meant the seeds would be at home in the second leg, to gain an advantage if it was to go to extra-time?
No, it's a separate draw to determine the home/away order.
Wales thought that too in 2003. Having got a draw in Moscow, they lost the return leg.
Football wise, they aren't that fearful, they've just come out of a much easier group than ours. Climate and travel wise, presents a far more difficult challenge.
I still hate playoffs though, not just in the WC, but in every competition. It should be the top 2 guaranteed qualification in European groups, finishing in November. If it means bigger groups, that's fine.
I think Russia is the worst possible draw. Ireland get through games with tenacity, this doesn't count for much when you are playing a more skilled team who are as tenacious.
Closed Account 2
14/10/2009, 4:19 PM
Russia match vs Azeris in Baku now on
http://www.fromsport.com/video-93058.html
DeLorean
14/10/2009, 4:33 PM
I think you may have been Russian in a previous life Edmundo:D
Closed Account 2
14/10/2009, 4:59 PM
maybe... who knows...
anyway they are 1-0 up playing a sort of half way team (some full players some youth ones) have looked in control... Arshavin scored
Semak is back - for Denisov, and their ball rention in midfield has been very solid. They've thrown Dzagoev (set up goal for Arshavin via the post), Rebko and Bilyaletdinov into the starting 11 and their pace (with Bystrovs too) has been causing problems for the Azeris.
Yanbaev has been booked, not sure if he has prevous yellows, prob not as he's a bit part player for the national team.
Closed Account 2
14/10/2009, 5:22 PM
1-1 Azeri's have equalised, utter howler from the Russian keeper Akinfeev, the ball did bounce before reaching him but he still should have got it.
Closed Account 2
14/10/2009, 5:56 PM
Ukraine are confirmed as through, so that resolves the potential issue of Croatia overtaking Portugal in the table of the top seeds in the playoffs
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