Hoops face new crisis [Archive]

View Full Version : Hoops face new crisis

Ringo

17/02/2004, 6:52 AM

HAVING being denied a return to Richmond Park and Tolka Park already for the forthcoming season, Shamrock Rovers look like being rejected a third time as the Bohemians committee meet to consider the ramifications of accepting the Hoops as tenants in Dalymount Park.

Rovers are believed to have approached Dublin City, who have secured a deal with Shelbourne to use Tolka Park, about the possibility of swapping landlords. That would mean City playing their home games at Dalymount instead of Tolka, and so allowing the Hoops pitch tent in Drumcondra again.

It is believed that Dublin City might agree to this suggestion if they are offered some financial compensation.

Macy

17/02/2004, 8:14 AM

Ringo, if your doing a copy and paste job, tell us where it's from and stick in a link....

Ringo

17/02/2004, 10:48 AM

normally do, forgot, please forgive me.
Link won't work onless your registered
© Irish Independent
http://www.unison.ie/irish_independent/stories.php3?ca=94&si=1128459&issue_id=10458&printer=1

Robinski

17/02/2004, 10:48 AM

Macy, it's from the Indo.

Ringo

17/02/2004, 10:53 AM

do you want rovers at Dalymount?

Ringo

17/02/2004, 11:01 AM

From Bohs website.

http://www.bohemians.ie/news.htm#Members%20Meeting:::16/02/04

The Long Bar in Dalymount was tonight the venue for an emotive meeting between the members and the Board of Directors of the Bohemian FC. The main item of discussion was the proposed groundshare of Dalymount with other interested parties, including Shamrock Rovers, Dublin city and an unnamed Junior club who only came into the picture today.

In the end members gave their permission for the Board to discuss the matter further with all interested parties. A decision will be made in the next couple of days.

It should be pointed out that Dublin City have a deal for Tolka, we aren't looking to go to Dalymount. Rovers are the one with the problem.

Robinski

17/02/2004, 11:08 AM

Originally posted by Ringo
do you want rovers at Dallymount?

I'll assume that's directed at me, this is going to open a can of worms.

It's a tough one to call. Financially, any paying club should be welcome. But the recent trouble at Bohs v Rovers matches tells me that it's not really a good idea.

There are all sorts of hypothetical deals being talked about at the moment in relation to this but realistically the security issue is a huge factor.

Ringo

17/02/2004, 11:22 AM

Originally posted by Robinski
I'll assume that's directed at me, this is going to open a can of worms.

It's a tough one to call. Financially, any paying club should be welcome. But the recent trouble at Bohs v Rovers matches tells me that it's not really a good idea.

There are all sorts of hypothetical deals being talked about at the moment in relation to this but realistically the security issue is a huge factor.

There's a spin being put on this at the moment that Dublin City won't move aside and let Rovers into Tolka. Bohs & Pat's are right to be cautious of letting Rovers in, because of past behaviour of fans. Rovers have no one to blame for this but themselves. Why should Dublin City move?

Robinski

17/02/2004, 11:41 AM

Originally posted by Ringo
There's a spin being put on this at the moment that Dublin City won't move aside and let Rovers into Tolka. Bohs & Pat's are right to be cautious of letting Rovers in, because of past behaviour of fans. Rovers have no one to blame for this but themselves. Why should Dublin City move?

I agree, why should they move? Their deal is done.

The only reason I can think of is again the security one. Rovers won't cause trouble at Tolka but more than likely will at Dalymount. Dublin City won't cause trouble anywhere.

My guess is that the eL administrators/FAI are looking at this from a point of view of damage control.

Macy

17/02/2004, 11:42 AM

Ringo

17/02/2004, 5:53 PM

Its official. Dublin City are not moving from Tolka.

Juz the Hoop

18/02/2004, 10:03 AM

Oh its all rovers fault.

I dont want us to move into Dalymount. Any Rovers fan Ive talked to doesnt but to say that its just rovers fans who cause trouble is ridiculous. If we were to move there there would be trouble but Bohs fans would cause it also. i dont want to open a can of worms here but this must be said.

Nah Dublin City dont have to move and why should they but if they want to be accepted in this league (I dont have a problem with them a lot do) then surely it would make more sense to co-operate with the other clubs as 3 clubs were willing to do this. This may come back to haunt Dublin City

KOH

JUZ

Candystripe

18/02/2004, 10:17 AM

Whats the craic with Tallaght?

Sorry, I've been out of the loop for a while.

Ringo

18/02/2004, 10:18 AM

Originally posted by Juz the Hoop
Oh its all rovers fault.

Nah Dublin City dont have to move and why should they but if they want to be accepted in this league (I dont have a problem with them a lot do) then surely it would make more sense to co-operate with the other clubs as 3 clubs were willing to do this. This may come back to haunt Dublin City

KOH

JUZ

We are in the League & accepted. We have every right to be in the premier leaugue, we won that right.

What are three clubs willing to do? Do Dublin City not have a say in it? Its blame Dublin City, rather than face down their own fans at Boh's or Pat's. Why didn't your club make adeal earlier? You've been moving around the last few years, surely they new their was going to be a problem. I don't see how this could come back to haunt Dublin City.:rolleyes:

Juz the Hoop

18/02/2004, 10:34 AM

Originally posted by Ringo
We are in the League & accepted. We have every right to be in the premier leaugue, we won that right.

What are three clubs willing to do? Do Dublin City not have a say in it? Its blame Dublin City, rather than face down their own fans at Boh's or Pat's. Why didn't your club make adeal earlier? You've been moving around the last few years, surely they new their was going to be a problem. I don't see how this could come back to haunt Dublin City.:rolleyes:

Where did I blame Dublin City? All I said was that out of the 4 clubs 3 were willing to do a deal the only 1 who wasnt were Dublin City thats their perogitive. It could come back to haunt them if they want something done in the future that all. People have long memories in this game at times.

I agree our board should have done something earlier. In fairness Ringo you did win the right but a lot of people are sceptical about Dublin City thats all.

Take a chill pill m8 i was not having a go.

KOH

JUZ

Juz the Hoop

18/02/2004, 11:36 AM

A face

18/02/2004, 12:20 PM

Juz,

I think most people see where you are coming from but your point is being drowned out by the "elements" activities. No matter how much good is done, it is all undone straight away by any incidents that take place.

Going north for games and to Millwall and this kinda of thing, while you might think it is harmless and isn't worth mentioning, most others see it as clandestine and a statement of intent. Again ... it is only a hand full of your support part-taking in these trips but it is that small few that will be spoken about.

You could have 3,000 fans or 30,000 fans all behaving themselves at you home games or where ever but it is the small element that people will give out about. All the normal fans might as well not be there. No one cares about them when everyone is taking about the element.

It is unfair and unbalanced maybe, but that is the way it is.

I have spent a couple of weekends in Dublin recently and have spoken to a few barstoolers and i brought it up (as you do) "Why dont you go across town and support you own ? " ..... "no way man, it is all scumbags and trouble, you'd get the head kicked off you" ..... I could try an argue with them but they are not that interested. They heard the name/label/stigma that it has and just stay away. They dont cast it another thought.

One incident can change five years hard work and that is the truth of it. And there is nothing anyone can do about it. People remember bad news before good.

No trouble IS the only way to go !!

soccerc

18/02/2004, 12:22 PM

Originally posted by Juz the Hoop
Seems to me "SuperKev" if that is YOUR real name that you believe everything you read.

I dont want to get into a tit for tat argument but if you think that the only club that cause trouble is Rovers ud wanna check your facts. We have an undesirable element in our club but so do a lof of clubs. To say that the majority of our fans are scum is way way way off the mark and once again is a genralisation. As for the Milwall thing dont amke me laugh

KOH

JUZ

Juz

My advice for what it's worth is to ignore anything from the keyboard warrior superkev, or for that matter whatever other nickname he chooses to log on under.

Responding to his stupid ill informed, inaccurate views is only going to satisfy his ego and allow him to "push up his post rate".

TommyT

18/02/2004, 4:28 PM

Originally posted by Ringo
(a)We are in the League & accepted. We have every right to be in the premier leaugue, we won that right.
What are three clubs willing to do? Do Dublin City not have a say in it?
(b)Its blame Dublin City, rather than face down their own fans at Boh's or Pat's.
(c)Why didn't your club make adeal earlier? You've been moving around the last few years, surely they new their was going to be a problem.

(d) I don't see how this could come back to haunt Dublin City.:rolleyes:

(a) Juz mean's accepted by supporters. You claim you're no threat to the other clubs support base and traditions but here you are forcing one to the brink. The other three clubs were willing to find allow Dublin City to play in Dalyer and Rovers in Tolka, either makes **** all difference to you TBH.

(b) Easy to say when you've no fans-that's why the rest of us dismiss you as a plastic club-hopefully the footballing public do the same.

(c)They did the FAI blocked it. Also they (unlike your board) are trying to sort out the building of our own ground

(d) I do in votes/goodwill re grants and when your looking for somewhere to play. As mentioned above you won't have a PD standard ground of your own for many moons.

Dr.Nightdub

18/02/2004, 11:08 PM

Originally posted by SuperKev
Well maybe if ye had behaved yourselves in a certain Richmond park, ye wouldnt be in this trouble in the first place. And dont mind coming back with your "its other clubs as well" routine, rovers need to sort out their support. The majority are scum and yere all happy to hide behind yere little scarves on the rovers website and act as some sort of organisation of hooligans. Going over to milwall games etc. Always the hooligan element clubs. Ye make me sick. Go away now with your petty little argument. You have no basis for it whatsoever Juz the Hoop if that is your real name

Once again, for the hard of hearing or for those arriving late like Superkev: Pats agreed to rent Richmond to Rovers up until the end of last September. We decided not to renew the arrangement purely on account of repeated late / non-payment of rent by Rovers. That decision was made BEFORE the Rovers-Bohs match in Richmond, which I think was on 1st September. We just ended up in the queue of people owed money by Rovers, along with their laundrette and their players. Understandably, considering we lost enough money under our own steam last season, our board didn't fancy letting the situation get any worse.

We played Rovers towards the end of September - complete with "Cheerio Homeless, Shut The Door On Your Way Out" banner. You might think that, seeing as they'd been told they were out on their ear and we WERE kinda rubbing their noses in it and they didn't have to mind their Ps and Qs any more, their legions of barbarians, visigoths, vandals and ne'er-do-wells might well have trashed the place in revenge but funnily enough, Richmond was not a heap of smoking rubble at the end of the ninety minutes.

Pats were willing to listen to proposals from Rovers re them coming back to Richmond this season, providing the FAI was willing to pay the rent (and presumably recoup it off Rovers). Again, our board's main concern was getting paid. Rovers board failed to turn up at a meeting that had been scheduled to discuss this proposal. When a Rovers official rang in a panic two days before the licencing results were announced, looking for a meeting that night, he was quite rightly told where to get off.

I'm not saying the prospect of Hooped boogeymen rampaging through Inchicore never occured to anyone, because I know it did figure in the initial discussions with the FAI, but the Richmond door was closed to Rovers because their board are welching idiots. Rovers' nutcase element were just a smokescreen behind which their board could hide their own ineptitude.

EireBadBoy

19/02/2004, 2:53 AM

Therefore, would the fact that WE ALL accept that Rovers Board are the idiots that have gotten such a Club (forgive my ignorance, but I see Rovers as an EL Club of fine Tradition) into such a state not create a bit of a guilt that they are going to the Wall? C'mon!

Cast aside the Millwall, Cardiff blah de blah element!! Underneath that they have a decent Fan base, EL Fans, and we can't ignore it any longer. Most Derry Fan's hate Rovers - although I suspect Harps have taken the heat off any other EL Club recently in those stakes - but I would really hate to see a minority like the EL sit by and watch such a Club go down the drain.

I really do think the League body should step in and organise some way of sorting out the Tallaght patch they have. Bertie himself turned the first Sod!! As scribe after scribe humours themselves on the League and the multiple posts that are posted here one of the Leagues proudest Clubs (Put rivalry aside - accept it!) is going down the Pan!! It's not Funny anymore. Should it be any other Club I would feel the same.

Bertie **** YOU! May the next Sod you see turned turned be your Grave!! You built up the hopes of so many and then do a U Turn that should have made your Muck Savage head spin!!!

Should Rovers be turned away from every Stadium in this Island I hope the last hure that does it knows what they are doing!!!:mad:

Ringo

19/02/2004, 9:50 AM

Originally posted by TommyT
(a) Juz mean's accepted by supporters. You claim you're no threat to the other clubs support base and traditions but here you are forcing one to the brink. The other three clubs were willing to find allow Dublin City to play in Dalyer and Rovers in Tolka, either makes **** all difference to you TBH.

(b) Easy to say when you've no fans-that's why the rest of us dismiss you as a plastic club-hopefully the footballing public do the same.

(c)They did the FAI blocked it. Also they (unlike your board) are trying to sort out the building of our own ground

(d) I do in votes/goodwill re grants and when your looking for somewhere to play. As mentioned above you won't have a PD standard ground of your own for many moons.

a)This ****e of the other clubs were willing to allow Dublin City to play at Dalyer. At no time was Dublin City consulted about this. dublin City had a signed contract to play at Tolka, end of story.
b) Infintile statement, get over youreslf. your fan base is dying not growing.
c)Your board can't even do a deal to rent a ground. Can't see Tallaght ever being built. Oh no i forgot! Brendan o'Carroll's going inject millions into the club. Can't even pay your players.
d)business is business. We'll take our chances.

Juz the Hoop

19/02/2004, 10:25 AM

Originally posted by Ringo
a)This ****e of the other clubs were willing to allow Dublin City to play at Dalyer. At no time was Dublin City consulted about this. dublin City had a signed contract to play at Tolka, end of story.
b) Infintile statement, get over youreslf. your fan base is dying not growing.
c)Your board can't even do a deal to rent a ground. Can't see Tallaght ever being built. Oh no i forgot! Brendan o'Carroll's going inject millions into the club. Can't even pay your players.
d)business is business. We'll take our chances.

Ringo

a) Are you privy to the fact that Dublin City were not consulted. Its not what I heard

b) I suppose DCFC (Or whatever your called this week ;) ) fan base is going through the roof. NO LOI Club can have a go over fan bases.

c) Again we did pay our players most of the time just a few weeks were not paid. Its not right I know but Ringo we werent the only club.

d) Fair point but as i say it could come back to haunt you.

Ringo myslf and Tommy aint having a go we are just pointing out a few facts. I may get slated for this but I think Dublin City have done very well. The Idea with Carrolls while obvious to most they were the first club to get off thier Ass and do it.

KOH

JUZ

Ringo

19/02/2004, 11:02 AM

Listen I think Shamrock Rovers are a great club, who over the years have been shafted along the way. Ronan Seery has put everything he owns and his whole life in building up Dublin City.

Dublin City were asked, after the other clubs had got together & decided amongst them, much to the annoyance of Dublin City.

I would love to see Tallaght get off the ground, but your present board seem unable or incapable of achieving this.

Fan bases are crap all across the league, we have a small fan base, but it is growing & we are doing a lot more than other clubs to promote Irish soccer.

I’m a bit hung-over so I was a bit tetchy earlier! Every club has money problems .

As regards Carroll’s, they approached Dublin City & Seery saw a good opportunity and grabbed it. Both seem to be very happy with the arrangements.

It could have been a lot different if Shelbourne had of returned a message left by Carroll’s on their answering machine over two years ago.

TommyT

19/02/2004, 5:08 PM

Originally posted by Ringo
(b) Infintile statement, get over youreslf. your fan base is dying not growing.

Dublin City were asked, after the other clubs had got together & decided amongst them, much to the annoyance of Dublin City.

Dying ??? Hardly, it's actuallt been going up since we left Santry. We had more fans in POLAND than you had at any game I've ever been at in Whitehall.

Come on, no point in asking Dublin City if Shels don't want us at all or if Bohs don't want you, obviously the reverse is true, but the fact is you won't move, stop blaming the order you were asked in.

soccerc

19/02/2004, 5:16 PM

Originally posted by SuperKev
Soccerc unfortunately in reality the majority are thugs and scum and while tommy t and co think their the UN their only glad to join the big boys when stuff starts heating up. I cant ever remember attending a cork city match where Rovers fans hadent been involved in something. For the fact why everytime can you explain soccerc in Cork that every bar in the turners cross area have an array of bouncers on view. My sympathies are with the true Rovers fans but the club is rotten to the core and their is no turning back

Let's get this straight. First up, I'm not a supporter of Rovers or an apologist on their behalf but I find your statement above that the majority of Rovers fans are thugs and scum totally and wildly inaccurate and a downright blatant lie.

I know quite a number of them and indeed had the pleasure of their company in a small Czech town for a few nights last summer. While I may not see eye to eye with them on some issues and while they may accuse me of anti-rovers bias I have never ever found them to be anything less than totally committed in the support of their club.

I can't comment on what happens in Cork pubs when Rovers play at the Cross but will comment that i've seen the same when Pats, Bohs and Derry play there too.

WeAreRovers

19/02/2004, 5:51 PM

I would like to thank SOCcfc, soccerc and Doctor Nightdub for saving me the bother of replying to that fool. Is it coincidence that we have shared pints and banter with the above mentioned - in other words those lads have actually met real live Rovers fans and come away unscathed?

I will correct one point though 'cos it does my head in, we have never had any links with Millwall. Not now, not last year, not ever. Cardiff on the other hand is a different matter. But they suffer from the same preconcieved nonsense as outlined by SuperKev.

He's right about one thing though we're all scum. :D

KOH

Ringo

19/02/2004, 10:40 PM

Originally posted by TommyT
Dying ??? Hardly, it's actuallt been going up since we left Santry. We had more fans in POLAND than you had at any game I've ever been at in Whitehall.

Come on, no point in asking Dublin City if Shels don't want us at all or if Bohs don't want you, obviously the reverse is true, but the fact is you won't move, stop blaming the order you were asked in.

Why should we move, because you couldn't be arsed finding a ground. You knew you couldn't get a licence without a ground and did nothing.