The Derry City thread - Derry sign first four players

[Mr_Parker]

Because of the voices in their head.

Why do you think.....? The Board may or may not have known how limited the interest amongst City fans was in this game, but probably hoped the Celtic 'massif' would show up to make up the numbers anyway.

Turns out the Celtic massif is in fact miniscule. Unless there's lots of protestant fans supporting the other team for them to goad in a medieval fashion, that is....

:D Lot's of Prods at our club. That must be it. ;)

[Mr A]

Kenny says the players are unhappy:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/irish/8312230.stm

[brianw82]

Kenny says the players are unhappy:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/irish/8312230.stm

In other groundbreaking news, the earth not flat.

[OneRedArmy]

Kenny says the players are unhappy:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/irish/8312230.stmThey'd get a bit more sympathy if they hadn't lost 4 on the bounce.

Come to think of it, the fans are unhappy too.

[MariborKev]

Posted elswhere....

http://img96.imageshack.us/img96/2408/dcfcpressconference09.jpg

[DmanDmythDledge]

They'd get a bit more sympathy if they hadn't lost 4 on the bounce.

Come to think of it, the fans are unhappy too.
Why should that have anything to do with it? They haven't been paid the wages owed to them (one player as of last week had gone 9 weeks without receiving what was owed to him by Derry City FC) which are not performance related.

[passerrby]

dispite alll the problems theres always europe eh, that cure for all ills.
thats kenny and doolin who believe it does not matter how much **** there in Europe is at the end of the tunnel

[OneRedArmy]

Why should that have anything to do with it? They haven't been paid the wages owed to them (one player as of last week had gone 9 weeks without receiving what was owed to him by Derry City FC) which are not performance related.I've more sympathy for the players that the board. But I'm not losing too much sleep over a group of people who earn a multiple of the average wage in Derry, where unemployment is some of the highest in Western Europe.

Don't get me wrong, I would prefer if they were paid, but I want whats best for the club and maybe if Kenny hadn't made ridiculous requests like overnight stays for Dublin games and then not delivered results we wouldn't be in this position.

[thischarmingman]

I've more sympathy for the players that the board. But I'm not losing too much sleep over a group of people who earn a multiple of the average wage in Derry, where unemployment is some of the highest in Western Europe.

Don't get me wrong, I would prefer if they were paid, but I want whats best for the club and maybe if Kenny hadn't made ridiculous requests like overnight stays for Dublin games and then not delivered results we wouldn't be in this position.

Ridiculous to blame players for how much they get paid imo. I don't know how much the players are paid but they certainly don't get paid so much that missing 9 weeks of them is anything less than a gravely serious issue. Do you think the players should have said, "No seriously boss, I really don't need that much, take 25% off it and we'll talk." It has absolutely nothing to do with them. We employ Gareth McGlynn, for instance, for his ability at kicking a round thing across some grass, not for his financial acumen. We employ Tam McManus for his habit of kicking that round thing into the white thing, not for his payroll skills.

Also, you do know that lots of people in Derry earn over the average wage? Should they all go back into their employers office and demand their wages be cut? I'm not having a go at you personally here, but it is such a typically begrudging Derry view, "Lots of people are unemployed at the moment, why should those who are employed by happy? They earn more money than some other people do, therefore they don't fully deserve it and should feel suitably guilty at receiving it."

[pineapple stu]

(one player as of last week had gone 9 weeks without receiving what was owed to him by Derry City FC)
Nine weeks without being paid in full, technically.

[MariborKev]

Our accounts are overdue by several weeks as well, but that is no surprise...

[pineapple stu]

Now now - you'll have them at the AGM. Feck off and be patient. :rolleyes: :p

[EalingGreen]

What is Kenny hinting at here? Is it that DCFC may be so financially hamstrung (esp if they don't qualify for Europe) that they won't receive an LOI Licence for the Prem next year?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/irish/8321317.stm
Page last updated at 16:38 GMT, Thursday, 22 October 2009 17:38 UK

Kenny concern over Premier status

Derry City manager Stephen Kenny has said that the club's Premier League status may be in some doubt.

"The club is under pressure and it is important that we are in the Premier League next season although there is probably a concern about that.

"There is a lot of uncertainty and we know we have to play our part by taking cutbacks but hopefully everything goes well," said the Candystripes boss.

(Continues)

[OneRedArmy]

What is Kenny hinting at here? Is it that DCFC may be so financially hamstrung (esp if they don't qualify for Europe) that they won't receive an LOI Licence for the Prem next year?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/irish/8321317.stm
Page last updated at 16:38 GMT, Thursday, 22 October 2009 17:38 UK

Kenny concern over Premier status

Derry City manager Stephen Kenny has said that the club's Premier League status may be in some doubt.

"The club is under pressure and it is important that we are in the Premier League next season although there is probably a concern about that.

"There is a lot of uncertainty and we know we have to play our part by taking cutbacks but hopefully everything goes well," said the Candystripes boss.

(Continues)In fairness, Ealing Green, its hardly a surprise if you've read the thread?!

Naivety, laziness or wumming, what do you plead?

[Mr A]

I think the concern isn't really a surprise, but the fact that Kenny has said it probably is!

[brianw82]

If Cork and Bohs are still in the PL next year with all their respective issues, I don't really think Derry have much to worry about.

[Aaron]

If Cork and Bohs are still in the PL next year with all their respective issues, I don't really think Derry have much to worry about.

Apparently we do

[MariborKev]

Naw,

Sure the board says there are no problems.

Financial meltdown story to break tomorrow.

[MariborKev]

I think the concern isn't really a surprise, but the fact that Kenny has said it probably is!

Not really, he is more forthcoming than the board.

[Aaron]

It was Kenny who broke the news about our problems before we played CSKA Sofia. At least there is someone from the club telling us something. What I heard this evening is quite worrying, to the extent that we may not even survive:(

[EalingGreen]

In fairness, Ealing Green, its hardly a surprise if you've read the thread?!

Naivety, laziness or wumming, what do you plead?
"Not Guilty!" on all three counts.

I am well aware that DCFC are in big trouble financially, will have to go part-time next season, cannot fund the B'well redevelopment etc.

I suppose I might be a bit slow on the uptake, but since they obviously won't get relegated on results, nor are they going to volunteer for relegation, what have they done which will cause the FAI to withhold a Premier Licence or relegate them on some other grounds?

And as Brian W82 points out, if general financial mismanagement would cause this, is the FAI going to deal with eg Cork and Bohs the same way?

Late Edit: As I type, I note CTID's rather apocalyptic post "we may not even survive". If things really are that bad, does that mean Kenny was trying to "soften the blow"? Is it that DCFC may go completely bust by or at the season's end, so that they would have to reform as a "new" club and start again in the "A" League etc?
I must confess I didn't think things could be that dire, so maybe I am being naive?

[Aaron]

"Not Guilty!" on all three counts.

I am well aware that DCFC are in big trouble financially, will have to go part-time next season, cannot fund the B'well redevelopment etc.

I suppose I might be a bit slow on the uptake, but obviously they won't get relegated on results, nor are they going to volunteering for relegation, so what have they done which will cause the FAI to withhold a Premier Licence or relegate them on some other grounds?

And as Brian W82 points out, if general financial mismanagement would cause this, is the FAI going to deal with eg Cork and Bohs the same way?

Late Edit: As I type, I note CTID's rather apocalyptic post "we may not even survive". If things really are that bad, does that mean Kenny is trying to "soften the blow"? Was he hinting that DCFC may go completely bust by or at the season's end, so that they would have to reform as a "new" club and start again in the "A" League etc?
I must confess I didn't think things could be that dire, so maybe I am being naive?

Ealing if only you knew half of it. Do you post on ILS?

[awec]

This is bad luck for Derry. Bad to see any football club go under.

If you do get rid of players though, feel free to send Morrow to Glenavon. :)

[Schumi]

Something big to come out tomorrow apparently. http://www.derrycityfc.net/cityweb/Latest/board-of-directors-statement-23rd-october-2009.html

[MariborKev]

Players have gone public with their side of the story re wages.

[DmanDmythDledge]

Nine weeks without being paid in full, technically.
Cheers. Wasn't too sure if that was the case so didn't what to say it.

[Dodge]

Being really lazy here, but is there a chance of a strike (or something else that will make Derry not play Pats on Friday)?

[Mr_Parker]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/northern_ireland/foyle_and_west/8321788.stm

[Ronnie]

This is nuts lads. I can't believe that 3 of the best supported clubs, and 3 of the current top 4, and 3 of the traditionally strongest clubs over the last 20 years are all at risk of not being in the premier in 2010. Its mental.

[Ezeikial]

This is nuts lads. I can't believe that 3 of the best supported clubs, and 3 of the current top 4, and 3 of the traditionally strongest clubs over the last 20 years are all at risk of not being in the premier in 2010. Its mental.

Do you think these things are linked in any way?

[Steve Bruce]

It's like anything, if these clubs who are big clubs in their own right, had of stayed within their means, they would still more than likely be up their and they would still be financially sound

[OneRedArmy]

It's like anything, if these clubs who are big clubs in their own right, had of stayed within their means, they would still more than likely be up their and they would still be financially soundThats it, in a nutshell.

[dcfcsteve]

It's like anything, if these clubs who are big clubs in their own right, had of stayed within their means, they would still more than likely be up their and they would still be financially sound

But football is like an arms raise. Once one club breaks rank and starts increasing its spend significantly, the other clubs who want/expect to be at the business end of things eventually have to do likewise or face becoming irrelevant. And footbalkl is about competing, not being irrelevant - particularly for the bigger clubs, who have a greater weight of expectation.

Without wanting to incur the wrath of their fans, a straight line can be drawn from the financial madness in the league towards Shelbourne and Ollie Byrne. That's where the current arms raise started about 10 years ago.

[LeixlipRed]

Without wanting to incur the wrath of their fans, a straight line can be drawn from the financial madness in the league towards Shelbourne and Ollie Byrne. That's where the current arms raise started about 10 years ago.

Very true, though I'm comforted by the fact that we may be one of the few clubs to actually survive this coming apocalypse.

[Steve Bruce]

I think the best thing to do, is get the IFA to agree to a big contract to host NI internationals.

Now I wonder what club thought of that piece of genius :D

[Ezeikial]

But football is like an arms raise. Once one club breaks rank and starts increasing its spend significantly, the other clubs who want/expect to be at the business end of things eventually have to do likewise or face becoming irrelevant. And footbalkl is about competing, not being irrelevant - particularly for the bigger clubs, who have a greater weight of expectation.

Without wanting to incur the wrath of their fans, a straight line can be drawn from the financial madness in the league towards Shelbourne and Ollie Byrne. That's where the current arms raise started about 10 years ago.

Of course you are completely correct - but that does not excuse any club for flagrantly spending beyond their means.


It is also the compelling reason why the FAI are morally obliged (for the long term benefit of the league) to issue proper sanctions against any clubs who end up in breach of the 65% rule

[Mr A]

Here's the article. It paints a very bleak picture indeed:

http://www.londonderrysentinel.co.uk/news/Derry-City-on-verge-of.5761025.jp

[EalingGreen]

But football is like an arms raise. Once one club breaks rank and starts increasing its spend significantly, the other clubs who want/expect to be at the business end of things eventually have to do likewise or face becoming irrelevant. And footbalkl is about competing, not being irrelevant - particularly for the bigger clubs, who have a greater weight of expectation.
Not quite. Football in the LOI is like an arms race, as it is eg in the English Premier League*.
But it need not be that way. Football in Germany is extremely well run, for instance. Of course, German club football is no longer the force it once was in European competition, but domestically they seem to be doing OK, ditto the National team.
And if UEFA/EU should act to impose an element of financial reality on European club football, then debt-free German clubs, with their big crowds in
modern new stadia should be very well placed to resume their former place at the top.
Closer to home, even the poor old Irish League, by not eg "chasing the European Dream", is managing to scrape along somehow. Of course, with one obvious exception, the clubs don't have a pot to p1ss in between them.
But at least they're not completely in hock to "Pots-R-Us" and they do get to keep their own p1ss...
In any case, even in the worst "arms races", certain clubs have declined to get sucked in eg Arsenal in EPL, Shams in the LOI and, er, Bangor in the IL!

Anyhow, although I have no particular affinity or connection with them, I really do hope DCFC pull through somehow.

[Mr A]

From the article linked above:


One player said: "A rosy picture continues to be painted in the local Press in relation to the difficulties we have encountered this season, yet that's not the reality."
Another player remarked: "We've done everything in our power to assist the Board since these difficulties were made known to us. We agreed to keep everything 'in house' and not run to the Press but now we've gone beyond that stage and we feel it's important that we let the public know the situation, particularly that fact the club is in danger of disappearing off the map."
The players say they were "completely stunned" when told at Wednesday night's meeting that those who wished to leave the club could do so.
"As playing for Derry City is our only livelihood, this came as a real bombshell", said a players' spokesman. "We couldn't believe it. We asked was there no help available from anywhere and we were told that all avenues had been investigated and there was no help forthcoming.
"The Board also claimed that, if Friday's meeting with the FAI isn't successful, then there was no way of paying any more wages or, indeed, debts, for the foreseeable future - possibly stretching into February or March of next year."
Another player added: ""We are concerned that the general public in Derry are not fully aware of what has gone on or how desperate the situation is relating to the club and its very existence."

There could well be an element of the board pleading the poor mouth with the players in order to keep the pressure from that quarter as low as possible, but the picture painted there is stark.

Also, at this stage the FAI should probably just give everybody whatever prizemoney that they're guaranteed.

[Acornvilla]

if we win the playoffs mabey the fai will double the prize money to bail everyone out? (wishful thinking i know)

[brendy_éire]

Being really lazy here, but is there a chance of a strike (or something else that will make Derry not play Pats on Friday)?

Nah, nothing like that. But don't worry yourself, playing against us at the minute is almost as good as being given a 3 point walkover anyway.

[thischarmingman]

Nah, nothing like that. But don't worry yourself, playing against us at the minute is almost as good as being given a 3 point walkover anyway.

Probably better, because as well as the 3 points you get a wee runaround and gate receipts.

[Steve Bruce]

Rumour on another forum has it, that Derry City haven't given us the money yet from our tickets sold to Derry City supporters in the recent Setanta cup match.

[chazzle]

There was no meeting with the FAI today apparently, which was not the understanding of the players.

[Mr_Parker]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/northern_ireland/8322728.stm

[brendy_éire]

Rumour on another forum has it, that Derry City haven't given us the money yet from our tickets sold to Derry City supporters in the recent Setanta cup match.

What money? There were no Derry fans in Windsor.

[Mr_Parker]

Rumour on another forum has it, that Derry City haven't given us the money yet from our tickets sold to Derry City supporters in the recent Setanta cup match.

If that is true then they should not be allowed to take any further part in the competition until it is paid, that of course is presuming that they can survive until the next phase.

[Mr A]

A lot of inaccurate reporting around the licensing implications of not paying wages. It's not a cut and dried end of month deadline if the players agree. End of January is the real deadline.

And if you aren't sorted at that point, you should get neither Premier or D1 License.

Quote from licensing:


No payables overdue towards employees and revenue/social/tax authorities
The licence applicant must prove that, in respect of contractual and legal obligations with its employees, it has no payables overdue towards employees or revenue/social/tax authorities as at 30 November of the year preceding the season to be licensed, unless by the following 31 January they have been fully settled, deferred by mutual agreement with the creditor or are subject to a not obviously unfounded dispute submitted to a competent authority.

[Longfordian]

It does beg the question of their compliance with the 65% rule though.

[waide]

Really is depressing and sad to see derry in diffs again.