Derry's turn

[MariborKev]

http://www.derryjournal.com/derry-sport/Skonto-defeat-would-signal-disaster.5456330.jp

Derry's turn.

No surprise to any of us with half a brain.....

[SligoBrewer]

http://www.derryjournal.com/derry-sport/Skonto-defeat-would-signal-disaster.5456330.jp

Derry's turn.

No surprise to any of us with half a brain.....

3 down, 7 to go.

[Mr A]

The most bizarre thing about that article is that there is absolutely no indication that Derry will be looking to lighten the wage bill.

3 of the top 4 in trouble to one extent or another and not one of them seems intent on cutting costs. It really would make you despair for the future of this league.

And once again you have to wonder how DCFC stand in relation to the 65% rule. Although at this stage you'd have to assume that so many clubs are urinating all over it that it'll have to be fudged again.

[Dodge]

I split the thread. No real point of it being stuck in the (already huge) Cork thread

[MariborKev]

The most bizarre thing about that article is that there is absolutely no indication that Derry will be looking to lighten the wage bill.

3 of the top 4 in trouble to one extent or another and not one of them seems intent on cutting costs. It really would make you despair for the future of this league.

And once again you have to wonder how DCFC stand in relation to the 65% rule. Although at this stage you'd have to assume that so many clubs are urinating all over it that it'll have to be fudged again.

Exactly Mr A,

A small minority of us having been highlighting the real dangers for the last 18 months or so, but having been branded "troublemakers" and patronised at AGMs, it has suprised me that we kept the show on the road this long.

[Hairy Bowsie]

The only thing i can say is keep it up Maribor. I know it's going to be hard but slowly but surely people will realise you're right and hopefully it's before it's too late for Derry

[SkStu]

Exactly Mr A,

A small minority of us having been highlighting the real dangers for the last 18 months or so, but having been branded "troublemakers" and patronised at AGMs, it has suprised me that we kept the show on the road this long.

genuinely fair play to you and the other "troublemakers" Maribor.

However, i would like to point out that it sounds almost identical to what has happened with my own club. Behaviour and circumstances for which we get lambasted on this forum regularly.

There are none so blind as those who will not see (until its too feckin late!).

[MariborKev]

SkStu,

We have a Supporters Trust established and properly registered(very inactive mind, but the structure of the I&PS is there for the worst case scenario)

[cheifo]

Exactly Mr A,

A small minority of us having been highlighting the real dangers for the last 18 months or so, but having been branded "troublemakers" and patronised at AGMs, it has suprised me that we kept the show on the road this long.

hmmmm The exact same scenario as Harps.Start using words like Youth Development and Long term plan and that really gets them going.

[RonnieB]

Were all darn doodly oodly doodly dooomed

[dfx-]

Campiones campiones...

:)

[cheifo]

Campiones campiones...

:)

I know you have far too much intergrity to want to win something because of off the pitch matters.;)

[John83]

Campiones campiones...

:)
Shels for Europe, anyone? ;)

[fanatic]

Campiones campiones...

:)


shouldnt that be Championes championes :D , sounds a bit camp ur way :D

[Celdrog]

Shels for Europe, anyone? ;)Its starting to look like Drogs for Europe at this stage :eek:
Mind you we would be going Ryanair and staying in a hostel next time

In fairness to Derry they have some extenuating circumstances with the sponsorship withdrawal.

[MariborKev]

In fairness to Derry they have some extenuating circumstances with the sponsorship withdrawal.

It was well known that our sponsor had been in difficulties for quite a while.

I disagree with the extenuating circumstances, not when you keep signing players and making overnight stays. This was always coming, just a question of when.

[eamo1]

Someone said 3 down 7 to go well its almost 4 down if this take over doesnt happen for us(Galway Utd).Debts of 500k and losing 5 grand a week.Although we did just get a new main sponsor today,Papa Johns Pizza:).I look forward to playing Bohs and Cork in the A championship next year.:(

[dcfc1928]

Shels, Drogs, Cork, Bohs, Harps, Pats, Galway.......... and us.

We should start a breakaway league, the Northern Rock Financial Services League of Ireland.

[Celdrog]

Shels, Drogs, Cork, Bohs, Harps, Pats, Galway.......... and us.

We should start a breakaway league, the Northern Rock Financial Services League of Ireland.
With Nick Leeson replacing John Delaney

[dcfc1928]

With Nick Leeson replacing John Delaney

and with Sir Allen Stanford (http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2009/feb/18/allen-stanford-banking-fraud) bankrolling it, it has to be a success!

[OneForTheFuture]

Shels, Drogs, Cork, Bohs, Harps, Pats, Galway.......... and us.

We should start a breakaway league, the Northern Rock Financial Services League of Ireland.

Cobh can be ball boys!

[Martinho II]

Shels, Drogs, Cork, Bohs, Harps, Pats, Galway.......... and us.

We should start a breakaway league, the Northern Rock Financial Services League of Ireland.

how come ye changed yer kit by the way?

[Martinho II]

Someone said 3 down 7 to go well its almost 4 down if this take over doesnt happen for us(Galway Utd).Debts of 500k and losing 5 grand a week.Although we did just get a new main sponsor today,Papa Johns Pizza:).I look forward to playing Bohs and Cork in the A championship next year.:(


I thought that Galway Utd had sponsors at the start of the season??

[thischarmingman]

how come ye changed yer kit by the way?

Due to loss of our shirt sponsor:

http://www.derrycityfc.net/cityweb/Commercial-News/derry-city-launch-new-initiatives.html

Initiative 1: Shirt Sponsorship

We are looking for 50 businesses/individuals/groups of people to pay £1,000 to be entered into a draw to be branded on the front of our first team jersey. There's also a runners up prize of the back of our jersey.

Everyone who enters will be featured on the jersey even if they don't win either of the main prizes, albeit on a smaller scale

The names of both the treble winning squad of 1989 and the names of our current squad of 2009 will also be embossed on the jersey along with Foyle Hospice being branded on the sleeves

This will become a collectors item in years to come and the jersey will be available to purchase from July until the end of the 2009 season with a percentage of all profits being donated to the Foyle Hospice

[thischarmingman]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/irish/8150851.stm


Derry City chairman Pat McDaid has acknowledged that a European run this season would be a much-needed boost for the Brandywell club.

[eamo1]

Galway Utd did have a main sponsor,but they missed a few payments as they are struggling big time themselves(O'Connell Dry Lining).So within a week Nick dropped them and brought in a new one.

[Dunny]

http://loi.ie/components/com_gk2_photoslide/images/thumbm/310360Galway_United_Players_Deliver_2.jpg

John Lesters going mad he left...

[sheao]

It seems really worrying that no team other than Shamrock Rovers in the premier division are financially stable.

[dcfcsteve]

Some disparity there between the comments of our Chairman and SK.

The Chairman is giving it the whole 'nothing to see here - everyone's in trouble, the club will survive' chat, whilst SK has presented a much more gloomy picture.

I'm worried about how we'll do against Skonto. We're playing breac at the moment.

:(

[soccerc]

Some disparity there between the comments of our Chairman and SK.

The Chairman is giving it the whole 'nothing to see here - everyone's in trouble, the club will survive' chat, whilst SK has presented a much more gloomy picture.

I'm worried about how we'll do against Skonto. We're playing breac at the moment.

:(

check your mobile for a trext Steve

[Celdrog]

http://loi.ie/components/com_gk2_photoslide/images/thumbm/310360Galway_United_Players_Deliver_2.jpg

John Lesters going mad he left...:D:D
Magicme's going to get ya .....

[CharlesThompson]

Funny how the amount of Derry supporters joined in Schadenfreud Fest on the Bohs thread. Then we get "Oh, but sure we lost our sponsor" as an excuse here. Says it all really.

Btw, I hope Derry City survive and I hope they beat Skonto Riga over the two legs.

[OneRedArmy]

Funny how the amount of Derry supporters joined in Schadenfreud Fest on the Bohs thread. Then we get "Oh, but sure we lost our sponsor" as an excuse here. Says it all really.

Btw, I hope Derry City survive and I hope they beat Skonto Riga over the two legs.Hardly a fair representation of the posts on here (if not the Hear No Evil See No Evil brigade on DCchat). I think many of the posts above, and in previous threads, show that a lot of us knew it was only a matter of time and actually were surprised it was brushed under the carpet until now.

As for those who troll on other clubs websites, rarely the sharpest knives in the drawer when it comes to finances.

[Magicme]

:D:D
Magicme's going to get ya .....

:D Brat!

[Macy]

Where's that thread about how great the FAI are at running the league? Who's vision was the 10 team, fully pro premier league? Who's supposed to be implementing Licencing to stop this crap from happening?

This is a total farce, but look at the rush by the FAI to an expanded 18 team one division league now so many "big" clubs are in trouble...

[SeanDrog]

Do any other non Derry supporters believe that it is crazy that a club can be hit with potential relegation if they fail to meet the 65% wage cap as a result of some issue which was out of their control such as the sponsor pulling out.

Surely they should get a "pass" at the end of the year if this was the only thing that resulted in them brealking the 65% rule.

[Macy]

Do any other non Derry supporters believe that it is crazy that a club can be hit with potential relegation if they fail to meet the 65% wage cap as a result of some issue which was out of their control such as the sponsor pulling out.
The linked articles says they're not going to be able to meet the wages for the rest of the season - they must've been way over the 65% already if the loss of sponsorship means they wont be able to cover wages, never mind get under 65%!

We've two clubs saying that they need wins in cup competitions to get close to the 65% cap (bohs), or to simply pay the players for the rest of the season (Derry). Have the FAI Licencing Committee been accepting wins in cup games as part of the accepted budget for the season? If so, that's completely ridiculous.

But to answer your question, if they're going to have licencing it should be properly implemented and enforced. You only have to look at the last two seasons to see what happens when it's fudged.

[Mr A]

I agree with you Macy that the FAI needs to tighten things further.. but ultimately it goes back to the clubs themselves and their outrageous serial recklessness. All the clubs knew the economical situation at the the start of the season yet still they screwed themselves over. Licensing failures have probably been more the clubs' fault than the FAI because the sheer scale of insanity in the league means they cannot punish everyone. Attitudes have to change in senior football and we'll get nowhere until we see that change coming from the clubs themselves.

[passerrby]

Do any other non Derry supporters believe that it is crazy that a club can be hit with potential relegation if they fail to meet the 65% wage cap as a result of some issue which was out of their control such as the sponsor pulling out.

Surely they should get a "pass" at the end of the year if this was the only thing that resulted in them brealking the 65% rule.

so as long as your excuse is ok you should get a pass like our sponsor has gone bellyup or.. we were told these beans were magic.
it would be mayhem with certain clubs getting a pass while others being screwed

[ger121]

Someone said 3 down 7 to go well its almost 4 down if this take over doesnt happen for us(Galway Utd).Debts of 500k and losing 5 grand a week.Although we did just get a new main sponsor today,Papa Johns Pizza:).I look forward to playing Bohs and Cork in the A championship next year.:(

Gonna be some A Championship alright next year:)

[ger121]

Funny how the amount of Derry supporters joined in Schadenfreud Fest on the Bohs thread. Then we get "Oh, but sure we lost our sponsor" as an excuse here. Says it all really.

Btw, I hope Derry City survive and I hope they beat Skonto Riga over the two legs.


I'd be hoping the same. I'd hate to see any club in the league go to the wall as it's just another stick for all the Barstoolers, Media etc to beat us with...

[SeanDrog]

so as long as your excuse is ok you should get a pass like our sponsor has gone bellyup or.. we were told these beans were magic.
it would be mayhem with certain clubs getting a pass while others being screwed

come on - I do not mean excuses but real reasons. Leave Derry aside (as it is suggested that the sponsor is not the sole reason behind their issues) but lets say there is an unforseen event that forces a club over the 65% , they couldnt plan for it and it knocks the daylights out of their budget - should they be relegated - not saying fudge licencing but build into licencing some form of derogation system.

For the sake of illustration:

Sligo have a good budget, keeping everything very tidy and then it rains like hell for a month in Sligo and destroys their pitch, they are forced to play in Galway and this destroys gate receipts and adds greatly to travel costs - this pushes them over the 65% rule - should they be relegated?



To me the current system seems too black and white.

[Dodge]

To me the current system seems too black and white.

No club has been punished so far, so you can't say whether its clear cut or not.

[SeanDrog]

No club has been punished so far, so you can't say whether its clear cut or not.

fair point - I am just assuming given the presentations on this thread (and others) that Derry and Bohs will be relegated if they break the 65% rule. Just on what I am reading the system looks very black and white.

[Ezeikial]

come on - I do not mean excuses but real reasons. Leave Derry aside (as it is suggested that the sponsor is not the sole reason behind their issues) but lets say there is an unforseen event that forces a club over the 65% , they couldnt plan for it and it knocks the daylights out of their budget - should they be relegated - not saying fudge licencing but build into licencing some form of derogation system.


There is no doubt that it is possible for a prudently managed club to experience circumstances completely beyond their control that pushes them over the 65% mark. Can any of the four premier clubs reported to be in difficulty (Bohs, Derry, Cork, Galway) validly claim this?

It is imperative that the FAI implement the existing regulations as they stand at the moment. To do anything else would totally demolish any shred of credibility that remains. If it takes a number of clubs to be relegated to hammer the message home to them and others, then so be it.

If any adjustments (such as an appeal or derogation system) are valid for the future, this should be debated and possibly introduced in the future, and not retrospectively.

[EalingGreen]

come on - I do not mean excuses but real reasons. Leave Derry aside (as it is suggested that the sponsor is not the sole reason behind their issues) but lets say there is an unforseen event that forces a club over the 65% , they couldnt plan for it and it knocks the daylights out of their budget - should they be relegated - not saying fudge licencing but build into licencing some form of derogation system.

For the sake of illustration:

Sligo have a good budget, keeping everything very tidy and then it rains like hell for a month in Sligo and destroys their pitch, they are forced to play in Galway and this destroys gate receipts and adds greatly to travel costs - this pushes them over the 65% rule - should they be relegated?



To me the current system seems too black and white.

You raise an interesting point, SD, but I would make two observations.

1. The "Great Flood of Sligo" you quote is unforeseeable/unavoidable, an "Act of God" if you like. However, none of the problems which have hit LOI clubs come into that category. No harm eg to Derry, but sponsors sometimes go bust; you might as well eg make allowances for Sligo drawing a European opponent which was too obscure to attract a big crowd, but too good to beat.
In any case, if a club were to fall victim to a genuine "disaster", I don't see how anyone else could object, say, to the FAI making an Emergency Loan.
2. If you think about it, by imposing a 65% Cap, you are also effectively implementing a 35% "Contingency" in a club's affairs.
That is, if a club is abiding by the spirit and the letter of the Cap, then this would reflect that they are a prudently run club, sustainable over the medium-to-long term.
In which case, they would be in a position to go to their Bank/Investors/Shareholders/Fans etc and argue for a short-term injection of funds to tide them over what would be a "one-off" problem.
Alternatively, a 35% "Contingency" should allow for Insurance*, something which many other sports clubs etc routinely take out.


* - Then again, considering some clubs don't even appear able to pay the Revenue their dues, I wonder how many are up-to-date with their Insurance premiums?

[pól-dcfc]

You raise an interesting point, SD, but I would make two observations.

1. The "Great Flood of Sligo" you quote is unforeseeable/unavoidable, an "Act of God" if you like. However, none of the problems which have hit LOI clubs come into that category. No harm eg to Derry, but sponsors sometimes go bust; you might as well eg make allowances for Sligo drawing a European opponent which was too obscure to attract a big crowd, but too good to beat.
In any case, if a club were to fall victim to a genuine "disaster", I don't see how anyone else could object, say, to the FAI making an Emergency Loan.


I get what your saying, but does that mean you believe teams should have to budget for the year with the assumption that their sponsor is going to go bust? That's ludicrous.

[Mr A]

No, but there should be enough leeway in the budget to cope with such shocks without threatening the ability to pay wages, especially when entering the season you know that times are very tough economically.

[pól-dcfc]

No, but there should be enough leeway in the budget to cope with such shocks without threatening the ability to pay wages, especially when entering the season you know that times are very tough economically.

Our sponsorship deal with Meteor was huge. What's the point of getting a good deal on sponsorship if the money can't be used? Undoubtedly the Derry board have dropped the ball a bit. Too much spent on trips away and wages. I don't think we are breaking the 65% rule though - there's be no word about an embargo for us.

I can't remember the exact figures involved, but Meteor were due to give us a massive amount of money (was it £1million over 3 years?). We budgeted on the basis of receiving that money.

[SeanDrog]

you cant have a continency fund for everything.

For me if (and I know its an if) Derry break the 65% rule and if (again an if) it is solely down to the sponsor pulling out - the imo they shouldnt be relegated.