Is Foot.ie just becoming a talking shop?

[NeilMcD]

I hope this is not deleted as I am not having a go at anyone but there was a time when the fans forum on foot.ie in the Ireland section was vibrant. You had people arranging flags and buses for away trips and various other things. It seems to me now that the Ireland section has just become a talking shop and a discussion board for the merits of Stephen Ireland or Kilbane at left back or the tactics of Trap. All that is fine and I contribute towards that but I certainly think that in relation relation to the Fans forum aspect of thing YBIG has stolen a march and the fans forum bit here has become nearly redundant. Any thoughts and again I am not having a go at anyone.

[Claret Murph]

YBIG has taken over as simple as that Neil ..............

[theworm2345]

YBIG has taken over as simple as that Neil ..............
Except YBIG has turned to **** with all the new members (no offense Count :o). It used to be good craic because there were sort of inside jokes and the like. foot.ie is good but its different. This is the place to go to for information on Irish footy, whether its a link to watch a match, the latest on someone's injury, historical stats (though Donal at YBIG had a penchant for that as well), or anything. YBIG has/had the more personal effect to it, the Sofia and Bari t-shirts, the 12th man jersey (one of which I got free for making the 100,000th post on YBIG, something you won't see here), travel guides, the fanzine, etc. Hell I've been here over three years and I still don't know most the people who post on here's mannerisms, etc. and I'm sure its the same vice versa (well maybe I'm the David Connolly guy to many...a distinction I wear with pride).

[paul_oshea]

The YBIG thing are more about meetups and organising things and having the craic on away trips etc, a fanzine. Foot.ie is really what people use who want to converse on all things, not just football, but the Ireland section is for those, many of whom are abroad, like to discuss all things related to the Irish international team. Not a lot seem to go to away matches but use it as a home-from-home place where they share a common interest and a form of escapism from the place in which they have inhabited away from home.

But I see your point Neil and I'd agree, assuming its the fans forum section you are only referring too.

[John83]

...the 12th man jersey (one of which I got free for making the 100,000th post on YBIG, something you won't see here)...
That's not entirely fair. Dahamsta stumps up for a prize for post of the year.


...the fanzine...
A fanzine from a group here launched at the same time as YBIG. It didn't have the kind of sponsorship they did and consequently the production values or the distribution network, and was quietly shelved. For all their contributions to fan culture, I don't think YBIG have ever run an article that got them into the kind of trouble with the FAI that the Don Givens article from that fanzine did.

[Ash]

A fanzine from a group here launched at the same time as YBIG. It didn't have the kind of sponsorship they did and consequently the production values or the distribution network, and was quietly shelved. For all their contributions to fan culture, I don't think YBIG have ever run an article that got them into the kind of trouble with the FAI that the Don Givens article from that fanzine did.

Wasnt that The Geneisis Reporter ... came out the same day as the 1st YBIG
as far as I remember. Content was good but the printing was shocking, looked
like a botched photocopy job where as YBIG was championed by The Star I
think and looked like a proper mag.

[pineapple stu]

Yeah, that's the one. Twas photocopied by Troy McClure, who used to be on here. I think it stirred YBIG into action, so something good came out of it!

[Sono_il_capo]

YBIG is just a better site with better discussions about everything and anything end of.

Great bunch of lads on there too with some great banter.

Worm - You have a poxy attitude problem.

[dahamsta]

Sono_il_capo, if you can't have a conversation without getting personal, don't join in.

If there's anything we can do to improve the Fan's Forum, then let us know, via here, the mods, or me. If it's gone off topic then we can push it back, if we need to change something then we can change it, if we need to add something then we can look at that. Don't be passive, be active.

John83, at this stage I think we're up to 1 jersey, 3 tshirts and various other odds and sods on the fly, per year. We just don't make a big deal of it.

adam

[Sligo Hornet]

YBIG is just a better site with better discussions about everything and anything end of.

Great bunch of lads on there too with some great banter.

Worm - You have a poxy attitude problem.


Sono......don't be turning Neil's "Talking Shop" into a "Knocking Shop";)

[tetsujin1979]

I see a lot of comments on ybig along the lines of "not like that shower on foot.ie"
Don't see similar comments about ybig here

As for better banter, there's little moderation on ybig, which has its positive and negative sides

[Junior]

Do many people use ybig? I very rarely go on there but have just viewed a bit more in the last few weeks, rarely does there seem to be more than a dozen or so viewing the Republic of Ireland forum????

[Kingdom]

I'd refer to ybig as being more clubby/matey than foot.ie

I'm on the other site occasionally, but this is still my reference point for all things informative.

While there are a number of good posters on YBIG, there is nothing to equal the posts of Tets, Stuttgart and occasionally Eirebhoy (:)) here, as I find when reading their posts that my head is nodding more than one of those dashboard dog toys.

Both sites have their merits, I love the fanzine myself, but the constant references to foot.ie does wear thin on me I have to say.

[Sligo Hornet]

I'd refer to ybig as being more clubby/matey than foot.ie

I'm on the other site occasionally, but this is still my reference point for all things informative.

While there are a number of good posters on YBIG, there is nothing to equal the posts of Tets, Stuttgart and occasionally Eirebhoy (:)) here, as I find when reading their posts that my head is nodding more than one of those dashboard dog toys.

Both sites have their merits, I love the fanzine myself, but the constant references to foot.ie does wear thin on me I have to say.


That may be fuelled by a few who were "red carded" from here

[eaststand85]

I'd refer to ybig as being more clubby/matey than foot.ie

I'm on the other site occasionally, but this is still my reference point for all things informative.

While there are a number of good posters on YBIG, there is nothing to equal the posts of Tets, Stuttgart and occasionally Eirebhoy (:)) here, as I find when reading their posts that my head is nodding more than one of those dashboard dog toys.

Both sites have their merits, I love the fanzine myself, but the constant references to foot.ie does wear thin on me I have to say.

Agree with that Kingdom, personally I find the discussion on foot.ie more informative (the foot.ie Sofia thread had a lot more about the various flight and accommodation options available for example in my opinion) and the posters more open to debate (generally!), whereas some of the posters on ybig seems to be more concerned with promoting their 'brand' than anything else (via flags, tshirts etc.).

To return to the original question posed by NeilMcD, maybe foot.ie is more of a talking shop but that's why I prefer it because I think it's what a forum should be.

[Sligo Hornet]

Agree with that Kingdom, personally I find the discussion on foot.ie more informative (the foot.ie Sofia thread had a lot more about the various flight and accommodation options available for example in my opinion) and the posters more open to debate (generally!), whereas some of the posters on ybig seems to be more concerned with promoting their 'brand' than anything else (via flags, tshirts etc.).

To return to the original question posed by NeilMcD, maybe foot.ie is more of a talking shop but that's why I prefer it because I think it's what a forum should be.

Well said........STAND UP for what you believe in;)

[paul_oshea]

Stand up, sorry im lys dexic, sit down for the boys in green :D

[dahamsta]

Out of curiousity, is the problem with the Fans Forum in particular or the site in general? Some of the comments in the thread seem to suggest that the Fans Forum has kind of gone off-topic, i.e. discussions there are about football, rather than fans -- with all the associated stuff like banners, displays, meetups, etc. If that's the only problem, surely all that's needed is an adjustment in moderation?

[Claret Murph]

That may be fuelled by a few who were "red carded" from here

Talk about hitting the nail on the head Hornet ..................................

[eaststand85]

Well said........STAND UP for what you believe in;)

Just did but got some funny looks in the office when I started singing that Manuella used to be Italian but is Irish now! :D:D

[Kingdom]

Some of the comments in the thread seem to suggest that the Fans Forum has kind of gone off-topic, i.e. discussions there are about football, rather than fans -- with all the associated stuff like banners, displays, meetups, etc.

Yes I think that is where the problem lies damahsta


That may be fuelled by a few who were "red carded" from here

Ok fair enough if they've issues, but no need for it to be a constant theme, it looks completely childish to me.

[NeilMcD]

My original point was about the Fans Forum aspect of it. This has seemed in my view wained. Eaststand is right about the accomodation options on the various match threads etc.

I was not having a go at anyone at all. The talking about tactics and formations and various players is part of any forum. What I specifically was referring to was the energy from the site in relation to the fans forum aspect of it.

Things like the T Shirts for Dan Nolan, the Flags etc. The fun aspects of being a supporter I think have wained in this part of the site which. foot.ie is still great for tips on flights and hotels etc. In my view the FANs forum has the potential to be the best part of the site. Taxis being organised, buses being organised that sort of thing. Its teh best way of meeting people wecoming to people who go to trips on their own etc.

[pineapple stu]

The Fans' Forum was always kind of vague, to be honest. Whereas the Ireland forum is for talking about matches, players, etc, the Fans' Forum is for arranging stuff specifically to do with the fans, and the two main things there are really the away games and sorting tickets. It was never really that busy except in the lead up to a match. Stuff like new chants come up every once in a while, but end up repeating themselves and drop away very quickly.

On flights, taxis, buses etc, being arranged for away games, this is obviously up to the people going to games. So it seems the general problem is that the forum itself is too quiet? I'm not sure how we can encourage more travel arrangements, to be honest. The Cyprus charter flight has a separate thread, and I've no problem in general giving such items a thread on their own, or else I'll link a post in the general away match thread from the summary thread.

Possibly the number of threads has died down since the idea of one big thread for away games took off, but I think that's the best way to keep everything together (with the summaries as well).

Any suggestions though, let us know.

[Sheridan]

I'd be all for closing down the Ireland section if they feel they have alternative elsewhere anyway.

[Junior]

and not even a winking smilie now now........

[NeilMcD]

I think the crux of the issue I suppose is that most of the people on YBIG go to the Ireland away games and are pretty vocal at them and its not the same here. Therefore the fans forum can be quiet and you get people who have no interest whatsoever in the Irish team, taking threads off topic or taking them a road that is well travelled.

[Razors left peg]

I'd be all for closing down the Ireland section if they feel they have alternative elsewhere anyway.

I still dont understand why someone who has an obvious dislike for the national team wastes their time even reading the Ireland forum let alone write comments

[NeilMcD]

I still dont understand why someone who has an obvious dislike for the national team wastes their time even reading the Ireland forum let alone write comments

Lets not let him ruin the thread. Move on.

[paul_oshea]

Its called a love hate relationship, deep down he loves it really ;)

I think what neil is getting to, is "a get up and go" factor associated to YBIG. Almost a brotherhood without sounding cheesy, thee is great camraderie, a good sense of belonging and a great sense of community. They are also really good at actually doing things and organising things, from what ive seen away at matches and the odd time im over there gancing.

[NeilMcD]

Spot on Paul.

[Sono_il_capo]

For what it's worth I find Foot.ie not the most user friendly in terms of navigation compared to YBIG.ie and there seems to be better banter on YBIG.

Also the layout on YBIG is an awful lot better IMO.

[Claret Murph]

I think Neil and Paul have a very good points , a lot on here post on YBIG also and I know I will carry on posting on both sites .

I just feel that foot is more an armchair fan really and YBIG are the hardcore , that's how I see it myself .:ball::):ball:

[dahamsta]

We're getting lots in terms of feedback and that's good, but little in the way of suggestions. Moderation seems to be a problem, but the forum effectively has 3 mods in pineapple stu, gustavo and eirebhoy, and they'll need to know how to lead the forum if it's to be improved. Navigation and usability has been highlighted as a problem and that's my issue, but I need specifics if I'm to fix it. What, specifically, can we do to improve things in the forum? Bullet points and details are needed if we're to do that.

adam

[bennocelt]

May I ask - what are YBIG like for LOI - or do they just stick to Ireland?

[RogerMilla]

May I ask - what are YBIG like for LOI - or do they just stick to Ireland?

lots of LOI fans on ybig benno , and plenty focus on it in the fanzine , interview with richie sadlier in the next issue !

[pineapple stu]

One option could be to split the away game threads into separate threads on accommodation, tickets, pubs, flights, things to do and miscellaneous, with the first post kept as a summary. May focus the mind a bit more. But in terms of "this forum's not as good as this other one", vague comments won't really achieve a huge amount.

[irishfan86]

In terms of navigation, having the fans forum as a sub-forum makes it less accessible. Perhaps giving it full forum status like the Ireland section, World Cup section, etc. would make more people visit it from the main page.

[paul_oshea]

I think its down to the people i.e. users as much as it is anything else, or in fact all.

[Sligo Hornet]

I think its down to the people i.e. users as much as it is anything else, or in fact all.

Is that another Forum paul?.......How does it compare?;)

[NeilMcD]

Yeah I would agree Paul, I would not really think that the format of the site is the main reason. More the culture. I think JT's post in relation to Cyprus is a perfect example. I think foot.ie looks great and the threads are kept very well, but a new user like JT is probably going off feeling as if she has just had her knuckles rapped. I think for people who are very au fait with forums this site works well but for those that are new and not sure how things work, their is an element of snappy school teacher about and this in my view should be relaxed a little for the fans forum, due to the nature of the fans forum which is about creating fan spirit and organising buses and giving advice etc etc.

Again I do not want to see this as having a go at anyone, just my views as someone who has posted for a good while and likes to get involved with various fans and I have met many people from this site on away trips through this site etc.

[MariborKev]

Lads,

I think this is great as it will help to kick on for future development of the forum.

Would it be worthwhile taking a look at the format of the OWC forum that the Norn Iron lads have?

They have the forum and then it is subdivided into separate forums for each game, then one for atmosphere etc. I think this might help.

YBIG does a fantastic job, but I come here for my LOI news and then as an Ireland fan I tend to drift in here for Ireland chat etc.......

[paul_oshea]

Is that another Forum paul?.......How does it compare?;)

Its an inverted cork site, you wouldn't understand ;) :D

[paul_oshea]

Ya does EG check this out, or would that go against his constitution i.e. FANS forum :D

EG our GR if you are reading please post/give advice. You like giving advice EG so nows your chance!

Without over populating the "fans forum" perhaps an "away trips" forum might help specifically away from the fans forum etc. I think OWC do it that way. So "cyprus away" thread in a forum called "away trips" might be an idea. Personally I like the way its done currently but if you want a forum that is specifically getting at what Neil is saying, doing something like that might filter out into exactly what people are looking for without trawling through different things.

[pineapple stu]

Without over populating the "fans forum" perhaps an "away trips" forum might help specifically away from the fans forum etc. I think OWC do it that way. So "cyprus away" in a forum called "away trips" might be an idea.
Change "Fans' Forum" for "Away trips", and that's exactly what we do have. Separate forums for separate games would mean threads on everything and anything getting started, which would make it very awkward to look up. Again, no bothers splitting the Cyprus thread into separate threads on accommodation, flights, drink, towns, etc.

I've no bothers trying to change things around, but all we have so far is vague unsubstantiated moaning. Maybe this thread is also just becoming a talking shop, but unless there's positive suggestions, there's little that can be done.

[paul_oshea]

no ye dont get me.

Have away trips as possibly a sub forum of Fans forum or another sub forum under ireland. not a forum for every trip.

[NeilMcD]

[QUOTE=paul_oshea;1176263]no ye dont get me.

/QUOTE]

I would say you have to say that a good bit to be honest Paul.

[Newryrep]

Change "Fans' Forum" for "Away trips", and that's exactly what we do have. Separate forums for separate games would mean threads on everything and anything getting started, which would make it very awkward to look up. Again, no bothers splitting the Cyprus thread into separate threads on accommodation, flights, drink, towns, etc.

I've no bothers trying to change things around, but all we have so far is vague unsubstantiated moaning. Maybe this thread is also just becoming a talking shop, but unless there's positive suggestions, there's little that can be done.

The TAMB doesnt have a bad set up format wise,does exactly what it says on the tin

General

TA specific
Home Games
Clubs

Away travel

General
specific games

AOB

Football - non TA
General
tech support
Photos

[pineapple stu]

Have away trips as possibly a sub forum of Fans forum or another sub forum under ireland. not a forum for every trip.
What would go in Fans' Forum so? Is there a need to split a quiet forum into two parts?

Also, irishfan86 says that the Fans' Forum gets lost as it's a sub-forum; this would be exemplified if it were a sub-sub-forum. Personally, I use the "New Posts" button, so that doesn't affect me, but just want to throw out the disagreement.


The TAMB doesnt have a bad set up format wise,does exactly what it says on the tin

General

TA specific
Home Games
Clubs
I assume this corresponds to Ireland, Fans' Forum (maybe? Could start a thread for each home game?) and Premier and First Divisions?


Away travel

General
specific games
Both these are included under our Fans' Forum.


AOB

Football - non TA
General
tech support
Photos
This then constitues World football, Off Topic, Support, etc.

Different names, but broadly speaking the same layout?

How does the content on TA differ to here? Or what would it be hoped be achieved by the changes?

[NeilMcD]

I personally do not think it has anything to do with the format of the fans forum to be honest. If anything actually represents the issue it is the fact that the discussion has become about the format. This is not a technical issue it is a cultural one that I do not think can be fixed in a quick fix. The issue can be as simple that the culture on the site over the last while has been only to talk about the tactics of the games, and not get into actually doing things and organising funny t shirts, buses to games, taxis at airports. Flags etc. putting up pictures of the away matches. Basically creating a community of supporters. This has dwained and it was dwaining before YBIG was there, in fact I think YBIG just tapped in to this.

This is a members issue as much as anything.

[pineapple stu]

Fair enough so; cheers for that.

What I'll do anyway is split the Cyprus thread into smaller, topic specific chunks; I think it'd work well.

If it's a members issue, the best thing you - or anyone - can do is start a few threads.