Harvesting Away tickets

[gspain]

In the past England and Scotland travel clubs have had issues with fans harvesting tickets. This means buying away tickets to get loyalty points and not going to the games.

I know of some fans who have bought 4 tickets for each of our 3 away games and still haven't attended an away game in this campaign. I've just heard 2nd hand of another group who have done something similiar. A mate will be buying their Bulgaria tickets.

In Montenegro we had 2,000 tickets sold but I doubt if we had that many in the away end. Over 5,000 tickets sold for the Irish end in Bari yet 3,000-3,500 fans in our end. Some no shows may be down to the recession but surely not all.

It is an expensive business buying tickets you don't use. Thos eof us who do go to all games could well be left without tickets because of people who haven't travelled yet.

Maybe it's time we had a proper travel club with fans required to provide airline boarding passes as per Scotland or occasionally pick up tickets abroad showing your passport as per England.

BTW there is no guarantee that even those that travel will get tickets should we reach South Africa.

[Bluetonic]

The exact same happens for home games with people taking numerous tickets and selling them for every game at face value.

What makes it worse is that sites like foot.ie facilitate people in this 'harvesting'.

[Superhoops]

In the past England and Scotland travel clubs have had issues with fans harvesting tickets. This means buying away tickets to get loyalty points and not going to the games.

I know of some fans who have bought 4 tickets for each of our 3 away games and still haven't attended an away game in this campaign. I've just heard 2nd hand of another group who have done something similiar. A mate will be buying their Bulgaria tickets.

In Montenegro we had 2,000 tickets sold but I doubt if we had that many in the away end. Over 5,000 tickets sold for the Irish end in Bari yet 3,000-3,500 fans in our end. Some no shows may be down to the recession but surely not all.

It is an expensive business buying tickets you don't use. Thos eof us who do go to all games could well be left without tickets because of people who haven't travelled yet.

Maybe it's time we had a proper travel club with fans required to provide airline boarding passes as per Scotland or occasionally pick up tickets abroad showing your passport as per England.

BTW there is no guarantee that even those that travel will get tickets should we reach South Africa.

Apart from the later rounds of the WCF's the only places I can remember having to collect tickets abroad were in Tehran in 2001, and in Tbilisi and Tirana in 2003, all of which had very small numbers.

Edit: Forgot Mainz last year.

[NeilMcD]

The exact same happens for home games with people taking numerous tickets and selling them for every game at face value.

What makes it worse is that sites like foot.ie facilitate people in this 'harvesting'.

Technically a lot of us harvest I suppose. I get tickets and I bring my Dad and brothers to the home games on them. However if for whatever reason they cannnot go, work etc. I will ask one of my mates to go instead and if not we take the hit. The system in one way encourages this or forces this as there is no way you are going to give up your tickets just cause you cant make one match. I go to all the home and away games .

[Colie]

I've always hoped that in some way if you could prove you were there you got the ticket. That's how it ended up working in Mainz & that seemed to work great. The FAI lad had our names down & all & there wasn't a queue or anything. I think it should always be done like this for the away games. That said, I've never not got into the game but paying €300 a ticket is a bit of a bummer when you've been able to get tix no bother for other games. Deffo gonna hurt the wallet when we get to SA. I'd be expecting to pay €300+ per game down there even though the FAI know who goes to all the away matches at this stage anyways.

[Newryrep]

In the past England and Scotland travel clubs have had issues with fans harvesting tickets. This means buying away tickets to get loyalty points and not going to the games.

I know of some fans who have bought 4 tickets for each of our 3 away games and still haven't attended an away game in this campaign. I've just heard 2nd hand of another group who have done something similiar. A mate will be buying their Bulgaria tickets.

In Montenegro we had 2,000 tickets sold but I doubt if we had that many in the away end. Over 5,000 tickets sold for the Irish end in Bari yet 3,000-3,500 fans in our end. Some no shows may be down to the recession but surely not all.

It is an expensive business buying tickets you don't use. Thos eof us who do go to all games could well be left without tickets because of people who haven't travelled yet.

Maybe it's time we had a proper travel club with fans required to provide airline boarding passes as per Scotland or occasionally pick up tickets abroad showing your passport as per England.

BTW there is no guarantee that even those that travel will get tickets should we reach South Africa.

surely the reason for the away points system is to ensure that where tickets have been difficult to come by those who freqently travel get them.

However It was stated here in the general consensus that only 2 games in the past number of years were tickets a real issue Belgium and Basle Mk 1 so it was thought there is no need for it as it will cost money to administer.
It became an issue for Scotland when in Kiev how prevelent it was as 20% nearly 200 tickets werent collected for the match. You would hope the FAI have made a note of who bought tickets at least

[magnumpi]

for recent matches you can't buy tickets without providing travel details, so wouldn't this put most people off doing this?

sorry, not sure i understand how it works

[Sligo Hornet]

for recent matches you can't buy tickets without providing travel details, so wouldn't this put most people off doing this?

sorry, not sure i understand how it works


I know what you mean but I am pretty sure no one checks the details given. They probably just get filed and only reviewed if someone misbehaves

[gspain]

Tickets for major finals will normally be a problem. England have ticket problems for quite a few away games as they are a big draw in the home country and thus normally just get the minimum away allocation.

This campaign is the first time I've noticed it for us. Clearly there were hundreds of tickets not sued in Montenegro and 1,500-2,000 unused for Bari. No doubt some of these are genuine and we had one unused ticket in our group as somebody who had paid to travel couldn't.

[jbyrne]

maybe the georgia match venue switch stopped a few going to monty also. they may have been planning attending both matches but when one was switched they had to change their plans

[aidz1]

Harvesting homes tickets is worse.
There are holding tickets from the waiting list and then regularly come on here 'doing a favour' by offering tickets :/
I know a lot who are block booking waiting listers but have attended all games in this group (home and away- who have attended homes for years but cant get on the block booking scheme). But should an away allocation number be restricted they would lose out to a blockbooker with homes only when distribition of tickets is being done. I dont think there is fairness there. There have been people on the waiting list for up to 8 years now...

tickets may have been easier got for this qualifier series, but in the last qualifiers we got knocked back from the fai for the czech and germany aways (although we did get sorted with home end tickets).

That said, the way the economy has gone recently, harvesting tickets may not be an option. Though the re-opening of landsdowne will lure some to remain hoarding these tickets.

[Newryrep]

Harvesting homes tickets is worse.
There are holding tickets from the waiting list and then regularly come on here 'doing a favour' by offering tickets :/
I know a lot who are block booking waiting listers but have attended all games in this group (home and away- who have attended homes for years but cant get on the block booking scheme). But should an away allocation number be restricted they would lose out to a blockbooker with homes only when distribition of tickets is being done. I dont think there is fairness there. There have been people on the waiting list for up to 8 years now...

tickets may have been easier got for this qualifier series, but in the last qualifiers we got knocked back from the fai for the czech and germany aways (although we did get sorted with home end tickets).

That said, the way the economy has gone recently, harvesting tickets may not be an option. Though the re-opening of landsdowne will lure some to remain hoarding these tickets.

Its probably luck and timing of the fixtures that havent caused any major issues. Germany away 06 on a saturday in late summer was the glamourous tie last series there seemed to be alot about here requesting tickets although in the end some of the posters couldnt give away tickets. (This was helped in no small measure by the german ticket agency issueing tickets before they caught on) but in theory 12000 travelled we only got 6000 tickets.

Thought Italy away this time (Rome, saturday game, late/early summer etc) would of casued some ticketing issues but with it being in Bari and early april it didnt materialise.

Would fans be willing to pay an admin fee for a guaranteed away ticket subject to a points scheme ?. I doubt it but it may worth looking at if we get to a playoff/finals and loyal travellers (as opposed to loyal home supporters) are screwed. I dont want to spend what ever time I have on foreign soil before a match running around trying to source 2 tickets

[NeilMcD]

Harvesting homes tickets is worse.
There are holding tickets from the waiting list and then regularly come on here 'doing a favour' by offering tickets :/
I know a lot who are block booking waiting listers but have attended all games in this group (home and away- who have attended homes for years but cant get on the block booking scheme). But should an away allocation number be restricted they would lose out to a blockbooker with homes only when distribition of tickets is being done. I dont think there is fairness there. There have been people on the waiting list for up to 8 years now...

tickets may have been easier got for this qualifier series, but in the last qualifiers we got knocked back from the fai for the czech and germany aways (although we did get sorted with home end tickets).

That said, the way the economy has gone recently, harvesting tickets may not be an option. Though the re-opening of landsdowne will lure some to remain hoarding these tickets.


Just out of interest I asked to be on the list in 2003 and I was on the waiting list up until the game agaist Israel at home in 2005 so that was 2 years on the waiting list. However I went to every game while I was on the waiting list because the likes of Georgia Albania and Russia did not take up their full allocation. I have been on the full block booking since then. Wondering how it is possible for someone to be on the list for 8 years. Did the FAI preference some over others or did those who have been on the waiting list for 8 years miss friendly games.

[KildareRed]

[QUOTE=gspain;1147419]I know of some fans who have bought 4 tickets for each of our 3 away games and still haven't attended an away game in this campaign. I've just heard 2nd hand of another group who have done something similiar. A mate will be buying their Bulgaria tickets.
QUOTE]

In fairness the FAI dont really have a loyalty scheme so these people who have bought tickets for away games and have not used them its at their own loss. If we got a small allocation for Bulgaria someone who hasnt been to any away games so far has the same chance in getting a ticket as someone who has been to all the games if both are block bookers. Loyalty scheme wouldnt really work as it would encourage people buying and selling on the tickets. Also not many of our away games have sold out in the last few years

[Mayo_Bhoy]

Well, i'm robably guilty of this. I've been getting 2 tickets for every home game since 1992 and numerous occasions i havent been able to go for various reasons so always sell them on to mates. I have been left holding tickets for friendlies which i couldnt get rid of however. No way am i giving this up though!

[Colie]

Good points. If we're in a qualifier you should HAVE to show your ticket stubbs for the away matches to get a ticket. If we're in a qualifier I know most of us that go to them all could be screwed. Guess we'll just have to win the group. Seriously though, there could be some real pain.

[NeilMcD]

I must say if I was offered 3 tickets for a playoff game and 3 mates of mine wanted to go and only 1 was a regular and goes to all the away games I would give my extra ticket to somebody who I meet at all the Ireland games, somebody who I know goes to all the games.

[elroy]

Just out of interest I asked to be on the list in 2003 and I was on the waiting list up until the game agaist Israel at home in 2005 so that was 2 years on the waiting list. However I went to every game while I was on the waiting list because the likes of Georgia Albania and Russia did not take up their full allocation. I have been on the full block booking since then. Wondering how it is possible for someone to be on the list for 8 years. Did the FAI preference some over others or did those who have been on the waiting list for 8 years miss friendly games.

Im on the waiting list since 2001 roughly. I go to all home games and at least one away game a year. I should be on the block booking list by now but the fai screwed up my application and i think i was put to the back of the list again.

[Bluetonic]

Simple solution is to load tickets (home - away won't work) on a nominated card (social security card, work id, or mobile phone etc.., - we'll rule out bank and credit cards) One card one ticket, unique card id matches swipe at gate preloaded by FAI, scanned by scanner.

Tickets will be less likely to change hands and be harvested if they are loaded onto something personal and valuable.

The technology is out there but then if the FAI can't issue standard swipe cards (even the GAA have this now and although they can be passed around they've cut down touting (or harvesting if you want to call it that) massively) what hope is there for the more secure system above.

[Junior]

Unfortunately touting still alive and well with grounds that use swipe cards such as Old Trafford. It probably does reduce the amount of 'harvesting' I suppose where fans are just looking to recoup face value but dont feel comfortabel in passing on their swipe cards to strangers etc...

[Newryrep]

Harvesting as i understand it is buying tickets with no intention of going but only to be registered that you went to an away game so when a difficult ticket situation arises there is a record that you 'went' to all the away game.

That is different to touting.

Hovever in an Irish context what is the point .. unless the FAI keep a record who gets away tickets and uses it as a means of who is more deserving?

[jbyrne]

Harvesting as i understand it is buying tickets with no intention of going but only to be registered that you went to an away game so when a difficult ticket situation arises there is a record that you 'went' to all the away game.

That is different to touting.

Hovever in an Irish context what is the point .. unless the FAI keep a record who gets away tickets and uses it as a means of who is more deserving?

agree. given that you have to apply for tickets well in advance and given that the away ticket prices are usually quite small id say its all more of a case that lads get tickets in case they go but dont always be able to do so. i dont think theres anything sinister about it at all

[zenokelly]

agree. given that you have to apply for tickets well in advance and given that the away ticket prices are usually quite small id say its all more of a case that lads get tickets in case they go but dont always be able to do so. i dont think theres anything sinister about it at all

Ya I think this thread is really making a meal out of nothing. I don't see what 'harvesters' would be harvesting for, as in reality if you are a block booker you can nearly be assured you'll get tickets from the FAI for the WC, bar if it was in Europe. Their own loss in my opinion.

[NeilMcD]

Will the FAI get tickets for the world cup though.

[jbyrne]

Will the FAI get tickets for the world cup though.

it doesnt look like it. see the end of this article...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/internationals/7498630.stm

[reder]

This campaign is the first time I've noticed it for us. Clearly there were hundreds of tickets not sued in Montenegro and 1,500-2,000 unused for Bari. No doubt some of these are genuine and we had one unused ticket in our group as somebody who had paid to travel couldn't.

The travel agents had massive problems selling their packages for the Italy away game. Some were advertising, what must have been, cost price flight and tickets packages at the Bulgaria home game and in varous papers. I'd say a that a fair percentage of the unused tickets are from these packages. I know the FAI say they dont give tickets to travel agents other than Ray Treacy but these other agents always bring bus loads to big away games.

I am always unsuccessful in the "ballot" for away games that have any sort of demand. I didnt even get a ticket from the FAI for the game in Germany in the last campaign yet I had my choice of travel agent packages with tickets in the away end. I attend aways regularly including away friendlies.

Any system which means tickets go to genuine fans is good. I would love to see the travel agent situation addressed as opposed to receiving the same old response from the FAI. I am going to blow a fuse, if I have to use a travel agent again for Sofia after forking out €300 on flights and accomadation.

I am thinking of putting a note at the bottom of my application to remind them that I attended the likes of Norway away with about 800 others and Wales away when our end was half empty because there was nothing to play for. I am a BB since the start also.

[gspain]

The travel agents had massive problems selling their packages for the Italy away game. Some were advertising, what must have been, cost price flight and tickets packages at the Bulgaria home game and in varous papers. I'd say a that a fair percentage of the unused tickets are from these packages. I know the FAI say they dont give tickets to travel agents other than Ray Treacy but these other agents always bring bus loads to big away games.

I am always unsuccessful in the "ballot" for away games that have any sort of demand. I didnt even get a ticket from the FAI for the game in Germany in the last campaign yet I had my choice of travel agent packages with tickets in the away end. I attend aways regularly including away friendlies.

Any system which means tickets go to genuine fans is good. I would love to see the travel agent situation addressed as opposed to receiving the same old response from the FAI. I am going to blow a fuse, if I have to use a travel agent again for Sofia after forking out €300 on flights and accomadation.

I am thinking of putting a note at the bottom of my application to remind them that I attended the likes of Norway away with about 800 others and Wales away when our end was half empty because there was nothing to play for. I am a BB since the start also.

The FAI will give tickets to travel agents when there are extra tickets aka Italy. They just give block bookers priority. For most away games anybody can get tickets in the away end. Travel agents often source tickets locally for the home end where there is big demand.

However some of the unused tickets could well be travel agents in this case.

I started the thread because I know of a group buying away tickets with no intention of going and trying to offload them if they can but if not then no problem. I susbequently heard 2nd hand of up to 10 tickets being bought in the same way.

[Greenforever]

The FAI will give tickets to travel agents when there are extra tickets aka Italy. They just give block bookers priority. For most away games anybody can get tickets in the away end. Travel agents often source tickets locally for the home end where there is big demand.

However some of the unused tickets could well be travel agents in this case.

I started the thread because I know of a group buying away tickets with no intention of going and trying to offload them if they can but if not then no problem. I susbequently heard 2nd hand of up to 10 tickets being bought in the same way.

I dont personally know anyone doing this, but am sure it's done, similar to the way people keep block bookings in excess of the number in thier own group.

When I pointed this out on a thread for the recent home games, someone trying to offloaad bundles of tickets I got a rough time.

While the ticket exchange is a good idea in principal it seems to have the same people offering tickets regularly and the same looking for them,

[Junior]

I started the thread because I know of a group buying away tickets with no intention of going and trying to offload them if they can but if not then no problem. I susbequently heard 2nd hand of up to 10 tickets being bought in the same way.

As has been mentioned already on the tread somewhere - where is the benefit in doing this? The FAI do not have a points system to my knowledge and so no benefit is really gained.

Is it a case of just having it there as backup to an argument if WC2010 tickets are hard to source and trying to use it as a goodwill angle with the FAI - "Look at me 'superfan' - I should get tickets"?

[gspain]

As has been mentioned already on the tread somewhere - where is the benefit in doing this? The FAI do not have a points system to my knowledge and so no benefit is really gained.

Is it a case of just having it there as backup to an argument if WC2010 tickets are hard to source and trying to use it as a goodwill angle with the FAI - "Look at me 'superfan' - I should get tickets"?

It is an attempt to ensure they get tickets for the world cup if we qualify. There is no allocation system as you say but you'd imagine those who have "attended" all the qualifiers will get preference. However I attended all 12 qualifiers in 94 and wasn't allocated any tickets for the finals (I did get them in the end).

So far it has cost them €19 per head total for 3 games. Cyprus normally charge us 3-4 times the home fans price so that will be expensive for them.

In reality I don't think tickets will be a problem in South Africa except maybe for a game v a top seed like Brazil, England or the hosts.

[NeilMcD]

Lets hope you are right gspin as I stupidly never applied for tickets for South Africa.

[Junior]

I didnt bother either. I wont be going to SA unless we qualify and family commitments now mean that if I can go it will have to be planned carefully to minimise cost/time away etc.. Past experience in America and Japan has meant Im not going to overly worry at this stage about tickets.

Lets get there first!!!

[NeilMcD]

I purposely do not start a family or have any interaction with the opposite sex in order so I can go to the World Cup. That is the only family planning I do.

[Junior]

Judging by the amount of 'thinly veiled' flirting groundwork with female (I think?) posters you do on this site, that might not last forever;)

Lets review your status pre-2014 World Cup!!!

[NeilMcD]

Problem is Junior is that the likes of Babysis and Green Tribe have all met me in person and that ends the flirting as they see my face.

[corkboy360]

Calm down lads
Who said we will get to SA ?

[NeilMcD]

Ha ha, on other forum people are giving out because people are chatting about possible play off opponents and saying we can win the group. Here people are giving out cause we are chatting out about potential ticket issues if we qualify.

I wonder is this how Bertie Ahern worked. When Members of his cabinet a few years ago started saying Boss what will we do if the property market goes bust what will we do. Ahh lads why dont you go and hang yourselves we are going to boom and the boom times are going to get even boomier.

[gspain]

So Neil do you fancy us to play Brazil or Germany in the final? :D

Based on the England figures (have to assume all countries got the same) there were approx 8,800 TSTs given out.

If we qualify there will be another 12% for Irish fans (appreciate jbyrne's link that the FAI may not get these but they will be for Irish fans) say 6,000 min per game. The travel agents will also get a chunk of tickets for the first time since 1994. These will be at ripoff prices but will take care of the corporate end.

We should be up at 16,000 - 17,000 for the bigger stadiums.

Local demand is not that high. I suspect that a good chunk of those that have bought tickets intend to tout them. They may go if it is Brazil but Ireland v Paraguay or Korea.

If we draw England, Brazil or the hosts then tickets for that game will be at a premium. Otherwise there should be spares floating around.

In 2002 the only game that had fans locked out was v Saudi in Yokohama. The locals in Japan all wanted to go to games. The Koreans by and large didn't bother or couldn't afford it. I'm pretty sure all block bookers were sorted out by the FAI. 13,000 travelled. I can see a few more going to South Africa if we make it but in the current climate even 20,000 might be optimistic.

So in summary I think tickets will be OK in the end. Qualifying will be much much harder,

[NeilMcD]

I just think its terrible that we have to qualify for 2014 in Brazil even though we will be World Champions. I think Delaney should do something about it.

[jbyrne]

In 2002 the only game that had fans locked out was v Saudi in Yokohama.

this was a disgrace at the time as the match was not a sell out. we needed to replace our tickets (long story!) yet we could not get any officially (got sorted in the end elsewhere though). we couldnt believe it when we got to the match and saw empty seats as we were aware of others who came out to Japan en-spec only to be unable to get tickets

[gspain]

this was a disgrace at the time as the match was not a sell out. we needed to replace our tickets (long story!) yet we could not get any officially (got sorted in the end elsewhere though). we couldnt believe it when we got to the match and saw empty seats as we were aware of others who came out to Japan en-spec only to be unable to get tickets

The match was definitely soldout as were all the games in Japan if I recall correctly. I don't remember too many empty seats either. The Japanese were really keen to go to any games and a couple of hundred at least followed us to Korea. Two of us went to Mexico v Ecuador in Myagi and had huge problems getting an extra ticket. As Yokohama is neat Tokyo and was the biggest stadium w eplayed in (and potentially the least attractive game)
many saw this as an opportunity to go on spec. Contrast that with Ibaraki - small stadium - Ireland v Germany yet loads of tickets at face value

I know Cameroon v Saudi had thousands of empty seats but was also officially soldout. It is often down to sponsor's tickets not being used.

[Claret Murph]

I have been to two world cups 90 & 94 and never had a ticket for game before I got there and somehow managed to buy tickets for all of Irelands games now I did have to pat $190 for a ticket in 94 for some game against Italy but I did think it was quite well worth it at the end .:)
Until four years ago I used to take my chance at the home games looking for tickets and never failed to get one at Jury's , maybe I was lucky but some times you make your own luck as I would ask everybody who pased me .:ball:

[jbyrne]

The match was definitely soldout as were all the games in Japan if I recall correctly. I don't remember too many empty seats either. The Japanese were really keen to go to any games and a couple of hundred at least followed us to Korea. Two of us went to Mexico v Ecuador in Myagi and had huge problems getting an extra ticket. As Yokohama is neat Tokyo and was the biggest stadium w eplayed in (and potentially the least attractive game)
many saw this as an opportunity to go on spec. Contrast that with Ibaraki - small stadium - Ireland v Germany yet loads of tickets at face value

I know Cameroon v Saudi had thousands of empty seats but was also officially soldout. It is often down to sponsor's tickets not being used.

we actually went to the wc ticket headquaters in tokyo and were told there were tickets but we had to call the phone line to purchase them. sat in a japaneses contacts house for about 6 hrs on the phone but couldnt get through. the game was the highest non japanese attendance of the first round but there were empty seats in the opposite end of the ground from us for sure. there were also 3 empty seats due to lost / stolen tickets in the Irish end but thats a different story!

[Colbert Report]

Simple solution: screw the block bookers, have everyone who wants a ticket register online for a pair, then have the FAI do an open draw a few weeks before a match. Done!

[NeilMcD]

Thats hardly fair. People who go to all the games need to be rewarded. The block booking system being used for home games is not perfect but its a lot fairer than what you suggest.

[Greenforever]

Simple solution: screw the block bookers, have everyone who wants a ticket register online for a pair, then have the FAI do an open draw a few weeks before a match. Done!


So I like Neil & Been There and a few others like that on this forum, who in the past year have been to Bari, Montenegro, Mainze, Oslo, Craven Cottage, Bratislava, Prague, Cardiff, Aarhus etc over the past 24 months should have to go in a draw with someone that has not gone to a singe game:confused:

[Colbert Report]

These people are rich if they can afford to jet around the world watching football. No sympathy for them. I recently attended Ireland/Bulgaria at Croke Park and it was the first match I've ever been to in my life! I probably won't be able to afford another match for another ten years. Screw these rich people, everyone should have the same chance to get tickets.

[Greenforever]

These people are rich if they can afford to jet around the world watching football. No sympathy for them. I recently attended Ireland/Bulgaria at Croke Park and it was the first match I've ever been to in my life! I probably won't be able to afford another match for another ten years. Screw these rich people, everyone should have the same chance to get tickets.


If you hadnt finished your post with the underlined bit, I would quite happily have given you a ticket for your next match,

Let me tell you that most of the hard core are far from rich, my average trip costs €350 for flights and hotels x 4 games a year = €1,400

I don't smoke - 20 a day costs about €2,500

I rarely go out at home

I keep all my holidays for matches

My circumstances are very similar to most of the hardcore support....

[zenokelly]

These people are rich if they can afford to jet around the world watching football. No sympathy for them. I recently attended Ireland/Bulgaria at Croke Park and it was the first match I've ever been to in my life! I probably won't be able to afford another match for another ten years. Screw these rich people, everyone should have the same chance to get tickets.

You're talkin through your aras. Seeing you've only been to one match, and it was at home, you seem to know an awful lot about travelling fans...

I couldn't be even bothered trying to reply to that post.

[NeilMcD]

I really hope this guy is **** stirring I really do hope he is. If not the poor guy is deluded. Anyway I wish my butler was better at typing because sometimes he makes typos on this forum and I am going to whip him now for such errors. He was talking ****e too on the Roy Keane thread under my name.