Bosman ruling

[pineapple stu]

I think I've asked this before, but how does the Bosman ruling affect out-of-contract signings between League of Ireland clubs? Say if Cawley leaves for Shels, are we due compensation because he's under 23? And will we be due a percentage of any future transfer fees because we've developed him for the past two years? Or doe sthat latter apply only to schoolboy clubs?

Any ideas?

[John83]

AFAIK, we get nothing for him under the new FIFA rules in a domestic transfer for developing him (would/will be some amount per year we had him under the age of 21 if/when he went/goes abroad), but we should get compo for the bosman as he's under 23 under the EU transfer deal of a couple of years ago.

[Xlex]

IMO, any devolopment fee is due when the player undergoes an international transfer, ie. Crumlin United were due cash because of Keanes transfer from Leeds to Spurs, yet Wolves weren't...

[Schumi]

Originally posted by pineapple stu
Say if Cawley leaves for Shels, are we due compensation because he's under 23? Yes, does anyone know how much we'd get or how it's calculated?


And will we be due a percentage of any future transfer fees because we've developed him for the past two years? Or does that latter apply only to schoolboy clubs? Only if he goes abroad for money (i.e. not a free transfer) or if he subsequently moves within that country or to another. I'm not sure of what happens if he were to move back to Ireland though.

[Dodge]

The total owed to all “development” clubs is 5%

Depends on when they(UEFA?FIFA?) decide his development starts. If they say it starts at 16, and he plays for UCD between 18-23. UCD would be owed 5/7ths of that 5% of any international fee….

Seems straight forward to me
:confused: :confused: :confused:

[Schumi]

Originally posted by Dodge
The total owed to all “development” clubs is 5%

Depends on when they(UEFA?FIFA?) decide his development starts. If they say it starts at 16, and he plays for UCD between 18-23. UCD would be owed 5/7ths of that 5% of any international fee…. That's different to the under 23 compensation though isn't it? Teams get paid that under the Bosman ruling, i.e. even if the player is out of contract, there's some fee paid. Or am I wrong?

[pete]

Originally posted by Dodge
The total owed to all “development” clubs is 5%

Depends on when they(UEFA?FIFA?) decide his development starts. If they say it starts at 16, and he plays for UCD between 18-23.

Yeah sounds ridiculous to be saying development starts at 8 or so... Then again I don't know what age it should start at.

Seems very strange that FIFA/Uefa have not clarified all the conditions to these new rules. Crazy that Crumlin Utd had to get clrification on the Robbie Keane transfer - surely all the permutations have been worked out by now?

:confused:

[UCD_4_Life]

Originally posted by Schumi
That's different to the under 23 compensation though isn't it? Teams get paid that under the Bosman ruling, i.e. even if the player is out of contract, there's some fee paid. Or am I wrong?

Yeah, if he's under 23 then they get compenstation after a tribunal.

Sunderland got paid off like £500,000 a few weeks ago there after David Bellion went to Man Utd. They've only had him since 2001 and he rarely played so it definitely wasn't for development.

Plus, it's in CM. So it must be true!

[John83]

Originally posted by UCD_4_Life
Yeah, if he's under 23 then they get compenstation after a tribunal.

Sunderland got paid off like £500,000 a few weeks ago there after David Bellion went to Man Utd. They've only had him since 2001 and he rarely played so it definitely wasn't for development.

Plus, it's in CM. So it must be true!

Actually, Man Utd had to cough up something like £2m for Bellion, which was a joke. It's far too mcuh. And yes, we would get somthing for him going on a Bosman.

As for when youth development starts, I'm nearly sure it's 12.

[Bald Student]

I think that it's 12 aswell. I'm not sure if senior clubs get it. I think that the 5% compensation only goes to schoolboy clubs

[UCD_4_Life]

That's another drawback of the one year contract dealie - if we were able to actually sell players we could bung in a 10% sell on clause just in case whoever we're selling goes for a big amount at some stage. So if Doyler was bought tomorrow by Southampton or someone for €500,000 we'd get fifty grand which is worth two Jay Byrnes...had we've had even one this season we'd be challenging for Europe!

[pineapple stu]

How many players will leave for England for that sort of money or anything close to it though? The most anyone's left Ireland for is around E200000 (Noel Hunt to Dunfermline). which was exceptional. You'd be talking half that again as a decent sum. 10% is only 10k. Still a nice bit of money, but then again, how often is it going to happen, especially in this world of Bosmans?

We have a sell-on clause in Ciarán Martyn's transfer, though - 50%!!! I thought he was out of contract when he left, in which case it's possible that you can put in sell-on clauses in Bosman transfers for players under 23. Does that make any sense???

[Schumi]

Originally posted by pineapple stu
it's possible that you can put in sell-on clauses in Bosman transfers for players under 23. Does that make any sense??? That might have been in lieu of getting money maybe? I don't know how this works though.

[pineapple stu]

Nuts to this; I'll just ask Maccer the next time I see him!

[John83]

Originally posted by pineapple stu
Nuts to this; I'll just ask Maccer the next time I see him!
He'll probably just give you the evil eye and refer you to some random 230 page document on fifa.com

[pineapple stu]

Originally posted by John83
He'll probably just give you the evil eye and refer you to some random 230 page document on fifa.com

:D

He was in a good enough mood on Sunday, given what'd gone on before. Offered to buy us a pint for doing the programme all season before I pointed out that we'd been doing the programme all season and could afford lots of pints! Also Robbie Mac had given us two of his Preciousssssses, but we weren't allowed to tell anyone that for some reason!

[Macy]

Originally posted by John83
Actually, Man Utd had to cough up something like £2m for Bellion, which was a joke. It's far too mcuh. And yes, we would get somthing for him going on a Bosman.
United settled with Sunderland for 2 million, allegedly to cover up he was tapped!

[John83]

Originally posted by Macy
United settled with Sunderland for 2 million, allegedly to cover up he was tapped!
No, it definately went to tribunal, although I did hear that Man U didn't contest it for that reason alright.

[pineapple stu]

Incidentally, Sunderland have just gotten out of paying Celtic for Colin Healy on the grounds that he was 23. Ceefax says that any transfer between an English, Scots or Irish club (presumably Welsh too) of a player under 23 (not 23 or under) has to result in compensation. Which still leaves open the issue of whether that holds for transfers within a country, as opposed to from one to another, which transfers have different rules in some cases.

[John83]

Originally posted by pineapple stu
Which still leaves open the issue of whether that holds for transfers within a country, as opposed to from one to another, which transfers have different rules in some cases.

No, it doesn't. If you sign someone on a Bosman who's under 23, you pay compensation. It's only the FIFA schoolboy development thing which is not applicable for national transfers.

[UCD_4_Life]

Originally posted by pineapple stu
How many players will leave for England for that sort of money or anything close to it though? The most anyone's left Ireland for is around E200000 (Noel Hunt to Dunfermline). which was exceptional. You'd be talking half that again as a decent sum. 10% is only 10k. Still a nice bit of money, but then again, how often is it going to happen, especially in this world of Bosmans?

We have a sell-on clause in Ciarán Martyn's transfer, though - 50%!!! I thought he was out of contract when he left, in which case it's possible that you can put in sell-on clauses in Bosman transfers for players under 23. Does that make any sense???

Okay, if you're gonna be so smart about it:

That's another drawback of the one year contract dealie - if we were able to actually sell players we could bung in a 50% sell on clause just in case whoever we're selling goes for a big amount at some stage. So if Doyler was bought tomorrow by Southampton or someone for €100,000 we'd get fifty grand which is worth two Jay Byrnes...had we've had even one this season we'd be challenging for Europe!