World Cup VS Champions League

[Pike B]

This is an arguement that crops up every 3 or 4 years, and every time I stand by my opinion which is, The World Cup is, always has been, and always will be, the greater competition.

I refer to a comment made in another thread by someone stating 'Champions league for me every time'.

I support Liverpool Fc and am a huge fan of the Champions League. It has no equal in club competition worldwide, but it is never as prestigous as winning the big one.

After reading that chaps opinion, I wondered what the general consensus might be, so I asked 10 workmates this question:
If you were playing for your favourite club, and an Irish International, which would you rather win, The World Cup or The Champions League?

The score was 9-1.
To the World Cup.

What say the rest of you on here????

[old git]

This is an arguement that crops up every 3 or 4 years, and every time I stand by my opinion which is, The World Cup is, always has been, and always will be, the greater competition.

I refer to a comment made in another thread by someone stating 'Champions league for me every time'.

I support Liverpool Fc and am a huge fan of the Champions League. It has no equal in club competition worldwide, but it is never as prestigous as winning the big one.

After reading that chaps opinion, I wondered what the general consensus might be, so I asked 10 workmates this question:
If you were playing for your favourite club, and an Irish International, which would you rather win, The World Cup or The Champions League?

The score was 9-1.
To the World Cup.

What say the rest of you on here????

would have to agree with you ...... no greater honour to play for your country and win the biggest & best competion in the world .. the one and only world cup :ball: nothing else would come close to this ..

[Pike B]

would have to agree with you ...... no greater honour to play for your country and win the biggest & best competion in the world .. the one and only world cup :ball: nothing else would come close to this ..
Thats 10-1.. Cheers old git..

[Neish]

World cup every time for me. Players(well the vast majority of them) always seem to play better and more passionatly when playing for their national team. And the fact that the world cup is only every 4 years and the champions league is every year, means better excitment and anticpation for the world cup

[Cymro]

World Cup. The CL is a horrendously overrated competition in which the format makes it hard to see any real shocks or surprises year to year. The same teams will always dominate it, whereas in the WC you often get genuine surprises even if the same group of teams may ultimately win it.

[Pike B]

12-1..
This is a landslide..
And I agree 100% with both the above statements.

[First]

As an Everton supporter , I would have to say World Cup , but seriously it would have to get my vote everytime . Roll on South Africa beginning tonight with a win...............

[brianw82]

Agree 100%. World Cup every time. The elation on the faces of the Italian players back in '06 tells you how much it means to players, and the scenes of celebration on the streets tell you how much it means to the fans.

[seand]

World Cup, of course.

Anyone with a soul would have to go for the World Cup.

[bennocelt]

Pike me old mucker ypu have totally missed the point:)

of course world cup is great for the heart and soul
but as a true lover of the great game the CL and club football is the best
I love watching good competive league games in the CL
and as far as I have seen the last few world cups have been mostly dissapointing with only a handful of decent teams (if that
and i ask wouldnt manure utd trash most natioanl teams?

[Mr Maroon]

The World Cup has much more romance and tradition but it has become just as commercialised as the CL now IMO.
When it comes to football my heart is shared between Galway United and Juventus, I don't really have much interest in our national team so I have to say my vote goes to the CL.

What's that, 15-2?

[osarusan]

and as far as I have seen the last few world cups have been mostly dissapointing with only a handful of decent teams
To be fair, the CL has only a handful of decent teams too. UEFA's desire to milk every available cent from the competition has seen it expand to the stage where half the teams are absolute garbage.

[irishultra]

european cup(european nations) is da best imo

[Pike B]

european cup(european nations) is da best imo
Good point too. Last years Euros were without doubt the best International tourney since Mexico 86 for me..
But to answer Benno me old adversery.

The football played in the group stages of the Champions League, is in my opinion as bad if not worse than any group game in the World Cup. I mean I'd rather watch Ecuador-Poland than say Celtic-Aalborg any day of the week.
And when you get down to the last 8 in both the standard is superb. But, the players always give that little bit extra for their countries, thus making the World Cup that bit more special.

So, I have the score at 15 WorldCup - 3 ChampsLeague..

[bennocelt]

The World Cup has much more romance and tradition but it has become just as commercialised as the CL now IMO.
When it comes to football my heart is shared between Galway United and Juventus, I don't really have much interest in our national team so I have to say my vote goes to the CL.What's that, 15-2?

15 - 2 my hat!!!!!!!!! ha ha this is ireland where people call "my team" liverpool, everton , man utd, celtic, etc - ur having a laugh -

Here in London at work its all Millwall, Charlton, West Ham, etc etc
Absolutely no mention of the England game at all yesterday - strange that!

As I said - world cup for the heart but league football for the head

Likewise Mr Maroon - ihave no interest in the national team - the LOI all the way for me, and I would much prefer to see a LOI team in the CL than Ireland get into a world cup :)

[Mr Maroon]

Likewise Mr Maroon - ihave no interest in the national team - the LOI all the way for me, and I would much prefer to see a LOI team in the CL than Ireland get into a world cup :)

Without a shadow of a doubt, even if that team was Sligo! :eek: :p

[holidaysong]

I think the World Cup is the better competition but I'd rather Dundalk win the Champions League than Ireland win the World Cup.

[Bluebeard]

Don't give a damn as long as I get to score a hattrick in the last fifteen minutes to knock out Rovers on the way...

Of the big competitions (WC, CL, Euros, UEFA), the one I would give a damn about most would be the Euros. Generally a very tough competition to get into, generally very good football, generally a lot of grudge matches, generally won by a deserving team. As you can imagine, I cried tears of both bitterness and begrudgery when Greece won it. What does that make it? 15-2-1?

[stojkovic]

Here in London at work its all Millwall, Charlton, West Ham, etc etc
Absolutely no mention of the England game at all yesterday - strange that!


Yes but when England get to the Semi Finals of the World Cup they are dancing in the streets !

[bennocelt]

Yes but when England get to the Semi Finals of the World Cup they are dancing in the streets !


ha ha ha Stok - thats a rare thing indeed!!!!!!:)

Guys dont get me wrong of course I love Int football too - but just prefer the club game

I especially enjoyed watching the African teams in the last world cup - much purer football than the cynical italians
And this years Euros were excellent ( that and the fat I made a killing in the bookies!)

But Ac Milan with the Dutch trio ?
Ajax
Celtic 67 team
various Man U teams down through the years
Clough (My all time fav manager)
Ferguson
Real Madrid
Barcelona (Barca 4 - Manure 0)
etc

[Pike B]

ha ha ha Stok - thats a rare thing indeed!!!!!!:)

Guys dont get me wrong of course I love Int football too - but just prefer the club game

I especially enjoyed watching the African teams in the last world cup - much purer football than the cynical italians
And this years Euros were excellent ( that and the fat I made a killing in the bookies!)

But Ac Milan with the Dutch trio ?
Ajax
Celtic 67 team
various Man U teams down through the years
Clough (My all time fav manager)
Ferguson
Real Madrid
Barcelona (Barca 4 - Manure 0)
etc
Uruguay shocking 200,000 people in the Marecana in 1950.
Brazil 1958(17 year old Pele crying on his team mates shoulders).
Garrincha's magic in 1962.
The Russian Linesman in 1966.
The single greatest team ever in 1970.
Germany destroying Total football in 1974.
Argentina 1978, a military victory.
Paolo Rossi 1982.
Diego's Cup 1986.
Roger Milla, Carlos Valderama, and of course the boys in green 1990.
Jack's last big one, Baggio, Romario and again Valderama 1994.
Zizou's face on the Arc De Triomphe 1998.
Big Ronny's grin and 8 goals 2002.
United Italy wins for themselves 2006.....

You want Color? Memories? Characters? Legends?

You want The Fifa World Cup mon ami.. ;)

The prosecution rests...

[Bluebeard]

The single greatest team ever in 1970.

That was indeed a great Waterford team, but I don't really know how this is relevant to the current discussion, never mind in favour of your argument Pike B - try keeping it on topic next time.

[Pike B]

That was indeed a great Waterford team, but I don't really know how this is relevant to the current discussion, never mind in favour of your argument Pike B - try keeping it on topic next time.
:D:D:D
Yes sir..

[bennocelt]

Pike - i was expecting that:)

but anyway Ac Milan were/are the best and most complete team I ever saw
I loved Franco Baresi - so effortless, and Van Basten up front with the odd scissors kick!:)

[Pike B]

Pike - i was expecting that:)

but anyway Ac Milan were/are the best and most complete team I ever saw
I loved Franco Baresi - so effortless, and Van Basten up front with the odd scissors kick!:)
Great team. I actually bought a retro trackie top in New York. The one those boys wore in 89-90 when warming up. It reminds me of one of the best teams I ever saw. I loved the Rossinieri back then. Still have a soft spot for them today. Champions League not the same without them.

[superfrank]

World Cup for me.

It's so much more exciting because it only happens for four weeks every four years instead of eight months every year.

You get to see how much it means to the smaller nations (like ourselves) who get there and how much it means to the large share of the fans who go to the games. It seems so much more colourful than any CL match will ever be. It also transcends club loyalties as you see players/fans from rival clubs all coming together for their country.

It always seems like the most famous/celebrated moments come from the WC. Ireland & Roger Milla in '90, Maradona in '86, Pelé in '58, Brazil in '70, Gemmill in '78, Bergkamp in '98, South Korea in '02, Italy in '06 & '82, NI in '82, England in '66, Houghton in '94, the list goes on forever. Moments from the CL aren't celebrated as much.

The difference in quality isn't really a big factor for me cos I don't really see one. There have been poor games and poor teams in both competitions and inevitably the top teams will get through.

That said though, I'd rather Wanderers qualify for the CL than see Ireland win the WC.

[Pike B]

World Cup for me.

It's so much more exciting because it only happens for four weeks every four years instead of eight months every year.

You get to see how much it means to the smaller nations (like ourselves) who get there and how much it means to the large share of the fans who go to the games. It seems so much more colourful than any CL match will ever be. It also transcends club loyalties as you see players/fans from rival clubs all coming together for their country.

It always seems like the most famous/celebrated moments come from the WC. Ireland & Roger Milla in '90, Maradona in '86, Pelé in '58, Brazil in '70, Gemmill in '78, Bergkamp in '98, South Korea in '02, Italy in '06 & '82, NI in '82, England in '66, Houghton in '94, the list goes on forever. Moments from the CL aren't celebrated as much.

The difference in quality isn't really a big factor for me cos I don't really see one. There have been poor games and poor teams in both competitions and inevitably the top teams will get through.

That said though, I'd rather Wanderers qualify for the CL than see Ireland win the WC.
You had to ruin it.. :D

[stojkovic]

Pike - i was expecting that:)

but anyway Ac Milan were/are the best and most complete team I ever saw
I loved Franco Baresi - so effortless, and Van Basten up front with the odd scissors kick!:)

Without doubt the Milan team 88-90 was a fantastic team (beat Real 5-0 in semis) and I loved watching them BUT the Liverpool team of that era was probably the best English side ever. Shame they never played each other because of the ban, I wonder what would have happened ?

Houghton-Whelan-McMahon-Barnes
Beardsley-Aldridge

[niallsparky]

I'd rather Bohs in the Champions League then Ireland winning the World Cup.

[DeLorean]

There is a much better buzz surrounding the WC or Euros. Basically you've month of solid football day and night and everybody is completely engaged in it. The Champions League is completely different in that it's stop start and games are only really discussed when they come up. I would prefer the WC and especially when it's held in Europe so the games are on at normal times.

[jbyrne]

the champions lge is a money making racket for the bigger teams untill the 1/4 finals. how often are there shocks??

the wc is miles better. the european (nations) cup is far better also

[Razors left peg]

Definately the World Cup for me. The group stages of the Champions league have been awful to watch for a while now, and even in the knock out stages I think too many teams play negative football away from home. I even enjoyed the Brazil against Italy friendly last week more than any group game of the Champions league this season

[Pike B]

Anyone got the current score??
I got sick of counting.
Think it's 27-3 to the World Cup or something like it!! :D

[Bluebeard]

Is it too late to say that the old European Cup, with two legged knock-outs the whole way along made the Champions League look like the First Division Shield in comparison?

[Pike B]

Is it too late to say that the old European Cup, with two legged knock-outs the whole way along made the Champions League look like the First Division Shield in comparison?
It would appear not sir..

[bennocelt]

Anyone got the current score??
I got sick of counting.
Think it's 27-3 to the World Cup or something like it!! :D

as i said before Pike lad, the score doesnt matter at all, its Ireland we are not exactly a hot bed of footbaLL, and have the most fairweather fans than any nation on earth

its also not about excitment, its quality, which league football has. Man Utd, Barcelona, Arsenal (when they get their act together), Inter, Lyon, etc etc.

[Pike B]

as i said before Pike lad, the score doesnt matter at all, its Ireland we are not exactly a hot bed of footbaLL, and have the most fairweather fans than any nation on earth

its also not about excitment, its quality, which league football has. Man Utd, Barcelona, Arsenal (when they get their act together), Inter, Lyon, etc etc.
Brazil, Portugal, Argentina, Spain etc etc etc... ;)

[hunt4the]

as i said before Pike lad, the score doesnt matter at all, its Ireland we are not exactly a hot bed of footbaLL, and have the most fairweather fans than any nation on earth

its also not about excitment, its quality, which league football has. Man Utd, Barcelona, Arsenal (when they get their act together), Inter, Lyon, etc etc.

you go on about quality i've never seen any in the LOI,
and it's not about excitement are you an accountant by any chance,

Its all about Ireland, its about supporting your country and everybody getting behind the national team and in a perfect world qualifying for a world cup, It's 4 weeks of heaven every 4 years with or without us in it.

Since they introduced the groups the CL is way too predictable and boring IMO

[Bluebeard]

Be wary folks, you are on the verge of pushing this over the edge into a Club Vs Country debate, which as we all know was definitively and unanimously decided in favour of, of, ehm, I know this one, just give me a second...

[Pike B]

you go on about quality i've never seen any in the LOI,
and it's not about excitement are you an accountant by any chance,

Its all about Ireland, its about supporting your country and everybody getting behind the national team and in a perfect world qualifying for a world cup, It's 4 weeks of heaven every 4 years with or without us in it.

Since they introduced the groups the CL is way too predictable and boring IMO
Beautifully put Sir..

[bennocelt]

you go on about quality i've never seen any in the LOI,
and it's not about excitement are you an accountant by any chance,

Its all about Ireland, its about supporting your country and everybody getting behind the national team and in a perfect world qualifying for a world cup, It's 4 weeks of heaven every 4 years with or without us in it.

Since they introduced the groups the CL is way too predictable and boring IMO

no i dont support Ireland - doesnt mean im unpatriotic - how could it:(
I follow the LOI, the grassroots of irish soccer, whcih without few irish players wopuld progress into the national team

i love the world cup - i hope i have made that clear
BUT i just find the day in day out bread and butter stuff more interesting:)

[Pike B]

no i dont support Ireland - doesnt mean im unpatriotic - how could it:(
I follow the LOI, the grassroots of irish soccer, whcih without few irish players wopuld progress into the national team

i love the world cup - i hope i have made that clear
BUT i just find the day in day out bread and butter stuff more interesting:)
So, I'll put you down for World Cup then..
26-2!!! :D

[hunt4the]

:confused:
no i dont support Ireland - doesnt mean im unpatriotic - how could it:(
I follow the LOI, the grassroots of irish soccer, whcih without few irish players wopuld progress into the national team

i love the world cup - i hope i have made that clear
BUT i just find the day in day out bread and butter stuff more interesting:)

how can you not support ireland!!! are you irish?

bread and butter stuff fair enough
but i remember me and me mates thinkin how lucky we
were that our leaving cert didn't fall in a world cup June
it meant that much thats what footie's all about for me

[bennocelt]

:confused:

how can you not support ireland!!! are you irish?

bread and butter stuff fair enough
but i remember me and me mates thinkin how lucky we
were that our leaving cert didn't fall in a world cup June
it meant that much thats what footie's all about for me


no i dont, i prefer the LOI, the soul of irish football. And i am irish :)

[peadar1987]

World Cup, all the way. The European Cup used to mean something, the "Champions League" (Which is neither a league, nor for champions), is just an exercise in making rich clubs richer. There are only so many times you can get worked up about Liverpool's Spaniards playing Barcelona's Spaniards (or Catalans) each season. The World Cup comes once every 4 years, so it stays fresh.

Ireland to win the world cup over Wanderers (or Stoke!) qualifying for the Champions' League.

[Pike B]

I think the league of Ireland lovers are all very loyal and its admirable that they follow a terrible low standard league so passionatley.
However be realistic lads. Ireland in the World Cup is surely more important??
Come on..

[bennocelt]

I think the league of Ireland lovers are all very loyal and its admirable that they follow a terrible low standard league so passionatley.
However be realistic lads. Ireland in the World Cup is surely more important??
Come on..

see you dont get it -its everyday football in your blood stuff, absolutely nothing got to do with quality:rolleyes:
(if thats the case why dont you follow argentina or brazil!!!)

[Bluebeard]

Ireland in the World Cup is surely more important??


Not remotely. I like to see Ireland do well, I follow their progress, and I am delighted if world cup qualification happens, or disappointed when they lose, bring on Darron Gibson.

However, when I get a text message on a Friday night telling me that a mediocre team in the second tier of a terrible low standard league in what is now a distant country have conceded a goal while 2-0 up, I almost retching. I am not saying I am a "better" fan than you because I follow my local side, even though I live elsewhere. Far from it. I am just saying that for many of us, our reality revolves around our clubs: indeed for some of us, it is as a Shamrock Rovers fan once put it on here - we'd rather our club to win a corner than Ireland to win the world cup.

As Bennocelt rightly puts it, who you follow is nothing to do with quality, it is to do with identity. Some people in Ireland follow Liverpool because that is who their family traditionally follow - an inherited identity. Some follow their local league side because it is a part of their neighborhood, and represents where they live - a community identity. Some follow Ireland because prior to the Charlton years of success there was no football in their family / area - an uncovered identity. Some move from following Ireland or Liverpool to following their local side too, or the reverse - an evolving or expanding identity.

And there are another hundred different reasons, most of them very valid reasons as football supporters to follow a team. The only one I have no time for is that of quality. You follow your team / country / club through thick and thin. It is fine being a fan of a team that plays particularly well and acknowledging that. I am a fan of the way that, say, Foggia played the first two or three seasons they were in Serie A. I don't lose sleep over how they are doing now. But to base your supporting a club or nation based on the quality is only one step short of saying that it is based on success.

Success is much sweeter when it is earned by years of following through the misery. Indeed, the best game I have ever gone to as a supporter was the game that the Blues won against Rovers to stay up in 2005. What should matter is not the team, but the reason for supporting the team - identity. I am stuck with my club, and I'd have it no other way. You are stuck with Ireland, presumably you would have it no other way either.

Basing it on quality alone makes me think of former Chelsea fans who used to have an Arsenal shirt but now are looking at a trip to Old Trafford over Easter.

I said before that this could become a debate on the whole Club v Country thing. Talking of following either club or country being the reason to choose the World Cup or CL is not remotely relevant to the debate. So now that we have eliminated that by acknowledging that that whole area is not up for discussion as it is irrelevant, PLEASE could we go back to the debate. And perhaps a poll?

My top choices of international competition, in order.
1. The European Nations Cup
2. European Cup (Pre CL)
3. European Cup Winners Cup (RIP:()
4. African Nations Cup
5. World Cup (any format other than 1986-94 - 24 teams is a bad idea)
6. World Club Cup (or whatever they call it)
...
12. Champions League:cool:

[Pike B]

Some good points, some strange points, and a fair bit of presumption, but I do hear what your saying.
I personally have zero intrest in League of Ireland.
I became a Liverpool fan for no other reason than my Uncle was a fanatic and he bought me the gear when I was 5. I've loved them since. My home which I built a year ago is named Anfield House.
I have been involved with my Junior club Pike Rovers, most of my life, since around 12 years old, and I've always seen Limerick F.C as a bit of a joke really.
I know they have some loyal supporters but I've no intrest as I said.
I love the National team because they are Ireland. Nothing else I can add really.
The World Cup I fell in love with as a 9 year old wathcing Italia 90.
No other competition brings out the passion for football in me like this tournament.
Not even if Liverpool win the league at last, would it surpass those four weeks every four years that I countdown so impatiently.
Quality never comes into it. And I did apply that badly in my post about the league of Ireland. So I take it back.

But, as you said, it's back to topic and my list would be:
1:World Cup
2:European Championships
3:Premiership
4:Champions League
5:Copa America
6:African Cup Of Nations
7:Confederations Cup
8:La Liga
9:Asian Cup
10:Copa Libertadores
11:Limerick Division 1b.
987:Eircom League..

[Bluebeard]

Hey, as long as you accept that for many the national team ranks as highly as you rate Limerick, we are at least in understanding


But, as you said, it's back to topic and my list would be:
1:World Cup
2:European Championships
3:Premiership
4:Champions League
5:Copa America
6:African Cup Of Nations
7:Confederations Cup
8:La Liga
9:Asian Cup
10:Copa Libertadores
11:Limerick Division 1b.
987:Eircom League..

Damnit, I thought that the topic was meant to be World Cup vs Champions league, with international tourneys only! :p