BBC's Top Keepers (No Given)

[an_ceannaire]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/7833000.stm

What ye think lads? All above 4 superior to Shay?

[OneRedArmy]

Hard to compare.

They all see a lot less action than Shay and have much, much better defences in front of them.

Also have played at the highest level (Champions League).

[an_ceannaire]

woud agree with Buffon and Cassilas but not VDS and 50/50 with Cech
Still its often said the best keepers are the ones with good defences as they are not called to do much, so when they are called, only the best can react.

[irishultra]

if ever there was a european national team, given would be in contention, but I think he'd be second choice at best.

[elroy]

off the top of my head i only really remember one goal Ireland conceded where i have immediately thought Shay shouldve saved that and that was against Greece in a friendly in LR around 96/97. it was a shot from the right hand side that went in at the near post, i think we lost one-nil. Im sure others might come up with one or two other examples.

Casillas is a top keeper in Spain, im not sure he would be so good in England but I think he is in the top four on merit.
Buffon is class. Van deSar has had a good season overall but a few shaky moments at the start of the season, notably against Liverpool and Cech a top keeper but imo nowhere near as good as he was pre his injury.

[Stuttgart88]

In fairness, if any commentator was to name the world’s best ‘keeper, the Ireland & Newcastle no. 1 isn’t going to be top of many people’s lists unless you’re Irish or a Geordie.

We’re hardly Man United but I’ve seen enough of Given to think he can play just as well when he’s rarely called upon as when he’s fending off an avalanche.

Montenegro away is a great example – that late save after a deflection was top class and about his only meaningful action in that game.

Iran at home in 2001 another example but I’m sure there are dozens more.

I also think Shay is confident enough to step into a big team and a big enough character to command the respect of any high profile teammate.

Of the 4 mentioned I think Given & Casillas are the two most directly comparable: neither is a beanpole and both are agile and elegant in the way they do their jobs (a bit like Seaman at his peak). I think Casillas is probably better with his feet whilst Given’s handling is better.

Cech and VDS are both top keepers but each has been fallible at key moments, Cech especially so.

Buffon stands out as the world’s best for me, though I admit I usually only see him playing for Italy.

[Closed Account]

First let me qualify this statement by saying that I hardly ever see Italian football, but why does everyone rate Buffon so highly?

Does everyone watch considerably more Italian football than me? If so, where? Buffon has been injured for a while, previous to that, has been playing
in a lower division, so why is he still always included in Best Keeper polls.

Ok, he has been a good keeper when I've seen him, and was a high transfer fee, but people write off Cech and Casillas and others based on current form or quality of opposition but Buffon seems to be imperviable to criticism.
People judging him on reputation alone in my opinion.
Casillas has been the best keeper in the world for the last 3 seasons. In my opinion.

Anyway, this is a bit off topic.

[Stuttgart88]

In my opinion Buffon just oozes authority & presence. I think his penatly save from Mutu said it all about the guy. It's not fair to say Buffon is above criticism whereas Cech is knocked for errors. I simply haven't seen Buffon make some of the errors that Cech has made (Turkey game, vs Spurs in Carling Cup, vs Liverpool in SF semi final...). I'm not even sure it's the injury that was the turning point for Cech. He was utterly brilliant in his first season at Chelsea but I think he lost form even before the Hunt incident.

I haven't seen much criticism at all of Casillas. 4 or 5 years ago I thought he was overrated but I admit my error. At the same time I was heavily critical of Robinson though few agreed with me :)

[back of the net]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/7833000.stm

What ye think lads? All above 4 superior to Shay?

agree with buffon , and am willing to just about accept casillas but cech and van der sar are not in givens class imo

[John83]

First let me qualify this statement by saying that I hardly ever see Italian football, but why does everyone rate Buffon so highly?

Does everyone watch considerably more Italian football than me? If so, where? Buffon has been injured for a while, previous to that, has been playing in a lower division, so why is he still always included in Best Keeper polls.
He was a great keeper before he spent a season in Serie B, and he's been very good recently too. I saw a little of a recent game for Juve. The Juve defence were making back passes to him in difficult positions, with total conviction that he'd get them out of it. He dribbled past a striker and cleared on more than one occasion. He's a huge presence for them at the back. There's no doubt that he's among the very best keepers of his generation.

[back of the net]

First let me qualify this statement by saying that I hardly ever see Italian football, but why does everyone rate Buffon so highly?

Does everyone watch considerably more Italian football than me? If so, where? Buffon has been injured for a while, previous to that, has been playing
in a lower division, so why is he still always included in Best Keeper polls.

Ok, he has been a good keeper when I've seen him, and was a high transfer fee, but people write off Cech and Casillas and others based on current form or quality of opposition but Buffon seems to be imperviable to criticism.
People judging him on reputation alone in my opinion.
Casillas has been the best keeper in the world for the last 3 seasons. In my opinion.

Anyway, this is a bit off topic.
stuttgarts post says it all about the man- no need for me to add to it.
i have seen a lot of buffon mate - he is just a seriously class keeper...number 1 imo

[Shilts]

There are a couple of other keepers in the premiership better than Given - Reina, Friedal, Cech and the Bolton guy Jaskuleinin come to mind straight away. Van der Saar was better but is slipping with age. In Europe Buffon and Casillas stand out.
Given will always look good playing for a team that leaks chances. To prove he is top notch he has to do it in the Champions League (which is the top layer of the game - above even international football). IMO a good keeper, but not proven to be a great keeper (yet?)

[jbyrne]

There are a couple of other keepers in the premiership better than Given - Reina, Friedal, Cech and the Bolton guy Jaskuleinin come to mind straight away. Van der Saar was better but is slipping with age. In Europe Buffon and Casillas stand out.
Given will always look good playing for a team that leaks chances. To prove he is top notch he has to do it in the Champions League (which is the top layer of the game - above even international football). IMO a good keeper, but not proven to be a great keeper (yet?)

a great save is a great save no matter what competition its in. in the top 5 in europe id say

[dr_peepee]

The only honest assessment you can make regardless of what the polls, stats or experts say, is that would you swap Shay for any other keeper in the world.

I wouldn't....

So f'ck the neighbours!!!

[Razors left peg]

The only honest assessment you can make regardless of what the polls, stats or experts say, is that would you swap Shay for any other keeper in the world.

I wouldn't....

So f'ck the neighbours!!!

agreed:ball:

[eirebhoy]

Given will always look good playing for a team that leaks chances. To prove he is top notch he has to do it in the Champions League (which is the top layer of the game - above even international football). IMO a good keeper, but not proven to be a great keeper (yet?)
He has 90 caps for Ireland. I think most of us would have saw the majority of those games and we've had a solid defence for the most part. Given is the least error prone keeper in the premiership. No doubt in my mind of that. I also believe he's also the only keeper in the league that would have pulled off all 5 of those saves in the first half against Liverpool.

http://www.zshare.net/video/542316119c4b497b/

The last save from Lucas is incredible and that replay doesn't do it justice. The shot had plenty of power in it.

[irishfan86]

There's no way you'd swap Given as Dr. Peepee puts it.

That said, if you had Casillas you wouldn't swap him away either.

But there's no question in my mind that Shay is world-class. Probably our only truly world-class player at this point in time, although Stephen Ireland is making a case for himself at the moment (I realize he isn't technically playing for us right now, so don't jump on me please!).

[Sheridan]

Some amount of ignorance being paraded here, but it's the right forum for it I guess.

Casillas is the best goalkeeper in the world by a mile, no-one else comes close. He's also been the best player in the world since the start of the decade, in terms of consistency.

[eirebhoy]

Casillas is the best goalkeeper in the world by a mile, no-one else comes close. He's also been the best player in the world since the start of the decade, in terms of consistency.
Eh, Casillas seems to be the one keeper in this thread that is unanimously rated as top class...

Technically Given is up there in that class. Trap thinks so too. Trap reckons he's as good as Buffon and he's certainly not lying when he says that as he loves to use any opportunity to play down our players and compare them to the individually average Greeks.

Buffon and Casillas were nominated for the FIFA player of the year. Given voted Casillas as his number 1 player (Ronaldo 2nd and Messi 3rd).

[hoops1]

Have to say i think Given is totally overrated mostly by people in this country.
I think he has some flaws in his game, probably which stop him moving to a club that can challenge for trophies. Have to say Buffon and Cassilas are one level above him.

[tetsujin1979]

Buffon and Casillas were nominated for the FIFA player of the year. Given voted Casillas as his number 1 player (Ronaldo 2nd and Messi 3rd).

Why did Given vote? I thought it was only the managers and captains?

[irishfan86]

Have to say i think Given is totally overrated mostly by people in this country.
I think he has some flaws in his game, probably which stop him moving to a club that can challenge for trophies. Have to say Buffon and Cassilas are one level above him.

I think the only noticeable problem Shay has is with his kicking and distribution in general.

And a lot of top clubs want a keeper who will move the ball well to keep the flow going.

His injury plagued season last year probably isn't helping his cause either in terms of attracting top clubs.

[eirebhoy]

Have to say i think Given is totally overrated mostly by people in this country.
I think he has some flaws in his game, probably which stop him moving to a club that can challenge for trophies. Have to say Buffon and Cassilas are one level above him.
The only flaw I've ever noticed is his kicking. Any others? Us fans can't really tell how good his vocal, organisational skills are but I think his managers and teammates can and they all seem rate him very highly. In terms of technical ability he's more than proven himself in the 100 odd games we've seen from him to be in the top class bracket.


Why did Given vote? I thought it was only the managers and captains?
Haven't a clue why Keane didn't vote.

[Mr Maroon]

First let me qualify this statement by saying that I hardly ever see Italian football, but why does everyone rate Buffon so highly?

Does everyone watch considerably more Italian football than me? If so, where? Buffon has been injured for a while, previous to that, has been playing
in a lower division, so why is he still always included in Best Keeper polls.

Ok, he has been a good keeper when I've seen him, and was a high transfer fee, but people write off Cech and Casillas and others based on current form or quality of opposition but Buffon seems to be imperviable to criticism.
People judging him on reputation alone in my opinion.
Casillas has been the best keeper in the world for the last 3 seasons. In my opinion.

Anyway, this is a bit off topic.


:eek::eek: Are you serious? You really must not see any Italian football.

You can watch it for free on:
http://atdhe.net/
http://www.bet365.com
http://www.rojadirecta.com/
http://www.justin.tv/


"People judging him on reputation alone in my opinion."
but you said yourself you don't see him play much. So what do you judge him on?

Buffon is a class above Casillas who is at least a class above the next nearest challengers (Cech, Shay, etc) IMO.

As well as "being injured" and "playing in a lower division" he has played in Serie A, the Champions League, the World Cup, the European Championships. Won Serie A several times, won the World Cup, captained his club and country on numerous occasions.

Watch him play. He's fit again now. You'll be impressed.




Casillas is the best goalkeeper in the world by a mile, no-one else comes close.
I'm guessing you don't see too much Serie A either.

[BonnieShels]

Typical bbc nonsense of rating their own ridiculously better than others. Cech and VDS have had dodgy years and are nowhere near the top 4 in the world

Right on the money there.

[eirebhoy]

Apparantly Given made brilliant save from Benni McCarthy's freekick a few minutes before Blackburn scored.

[Cymro]

Cech has been mediocre (by his standards) for the last year or so, but I've always rated Van der Sar. He has pulled off some great saves this year.

On current form Brad Friedel would have be considered for a top keepers poll.

Given is a great keeper but will always be hampered by playing for Newcastle.

[eirebhoy]

Apparantly Given made brilliant save from Benni McCarthy's freekick a few minutes before Blackburn scored.
http://www.zshare.net/video/543206262dac1b7a/

[FahyForever]

Cech has been mediocre (by his standards) for the last year or so, but I've always rated Van der Sar. He has pulled off some great saves this year.

On current form Brad Friedel would have be considered for a top keepers poll.

Given is a great keeper but will always be hampered by playing for Newcastle.


In my opinion Reina has been the best keeper in the premiership this season, and possibly last season too. He seems be overlooked in this debate, getting only one mention.....

[Stuttgart88]

I think Reina has played well this season in fairness but I still think he's an accident waiting to happen in a big game. He has rescued Liverpool at key times in tough games this season and has upped his game. I still don't think he's in the really top bracket though.

Cech was flapping at high balls and totally lacked authority from what I saw of Chelsea vs Stoke on MOTD. Poor communication with Alex (Cech's fault) for a Delap throw and dreadful footwork for an early corner.

[irishfan86]

I think Reina has played well this season in fairness but I still think he's an accident waiting to happen in a big game. He has rescued Liverpool at key times in tough games this season and has upped his game. I still don't think he's in the really top bracket though.

Cech was flapping at high balls and totally lacked authority from what I saw of Chelsea vs Stoke on MOTD. Poor communication with Alex (Cech's fault) for a Delap throw and dreadful footwork for an early corner.

I agree with your assessment of Reina, but as you say it's hard to be too critical of him as he's been fairly solid for them this season.

In defence of Cech against Stoke, he's not the first keeper to have a nightmare against them!

[Closed Account 2]

I'd say the best years are behind Buffon, he's only played 5 matches for Juventus this season due to his back spasms, Manninger (ex Arsenal) is playing for them instead.

[irishultra]

Typical bbc nonsense of rating their own ridiculously better than others. Cech and VDS have had dodgy years and are nowhere near the top 4 in the world.

Buffon, Frey, Akinfeev and Casillas are the only four that I'd consider comfortably better than Given.

:o lol hes good but not that good.

[donalmcdonagh]

IMO Shay Given has been consistent with his form for as long as I can remember. But maybe people come to expect that from him. SHAY GIVEN IS NOT ERROR PRONE!!! I cant think of another keeper that makes on average 4 world class saves a game, couple that with his good handling, organisation, control of penalty area and contrary to public opinion his kicking is very accurate(can anyone highlight his so called poor kicking, remember his assist for Nzogbia a few weeks back, also he hits Kevin Doyle on the head in every Ireland game, thats our kick out ball.).
Even as a young keeper he wasnt error prone. It is Fair to say that the other keepers (Buffon, Casillias) are world class but on the evidence (i.e. the displays we see week in week out for over 6 years) Shay Given is as good as anyone. Shay always declared himself happy at Newcastle and this probably ensured he never got a big move....if he was at a bigger club he would have got a lot more recognition. When he is gone from Newcastle and Ireland in particular we will notice the void.
Finally, I feel some one like Reina is too young to be considered world class, without doubt he will mature but at the moment his management of the penalty area is very poor...fact!!

[elroy]

I think Given could go this in this transfer window with MC the most likely. How he can not be demoralised at Newcastle is beyond me, they are a nothing club that goes from crisis to crisis. Yet another disasterous result on sat.

Cech was very error prone on sat, Andy Gray commented last night that he doesnt believe that Cech has been as good since his injury. Its rare you see Given come for a cross and at least not get some sort of decent connection on it. Cech has flapped at many a cross this season.

[Closed Account 2]

Typical bbc nonsense of rating their own ridiculously better than others. Cech and VDS have had dodgy years and are nowhere near the top 4 in the world.

Buffon, Frey, Akinfeev and Casillas are the only four that I'd consider comfortably better than Given.


I dunno about Akinfeev, he has the ability but his decision making can let him down in big games. At 22 time is still very much on his side, he's captain for CSKA now (assuming Zico doesnt change that) and will be in the Champions League next season. All the other national team goalies Malafeev, Ryzhikov, Gaboulov are older and well behind him the selection order...

[Den Perry]

IMO Shay Given has been consistent with his form for as long as I can remember. But maybe people come to expect that from him. SHAY GIVEN IS NOT ERROR PRONE!!! I cant think of another keeper that makes on average 4 world class saves a game, couple that with his good handling, organisation, control of penalty area and contrary to public opinion his kicking is very accurate(can anyone highlight his so called poor kicking, remember his assist for Nzogbia a few weeks back, also he hits Kevin Doyle on the head in every Ireland game, thats our kick out ball.).
Even as a young keeper he wasnt error prone. It is Fair to say that the other keepers (Buffon, Casillias) are world class but on the evidence (i.e. the displays we see week in week out for over 6 years) Shay Given is as good as anyone. Shay always declared himself happy at Newcastle and this probably ensured he never got a big move....if he was at a bigger club he would have got a lot more recognition. When he is gone from Newcastle and Ireland in particular we will notice the void.
Finally, I feel some one like Reina is too young to be considered world class, without doubt he will mature but at the moment his management of the penalty area is very poor...fact!!


you sound like a stalker

[donalmcdonagh]

so you agree with me then!!!

[Mr Maroon]

Buffon wins 'keeping crown

Monday 19 January, 2009
Juventus star Gigi Buffon is the best goalkeeper in football history, according to the International Federation of Football History and Statistics.

The IFFHS is an organisation that uses statistical data to analyse and classify footballers and clubs.

While their studies are widely respected, they also have their detractors who feel football cannot be reduced to a series of numbers.

According to their latest study of goalkeepers, Azzurri No 1 Buffon beats former Manchester United and Denmark custodian Peter Schmeichel to the all-time 'keeping crown.

Spanish shot-stopper Iker Casillas was awarded third place with German legend Oliver Kahn in fourth and Paraguayan international Jose Luis Chilavert in fifth spot.

Buffon was awarded the IFFHS' best goalkeeper award in 2003, 2004, 2006 and 2007.

channel4.com

[superfrank]

I think Given's very good but he's not the best in the Premiership.

Reina, Friedel and James have all been better this season. Cech is not as good as he used to be but he's still a very good keeper. Jaaskelainen and Green are also two very good keepers. VDS is over-rated though.

He's definitely nowhere near the top four in the world.

[L37Ultra]

Why did Given vote? I thought it was only the managers and captains?

Ya they even named Given as the Ireland captain on Sky Sports News. Maybe its based on the last International game and wasn't Given captain against Poland?

[Drumcondra 69er]

I think Given's very good but he's not the best in the Premiership.

Reina, Friedel and James have all been better this season. Cech is not as good as he used to be but he's still a very good keeper. Jaaskelainen and Green are also two very good keepers. VDS is over-rated though.

He's definitely nowhere near the top four in the world.

Nonsense, James has been at his most error prone for years this season , Freidal is a very solid keeper but I''d rate Given above him and Reina. Cech has undoubtedly not been the same since his injury, had a shocking European Championships and has also been inconsistent for Chelsea this season. Jaaskelainen is an excellent keeper alright but Green has yet to show the level of consistency you'd get from Given.