Champions League 2003/04

[Shed End John]

Some will say that it's a bit early for this one, BUT, we've all had a bloody good look at the contenders and pretenders to AC Milans throne; so who do you reckon will win it.
Personally, I can't see Real Madrid being too far away, might even be a Madrid-Milan Final. Dark horses would be Stuttgart and Chelsea, Celtic may reach the quaters but will go no further.

[NigeSausagepump]

My money's on Chelsea.

They're getting better with every game and won't feel the pinch in terms of injuries and suspensions the way everyone else, including Real, will.

It'd be legendary to see Duffer playing in a Champos League final too.

[Junior]

Originally posted by Shed End John
Some will say that it's a bit early for this one, BUT, we've all had a bloody good look at the contenders and pretenders to AC Milans throne; so who do you reckon will win it.
Personally, I can't see Real Madrid being too far away, might even be a Madrid-Milan Final. Dark horses would be Stuttgart and Chelsea, Celtic may reach the quaters but will go no further.

apart from the obvious Madrid, Man U, Milan (though they were beaten by Brugge in the San Siro), I'd agree with you that Chelsea and Stuttgart are great outside bets.

Juve have done well so far, albeit in one of the easier groups.

Stuttgart, great defensive record this season, good attacking side with Kuryani in top form, can see them being a bit of a B Leverkeusen - so near but yet so far.

Chelsea, lack of experience might be their downfall or the odd dodgy result (Besiktas) at the wrong time.

Celtic, agree we won't win it:( but IF we do get through the group stages, we proved last season that we can do ok in the 2 legged ties (particularly at Celtic Park) and apart from the top 2 or 3 I wouldn't fear anyone.

Betting man = Juve v Stuttgart, as long as they don't meet each other on the way!!

[Beavis]

Monaco might be a good outside bet for maybe the Semis.They a look very decent side so far and you'd get large odds I'm sure

[Shed End John]

Originally posted by Beavis
Monaco might be a good outside bet for maybe the Semis.They a look very decent side so far and you'd get large odds I'm sure

Except they haven't been tested yet. A group containing an underperforming Depor, AEK Athens and PSV is hardly any preparation for the much bigger challenges ahead.

[Coltron]

Its Juventus all the way. Lippi reckons its one of the strongest squads hes ever had, and they've got the experience and the hunger. Bayern arent out of it yet either.;)

[liamon]

I've not ben too impressed with Bayern this year. They're not really hammering the teams in their group they way you' expect them to.
Madrid will rue selling Makele (sp?).
Don't see Mau U winning it with Rio Ferdinand suspended or if Ruud vN gets a cold.
Chelsea are serious contenders, and have tons of experience in Desailly, Veron, etc., but I fancy Juve to win it.

[Shed End John]

Originally posted by Coltron
Its Juventus all the way. Lippi reckons its one of the strongest squads hes ever had, and they've got the experience and the hunger. Bayern arent out of it yet either.;)

Bayern have been utter crap this season. Remember, if Celtic beat (which I think they will) and Lyon beat Anderlecht it's all over for Bayern.
Lippi is talking through his a**e. The 1996 squad was a hell of a lot stronger, semis for Juventus, but, no more.

[colster]

I reckon Chelsea can do it. Outside them I'd say Juve and Milan would be the next favourites.
Real definitely won't win it this season for the same reason they didn't win last season.
Their defence was appalling. This season they haven't got Makelele.
They'll flatter to deceive again
Chelsea have options all over the place. They are bonding well and can cope with suspensions and injuries better than any other team in the competition.
They've also got a top top manager.

[Shed End John]

Originally posted by colster

Real definitely won't win it this season for the same reason they didn't win last season.
Their defence was appalling. This season they haven't got Makelele.
They'll flatter to deceive again


Definitely is a bit strong. After all, it was said that Real 'definitely' wouldn't win it in 1998 or 2000 either and they caused minor upsets in winning both.
Chelsea will need more than one season, and a settled 1st eleven, to go all the way. Still reckon it'll be an AC-Real final.

[Coltron]

Cant see Chelsea winnin it, sure they'll go close and im sure will play some decent stuff but a settled side is needed, and i would hardly count CR as a top manager, has he ever won anything except for the odd serie B title (if even, cant remember), he was apparantly a big part in the Valencia cameo, but relegated Atletico Madrid (granted he was sacked in march). As for Veron, if he even plays is far from convincing and i'll take Nedved Monday to Sunday. If Chelsea ever win the European Cup it will most probably be without CR and in no sooner than two years.

Show me a club with the required talent, experience, hunger, manager, balanced squad and belief and the winner will appear clear as day, in black and white you could say.

[TheRealRovers]

Forza Milan

[Shed End John]

Originally posted by Coltron
Show me a club with the required talent, experience, hunger, manager, balanced squad and belief and the winner will appear clear as day, in black and white you could say.

That'll be the usual suspects we've already named, so no need for a rehash.
Hala Madrid!!

[Coltron]

I would have to disagree Madrid can be chalked off because of their defence which would come under balanced squad. Man U also, i think most people would agree are over dependent on Van the Man and Scholes, and their defence could maybe do with another year or two together thus lacking the experience. Bayern would most likely fall short for the about the same reasons, swappin Mckaay for Van and Ballack for Scholes, defensivly I think Thomas Linke says enough. AC mightened have the hunger, note that teams in the CL have a tendency if they win it to only come close again in two years time. As for the pretenders Ajax look like a team who could surprise in the knockout stages after they should top their group, Inter also are never easy to beat and with Vieri can always score despite his record in the CL.

The farer away you stand the clearer the painting becomes.Shedding some light on things

[Shed End John]

Originally posted by Coltron
I would have to disagree Madrid can be chalked off because of their defence which would come under balanced squad.

Inter also are never easy to beat and with Vieri can always score despite his record in the CL.
[/B]

Real, IMO, can outscore ANYONE. Besides, it would be utter stupidity to write off a team that has won the competition 3 times in the last 5 seasons.
Inter ARE a possible dark horse, but no more. I still have MAJOR reservations about their mental strength.
Ajax, IMO, are far too inexperienced, and won't top their group let alone win the competition.

[Coltron]

I agree with what ur sayin SEJ, but just because Real can outscore anyone doesnt mean they will in every game and with the revised format it will make it harder for them and suit a team like Bayern and Juventus better. I try not to write any team off completly as it can be damaging to the wealth (e.g.Brasil), but when im look for a team to put my hard earned euro on I discount teams because of certain factors and eventually end up with a team that I think has a strong probability of going all the way and that have decent odds. Before this years CL got under way I backed Bayern and I am man enough to admit that I got it wrong altough their not totally out of it yet, I revised it and came up with Juve. I have no real loyalties in the CL and write this as a neutral.

Im not a neutral in the eL and helped myself to the 3/1 on the Drogs against Bohs, maybe il put my money where my fingers are and back the Old Lady.

[Shed End John]

Originally posted by Coltron
I agree with what ur sayin SEJ, but just because Real can outscore anyone doesnt mean they will in every game and with the revised format it will make it harder for them and suit a team like Bayern and Juventus better.

I don't expect them to either. Surely, though, you'll accept that to outscore any team in one leg out a tie would be enough 90% for a team like Real. IMO, come 9:40 tonight, Bayern will be completely out of it. So far this season they haven't played with the same confidence as in previous seasons, which will make going to Celtic Park all the harder.
Also, I believe the revised format will only benefit Real who looked jaded towards the end of the past couple of seasons. At the risk of repeating myself, it IS absolute stupidity to write off the 1st team that qualified for the 1/4 finals; especially given their record over the past 6 seasons which reads:
1998- Champions
1999- Knocked out Group stage
2000- Champions
2001- Knocked out 1/4 final
2002- Champions
2003- Knocked out 1/2 final,
by an absolute mile the most consistent record over that time.

[Coltron]

To murder a cliche, everone is entitled to their own opinion, and even if I get this one wrong and Real cruse to cup its good make a case for the oppision as it keeps things in a healthy state, the Eamon Dunphys of this world are needed even they talk some bull from time to time. (In no way am I comparin myself to the afformentioned, any indication that I was or comparision with ED and youll be speakin with my solisitors, and promptly be sued for slander and deflamation of character, terms and conditions apply.):D

[Shed End John]

Originally posted by Coltron
To murder a cliche,

Murdering cliches? I'll kill the one about Reals 'dodgy' defence stone dead. It's not. In their last 5 Champions League games Real have only conceded 3 goals, in their last 2 Spanish League games.......just 1, and that was in the masterclass they gave Barca at the Nou Camp. Queiroz is starting to work his magic on the defence and with the strikers/midfield looking better than ever, Real have rarely been so well placed to take the League and European Cup Double.

[Éanna]

Any defence with Roberto Carlos in it is at least a bit dodgy!

[Beavis]

If any one saw the Lyon match yesterday,there were terraces behind each gaoal(nearly sure about that).
UEFA govern the Champions League so why should they see it as okay to have terraces in this competition but have us strictly banned from even using bucket seats?:confused:

[Shed End John]

Originally posted by Éanna
Any defence with Roberto Carlos in it is at least a bit dodgy!

Not recently it seems. As I say, he (+ 10 more) were excellent in the Nou Camp, finding form in the CL...........maybe this marks a new departure by Real.

[SÓC]

Lyon are handy side.

The new format will help the "lesser" team IMO.

If Celtic had gotten through I would have put €20 each way on them to win it, the home away thing would have worked in their favour. Now Im looking for some other team to back. Im thinking Lyon or Real Socidad . They will both be ******s of teams to beat at home and they are capiable of doing well enough awy from home. They are long shots that can, but most likely wont come off.

Bayern and Stuttgard are my other teams I might have a flutter on.

[Coltron]

Dont know for sure but id say Real were outscored by a handful of teams in the group stages most noteably Juve, no arguing with 7-0.

All players come into form, but is Real defense good enough to do it for the whole season? You seem to be cherry pickin your games.

P.S. stop diggin:D

[pete]

Earlier knock out format means odds on an italian winner.

[DolansWaistcoat]

The knock out thing could favour man u also.Though I hope to god they don't win it after the joke that was the 99 final.

I'd love to see one of the smaller clubs go all the way.Bayer leverkuesen almost did it in 2002 but fell to the brilliance of Zidane and madrid.

[DolansWaistcoat]

I don't know about Chelsea having a weaker first 11 than manu or arsenal but the experience man u have in the cl will make them the favourites of the 3 english clubs to go all the way.

[Coltron]

Conor is that directed to me?

If so it was thrown in at the end of my post and I wasnt totally behind it, my faith is in Juve as you probably well know by now.

If you want to go through the Chelsea XI with the United team man for man is might seem close but Chelsea are a relatively young team and dont have the charachter or confidence of true champions and if they progress over the next year or two together should develop this. Its all smoke and mirrors for them at the moment and when the dust settles it will be the same old same old teams at the top, and you can quote me on that when all is said and done this season, ill take my medicine if im wrong.

[DolansWaistcoat]

Lets hope its not boring again this year and the same old faces don't win everything again.

Chelsea for the prem and Stuttgart for the cl.

Oh,and Cork City for the eircom league and the first irish team to get through to the cl group stages in 2005,the year Cork is the city of culture.:cool: :D