Deep Trouble??

[Lim till i die]

I take it there's some pretty deep evil going down on Leeside now that you lot have locked your forum??*




*Yes I realise the probable pointlessness of this thread since if there is something ye don't want seen there you are hardly going to tell me about it here :p

[Longfordian]

They don't want you to see that Tom C intends joining forces with Danny Drew, taking over Limerick, merging Cork and Limerick to form Munster FC and play out of Musgrave Park. I kid you not LTID!.

[Lim till i die]

They don't want you to see that Tom C intends joining forces with Danny Drew, taking over Limerick, merging Cork and Limerick to form Munster FC and play out of Musgrave Park. I kid you not LTID!.

This actually isn't the first I've heard of this idea :eek: :D

I reckon if the two monkeys ever do get together in the same room we should just give them a typewriter see will they write the great Irish novel.

[Longfordian]

As long as it's called Crime and Punishment Volume II I reckon it'd be fitting.

[tiktok]

I take it there's some pretty deep evil going down on Leeside now that you lot have locked your forum??

The extra number of snooping guests who only appear when there's bad news was slowing it down. If you'd already been registered you can read away, most of it is gnashing of teeth over mathews 'sacking' and people insulting our new owner. There's also a thread about the Virgin mary appearing in an MRi Scan

[A face]

If you'd already been registered you can read away, most of it is gnashing of teeth over mathews 'sacking' and people insulting our new owner.

Today ...... City fans will be mainly ......... hurling abuse at people indescriminately and cranking up the panic machine a few notches.

[Mr A]

I reckon if the two monkeys ever do get together in the same room we should just give them a typewriter see will they write the great Irish novel.

Alternatively they could have a knife fight at half time in an LOI game.

[A face]

Alternatively they could have a knife fight at half time in an LOI game.

Will we ever see an anniversary like this ....

http://www.dailyshirts.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/05/monkeyknifefight.gif

[razor]

most of it is gnashing of teeth over mathews 'sacking' and people insulting our new owner. There's also a thread about the Virgin mary appearing in an MRi ScanThe whole forum explained away in a few sentences?
Surely theres more complex folk than that over there? :confused: ;)

[tiktok]

The whole forum explained away in a few sentences?
Surely theres more complex folk than that over there? :confused: ;)

Sadly, the more complex individuals are either
(1) Buying into it
(2) Staying clear

[razor]

Sadly, the more complex individuals are either
(1) Buying into it
(2) Staying clearThe "complex" ones are buying in alright, I think the sensible ones are staying clear.

[tiktok]

I think the sensible ones are staying clear.

Self praise ;)

This place could do with more CCFC fans posting anyway.
The students have the run of the place.

[razor]

Self praise ;)Not really, just some usual suspects lying particularly low.


The students have the run of the place.Sure what else would they be doing with their time

[tiktok]

It's funny actually.

The rumours of what Mathews actually asked for are clearly being circulated (I'm sure we all heard them) so now people are starting to back off and dobt their earlier outrage. I give it two days before people will be outraged by Mat and cheering our new owner. Three days after that it'll change back again.

The drama!

[razor]

It's funny actually.

The rumours of what Mathews actually asked for are clearly being circulated (I'm sure we all heard them) so now people are starting to back off and dobt their earlier outrage. I give it two days before people will be outraged by Mat and cheering our new owner. Three days after that it'll change back again.

The drama!They haven't hit my Inbox yet but i'm sure they will.
I think its absolutely hilarious, my favourite phrase of the whole debacle is definitely the term "outraged" to describe Mats supporters. Ingenious.

[HammerNThongs]

Myself, I'm quite happy that we chose the players over Mat if it was simply a decision of who to keep, Joey and Dan or Alan! 2 of the best players in the league, or an unproven League manager...dont really see any difficulty in the decision...obviously wasnt handled that nicely, but hell man, this is business and in football, let alone League of Ireland football, business is really ****ing nasty.

Also, I note Mathews comments in defence about him being willing to see out his remaining 2 years on his contracts. How great of him to help negotiate Joey and Dans wages down, but to keep his extortionatly high contract. Top man Mat!

[Longfordian]

All very well saying that it's great to keep the players but where are you going to get the money to pay him off?. Pretty much every independent onlooker seems to fell he's entitled to one. But sure that's a worry for a year down the line and maybe it'll have fallen out of the sky by then.

[HammerNThongs]

Where were we going to get the money if we kept him on? We would be doing the exact same thing, just hemorrhaging it out at a slower rate. If we can knock off anything of his contract via an out of court settlement (which hopefully is the way this will go) then it might have been worth the risk. Dont get me wrong, this does put us still in a precarious position, but I am weirdly confident about the whole thing working out right. And it's not through ignorance. I am very aware that he is due a settlement, but SURELY so is Coughlan.

[pineapple stu]

There's a lot to be said for paying things at a slower rate.

Plus not paying for a second manager.

[Longfordian]

By all accounts he was willing to take a pay cut and had shaken hands on the elements of a deal. Now maybe that was still too much, it seems it was, but any settlement is going to be based on his old contract and not his new contract. I don't see how that's saving money to be honest and where's the lump sum going to come from on top of paying a new manager?. I just think it was an ill thought out move personally

[HammerNThongs]

Maybe...but this way we wont have to pay off bonuses for our inevitable cup wins under him!:p

[tiktok]

By all accounts ....

Not quite.

[Longfordian]

Well I read interviews with him saying he'd accept a pay cut and reports from your chairman and general manager saying he'd agreed a new deal so there was at least a chance he was willing to work for less. It's the compensation issue that's most important though, refusing to work for less money is not a sackabale offence.

[tiktok]

Well I read interviews with him saying he'd accept a pay cut and reports from your chairman and general manager saying he'd agreed a new deal so there was at least a chance he was willing to work for less. It's the compensation issue that's most important though, refusing to work for less money is not a sackabale offence.

You're right in a lot of that.

Both sides admit they agreed a new contract, the Eveving Echo tomorrow is going to suggest that the club gave Mathews a different contract to what was agreed, on the other hand there are rumours that Mathews asked for add-ons that the club could not afford.

The chances are the truth is [as always] somewhere inbetween.
The key point for CCFC though is whether the previoous contract AM held has to be honoured, I expect it does.

[Longfordian]

Very sensible post tiktok I can see why you're not bothering with the other forum. Only one mention of "the truth" and no "spoofer"..

[HammerNThongs]

Very sensible post tiktok I can see why you're not bothering with the other forum. Only one mention of "the truth" and no "spoofer"..

The talk on that forum of people not buying season tickets amazes and aggrevates me!

[holidaysong]

The talk on that forum of people not buying season tickets amazes and aggrevates me!

Why are they not buying season tickets..? :confused:

[tiktok]

The talk on that forum of people not buying season tickets amazes and aggrevates me!

In fairness, a lot of people have made it clear that they're not committing until our licence is issued because they'd (rightly) expect a first division licence to cost less money. There's nothing wrong with that Forum for the record, as a source of CCFC news, it's unrivalled (of course as a source of nonsense it's also unrivaled so you have to know who to believe :D

[Real ale Madrid]

You're right in a lot of that.
The key point for CCFC though is whether the previous contract AM held has to be honoured, I expect it does.

This is the bit that really confuses me i have to say.

Is Tom Coughlan really that thick that he would fire the manager forcing him into a pay-off? All his actions so far have indicated that he has very little money to spend, i.e only 16 pro's next year, the sale of the Kevin Doyle clause etc.

Also, why did Gamble and Behan sign reduced deals knowing if they refused to do so the club would have to pay them the terms of thier old contract anyway?

:confused:

[Cici900]

This is the bit that really confuses me i have to say.

Is Tom Coughlan really that thick that he would fire the manager forcing him into a pay-off? All his actions so far have indicated that he has very little money to spend, i.e only 16 pro's next year, the sale of the Kevin Doyle clause etc.

Also, why did Gamble and Behan sign reduced deals knowing if they refused to do so the club would have to pay them the terms of thier old contract anyway?

:confused:

Must be or maybes hes hit the Christmas gargle early:D

[higgins]

Is Tom Coughlan really that thick that he would fire the manager forcing him into a pay-off?


You're talking about the same man/club that didn't realise there was a November 31st deadline for licencing recently :)

[holidaysong]

You're talking about the same man/club that didn't realise there was a November 31st deadline for licencing recently :)

When was that? :p

[Cici900]

When was that? :p

I can't remember but ask Tom:D

[El-Pietro]

You're talking about the same man/club that didn't realise there was a November 31st deadline for licencing recently :)

November 31st? Is that before or after the 29th of February?

[HammerNThongs]

In fairness, a lot of people have made it clear that they're not committing until our licence is issued because they'd (rightly) expect a first division licence to cost less money. There's nothing wrong with that Forum for the record, as a source of CCFC news, it's unrivalled (of course as a source of nonsense it's also unrivaled so you have to know who to believe :D

Maybe, but if you support the club and are willing to pay if we have a Premier Division licence anyway, and you know the club doesnt have a lot of money, then I see it as being extremely fickle. Fair enough if they arent regular season ticket holders, but if they are people who have been getting tickets for the last few years, I dont see what their gripe is. It's only hurting the club with that kind of attitude. A lot of clubs seem to base budgets on season ticket sales figures as well....but feck it, there is no reasoning with some people on that board.

[A face]

but feck it, there is no reasoning with some people on that board.

That can be said for a large portion of city fans, its always been our problem imo.

[HammerNThongs]

That can be said for a large portion of city fans, its always been our problem imo.


Aye, i suppose your right. Some may say the same of myself I guess! It took all of a bout 2 seconds after us exiting Examinership before little cliques and sides were being taken again!

[jimhacker]

Maybe, but if you support the club and are willing to pay if we have a Premier Division licence anyway, and you know the club doesnt have a lot of money, then I see it as being extremely fickle. Fair enough if they arent regular season ticket holders, but if they are people who have been getting tickets for the last few years, I dont see what their gripe is. It's only hurting the club with that kind of attitude. A lot of clubs seem to base budgets on season ticket sales figures as well....but feck it, there is no reasoning with some people on that board.

I will not be renenwing the two season tickets I got last year just yet.

Mr. Coughlan who purports ( with or without others?) to own the club is clearly in an.......ahem........highly leveraged situation. To buy season tickets at this stage is akin to advancing an interest free loan to this gentleman which, of course, is fair enough!

However, given some of his recent decisions ( which may well turn out to be correct for all we know) it is difficult to be convinced that he wil be able to deliver on his side of the equation.

There are still, it appears, unpaid creditors. There are still unpaid players. Mr. Mathews may well succeed in securing a sizable pay off.

It would be absolute folly to buy a season ticket until it's clear that there will actually be a season.

I'm one of those "people on that board" as you put it. Was that reason enough for you?

[micls]

It would be absolute folly to buy a season ticket until it's clear that there will actually be a season.


I disagree.

I see no reason to believe there wont be a season, where is another story. Wherever we are we will still need the money, players must be paid etc etc. None of that changes.

[HammerNThongs]

I'm one of those "people on that board" as you put it. Was that reason enough for you?

I know you are, and I did say some. It's the some that make me annoyed with the place and totally stopped me posting though I do still lurk occasionally just for news. Anyway, as for your reasons, as naive as I may seem, this is how I see it:


Mr. Coughlan who purports ( with or without others?) to own the club is clearly in an.......ahem........highly leveraged situation. To buy season tickets at this stage is akin to advancing an interest free loan to this gentleman which, of course, is fair enough!

No it's not. It is giving money to the club I support. TC is just a caretaker in the grand scheme of Cork City FCs history and future, should we have one, and in order to insure we do, the club needs money, money that will come from season ticket holders. I am giving money to CCFC, not to Tom Coughlan. It is mere coincidence that he is the one who currently dictates how this money is put to use. Being a football fan, this is part of the price you pay. You are not responsible for the product on display that you have the fortune/misfortune to watch.


However, given some of his recent decisions ( which may well turn out to be correct for all we know) it is difficult to be convinced that he wil be able to deliver on his side of the equation.

His recent decisions have been perplexing for sure, but like, for example the Kevin Doyle decision that was made, it may turn out to be a good thing as Reading could have bent us over a table (yet again!!!) with how they chose to structure his inevitable transfer out of the club in a couple of years time. Maybe the Mathews decision, which seems to be the great divider at the moment, will be resolved in a similar light. Maybe it wont. No matter what happened, unless we had someone with real actual liquid funds and pretty much no regard for them, this situation that we are currently in, was never going to be an easy one for the owners. People complain about Coughlan having no money and they did the same for Lennox, but Mr W had access to more funds then both these guys combined and his the cockmuncher that got us in this situation in the first place.



There are still, it appears, unpaid creditors. There are still unpaid players. Mr. Mathews may well succeed in securing a sizable pay off.

And not giving the club money to sort that out is good how?


It would be absolute folly to buy a season ticket until it's clear that there will actually be a season.

Like micls, I dont doubt that there will be a season next season and I also am oddly confident that it will be a Premier Division season. And **** it, if it's the First then so be it. Gamble and Murray have signed up with this risk in mind, I think I can too.

[A face]

I'm one of those "people on that board" as you put it. Was that reason enough for you?

Jebus Jim, you're a fierce man altogether with this season ticket stance, you'd peel an orange in your pocket i'd say :p

Nah, seriously, i hear what you're saying but its supporting the club. We'll all be going to games next year. Fair enough if you're not going to buy one but dont discourage people from buying one.

[paudie]

I've bought a season ticket before Matthews was sacked.

At least the money should go to pay the players back pay, which is the least they're due.

Perhaps I won't get any games to see any with it but I've followed them for over 20 years and I'm willing to take the risk if there's a chance my few bob will help the club get through this crisis.

[tiktok]

At least the money should go to pay the players back pay, which is the least they're due.

In fairness, no money from a 2009 season ticket should go to paying 2008 debts.
Tom Coughlan was the examiners preferred bidder and part of that preference involved ensuring that Coughlan had sufficient funds available to cover monies owed to creditors, revenue and staff. The amount required was known to all parties (and all bidders) throughout the process.

Factor in the Setanta Cup Final win and the reported €200k for the Kevin Doyle buy-off and there should be no reason to spend next season's money now.

[A face]

In fairness, no money from a 2009 season ticket should go to paying 2008 debts.
Tom Coughlan was the examiners preferred bidder and part of that preference involved ensuring that Coughlan had sufficient funds available to cover monies owed to creditors, revenue and staff. The amount required was known to all parties (and all bidders) throughout the process.

Factor in the Setanta Cup Final win and the reported €200k for the Kevin Doyle buy-off and there should be no reason to spend next season's money now.

Is there a bit of 'card playing', trying to get the best means of dealing with the situation? We all know we have to slash costs but agreed, the examiner picked Coughlan with the understanding that he could look after what was needed. If he is guilty of trying to get the best deal then fair enough.

[Dodge]

Were there any other options but Coughlan. Not rumours, but did the examiner actual have other offers on the table?

[HammerNThongs]

Were there any other options but Coughlan. Not rumours, but did the examiner actual have other offers on the table?

There definitely was at least one other bid. Dont think we will ever come close to knowing what their ideas were though.

[gufct]

See Jeff Kenna is rumoured to have been interviewed for the Cork Job.Very strange if Matthews was sacked as a cost cutting exercise.

[micls]

See Jeff Kenna is rumoured to have been interviewed for the Cork Job.Very strange if Matthews was sacked as a cost cutting exercise.

You think kenna was being paid anywhere near what Mathews was on?

[HammerNThongs]

Well, here's one for ya that I dont feel proud of saying because I generally hate all this rumor mongering and 2+2=5 talk. I was suppose to be flying out to Birmingham yesteraday for some work related thing, but the flights were canceled due to BMI Baby being a bit crap, but at the back of the queue all dressed up rather dapper in a suit and salmon pink tie in Cork Airport was none other then Mr Kenna himself with absolutely no baggage as if he was only over for the day for just such an interview.

Obviously could be pure coincidence, but the fact that I think he still has a base in Birmingham after spending a fair portion of his playing career there and the fact that he had no Bags at all certainly arouses suspicions

[Dodge]

I know how much he asked Rovers for during his interview there. Not giving the specific figure but he was asking for his assistant to be paid more than Pat Scully was earning.