The Future of the League

**shep** · 22/09/2011, 1:39 PM

With my own club seemingly in the sh*t,it just got me wondering how everyone else is feeling at the minute.Attendences are dropping alarmingly(oriel is like a ghost town most weeks) and i couldnt believe how bad the turnout from Bohs was the other night for a cup quarter final.Apart from Rovers...is there actually any clubs coming even close to breaking even,while remaining competative on the field???

The future seems very bad...i will continue to go...i am not having a personal moan...but am just wondering will there be a league at all,the recission seems to be hitting sponsership really hard and with revenues down it is hard to imagine the best players sticking around.

Yours in sport

A worried L.O.I fan

**pineapple stu** · 22/09/2011, 1:44 PM

There will be a league; it may continue to decline in standard though. It's ironic that in one of the poorest seasons quality-wise for a while, we've finally gotten a team through to the group stages.

Other leagues around Europe will be the same though. The recession isn't just an Irish phenomenon.

**Dodge** · 22/09/2011, 1:54 PM

Income's down alright. Crowds still brutal. Always have been though. We;re getting more through the gate now thatn when we won the league in 1990 with a brilliant team.

I've enjoyed this season more than most I've had following Pats, even with our various troubles.

As ever, some clubs are going to be happy with how things are going; Rovers, Derry (big crowds in first year up), Sligo (challenging for honours, good crowds), Cork (big crowds in the first), Shels (finally coming back up), Limerick (exciting moves off the field). While others can only see bad; Galway (Leeson messing them up), Dundalk (off field issues), Bray (boardroom struggles).

Others like Bohs and Pats are trying to sort themselves out off the field while tryingto be competitive. Other relatively big clubs like Harps and AThlone are in particularly bad runs at the moment but have decent infrastructure eithee behind them or planned.

I don't really think we're unlike any other league in the world. Some happy, some middling, some struggling

**Mr A** · 22/09/2011, 2:07 PM

I think the difference at the moment as opposed to previously is that if you carried in debt to the bust you're in very serious trouble as it's incredibly difficult to trade your way out currently.

For FHFC, it's a massive battle just to keep going at all. The Donegal economy never really soared in the boom but has been absolutely decimated in the bust. Emigration of young men, the core following of any club, has reached frightening proportions. And we're struggling more than ever to get people involved in helping out.

If we didn't have the stadium project to provide hope, I think we may well have slipped beneath the waves already. It could still happen. It scares the living crap out of me to be honest.

But hopefully we'll hang in there, and with the stadium on the way should come out the other end of this stronger than we've ever been.

**Dodge** · 22/09/2011, 2:42 PM

I should point out, I wasn't trying to downgrade any club's individual problems. most of them are very real, and very serious

A positive sign is that most clubs seem fairly determined to tackle their problems. Not as many looking to put their head in the sand and hope it works out

**Guinney** · 22/09/2011, 3:44 PM

At the moment the league is only surviving. Its hard to ever see a time in the future when it will prosper. The poor crowds seem to be getting poorer every year. Due to their size Derry and Cork will always have decent to good sized crowds, Sligo will get the crowds when they are doing well and Rovers now have by far the biggest support. I'm not to sure on figures but Dundalk, Bohs, Drogheda's and Brays crowds have been poor this year. UCDs will always be minuscule. For a cities and even counties as big as Limerick and Galway they should be getting much larger crowds, even Waterford should be getting in more.

So basically what I'm trying to say is that for whatever reason in a football mad country, the fans are not coming out to support their local clubs. Alot might be into the GAA or even rugby and thats fair enough. But there are to many barstoolers and event junkies in Ireland. To many who are quick to criticise the league without giving it a chance.

Its all been said before but the league needs to change. The FAI need to put more effort into the structures of the league and creating a better image of it as a whole. Personally I feel the league is to small, a 16 team league is needed. Its like ground hog day at times playing the same teams over and over. Only problem is there may not be enough teams to have a strong Premier division and a similar sized First division. In my opinion joining the the Northern and Southern leagues is the only way forward. Its has mentioned before and is probably unlikely due to the many difficulties (co-operation between IFA & FAI, lose of European places, increased trouble, etc) but for me these potential problems would be outweighed by the benefits of joining the two struggling leagues together.

**legendz** · 22/09/2011, 4:46 PM

I hope the league futures lies in being expanded from the current 21 clubs to 24. Cobh, Tralee and Carlow have been working hard these last few years. The league should open the door for these 3 clubs.

**freewheel30** · 22/09/2011, 4:59 PM

Poor facilities at grounds and poor European results were two of the big things that drove the crowds away - nowadays those things aren't really a problem but still the crowds aren't interested. People's "love" for English clubs is very deeply ingrained - but I think there's also just a primal fear on the part of some people. Going from my experience of trying to get people to go I sometimes reckon they think they're going to get "noticed" as a newcomer to the ground and that they'll be laughed at or attacked or something.

Maybe people just don't think they have the "right" to be there

**Nesta99** · 22/09/2011, 5:12 PM

Guinney you are relatively new to LoI, what was it that got ye up to Oriel? I myself had little choice as I 'inherited' supporting DFC growing up practically under the floodlights. Ive often felt that many people when they give LoI a chance are pleasantly surprised, the bug bites and then continue to attend matches! A lot of my old college mates over from England always enjoyed going to games when visiting, they were a lot less critical of the League (standards etc) than us ourselves. LoI fans seem to be very easily disillusioned with their clubs - couple of bad games and its 'f*ck that i'm not coming back'. If these 'fallen' fans returned attendances would dramatically up. It is very annoying that every second person asks how the game went walking through Dundalk after a match when seeing ye wearing colours so there is an interest.

Just out of interest question for other posters here. How did you get in to LoI eg dragged along by parents, simple curiosity, following mates etc. What keeps you going back apart from some wierd masochistic streak? Very open questions i know - i simply grew up 5mins from Oriel so it was always just a feature of life heading to games on a Sunday/Thursday, it was almost habit..

This Irish inferiority complex, driven by the media, that causes our obsession with the English/Scots leagues is an infuriating blight. Armchair republicans wearing liverpool shirts etc always amuse me!

The whole all-Ireland league debate has been done to death i know but the big deal with the Nordies i know, is that the FAI is the break-away association and as such must dissolve prior to a 32 county league, its a principled thing.

**Candystripe** · 22/09/2011, 5:15 PM

Originally Posted by Dodge

As ever, some clubs are going to be happy with how things are going; Rovers, Derry (big crowds in first year up),

Dodge I don't think our crowds are up very much at all.

The atmosphere was a lot better last year and we had some really good gates compared to this year.

**Lim till i die** · 22/09/2011, 5:21 PM

Originally Posted by Guinney

For a cities and even counties as big as Limerick and Galway they should be getting much larger crowds, even Waterford should be getting in more.

Limerick senior football is SEVENTEEN years in the First Division.

Our ground has 200 seats and no covered standing.

Munster play about two miles away.

I'm happy enough with our crowds to be honest!

Originally Posted by freewheel30

Poor facilities at grounds and poor European results were two of the big things that drove the crowds away - nowadays those things aren't really a problem but still the crowds aren't interested.

Facilities, bar one or two notable exceptions, are still stone age compared to anything across channell and indeed compared to a lot of GAA grounds.

European results are never going to be of a high enough standard for them to be relevant as to whether people will support League Of Ireland.

Future wise, clubs need financial backers if they are to make any headway. These days they aren't forthcoming. IMHO over the next five years, the league will continue to stagnate at best, crowds will level out at about 50% lower than the halcyon days of the mid noughties, some clubs will die, or at the very least go in to long term comas and the standard will settle somewhere a nice bit above the Welsh League and a nice bit below the Scottish League. Which is probably where it should be.

Rovers will dominate domestically for the next decade unless there's something very wrong, with an occasional challenge from a provincial team spending far too much money. (Come on Limerick!!!!)

**Lim till i die** · 22/09/2011, 5:28 PM

Originally Posted by Nesta99

Just out of interest question for other posters here. How did you get in to LoI eg dragged along by parents, simple curiosity, following mates etc.

My dad dragged me until I was old enough to go on my own......... then the ****er stopped going!!

I've started to drag him back since he got laid off, thank you Michael Dell.

What keeps you going back apart from some wierd masochistic streak?

Keeping the family tradition going.

By Jesus, I'll be damned if my son doesn't suffer the way I've suffered!!

**born2bwild** · 22/09/2011, 6:04 PM

Originally Posted by Nesta99

Just out of interest question for other posters here. How did you get in to LoI eg dragged along by parents, simple curiosity, following mates etc. What keeps you going back apart from some wierd masochistic streak? Very open questions i know - i simply grew up 5mins from Oriel so it was always just a feature of life heading to games on a Sunday/Thursday, it was almost habit..

I went along to a Bray - Fingal play off in the absolute p1ssings a couple of years ago, got pneumonia and hooked on live footie. Hope I don't outlive my current local club. I honestly don't know what I was doing with my life before this. I don't know if I fit the profile of a typical LoI fan, generally speaking, but I suppose I do in one respect: I love football.

**Guinney** · 22/09/2011, 7:20 PM

Originally Posted by Nesta99

Guinney you are relatively new to LoI, what was it that got ye up to Oriel? I myself had little choice as I 'inherited' supporting DFC growing up practically under the floodlights. Ive often felt that many people when they give LoI a chance are pleasantly surprised, the bug bites and then continue to attend matches! A lot of my old college mates over from England always enjoyed going to games when visiting, they were a lot less critical of the League (standards etc) than us ourselves. LoI fans seem to be very easily disillusioned with their clubs - couple of bad games and its 'f*ck that i'm not coming back'. If these 'fallen' fans returned attendances would dramatically up. It is very annoying that every second person asks how the game went walking through Dundalk after a match when seeing ye wearing colours so there is an interest.

Just out of interest question for other posters here. How did you get in to LoI eg dragged along by parents, simple curiosity, following mates etc. What keeps you going back apart from some wierd masochistic streak? Very open questions i know - i simply grew up 5mins from Oriel so it was always just a feature of life heading to games on a Sunday/Thursday, it was almost habit..

Well like yourself I live beside Oriel, for me though I literally live across the road. I wouldn't say I am relatively new to the league, I always had an interest just not as strong as interest as I have now. It would be nearly impossible for me not to have some sort of interest, as on match night my road is full of cars parked and people walking up to Oriel. Sometimes the feckers block my driveway. But after I spent a year in Cork for college about 5 years ago I started going to as many matched as I possibly could. Basically I started hanging around with a bunch of lads who always went to Dundalk matches, enjoyed myself, got a couple of jerseys, had a few pints in the Lilywhite Lounge, realised this is much better than watching football on the TV and caught the bug. I have tried and failed to bring other mates over to Oriel but after one or two matches they lose interest.

**legendz** · 22/09/2011, 7:45 PM

Originally Posted by freewheel30

Poor facilities at grounds and poor European results were two of the big things that drove the crowds away - nowadays those things aren't really a problem but still the crowds aren't interested. People's "love" for English clubs is very deeply ingrained - but I think there's also just a primal fear on the part of some people. Going from my experience of trying to get people to go I sometimes reckon they think they're going to get "noticed" as a newcomer to the ground and that they'll be laughed at or attacked or something.

Maybe people just don't think they have the "right" to be there

I don't work in marketing or anything like that but it'll take at least 6 weeks exposure to the domestic game for someone like that to start looking at the domestic game on a more regular basis. I wouldn't see it as a lost battle. If clubs have the right structure and the right people in place, clubs can establish themselves more within their regions. There' no quick fix and a lot of hard work.

**legendz** · 22/09/2011, 7:52 PM

Originally Posted by Nesta99

Just out of interest question for other posters here. How did you get in to LoI eg dragged along by parents, simple curiosity, following mates etc. What keeps you going back apart from some wierd masochistic streak? Very open questions i know - i simply grew up 5mins from Oriel so it was always just a feature of life heading to games on a Sunday/Thursday, it was almost habit..

This Irish inferiority complex, driven by the media, that causes our obsession with the English/Scots leagues is an infuriating blight. Armchair republicans wearing liverpool shirts etc always amuse me!

The whole all-Ireland league debate has been done to death i know but the big deal with the Nordies i know, is that the FAI is the break-away association and as such must dissolve prior to a 32 county league, its a principled thing.

I come from a region about as far away from a LoI club as you will get in this country. I've always have had an interest in world football. While I like the domestic game, I watch other leagues as well.
RTE TV were good in the early 90's in showing highlights of league games on a Saturday morning. RTE radio gave good coverage of the games as well. The three way play-off one year stands out. My general interest in the game of football was LoI on Saturday mornings and Italian football on Monday nights. I keep an eye out across the water as well but I don't make any apologies for that. It's not an obsession though and to be honest Gaelic Football is my bigger interest.

It'll be great to see a Kerry club part of the LoI, it'll be fantastic.

**Martinho II** · 22/09/2011, 7:55 PM

I got into the loi bug twenty years when me and sorbo the greek and close friends on sundays used to cycle to town matches in abbeycartron. the same lads that were goin back then are the same lads that do be in section o! the recession hasnt dramatically reduced our attendances as they were crap the season we went down anyway!

**Charlie Darwin** · 22/09/2011, 8:09 PM

Originally Posted by legendz

It'll be great to see a Kerry club part of the LoI, it'll be fantastic.

What's the story with Tralee, out of interest? Are there any plans to apply for a league spot?

**legendz** · 22/09/2011, 8:20 PM

Originally Posted by Charlie Darwin

What's the story with Tralee, out of interest? Are there any plans to apply for a league spot?

http://www.kerryman.ie/sport/gaelic-...d-2820294.html

Tralee Dynamos gearing up for U-19 League while application to join Airtricity League Division One has been lodged

TRALEE Dynamos boss Noel White says that the club are presently making preparations for the under19 league which kicks off on August 28.

The structure has been formulated and Tralee Dynamos will be carrying the Kerry flag in the competition and are in the Southern section in a seven-team division.

The teams in their group are Athlone Town, Longford Town, FC Carlow, Cobh Ramblers, Galway United, Limerick FC and Tralee Dynamos.

There are two other divisions Premier and Northern with 12 teams in each group.

The league will consist of three rounds so Dynamos will have 18 games in total.

"At present we are drawing up a panel of players and signing on a few new players also.

There are other players that want to sign up but they can't until the Kerry District League programe is concluded," Noel White explained.

" We see the under-19 league as an opportunity to nurture the younger players and get them to progress to the senior side.

"We have also made an application to join Division One of the Airtricity League next season as the Newstalk A championship will be terminated at the end of the season.

"We will have to meet the requirements set out by the League of Ireland to obtain a club license.

"The big obstacle in our way is financing the team if they are allowed into Division One.

"We are disappointed at the poor attendances at our games and we will have to do everything we can to get more people out to view our games," Mr White said.

"All players should aspire to playing the game at the highest level and as we are the only club providing League of Ireland football in Kerry should have the support of all Kerry clubs involved in the game.

"We will have to upgrade our facilities at Cahermoneen with new seating in the stand and also get the flood lights up and running for evenings games.

"We are committed to the challenge ahead of us and do our utmost to meet the requirements asked of us. After that it is up to The League of Ireland to delegate the clubs to go into Division One. The situation at the moment is that two clubs, which include Tralee Dynamos, will be allowed enter Division One but there will be four clubs seeking it.

"We are under no illusions regarding what a big step this would be but we believe we can rise a step further on the ladder and bring Division 1 football to Kerry," he added.