AIPL Proposal - How would you do it?

[gufcfan]

With all the lively debate for and against in the other thread, I thought it would be interesting to get people opinions on how exactly it should be done.

If you don't agree with the AIPL in principle, stick to the other thread.

Many people have posted that they are not in favour of the proposal, but don't really detail how they might like to see it run.

[pineapple stu]

I'd go with a 16-team league, top ten from the LoI and top 6 from the IL qualifying for the first season. Undecided on summer or winter football. Regional First Divisions below that; three down, regional winners up and a play off for the last spot. I'd put Jim Roddy into a rocket and send him to the moon, which is where he seems to reside mentally anyway.

I've put as much thought into this as Platinum One have, and I confidently predict it'll boost the league by however much your wildest dreams are.

Obviously it goes without saying that I would like to see an AIL, but there's more obstacles in its way than most people realise.

[jebus]

I would have an initial 16 team AIPL consisting of Derry, Cork, Bohs, Rovers, Limerick, Linfield, Glentoran, Drogheda, Galway, Pats, Dundalk, Shels, Cliftonville, UCD, Sligo and Waterford, and I would focus the initial outlay of money on clubs like Limerick, Galway, Rovers, Sligo, Waterford, Shels and Cliftonville (basically the weakest financially of the pack) to bring them up to speed with the rest.

From there, and with the co-operation of the IFA and FAI, I would have 2 seperate leagues below the AIPL. A combination of Ulster and Leinster teams and a combination of Munster and Connaught teams (teams that didn't make the cut, and junior teams looking to push on). I would, again with the FAI and IFA's backing, focus the FAI funding on these clubs, trying to bring them up to a level where it wouldn't be a huge jump up to the AIPL if they made it. I would close relegation/promotion for one season to try and achieve this, and from then on in I would automatically relegate the bottom AIPL team and promote the winner of a playoff between the champions of the two prospective leagues. The relegated AIPL team would then take their place in their corresponding league, with the team that finished bottom of that league being sent back to the juniors for at least a season. Ideally there would a pyramid structure taking the progression of relegation all the way down to the various junior leagues.

Basically you need the FAI and the IFA to browbeat the junior clubs into accepting that they will now be apart of one big structure, with the AIPL at it's head. The situation that we have, with the juniors hatred for the LoI, is unacceptable, and is at fault with a lot of what is wrong in Irish football if you aks me. By adding financial incentives from the FAI and the IFA to the regional clubs I would hope they could be brought in from the cold.

This is all idle speculation though, as I can't see the juniors going for it, I doubt the FAI and the IFA would be happy, and that's not even mentioning Uefa, but that's the system I'd propose. I think clubs like UCD, Galway and Limerick have a lot of potential if given the right backing, and to be fair to Sporting Fingal I would merge them into Shelbourne, there's not enough room in the new system for both of them and Shels have the history and the name to entice new fans easier. Cobh, Kildare, Monaghan and the rest would be given the season to get things in order (with the FAI's backing) in the hopes that they could survive in the AIPL when they come up.

Oh and I'd go for summer football. I think the AIPL's market is in family entertainment and summer football is more attractive in that respect

[passinginterest]

Ok here goes. Initially stick to a mainly summer season.

First season would see a straight merger between the leagues. Top tier of 20 teams the 10 premier division sides from North ans South with the first divisions remaining as they are.

Over the next 2 seasons the premier division would be reduced to 16 teams with three teams relegated and one promoted. Promotion would involve a playoff system. The top team in South 1 would meet second team in North 1 over two legs and vica versa. The playoff final would be at a major neutral venue in South one year and North the next.

Relegation might cause problems with the bottom divisions if the 3 relegated teams were from the North and the promoted team was from the South. Realignment would be necessary with teams furthest North in the South division re-located to the North in order to maintain even numbers.

After the first two years you end up with a top all-Ireland league with 16 teams, split at worst 10-6 in favour of Southern sides. The South and North leagues would have 14 teams each, with potentially further regional leagues below them (A league). Promotion would be two up two down, 2 legged playoffs with first in South playing second in North and vica versa. Relegated teams will be placed in most suitable region, with realignment allowed at the end of each season to best accommodate teams.

[GavinZac]

Is there any limitations? Any sort of connection to reality? Things like paying out large sums of half a 16 team league just so they're in anyway decent are very nice thoughts but in reality probably as far-fetched as "150% attendance increase in the first season".

[jebus]

Is there any limitations? Any sort of connection to reality? Things like paying out large sums of half a 16 team league just so they're in anyway decent are very nice thoughts but in reality probably as far-fetched as "150% attendance increase in the first season".

True, but we are playing God here, not actually proposing 150% attendance increases

[pete]

I would focus the initial outlay of money on clubs like Limerick, Galway, Rovers, Sligo, Waterford, Shels and Cliftonville (basically the weakest financially of the pack) to bring them up to speed with the rest.

So these clubs would be subsidised with FAI/IFA money to what purpose? Why should the worse run clubs be subsidised? Lets face it Galway & Sligo have shown incredible poor financial planning to date. At least Galway realised their mistakes & tried to make changes quickly.

[GavinZac]

True, but we are playing God here, not actually proposing 150% attendance increases

Alright then, playing god, we have a 16 team league similar to what passing interest suggests and a pyramidal structure all the way down. Each team gets 60,000 at their home games and prize money of 30 million is distributed between participants. Cork City win every second year, not every year as we like a good moan. This agreement is with the organisers in Dublin so then we can legitimately claim that only Dublin's convictions stopped us from winning every year.

And so on.

[jebus]

Alright then, playing god, we have a 16 team league similar to what passing interest suggests and a pyramidal structure all the way down. Each team gets 60,000 at their home games and prize money of 30 million is distributed between participants. Cork City win every second year, not every year as we like a good moan. This agreement is with the organisers in Dublin so then we can legitimately claim that only Dublin's convictions stopped us from winning every year.

And so on.

Making friends as ever I see Gav

So these clubs would be subsidised with FAI/IFA money to what purpose? Why should the worse run clubs be subsidised? Lets face it Galway & Sligo have shown incredible poor financial planning to date. At least Galway realised their mistakes & tried to make changes quickly.

To the purpose of bringing the clubs that have dug themselves into a financial hole up to scratch. This league won't work if after a few months Limerick or Sligo or Galway go bust and we get even more doom and gloom stories in the papers. It would only reaffirm the belief that this league is unworkable, and to be honest this is practically a last throw of the dice

[GavinZac]

Making friends as ever I see Gav

Without some basis in reality this thread is useless. I'm not sure there's even any point in going through how unrealistic many of the suggestions already have been as you yourself accept that and we've been doing it for quite a while in the other thread.

[jebus]

Without some basis in reality this thread is useless. I'm not sure there's even any point in going through how unrealistic many of the suggestions already have been as you yourself accept that and we've been doing it for quite a while in the other thread.

And your first post didn't make that clear enough? We're all aware that this is a pie in the sky thread, we don't need you marching in here with your usual condescending nonsense to make us aware of that

[Macy]

16 team premier, decided on purely on football basis once the have the required licence. 3 down, 3 up a season - top of FAI league, top of the IFA league, with a play off for the final place (2nd & 3rd in both leagues playing off).

Wouldn't be arsed with pushing the professional, as more important that it's sustainable, so would keep elements like the wage cap (properly enforced).

Anything else would be purely aspirational - so copy and paste the marketing that P1 claim will work if you really think their going to magic the crowds and TV deal out of think air.

[GavinZac]

And your first post didn't make that clear enough? We're all aware that this is a pie in the sky thread, we don't need you marching in here with your usual condescending nonsense to make us aware of that

I agree with passinginterest wholeheartedly - its the ideal situation and one that would the norm in a country of our size barring the whole north/side partition - and the rest of my post was (obviously misplaced) humour.

Don't let that get in the way of a bit of narky personal attacks though

[gufcfan]

So these clubs would be subsidised with FAI/IFA money to what purpose? Why should the worse run clubs be subsidised? Lets face it Galway & Sligo have shown incredible poor financial planning to date. At least Galway realised their mistakes & tried to make changes quickly.

I don't think that either Galway or Sligo can be singled out for that. Give it till the end of the season and I'm sure that my point will be proved. Granted though, neither club can deny they have made mistakes.

[Dodge]

16 team premier, decided on purely on football basis once the have the required licence... would keep elements like the wage cap (properly enforced).

Anything else would be purely aspirational - so copy and paste the marketing that P1 claim will work if you really think their going to magic the crowds and TV deal out of think air.

The wage cap is part of the club license. I'd keep that 100% intact.
I know the IFA has thier own license but ours is more stringent, and no way should we allow our standards (or at least the standards we aim for) slip

[gufcfan]

The wage cap is part of the club license. I'd keep that 100% intact.
I know the IFA has thier own license but ours is more stringent, and no way should we allow our standards (or at least the standards we aim for) slip

Couldn't agree more.

The wage cap may be seen as a nuisance, but it forces clubs to be responsible and flags ones that aren't fairly soon.

Its for their own good, whether they like it or not.

[jinxy lilywhite]

For me a Premier 16 team play home and away. Personally i'd prefer winter football. The teams would be Linfield, Glentoran, Derry City, Cliftonville, Dundalk, Drogheda(although these may be put into the Irish Basketball association considering their style of football), Bohs, Pats, Shamrock Rovers, Bray, Waterford, Cork City, Limerick, Sligo & Galway. 3 Teams from Dublin and Belfast is enough at the moment.
we would then have a first consisting of the next best 16 teams- UCD, Harps, Cobh, Shels, Portadown, Ballymena etc. A straight 3 up/ 3 down but we may steal a play off style situation from England in the First division. The bottom team of this league will be immediately relegated.
A third tier to be set up on a provinicial basis where the winners will enter into a round robin league and the winners will qualify to the first.
Strict guidelines to be introduced to each club in relation to promotion, expenditure, wages. I would even go as far as cut the wage cap from 65% to 50% and enforce that a certain % of the remiander. Admin expenses not to exceed 5% of turnover. Directors loans would be abolished and all income to be made via gate receipts, shirt sales, donations, patron schemes so on and so forth. Also remortgaging of grounds, assests and disolution of fixed assets to have strict guidelines attached too.
Far fetched but i feel every club needs to be involved

[thedoyler]

For me a Premier 16 team play home and away. Personally i'd prefer winter football. The teams would be Linfield, Glentoran, Derry City, Cliftonville, Dundalk, Drogheda(although these may be put into the Irish Basketball association considering their style of football), Bohs, Pats, Shamrock Rovers, Bray, Waterford, Cork City, Limerick, Sligo & Galway. 3 Teams from Dublin and Belfast is enough at the moment.
we would then have a first consisting of the next best 16 teams- UCD, Harps, Cobh, Shels, Portadown, Ballymena etc. A straight 3 up/ 3 down but we may steal a play off style situation from England in the First division. The bottom team of this league will be immediately relegated.
A third tier to be set up on a provinicial basis where the winners will enter into a round robin league and the winners will qualify to the first.
Strict guidelines to be introduced to each club in relation to promotion, expenditure, wages. I would even go as far as cut the wage cap from 65% to 50% and enforce that a certain % of the remiander. Admin expenses not to exceed 5% of turnover. Directors loans would be abolished and all income to be made via gate receipts, shirt sales, donations, patron schemes so on and so forth. Also remortgaging of grounds, assests and disolution of fixed assets to have strict guidelines attached too.
Far fetched but i feel every club needs to be involved

First idea I've read in this forum but finally someone is talking sense i'm sure the rest of this forum echo these sentiments, the exclusive nature of this league is what a lot of people i know including myself have a problem with!

[SalvadorSanchez]

First off the starting point here is to expand the Setanta cup and see how it works in generating interest over say, 5 season, 6 groups of 4, 12 north and 12 south (with a seeding system based on recent league positions etc.) with home and away ties and then 1/4 finals etc. bulk of prize money distributed to top 8 clubs and something for all participants. if this works out then look at rolling out an AIL.

I think to have any chance we'd be talking summer season (would really boost attendance for NI teams as they have don't have summer Gah/rugger fixtures) 16 teams, 2 automatic relegation places, (and a relegation /promotion play-off?)
Definitely no relegation promotion in year 1 to allow teams to stabilise themselves and to calm down tier 2 as well! (you could compensate those tier 2 teams missing out on promtion with say €150,000 cash each)

The big issue for the clubs is generating the interest in the league and maintaining it, so there has to be strong marketing and improvement of grounds (mainly in NI).

The hardest sell will be to get the blazers in Belfast to come onboard, the clubs would love the opportunity and would welcome the revenue, it's also vital that the tier 2 league has decent opportunity for promotion / relegation to keep the clubs going, therefore you need 2 or 3 places for promotion.

I think the key is getting more than Linfield and the Glens in there and then adding Derry as a NI team, it's simply not enough to get NI teams to buy into the idea, all the talk and money in world won't achieve anything unless the NI clubs come out strongly in favour, therefore the leagues need to develop links (Setanta cup, Friendlies, Tournaments etc.) and we need the help the NI teams sell this to their blazers and to Stormont (who will be paying for Ground developments, security etc.)
Also any aggro will result in Stormont going..."endangering the peace dividend and goodwill" which means scaring off investment in NI if riots make the news!! we have to be sure that the PSNI and the Gardaí buy in as well

[superfrank]

18-team Premier with 4 to be relegated. Below that two regional divisions (North & South) with the top two in each going up.

Keep the wage cap. If it can be arranged, bigger prize money and keep the promise that the national team sponsors must invest in the domestic league, say at a 50/50 split.