James McCarthy M Celtic b.1990

[DannyInvincible]

@ Danny

The bone of contention would be McCarthy missing a game he was adjudged fit enough to participate in. Not adjudged by me but by his managers and doctors. The fact that virtually an entire team has missed game time this season due to similar injuries also raises the possibility that, perhaps, unlikely though it is, the injury that McCarthy has been dealing with is not married to the one he allegedly missed a Scotland game with. Perhaps it's just a coincidence. Just look at the sheer number of Everton players that have had problems due to lack of rotation among other things. But I'm sure you know better than Martin, Roy and the Irish medical staff, Danny, so I will delegate to you.

Why are you regurgitating a previously-expressed position when serious fundamental problems therein have already been pointed out to you? Doubts have already been raised over your version of things and we've already been through all this from here onward.

That was before you decided to ignore this post of DeLorean's (besides the offering of a needlessly snide retort) and further questions I posed here.

If you're going to continue pushing the same dubious line as above, please at least deal with legitimate questions other posters have raised in relation to it before repeatedly trying to hoodwink us. Otherwise, just stop wasting everyone's time. I'm sure it's not a nice feeling to experience cognitive dissonance as a result of your sophistry either, but please drop the sarky comments just because you're irritated. I've not claimed to know better than anybody; my position is based on what Martin and James have said themselves (they were in accord), as well as the fact this was a proven recurring issue for the lad. For some reason, you still seem unable to grasp the difference between a scan and a fitness test.

[DannyInvincible]

I'm not dodging questions at all. I just think it would be better to agree to disagree, or discuss it further in private messages, rather than derail another thread. I don't think anyone is particularly interested in this subject anymore apart from you.

Maybe I am put off answering your questions because of your demeanor? It's pretty challenging like. You have accused me spoofing, wumming, trolling and called me "a vile little man" (although you deleted that after I challenged you on it), ostensibly because I have a differing viewpoint to yours.

Well, can we actually discuss this here then? You say you're not dodging questions but then admit to not answering questions, excusing yourself because you're put off by my demeanour. It's not just my questions you've been ignoring. And I don't think tets really has a problem with us discussing issues relevant to the thread so long as it doesn't devolve into multiple-quote digs. If you really want to discuss this via PMs, maybe you could respond to the one I sent you?

And just for the record, because you're posting misinformation about me, I have never referred to you as "a vile little man" (and tets can back me up on that), nor have I ever deleted something because you wanted me to. The reason I accuse you of spoofing and so forth, as you well know, is not because you have a different opinion; it's because of your sophistry and disingenuousness in debate.

If you could engage a little courtesy then maybe I would be prepared to further discuss the minutiae of whether James McCarthy was fit enough to play against Scotland or not - which O'Neill, Keane & FAI medics believed he was.

But you know that last bit there isn't even accurate.

[Stuttgart88]

The player himself thought he wasn't fit, something his instincts were proved right about shortly afterwards. Debate over as far as Im concerned.

[ArdeeBhoy]

Who cares anyway;the game was over weeks ago.
And we lost.

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

You did refer to me as a vile little man. You edited it out of your comment a few minutes after you posted it. I'm not particularly offended by it. but I do think things like that undermine your argument. You present good arguments and then you have to go and spoil it by saying untrue things like "I'm spoofing" and "I'm wumming", and engaging in namecalling. And Danny, you have been disingenuous plenty of times - I have just given one example - so accusing me of that is a bit like the pot calling the kettle black.

Even though O'Neill said he believed he would have played if it was a club game, even though Keane voiced his unease with the McCarthy/Everton situation and even though a scan cleared him to play.

I have said several times I have no interest in discussing this further but it's you that keeps bringing it up and if you keep calling me a liar or accusing me of being disingenuous - several times - I am going to defend myself.

The match is two months old now. Perhaps we should both build a bridge and walk over it? We are never going to agree and we are just winding each other up. There is no use winding other people up over it.

Edit:

"If you really want to discuss this via PMs, maybe you could respond to the one I sent you?"

But you haven't tried to discuss anything by PM. The only PM you have sent me directed me to this thread so you could continue your crusade here! And I don't know why you are acting like I am ignoring your 1 PM. Firstly, there was nothing to ignore (just a link to this thread), secondly, I only seen it after logging on this morning.

So basically, you want to post your responses here and I'll just PM mine to you?

[tetsujin1979]

Alright you two, go into neutral corners. Either block each other or take it to private messaging

[DannyInvincible]

Who cares anyway;the game was over weeks ago.
And we lost.

It's not even about that game specifically. It's the willfully-specious reasoning I find hard to stomach. James is a player I admire and for whom I have a lot of time because of his roots and because of what he's voluntarily put up with since deciding to play for us, but I think what TOWK is doing unfairly brings his integrity into question.

*The following aims to correct some inaccurate and misleading details about me in TOWK's post above, so you may ignore in advance if you wish.*

Anyway, I won't be engaging with TOWK again as this has all gotten a bit petty and ridiculous now just because he's desperate to avoid acknowledging outstanding questions with regard to his position. I'd hoped he might correct a few very loose facts in relation to my own conduct in that post above as it gives a completely misleading impression and I'm reluctant to continue with this out in the open, but he appears unwilling to give a more accurate portrayal despite my encouragement. To clarify matters, I never ever referred to him as "a vile little man"; I did once refer to him as "a bitter, small-minded little man" after he felt it was his place to make judgmental and belittling comments against whole swathes of people in the Andy Keogh thread. I took issue with what he'd said then and he even apologised later. He's obviously getting confused about that incident (and tets would be able to confirm that is the case), but he shouldn't make accusations without being sure of his facts. That latter reference was deleted by me upon tets' request and I acknowledge it wasn't in accordance with the type of conduct expected of users of the forum, but I could at least stand by why I used those terms. "Vile" gives a whole different impression and I wouldn't call him that.

As for my PM, it explicitly invited him to "let's do this via PMs" and it directed him (with clear written explanations) to posts containing questions I felt he still hadn't dealt at all. I didn't just fire off a solitary link; that's simply not my style, as you'll well know! He posted twice half-an-hour after I sent the PM (it's all recorded and time-stamped), which spurred my query another half-an-hour later in a post above as to whether he was actually going to engage via PM, so I'm puzzled over his claim that he only received the PM the next morning seeing as users are notified immediately of when they receive PMs if still signed in and using the forum. Not that all of that prevented him from sending me a PM response anyway if he did indeed wish to engage that way. Clearly, he has no interest in doing that, so I'll have to just let it go there and I assure this'll be the end of our little soap opera. Anyway, I'd hoped I wouldn't have to clarify matters myself here and I'm sorry and slightly embarrassed that I've had to do this, but I just wanted to clear up a few things for the record first.

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

*I promise this is the last I will say on this matter and I will graciously accept any repercussions that come my way because of this* *I just want to defend myself one more time* *Sorry for wrecking yer heads*

1. I have a different opinion on you about the subject and I am not going to be bullied into changing my mind. I did not call McCarthy's integrity into question. I called Martinez' and Everton's integrity into question. I accept that McCarthy is a young lad and I accept the pressure he has been and continues to be put under. Even if he didn't want to play against Scotland, I wouldn't judge him for it. I would be compassionate about it, if frustrated about his missing presence. I have never questioned his reasons for declaring for Ireland.

2. It's not up to you to say they are inaccurate or misleading. That's up to other people to decide.

3. You're not willing to share any of the blame for this? I accept that we are equally to blame but you seem to think you are above reproach. I am not avoiding any questions whatsoever. This is old ground we are covering. We have each went over this countless times. Yes. You called me a "bitter, small-minded little man" not a "vile little man". I do apologise for that. I sincerely doubt anyone else was offended by my comment in the Andy Keogh thread. If anyone else said it, I doubt you would find any issue with it. I still apologised in any case. I would like to point out that I am not prejudiced against people with tattoos. My father has tattoos. I was just making (what I thought was) a humorous comment about the preponderance of tattoos on modern footballers compared to a decade ago. I don't know why you think it's okay to call me "bitter", "small-minded" or "little", or to say that I am "spoofing", "trolling" or "wumming". I genuinely resent that. I have treated you with nothing but courtesy while we are arguing. I wish you would do the same.

4. We were both told to stop quarreling on threads because our behavior was irritating other users and derailing threads. Since then, you have continually flouted this. You brought up Jack Grealish, completely unprovoked, on a thread specifically to have a go at me; after Tets moratorium on mentioning him on threads. You have had a go at me, completely unprovoked, on the "Andy Keogh", "Jon Walters", "David McGoldrick", "James McCarthy" and "Kevin Long" threads off the top of my head. You didn't/don't attempt to discuss anything by private message. You just referred me to a thread where you left another haranguing public comment (after you/we were told to stop). Like I said, you referred me to a public thread where you left a comment, so I responded there. If you had left a comment by private message like you were encouraged to do, I would have responded there.

You're right. This is sorry and it is embarrassing. I have told you by private message that I don't have the time to be going in circles on this and reading essay length comments because I have had three exams this month and another on the way. Since I left you that PM, I have had to deal with a distraught younger sister because her friend died in a car crash.

There are more important things in life and I am not going through this anymore. I wish I could be naive enough to believe you won't engage me anymore but letting you have the last word on all the aforementioned threads hasn't worked then and it won't work now.

As I have said, I requested you to block me and/or to ignore me, but you refused to do it. That's on you, not me.

[DannyInvincible]

I've replied on your wall as it's dawned upon me that we're probably not receiving one another's PMs seeing as we both have one another blocked, by the sounds of it.

[geysir]

It's the friday night 'Karpman drama triangle' special.
episode 10 series 6.

[dong]

This whole exchange is priceless.
Will this all end up in divorce?

[colonelwest]

[Fixer82]

This whole exchange is priceless.
Will this all end up in divorce?

Who's gonna get the dog?

[DeLorean]

There is no dog. TOWK thinks they're too dangerous and although Danny says that this is a small minded attitude, he feels dogs are too illogical to tutor, though it is a challenge he is tempted by.

[Closed Account]

Nutrition is part of the recovery. There have been two big changes with James this season, one is the amount of international football he’s played, and that has brought extra work. The other is he is still growing.

That means the tissues are more sensitive. I know James can cope with the amount of games he needs to play, but it is true that your body can be extra sensitive the way you recover, the nutrition, the way you sleep, you shouldn’t overload, and it is important we find a way to help James in the future.

Quotes like this won't improve Martinez reputation with Irish fans. Smacks of a man under pressure. Wouldn't be suprised if he's out of a job by May.

http://www.herald.ie/sport/soccer/ev...-30896457.html

Also, Spurs are being heavily linked with our Jamie.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/footba...-james-4950895

[DeLorean]

After Keane's comments maybe he's just said to himself... "f**k them".

[DannyInvincible]

Quotes like this won't improve Martinez reputation with Irish fans. Smacks of a man under pressure. Wouldn't be suprised if he's out of a job by May.

It's odd considering James has played in only one international fixture since the beginning of this Premier League season; that was our group opening game in Georgia on the 7th of September. Prior to that game, he last played an international game on the 5th of March last year; that was the 2-1 friendly loss to Serbia. More recently, even when he was with the squad pre-Scotland game, he was rested from training for the entire week.

[tricky_colour]

It's the friday night 'Karpman drama triangle' special.
episode 10 series 6.

Looks like the triangle has morphed into a square.

Where will it all end??

[OwlsFan]

I can't blame Martinez for hating international football, and our international team in particular. I remember he was in the stand to see Gibson's much heralded return to our side following the departure of Trap and there, in front of his eyes, Gibson picks up an injury that rules him out for the rest of the season.

John Giles attacking a manager? Shock!

[KK77]

I can't blame Martinez for hating international football, and our international team in particular. I remember he was in the stand to see Gibson's much heralded return to our side following the departure of Trap and there, in front of his eyes, Gibson picks up an injury that rules him out for the rest of the season.

John Giles attacking a manager? Shock!

He wasn't attacking. He is was giving his opinion. Shock!