James McCarthy M Celtic b.1990

[tricky_colour]

At last I have found the build up to the last goal



Not really had a look at it myself yet so will comment later.

[geysir]

Apart from normal curiosity, i don't see the point of forensic analysis of who was where, when the last goal was scored.

That we could have managed to beat Austria at home playing the crudest form of football currently on the International scene, if only we played the last 5 minutes, doesn't justify the means.

[tricky_colour]

Well I have watched it several times now and they score every time.

[geysir]

Well I have watched it several times now and they score every time.

And what have you learned apart from they score every time?

[tricky_colour]

Apart from normal curiosity, i don't see the point of forensic analysis of who was where, when the last goal was scored.

That we could have managed to beat Austria at home playing the crudest form of football currently on the International scene, if only we played the last 5 minutes, doesn't justify the means.

I think you have to analyse and learn from your mistakes,

But I am not very good at explaining it and you might think I lack a 'certain credibility' in which case
I think you should watch the video here were Billie Davis who has just won 6 games in a row
explains it better than I can.

And remember he was done this with a couple of player who can't make the Ireland team!!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/21801109

Hull 1-2 Nottm Forest
Nottm Forest 3-1 Wolves
Nottm Forest 1-0 Ipswich
Sheff Wed 0-1 Nottm Forest
Charlton 0-2 Nottm Forest
Nottm Forest 6-1 Huddersfield


I woudl add he lost his first game in charge, and drew the second before going on a six game
winning streak.

I mean you have obviously done your own analysis (but not presented it) otherwise you woudl not be able to
make a statement such as "playing the crudest form of football".

I mean really you need to elaborate on what it is that is crude about our game.
That's the first step to making improvements.

[tricky_colour]

And what have you learned apart from they score every time?

How disorganised we were and the folly of McCarthy chasing that ball out when he is not going to get there
in time, Paul Green starts chasing it but pulls back when he realises he won't get the ball. OK McCarthy was closer
to getting the ball but none the less if he does not get there he leave a big hole in the defence.
I think you could criticise a number of players in the video, but at this late stage in the game surely defence has
to be top priority.

I mean we had defended OK for 45 minutes but it seems we lost it in those final few minutes.

[geysir]

I think you have to analyse and learn from your mistakes,

But I am not very good at explaining it and you might think I lack a 'certain credibility' in which case
I think you should watch the video here were Billie Davis who has just won 6 games in a row
explains it better than I can.

And remember he was done this with a couple of player who can't make the Ireland team!!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/21801109

Hull 1-2 Nottm Forest
Nottm Forest 3-1 Wolves
Nottm Forest 1-0 Ipswich
Sheff Wed 0-1 Nottm Forest
Charlton 0-2 Nottm Forest
Nottm Forest 6-1 Huddersfield


I woudl add he lost his first game in charge, and drew the second before going on a six game
winning streak.

I mean you have obviously done your own analysis (but not presented it) otherwise you woudl not be able to
make a statement such as "playing the crudest form of football".

I mean really you need to elaborate on what it is that is crude about our game.
That's the first step to making improvements.

Do I have to elaborate on what is crude about our game?

It's simple, we didn't lose the leading position just because of some piece of attacking play which found our midfield at 6s and 7s in the final minute.
Analysing the last piece of play, looking for ways to improve a defunct football strategy is a futile exercise, imo. The manager made a change late in the second half which didn't attempt to rectify what most could see and refused to make other decisions, all added up to leaving a bedraggled midfield in a worse situation and more susceptible to a sucker punch. And of all the sucker punches we have taken over the years, this one was thoroughly deserved.

[tricky_colour]

One of the things which worried me a bit was Trap saying he was going to punch James McCarthy.
I think this may have forced James to play out of his comfort zone leading to errors of judgement.

It's one thing saying players need to do so and so but it they don't have the capacity to play that way
and try to then it's gonna be problematic.

Anyhow we have plenty of time to sort things out before the crucial games between Sweden and Austria.

[tetsujin1979]

One of the things which worried me a bit was Trap saying he was going to punch James McCarthy.
I think this may have forced James to play out of his comfort zone leading to errors of judgement.

It's one thing saying players need to do so and so but it they don't have the capacity to play that way
and try to then it's gonna be problematic.

Anyhow we have plenty of time to sort things out before the crucial games between Sweden and Austria.

that's the second time you posted about that
you do know he was joking, right?

[Charlie Darwin]

you do know he was joking, right?

I'll reserve judgement until I see James' physical condition on Saturday.

[paul_oshea]

tets he isnt taking the line literally but that he is suggesting by trap talking like this and initially not going to play him its like mccarthy felt he needed to play the way trap wanted/expected him to play which was out of his comfort zone.

i think its a very good theory and a fair reason for his questionable positioning at time.

[Charlie Darwin]

I thought Trap's reasoning behind punching James was the opposite reason, to force him to be proactive and express himself rather than being meek and over-cautious.

[tricky_colour]

that's the second time you posted about that
you do know he was joking, right?

Many a true word is spoken in jest

He will probably get a good punch when Trap reviews the video of the last goal

[tricky_colour]

I thought Trap's reasoning behind punching James was the opposite reason, to force him to be proactive and express himself rather than being meek and over-cautious.

But this was something I was alluding too, confidence comes from ability and Trap is pressuring him
to be more confident on the pitch when he is not really capable of playing that roll with out costly
blunders.

I mean presumably James has tried being more confident on the pitch in the past with none
too good results. Had he Roy Keanes ability he would probably be a lot more confident.
Possibly even an arrogant bar steward.

[tricky_colour]

Having said all that the two draws do not really change much, the just kick the can a bit further down the road,
it's the remaining games between Austria and Sweden that matter.

I feel a little better about the incident having seen it in context, but it just struck me it is rare
to see James so far up the pitch, normally when I have watched him in the past he not at all keen
to get forward.

[paul_oshea]

i think we are almost in agreememt but looking from two different angles - im looking at the right angle Asking him to play with confidence is not going to put him out of position but asking him to be proactive and assertive might make james lose his head a bit and run around chasing everything. It would certainly hold water on the last goal.

[SwanVsDalton]

tets he isnt taking the line literally but that he is suggesting by trap talking like this and initially not going to play him its like mccarthy felt he needed to play the way trap wanted/expected him to play which was out of his comfort zone.

i think its a very good theory and a fair reason for his questionable positioning at time.

Can't really see it to be honest. Firstly I'd say the 'express yourself' message came from Ireland being on the ball ie James should get on it, set the tempo etc. Without the ball it stands to reason McCarthy's positioning should be disciplined. I'd find it hard to believe any manager, especially Trap The System, would encourage him to play like that without telling him to watch his position when we don't have the ball.

Second if James had an iota of common sense he wouldn't be thinking that way in the final moments anyway. Really it wouldn't be the time or place. If this was the case I think it'd reflect quite badly on the player, as well as manager, to be honest. I think McCarthy's got more about him than that. Sure he's a young guy looking to please his manager but, still, if McCarthy was feeling the pressure to act he'd have a good idea of how and when to do it. Think he was just caught out of position imo.

Edit - Also just about a minute previously McCarthy had, uncharacteristically, booted the ball first time back to the Austrian keeper from about halfway, even though he had plenty of time. Doesn't seem like a guy looking to please the manager so much as a guy losing his composure, with his teammates, at a crucial moment.

Also would the way Trap asked him to play be out of comfort zone? Just wondering what everyone's thoughts are, but I'd have thought most here would say James has the potential in him to dominate a game.

[tricky_colour]

Unfortunately I have not seen the bit where he boots the ball away.
It seems everything happening in the last few minutes my stream stopped working in.

[tricky_colour]

http://www.joe.ie/home/pic-of-the-da...-leg-0035924-1

Results of McCarthy tackle on the Austrian Zlatko Junuzovic

[NeverFeltBetter]

Ouch. When I first saw that tackle I thought a red was coming.