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View Poll Results: Who is your choice for the next senior men's international team manager

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33. You may not vote on this poll
  • Allardyce, Sam

    2 6.06%
  • Bilic, Slaven

    0 0%
  • Bruce, Steve

    0 0%
  • Carsley, Lee

    1 3.03%
  • Clement, Paul

    0 0%
  • Coleman, Chris

    1 3.03%
  • Cook, Paul

    2 6.06%
  • Goran-Eriksson, Sven

    1 3.03%
  • Grayson, Simon

    0 0%
  • Hughton, Chris

    5 15.15%
  • Keane, Robbie

    1 3.03%
  • Keane, Roy

    1 3.03%
  • Kenny, Stephen

    14 42.42%
  • Kerr, Brian

    3 9.09%
  • Lennon, Neil

    1 3.03%
  • McCarthy, Mick

    7 21.21%
  • Moyes, David

    0 0%
  • Queiroz, Carlos

    2 6.06%
  • Redknapp, Harry

    1 3.03%
  • Wenger, Arsene

    2 6.06%
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Thread: Next Ireland manager?

  1. #161
    Capped Player DannyInvincible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeLorean View Post
    I don't get this sudden love-in for Kerr. I actually like him for the most part and, yes, he probably should be involved at some level of Irish football but he had his chance in a big role and ultimately it wasn't very good.

    Stephen Kenny is a bit of a reactionary, flavour of the month suggestion. He doesn't have the credentials in my opinion and wouldn't garner the respect required for the role, neither from the media nor the players. He would have it all to prove and enter the firing line almost immediately.

    Has his stock not fallen somewhat anyway? John Caulfield isn't exactly hailed for his tactical nous and supposedly managing an inferior, primitive footballing side, yet he has almost completely got Kenny's measure over the last season or two (P 10 W 7 D 2 L 1 F 16 A 5). One of those draws was the FAI Cup win on penalties too. Their childish, small-time bickering at each other wouldn't inspire confidence either. Kenny had one opportunity to produce at a higher level and unfortunately he didn't, quite the opposite in fact.
    I dunno if it's fair to say that the evident esteem in which people hold Kerr is a love-in all of a sudden. I'd say it's more the case that the apparent tactical illiteracy of O'Neill has provided a stark reminder of the inexplicable reality that the knowledge and insights of the very-much-available Brian Kerr aren't being exploited at any level of Irish football beyond punditry external to the actual running of the game.

    I think former LOI players in the squad (and there are a lot more now in comparison to a decade or two ago) would at least respect and look up to Kenny if he was to be put in charge of the international team. In fact, he has already in the past worked directly with a few of the players who are currently in and around the squad; James McClean, Stephen Ward, Daryl Horgan, Seáni Maguire and Andy Boyle, for example. As for the players in the squad who've never played in the LOI, I'd doubt they'd look down upon the league or the fact it's where Kenny made his name considering half of their international team-mates came through it. I think the league commands a greater level of respect now that it didn't have in prior times.

    Fair point that Kenny has never done well against Cork. This season, Conor McCormack has been able to stifle Paddy McEleney in virtually every game they played. It is admittedly a concern or a blot of sorts on Kenny's record as he doesn't appear to have found a way to get the better of Cork head-to-head. It would appear to indicate that he may have an Achilles heal. In saying that, I'm not sure Kenny's stock has necessarily fallen of late. Obviously, he hasn't been in the limelight as much recently compared to when Dundalk were in the Europa League, but had they not narrowly missed out on European progression this season to Rosenborg, things might have been different.

    Dundalk started the domestic season poorly as Kenny had to re-organise after losing two pivotal players in Horgan and Boyle, but once they got going and into the run of things again, they were very impressive. Dundalk's form in the latter half of the season was superb. They displayed title-winning form towards the end and, whilst they didn't manage to completely close the once-massive gap on Cork, I'm sure there were some nerves on Leeside as Cork stuttered towards the finish line with Dundalk making a late push and closing in. It ended up a lot tighter in the end than anyone would ever have envisaged back in July when Cork showed all the signs of steam-rolling their way to the title with ease.

    On Kenny's alleged failure to produce at a higher level, I'd argue that the Europa League merits a "higher level" classification. Simply qualifying for that alone was an amazing achievement, after also having come so close to the Champions League group stage, but the fact his team then went on to pick up four points in the competition and remained very competitive in all their group games far surpassed anyone's wildest expectations.

    Dunfermline didn't go well for him on the whole, true, but it wasn't all failure. Dunfermline were already likely relegation candidates when he took over, so he already had a mountain to climb from day one. In spite of this, he still managed to lead them to a Scottish Cup final, beating Hibs in the semi-final, and qualified for Europe despite losing the final to Celtic 1-0. Dunfermline also reached the Scottish Challenge Cup final in his second season.

    Just a concluding thought or theory on the apparent spat between Kenny and Caulfield... After Richard Sadlier's involvement with St. Pat's, he once spoke of having attended a conference that had been arranged by some PR gurus to help those running clubs improve their clubs' profiles. According to Sadlier, the consultants running the conference expressly encouraged the idea of brewing or provoking relatively minor controversies, "feuds" and media "storms" in order to cultivate "bitter" rivalries and personas with whom the public could connect or identify and to garner more headlines, exposure, coverage and interest. As far as these consultants were concerned, the odd row in public now and again was of practical benefit to clubs and thus was considered entirely professional, in spite of the negative surface optics. Perhaps there's an aspect of that - pantomime and exaggeration - to the public rowing between Kenny and Caulfield. If not, it all does seem a bit petty, although I've always found Kenny to be very diligent in explaining and defending himself (as he has had to do after being personally and incorrectly accused of various things by Caulfield). Caulfield just strikes me as a bit more emotional, hasty and ill-considered in his declarations and outbursts.

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  3. #162
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    I was about to post something similar. MON needs someone alongside him who "does tactics". You often hear that tactics are overrated, players win games not formations etc., but tactics were clearly our downfall last Tuesday night. Denmark are not 4 goals better than us. Taking off Arter and Meyler (both of whom were doing okay) for McGeady and Hoolahan so early was way too much of a dice roll on a number of fronts. Bringing on Hoolahan would have been a good move, but you need some stability behind him and someone to play the ball in to him (i.e. Arter and Meyler). Playing Hoolahan like that with the carpet pulled from him was just bound to failure. Same holds for McGeady, who was an even bigger dice roll. Removing the two DMs obviously gave Eriksen oceans of space and all of the goals game from that space.

    We also had 45 minutes to get two goals without conceding. Surely the approach is get one at some stage during the second half (even on 85 minutes is still OK) and then the stadium goes nuts, the Danes get nervy and you have a chance of a second. Then you can pull your DMs and a central defender and go all-in. There was no need for the wild change of a approach on 45.

    Another thing that annoyed me is that Meyler didn't play the 1st game, so was probably one of the freshest lads on the field. Why pull him? Why not Arter? Why not Brady or Hendrick, who clearly weren't having the best of games? Why not Ward off, Brady to LB to keep him on the field for set pieces, and Hoolahan on? Why not Long for Murphy on 45 or 60 minutes, as Murphy was having little impact and looked knackered in both games (and I like the guy).

    To get back to the original point: listening to and reading Kerr, it is obvious that he has huge knowledge of the European and world game and an understanding of tactics and shapes and approaches. He was conservative in his stint as a manager, but a bit more conservativeness and shape on Tuesday might have kept us in it longer. How about MON for the motivation skills and for dealing with the press and someone like Kerr (or Kenny for that matter) to stand beside him on the sideline and say to him "let's not take off the two DMs, as they'll run amok, let's make one change and see how it goes". Keane doesn't seem to be the man to offer this kind of input.

    It's probably wishful thinking due to the personalities involved, but this kind of a ticket would add the skills currently missing from MON-RK. We have put out some very odd shapes in recent years. The friendly v Mexico was just batsh*t, trying out new(ish) caps and then pulling the rug from under them with the wild formation. An unimportant game, but why blood so many new players in a combination that is just bound to fail.

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  5. #163
    Capped Player DeLorean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DannyInvincible View Post
    I dunno if it's fair to say that the evident esteem in which people hold Kerr is a love-in all of a sudden.
    I explained what I meant by 'sudden' in post #156. I wasn't saying people didn't respect or like him previously. The u-turn from Dunphy is laughable though.

    Quote Originally Posted by DannyInvincible View Post
    I'd say it's more the case that the apparent tactical illiteracy of O'Neill has provided a stark reminder of the inexplicable reality that the knowledge and insights of the very-much-available Brian Kerr aren't being exploited at any level of Irish football beyond punditry external to the actual running of the game.
    Was Kerr really much better tactically when he actually had the job himself? Short memories.

    Quote Originally Posted by DannyInvincible View Post
    I think former LOI players in the squad (and there are a lot more now in comparison to a decade or two ago) would at least respect and look up to Kenny if he was to be put in charge of the international team. In fact, he has already in the past worked directly with a few of the players who are currently in and around the squad; James McClean, Stephen Ward, Daryl Horgan, Seáni Maguire and Andy Boyle, for example. As for the players in the squad who've never played in the LOI, I'd doubt they'd look down upon the league or the fact it's where Kenny made his name considering half of their international team-mates came through it. I think the league commands a greater level of respect now that it didn't have in prior times.
    He's still small time compared to the obvious respect players have for the likes of O'Neill & Keane. It doesn't mean it couldn't work, I just don't think Kenny is justifiably qualified for the job. It would swallow him up, just a personal hunch. I would love to be proved wrong and he repeats his Dundalk accomplishments with us, and does it with style.

    Quote Originally Posted by DannyInvincible View Post
    Dundalk started the domestic season poorly as Kenny had to re-organise after losing two pivotal players in Horgan and Boyle, but once they got going and into the run of things again, they were very impressive. Dundalk's form in the latter half of the season was superb. They displayed title-winning form towards the end and, whilst they didn't manage to completely close the once-massive gap on Cork, I'm sure there were some nerves on Leeside as Cork stuttered towards the finish line with Dundalk making a late push and closing in. It ended up a lot tighter in the end than anyone would ever have envisaged back in July when Cork showed all the signs of steam-rolling their way to the title with ease.
    Cork stuttered after losing two of their best players, one of which was irreplaceable. It would have been virtually impossible to maintain the form they were in for a full season anyway, but they still won pulling up. It was never really in doubt. Yes, Dundalk went on a brilliant run themselves but were still outplayed when they went to Turners Cross needing a win. Anyway, I'm not doubting Kenny's credentials at LOI level, he's clearly brilliant, just making the point that he's been outwitted on a regular basis by a manager who isn't held in anywhere near as high a regard.

    Quote Originally Posted by DannyInvincible View Post
    On Kenny's alleged failure to produce at a higher level, I'd argue that the Europa League merits a "higher level" classification. Simply qualifying for that alone was an amazing achievement, after also having come so close to the Champions League group stage, but the fact his team then went on to pick up four points in the competition and remained very competitive in all their group games far surpassed anyone's wildest expectations.
    They did, and it was absolutely brilliant, but it's a cup run/once off at the end of the day, for now at least.

    Quote Originally Posted by DannyInvincible View Post
    Dunfermline didn't go well for him on the whole, true, but it wasn't all failure. Dunfermline were already likely relegation candidates when he took over, so he already had a mountain to climb from day one. In spite of this, he still managed to lead them to a Scottish Cup final, beating Hibs in the semi-final, and qualified for Europe despite losing the final to Celtic 1-0. Dunfermline also reached the Scottish Challenge Cup final in his second season.
    I think you're clutching at straws a bit here. They had a very good cup run but were second bottom of the Scottish Championship when he was sacked! It was a disaster.

    Quote Originally Posted by DannyInvincible View Post
    Just a concluding thought or theory on the apparent spat between Kenny and Caulfield... After Richard Sadlier's involvement with St. Pat's, he once spoke of having attended a conference that had been arranged by some PR gurus to help those running clubs improve their clubs' profiles. According to Sadlier, the consultants running the conference expressly encouraged the idea of brewing or provoking relatively minor controversies, "feuds" and media "storms" in order to cultivate "bitter" rivalries and personas with whom the public could connect or identify and to garner more headlines, exposure, coverage and interest. As far as these consultants were concerned, the odd row in public now and again was of practical benefit to clubs and thus was considered entirely professional, in spite of the negative surface optics. Perhaps there's an aspect of that - pantomime and exaggeration - to the public rowing between Kenny and Caulfield. If not, it all does seem a bit petty, although I've always found Kenny to be very diligent in explaining and defending himself (as he has had to do after being personally and incorrectly accused of various things by Caulfield). Caulfield just strikes me as a bit more emotional, hasty and ill-considered in his declarations and outbursts.
    I find Caulfield very articulate, even if he is a passionate sort as well. I agree that a lot of the 'feuds' are for show, but they both lack the charisma to pull it off. Instead of being appealing, it's completely irritating/boring.

  6. #164
    Coach tetsujin1979's Avatar
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    Another possible negative for Kenny is he didn't get anywhere near his best from Sean Maguire

  7. #165
    Capped Player DeLorean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by p2011 View Post
    I was about to post something similar. MON needs someone alongside him who "does tactics". You often hear that tactics are overrated, players win games not formations etc., but tactics were clearly our downfall last Tuesday night. Denmark are not 4 goals better than us. Taking off Arter and Meyler (both of whom were doing okay) for McGeady and Hoolahan so early was way too much of a dice roll on a number of fronts. Bringing on Hoolahan would have been a good move, but you need some stability behind him and someone to play the ball in to him (i.e. Arter and Meyler). Playing Hoolahan like that with the carpet pulled from him was just bound to failure. Same holds for McGeady, who was an even bigger dice roll. Removing the two DMs obviously gave Eriksen oceans of space and all of the goals game from that space.

    We also had 45 minutes to get two goals without conceding. Surely the approach is get one at some stage during the second half (even on 85 minutes is still OK) and then the stadium goes nuts, the Danes get nervy and you have a chance of a second. Then you can pull your DMs and a central defender and go all-in. There was no need for the wild change of a approach on 45.

    Another thing that annoyed me is that Meyler didn't play the 1st game, so was probably one of the freshest lads on the field. Why pull him? Why not Arter? Why not Brady or Hendrick, who clearly weren't having the best of games? Why not Ward off, Brady to LB to keep him on the field for set pieces, and Hoolahan on? Why not Long for Murphy on 45 or 60 minutes, as Murphy was having little impact and looked knackered in both games (and I like the guy).
    I think nearly everybody would agree with all of this. The substitutions were bizarre beyond comprehension, with foresight as well as hindsight.

    Quote Originally Posted by p2011 View Post
    To get back to the original point: listening to and reading Kerr, it is obvious that he has huge knowledge of the European and world game and an understanding of tactics and shapes and approaches. He was conservative in his stint as a manager, but a bit more conservativeness and shape on Tuesday might have kept us in it longer. How about MON for the motivation skills and for dealing with the press and someone like Kerr (or Kenny for that matter) to stand beside him on the sideline and say to him "let's not take off the two DMs, as they'll run amok, let's make one change and see how it goes". Keane doesn't seem to be the man to offer this kind of input.
    O'Neill messed up with the substitutions, but defensive solidity it hardly something he needs lessons in from Kenny (in particular) or Kerr. I'm sure Roy Keane could see it if the rest of us could, but it's O'Neill's call.

  8. #166
    Seasoned Pro backstothewall's Avatar
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    This is starting to look a lot less theoretical!
    Bring Back Belfast Celtic F.C.

  9. #167
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    What's everyone thinking now? Is Mick McCarthy the safest best? How I would love Hughton to get it but unlikely. Is Stephen Kenny a risk?

  10. #168
    Seasoned Pro backstothewall's Avatar
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    I jotted down a quick list of potential candidates who are available, or who might be. I've assumed we won't be paying compensation to get anyone who is already in work elsewhere.

    Mick McCarthy
    Thomas Tuchel
    Peter Bosz
    Ronald Koeman
    Mark Hughes
    Bernd Schuster
    Carlo Ancelotti
    Manuel Pellegrini
    Carlos Queiroz
    Guus Hiddink
    Louis Van Gaal
    Michael O'Neill
    John Sheridan
    Stephen Kenny
    Jurgen Klinsmann
    Laurent Blanc
    Luis Enrique
    Marcelo Bielsa
    Sven Goran Eriksson
    Thomas Schaaf
    Jean Tigana
    Paul Clement
    Sinisa Mihailjovic
    Alex McLeish
    Martin Jol
    Brian McDermott
    David O'Leary
    Glenn Hoddle
    Roberto Di Matteo
    Gary Monk
    Last edited by backstothewall; 12/01/2018 at 1:27 AM.
    Bring Back Belfast Celtic F.C.

  11. #169
    International Prospect NeverFeltBetter's Avatar
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    McCarthy the front-runner, if he actually wants to come back. Michael O'Neill would be a coup. Think Stephen Kenny would be a great pick, but for the fact that the media would eviscerate him the moment things started to go even slightly wrong.

    Some of those high-profile names would be beyond us I think.
    Author of Never Felt Better (History, Film Reviews).

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  13. #170
    Capped Player DeLorean's Avatar
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    McCarthy is only contracted until the summer so I suppose the compensation wouldn't be huge. We could probably plod along until then anyway if needs be. I'd be happy enough with that choice.

  14. #171
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    Roy would be a bad choice, one good season as a manager
    S.Kenny I would be risky with as no experience in a fully Pro league and no international experience
    Mick would be a grand choice , but I would go for Michael O'Neill and I think he would go for us as well

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    It sure would be interesting to see if Michael O’ Neill would take the Republic of Ireland Job .

    Perhaps he could amalgamate the two teams just for the crack .

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  17. #173
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    Lee Carsley and Steven Reid are names I'd like to see in the mix in some capacity

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  19. #174
    Seasoned Pro backstothewall's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stuttgart88 View Post
    Lee Carsley and Steven Reid are names I'd like to see in the mix in some capacity
    I'd like Enda McNulty to be part of the backroom staff. I think the number of times we threw away leads in the last campaign is a sign that the mental toughness of the squad could be improved, and he has a track record of helping Irish sportsmen and women with that in the past
    Bring Back Belfast Celtic F.C.

  20. #175
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    I would be happy with Mick McC as he played decent football with us before and did well with a limited enough team, though probably more limited now. Think he would be interested, big difficulty is the history there which would be trotted out as soon as something goes wrong.

    The criteria should be a manager who has shown an ability to perform well with limited resources particularly in cup competitions. Arguably Stephen Kenny is in that bracket.

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  22. #176
    Seasoned Pro jbyrne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by elroy View Post
    I would be happy with Mick McC as he played decent football with us before and did well with a limited enough team, though probably more limited now. Think he would be interested, big difficulty is the history there which would be trotted out as soon as something goes wrong.
    we don't deserve mick back the way he was treated the last time. throughout his reign he had the media and many fans on his back culminating in the dreadful treatment he received at the swiss loss in 2002. absolutely loved following the team when he was in charge and would have him back in a flash but external factors like the media and the deluded expectations from many of our fans might put him off coming back

  23. #177
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    Quote Originally Posted by backstothewall View Post
    I jotted down a quick list of potential candidates who are available, or who might be. I've assumed we won't be paying compensation to get anyone who is already in work elsewhere.

    Mick McCarthy
    Thomas Tuchel
    Peter Bosz
    Ronald Koeman
    Mark Hughes
    Bernd Schuster
    Carlo Ancelotti
    Manuel Pellegrini
    Carlos Queiroz
    Guus Hiddink
    Louis Van Gaal
    Michael O'Neill
    John Sheridan
    Stephen Kenny
    ^Queiroz and Pellegrini are currently managing



    To add to the list above :

    Jurgen Klinsmann
    Laurent Blanc
    Luis Enrique
    Marcelo Bielsa
    Sven Goran Eriksson
    Thomas Schaaf
    Jean Tigana
    Paul Clement
    Sinisa Mihailjovic
    Alex McLeish
    Martin Jol
    Brian McDermott
    David O'Leary
    Glenn Hoddle
    Roberto Di Matteo
    Gary Monk
    Last edited by TrapAPony; 11/01/2018 at 2:13 PM.
    "We lost because we didn't win"- Ronaldo

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    David O'Leary still manages?
    Author of Never Felt Better (History, Film Reviews).

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    Capped Player DeLorean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jbyrne View Post
    we don't deserve mick back the way he was treated the last time. throughout his reign he had the media and many fans on his back culminating in the dreadful treatment he received at the swiss loss in 2002. absolutely loved following the team when he was in charge and would have him back in a flash but external factors like the media and the deluded expectations from many of our fans might put him off coming back
    A timely interview with The Irish Sun from a couple of days ago - https://www.thesun.ie/news/2021675/m...n-of-his-life/

    Quote Originally Posted by Mick McCarthy
    It rankles me that I left Ireland on such a sour note after the Switzerland game.

    Had I left after the World Cup, had I just walked away and done another job, I think my profile and legacy would have been looked at differently and better.

    But I stayed on because I had Kevin Kilbane, Robbie Keane, Damien Duff. I’d built a really good side, I didn’t want to walk away from that.
    Sounds a bit like unfinished business to me?

  26. #180
    International Prospect NeverFeltBetter's Avatar
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    An argument for and against the likelihood of McCarthy being offered the job could be the way thing stand at Ipswich. They've reverted under him after a good few seasons in the first half of his tenure, 16th last season, 12th currently. McCarthy might well want to get away and try something new having spent most of the last decade scrapping in the Championship or battling EPL relegation but, then again, has he really accomplished all that much to be considered next to other candidates?
    Author of Never Felt Better (History, Film Reviews).

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