Euro 2016 Play-Offs - November 13th and 16th

**davidatrb** · 13/10/2015, 10:48 PM

Originally Posted by DeLorean

To be fair I think your point was valid enough as well. I wouldn't get too bogged down with the various points some of our potential opponents picked up though. You must admit you'd surely be more concerned if any of them had picked up four points against a Germany or Spain than drips and drabs against so called direct rivals? I definitely would anyway.

Yep. We'll be the unseeded team to avoid. The seeds will prefer to play the team that lost 4-0 home to Armenia rather than the slayers of the World Champions.

**Kingdom** · 13/10/2015, 10:49 PM

Originally Posted by DeLorean

To be fair I think your point was valid enough as well. I wouldn't get too bogged down with the various points some of our potential opponents picked up though. You must admit you'd surely be more concerned if any of them had picked up four points against a Germany or Spain than drips and drabs against so called direct rivals? I definitely would anyway.

Yerra it's half of one, and half of another. For example, in the noughties on reflection and in the context of not qualifying for any tournaments in the respective campaigns, I'd have preferred Northern Ireland's notable victories over some pretty big-hitters (england, spain, denmark, sweden, italy draw) in comparison to their standing, rather than our situation whereby in every meaningful game we never struck a hammer-blow to the opposition. Despite those big victories, if we'd played the North at any stage, I'd have fancied us home and away.

Freak results are freak results, they happen every once in a while. If we'd dominated Germany or even achieved parity in play then yes, as a foreigner, I'd be trying to steer clear of the ROI, but despite coming third, we've imposed ourselves for roughly 20 mins twice against our peers. That form isn't sustainable.

**tetsujin1979** · 13/10/2015, 10:52 PM

Originally Posted by tricky_colour

Do I hate the editor it is useless!!

use a code block: https://www.vbulletin.org/forum/misc.php?do=bbcode#code

Code:

         P W D L  F  A GD PtsHungary 10 4 4 2 11  9  2 16
Sweden  10 5 3 2 15  9  6 18
Ukraine 10 6 1 3 14  4 10 19
Bosnia  10 5 2 3 17 12  5 17
----------------------------
Ireland 10 5 3 2 19  7 12 18

**Real ale Madrid** · 13/10/2015, 10:56 PM

Freak results are freak results but I wouldn't disregard our 1-0 win over Germany no more than I would disregard Sweden's 4-1 home defeat to Austria, or Hungary losing 4-3 to Greece when they had the chance to qualify automatically.

We must be in with a shout against those 2 in particular.

**Kingdom** · 13/10/2015, 11:06 PM

Originally Posted by Real ale Madrid

Freak results are freak results but I wouldn't disregard our 1-0 win over Germany no more than I would disregard Sweden's 4-1 home defeat to Austria, or Hungary losing 4-3 to Greece when they had the chance to qualify automatically.

We must be in with a shout against those 2 in particular.

Yeah fair enough.

Anyway I'm not trying to justify my stance, I suppose I'm that pi$$ed with the manager that I'm finding it hard to see a way through these play-offs.

**eekers** · 13/10/2015, 11:14 PM

Originally Posted by tricky_colour

I am quite optimistic we will qualify now especially if we avoid Ukraine.

Said before though it is quite likely it will go to penalties?

It really isnt. Two legged games don't go to penalties very often.
1 in the 59 two legged ties in last years champions league and 2 in 50 two legged ties in the last world cup qualifiers.

**backstothewall** · 13/10/2015, 11:31 PM

Originally Posted by Kingdom

we lost in glasgow.

DOH.

I really should have know that. Especially with me having been at the game.

**tricky_colour** · 13/10/2015, 11:38 PM

Originally Posted by tetsujin1979

use a code block: https://www.vbulletin.org/forum/misc.php?do=bbcode#code

Code:

         P W D L  F  A GD Pts
Hungary 10 4 4 2 11  9  2 16
Sweden  10 5 3 2 15  9  6 18
Ukraine 10 6 1 3 14  4 10 19
Bosnia  10 5 2 3 17 12  5 17
----------------------------
Ireland 10 5 3 2 19  7 12 18

Thanks and FYP

Worth noting we have the best goal difference of all the top seeds!!
Ukraine conceeded just 4 goal 9,9, and 12
for the rest v our 7.

**tricky_colour** · 13/10/2015, 11:44 PM

Originally Posted by eekers

It really isnt. Two legged games don't go to penalties very often.
1 in the 59 two legged ties in last years champions league and 2 in 50 two legged ties in the last world cup qualifiers.

Really? That is a surprise. I guess it must be due to away goals rules as a draw is about a 1 in 3 chance hence 2 draws 1 in 9.

Actually it is not even that as you can have 2-1 and 1-2.

So seems surprising.

Didn't Ireland qualify on penalties some time?

**DannyInvincible** · 14/10/2015, 2:18 AM

Originally Posted by tricky_colour

Really? That is a surprise. I guess it must be due to away goals rules as a draw is about a 1 in 3 chance hence 2 draws 1 in 9.

Actually it is not even that as you can have 2-1 and 1-2.

The away goals rule creates so many more chances for differentiation than if all goals - home and away - carried equal weight. As soon as the number of goals scored by the away team in the second leg differs from the number of goals scored by the away team in the first leg, the chance of the game going to penalties becomes nil because if the aggregate score ends up even, the away goals rule will come into play and decide a winner in a game that otherwise would have gone into extra-time and possibly penalties.

Didn't Ireland qualify on penalties some time?

To the best of my knowledge, Ireland have only ever contested two competitive shoot-outs in our history; against Romania in 1990 and against Spain in 2002. We've been in the Euros on two occasions; 1988 and 2012. And we've been at the World Cup on three occasions; 1990, 1994 and 2002.

We lost the play-off in 1995 to Holland (that was the first in which we ever competed, I think, bar one against Spain for the 1966 World Cup, which wasn't officially a play-off considering it only arose as the third team, Syria, pulled out of our qualification group to leave just ourselves and Spain), we lost in 1997 to Belgium, we lost in 1999 to Turkey due to an away goal, we beat Iran in 2001 and we then failed to make a play-off again until 2009 where we lost to France. We then beat Estonia in 2011 and now we're back again. None of those games went to penalties.

**thischarmingman** · 14/10/2015, 2:23 AM

Turkey's players realise they've qualified outright:

http://www.101greatgoals.com/blog/aw...ro-2016-video/

**DeLorean** · 14/10/2015, 9:33 AM

Originally Posted by Kingdom

we've imposed ourselves for roughly 20 mins twice against our peers. That form isn't sustainable.

We basically lost to both by the odd goal over the two games. Even when we were poor (definitely both away games) we were still fairly competitive, and comfortable for long spells in Glasgow. We could and probably should have won both the homes games and could easily have snatched something undeserved in the away games (arguably as they did to us). Overall there wasn't much in it - the home sides generally being the better sides. I think to talk about only having only twenty minutes against each is almost forced negativity. Poland are probably better than anything we're going to face, Scotland possibly worse*. All to play for I think, even if Ukraine fall our way.

Edit - *definitely than three of the four.

**DeLorean** · 14/10/2015, 9:44 AM

Originally Posted by thischarmingman

Turkey's players realise they've qualified outright:

http://www.101greatgoals.com/blog/aw...ro-2016-video/

That's kind of how I felt when I saw they'd qualified too! Definitely a good one to avoid, nothing good ever comes out of a trip there, just ask Eric Cantona or Tony Cascarino! Even when we won there in 1991 we were still eliminated. Was great to see Croatia move out of the picture too.

**Gather round** · 14/10/2015, 10:29 AM

Good luck lads, the field looks pretty open.

Here's the complete form table in pastel shades:

**tetsujin1979** · 14/10/2015, 11:00 AM

RTE will be broadcasting the play off draw live: http://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2015/...play-off-draw/

**ArdeeBhoy** · 14/10/2015, 11:30 AM

Originally Posted by Gather round

Good luck lads, the field looks pretty open.

Here's the complete form table in pastel shades:

Don't be fooled people, is
sending disparaging messages elsewhere...

**christo** · 14/10/2015, 11:43 AM

Originally Posted by Kingdom

Bucharest

Ukraine - win in Belarus, point in Slovakia
Hungary - Point in Bucharest, Point in Belfast
Sweden - point in Vienna, point home v Russia, 4 points v Montenegro
Bosnia - 4 points from Wales, Point in Bruxelles
Slovenia - win v Switzerland, win in Vilnius,
Norway - 6 points v Bulgaria, home win v Croatia
Denmark - 6 points v Serbia, rescued point away v Albania.

these are some of the nice results the other play-off qualifiers achieved versus their peers. We took a point away to Scotland and at home to Poland.
I'm worried.

You can also say

Bosnia lost at home to Cyprus and away to Israel
Ukraine scrapped two wins against Macedonia
Hungary got 1 point vs Greece
Sweden drew with Montengro, got hammered 1-4 by Austria.

They all got good results but they also got bad ones, there is a reason these teams finished 3rd and not directly qualified. Any of them should be takeable. Also a point in Bucharest and Belfast wouldn't be something to write home about either.

**Fixer82** · 14/10/2015, 12:07 PM

Hungary defence looked brutal against Greece. Wouldn't mind drawing them

**geysir** · 14/10/2015, 12:11 PM

Originally Posted by DeLorean

That's kind of how I felt when I saw they'd qualified too! Definitely a good one to avoid, nothing good ever comes out of a trip there, just ask Eric Cantona or Tony Cascarino! Even when we won there in 1991 we were still eliminated. Was great to see Croatia move out of the picture too.

I really don't get the fear about Turkey. It's not based on science or history or on Turkey's home performances. Our record is good against them and generally we have a good record in eastern Europe and in similar fan frenzied environments. And considering last night's game, tactically they went for a draw, they still went for a draw despite the Czechs being 2 up, you never got the sense that direct qualification was on the agenda they were shít scared and then they scored late on out of the blue from a free kick.

**geysir** · 14/10/2015, 12:23 PM

Originally Posted by Kingdom

If you think there is the same pressure and expectation playing away to Germany, Netherlands, Spain, Portugal, the standard-bearers (usually) of European football, as there is playing Scotland, Austria, Slovakia, or any other of the 20 middling teams in the Eurozone, then it's not me that is on a different planet.

I don't think we lost against Poland due to us not handling the pressure, we lost because they played better and they were fully worth their 2nd place. I thought it was generally accepted that Poland's game was more affected by the pressure of the importance of the game than us.
I wonder how such a pressure game would have transpired if it was played in Dublin.

Pressure accumulates in a group when options have run out.
We were under extreme pressure in the home game against Germany to get at least a point, if we had failed to at least draw, we would not be in the play offs. The players were under extreme pressure to be perfect and not make the slightest mistake, the longer the game went on that pressure became greater, then we scored and held out under great pressure. The crowd were mental.