16 Team Premier Division / Winter Season from 2012/13 TODAY'S DAILY MAIL

**harps1954** · 20/10/2010, 1:19 PM

Sorry if this has been posted elsewhere, but I didn't see it.

There's a report by Philip Quinn in today's Irish Daily Mail saying that the 22 League of Ireland clubs met in Athlone on Monday night last regarding the structure of the LOI. The outcome of the meeting was that the clubs voted on a majority of 12-9 (one club must not have attended or didn't vote) to change the following:

- Summer Soccer gone to be replaced by a Winter Season from August 2012
- Premier Division to increase from 10 to 16 teams from end of 2011 season
- Setanta Cup to be run-off during the month of July specifically to help the teams that qualify for Europe

There would be no relegation at the end of 2011, and the top six clubs in the First Division will be promoted to the new 16 team Premier. The bottom six in the First Division will link up with 'A' league clubs and form a new second tier division. Suggestions that the 'A' league would then be scrapped or revamped as the second tier division.

No metion on what clubs will do from the end of next season (Nov 2011) until August 2012. I don't think you could go with a mini-league from February to May as the League Champions won't get European football as the Nov 2011 League Champions will be playing in the 2012/13 European competitions.

Also, the tightness of the vote suggested that there is a big split as to what this is what ALL the clubs really want. However, the findings from Monday's meeting of the clubs in Athlone is going to be presented to John Delaney and the League of Ireland Executive Committee at their meeting in Dublin tomorrow (Thursday). If they ratify it, the new 16 team Premier League will kick-off in August 2012.

As I said apologies if this has been posted elsewhere and I missed it.

**Dodge** · 20/10/2010, 1:27 PM

Definitely haven't seen it reported elsewhere. Quinn's a strange one. Gets to hear things but doesn't seem to be able to filter news from BS

Personally I'd love a winter season back

**Mr A** · 20/10/2010, 1:30 PM

Been hearing rumblings bout this for some time- especially regarding a 16 team team premier.

Sounds like a good move to be honest, hope it's true. Also heard there was going to be a proper national (i.e. not regionalised) U19 league which would be welcome too.

**Rasputin** · 20/10/2010, 1:35 PM

TBH I think most of it sounds good, I hate the 10 league format playing teams at least 4 times a season.
If Pats had won their Semi Final against Shams that would have been the 8th time we would have played them this season.
The ten team league is repetative tbh, and there isnt the same arguement of diluting the quality as I think the gap between the First Division and the Premier is alot smaller than it was 3-4 years ago.
Also I miss winter football, I personally think its a big part of following the LOI, a cold winters night under the floodlights at the Showgies, different class.

**L.T.F.C.** · 20/10/2010, 1:40 PM

Hmmm. I don't know what to make of it. Its going to seriously **** up the 6 other teams that are put into the second tier. Also, there'll only be 30 games a season. Wouldn't be a fan of that!

**legendz** · 20/10/2010, 1:40 PM

Haven't heard that story before either but they were rumblings alright on bringing back winter soccer and an expansion to a 16 team division. August would be a good month so start the league with the Setanta Cup starting in July as mentioned. A 16 club division reduces the number of league games by 6 though. There would be room for a group stage in the League Cup but European football would have to be a prize to make it worth while.
I've no idea what they clubs could to between November '11 to August '12. They could run a one-off League Cup with groups of 6 or 8 sides playing home and away, with the knock-out stages played out during the new '11-'12 season.

**legendz** · 20/10/2010, 1:54 PM

Originally Posted by L.T.F.C.

Hmmm. I don't know what to make of it. Its going to seriously **** up the 6 other teams that are put into the second tier. Also, there'll only be 30 games a season. Wouldn't be a fan of that!

There is too much of a focus on league football. The FAI could be a bit inventive, creative while taking ideas from other tournaments and set-up the League Cup for Premier clubs only with 4 groups of 4 and the winner qualifying for Europe.
For the 6 clubs missing out, I can't see why Division One could not stay in existence as a 10 club division, invite 4 clubs from the A Championship, probably a 36 game season. In time they could look at expanding it to 16 as well and expand the League Cup to 8 groups of 4.

**Dodge** · 20/10/2010, 1:55 PM

Originally Posted by L.T.F.C.

Hmmm. I don't know what to make of it. Its going to seriously **** up the 6 other teams that are put into the second tier.

Well they'd be in the second tier. same as now. And if they can't get in the top 16, they can't really complain.

As long as promotion and relegation between the divisions is there I can't see that as a problem. 30 games isn't that big a change from the 33 they were playing 3/4 years ago.

**pineapple stu** · 20/10/2010, 1:59 PM

Could be an idea to include all top flight sides in the Setanta Cup; maybe like the way the League Cup was (groups of four, with the group winners progressing, so everyone gets three games anyway) - would bring the top flight back up to the 33-game mark.

Assume the likes of Tralee, Castlebar, etc would be asked to step up to form a 10/12 team First Division.

Won't change things massively of course - assume this is helped by the same "big clubs" who wanted the smaller ones kept out now being stuck in the First Division or staring it in the face. But I'd be in favour overall of that outline.

**legendz** · 20/10/2010, 2:02 PM

If the Premier was 16, 30 game season and the League Cup idea mooted is a non-runner and there was a reduction in games, Division One could get by with 8 clubs playing each other 4 times. Would be a 28 game season, two less than the Premier of 30 games.

**Schumi** · 20/10/2010, 2:05 PM

7-8 months with no football?

**Mr A** · 20/10/2010, 2:08 PM

Originally Posted by Schumi

7-8 months with no football?

Sounds like a great idea. As a Harps fan I generally enjoy the close season a lot more than when there's actually football.

**hoops1** · 20/10/2010, 2:09 PM

Winter football! Jesus wept

**Dodge** · 20/10/2010, 2:14 PM

Originally Posted by Mr A

Sounds like a great idea. As a Harps fan I generally enjoy the close season a lot more than when there's actually football.

its the most hopeful part of the year. Unless your club is being carved up in court.

There'll be another short season. Like the July 02 to January 03 one to go from winter 01/02 to Summer 03

**Jicked** · 20/10/2010, 2:20 PM

Originally Posted by legendz

There is too much of a focus on league football. The FAI could be a bit inventive, creative while taking ideas from other tournaments and set-up the League Cup for Premier clubs only with 4 groups of 4 and the winner qualifying for Europe.

Football in this country did get inventive, we switched to summer soccer with good results, but now it seems there's a chance of being dragged back to winter football on the back of crazy arguments that there'd be an increase in attendance if we played more games in the p*ssing rain.

As for a League Cup, it's the better teams who make any cup interesting. Do you think Rovers/Bohs/Pats/Sligo/Whoever it may be will be arsed playing group stages and knock out rounds for a European place they'll probably have secured through league or FAI Cup football.

While the 16 Division team might have some merit to it, the idea of winter football is just crazy.

**Mr A** · 20/10/2010, 2:24 PM

You say Summer football had good results.. what were they exactly?

A small improvement in Euro performances was probably far more related to increased professionalism than summer football, and in any case a small advantage in Europe only helps a few clubs every year.

**Jicked** · 20/10/2010, 2:30 PM

A better standard of football, better facilities, better European results (which help the League in general, bringing in revenue, new fans and public interest/advertising, though you may think it just helps individual games). The league as a whole would suffer if we go back to getting hammered by teams from Latvia. Then there's increased media coverage; there's bugger all coverage of last night's semi-final on the news sites, whereas in the Summer LoI coverage was much bigger when column inches had to be filled. Instead we get a half dozen match reports from around Europe, Rooney-gate and the game not even on TV due to it clashing with a Champions League game. Again, this knocks the profile of the league, knocking advertisement in general.

Why exactly would you change back to winter football, apart from romantic ideas of games being better under the rain and lights? If Harps crowds are suffering, do you really think they'd be any better in November and January with the team struggling in the First Division? It's like the farcical argument from Sligo fans years ago that it was the harvest or some such thing that was keeping local farmers from going to games and so affecting their gates.

**osarusan** · 20/10/2010, 2:34 PM

Originally Posted by Jicked

better facilities

Where are the better facilities which are a result of the switch to summer football?

**Mr A** · 20/10/2010, 2:35 PM

Better football- very debatable.

Better facilities- totally unrelated. Pitches may be slightly better perhaps, but there is a problem of having little time to work on pitches while there is any growth.

Better Euro results- again debatable. And there is no evidence they help the league generally. If anything the tendency for clubs to chase Euro success has done damage. Would we suffer if our teams lost to Latvians? Maybe. I suspect not much though.

I do agree that if we're going to change it again that it should be properly researched and thought out, but your reasons for keeping the status quo are not convincing.