Two gone?

[pineapple stu]

Post on the Waterford forum here that they've signed Seán Finn and Willie Doyle. Now this would be a big blow. Finn I had thought would leave; Doyle I thought was confirmed to be staying on for another year, but he's from Gorey, which would make Waterford easier, I suppose. Still, we badly need a forward now if this is true!

[Bald Student]

Does anyone know the circumstances of their (alleged) leaving? I'd be very surprised if they were released by UCD.

Should I presume that we'll be in the high court twice more this winter?

[CollegeTillIDie]

Post on the Waterford forum here that they've signed Seán Finn and Willie Doyle. Now this would be a big blow. Finn I had thought would leave; Doyle I thought was confirmed to be staying on for another year, but he's from Gorey, which would make Waterford easier, I suppose. Still, we badly need a forward now if this is true!

Unless Doyle quit his course :eek: well His goals had dried up anyhow.
Amazed the Blues have money to pay him wages to be frank, they are burdened with a big debt and not winning the F.A.I. Cup didn't do that any favours; besides we have Paul Byrne 26 goals in the Under 21's and 3 goals in 75 minutes of first team action. We also have Robbie Martin and Podge who got 12 goals each last season. Plus the rest of the lads in midfield.
Who knows what Brian Gannon will be able to do among the big boys for example?

[pineapple stu]

Well, CTID said here (http://foot.ie/showthread.php?t=19665) that Doyle was likely under contract for next season; if that's true, then we get a transfer fee. Seán Finn has been with us two years and is 23 as far as I know, which means transfer fee. Wouldn't be to happy to see Doyle in particular leave - some of us aren't as fickle as CTID! More worried about the fact that they're gone to Waterford, though, 'cos they were very poor when we played them in 2003 (when they somehow thieved seven points off us), and they're a team we should definitely be looking to finish ahead of. This definitely won't help.

Nothing on the Waterford site or eleven-a-side yet, though radio confirmation appears fairly good.

I remember Sherro on the way back from Dundalk saying we've lost very few players we didn't want to lose (outside of players who've been with the club six or seven years and want the proverbial new challenge). He even included Cawley in that!

[pineapple stu]

Confirmation from eleven-a-side (http://www.eleven-a-side.com/ucd/irish_soccer_detail.asp?newsid=15175). Though apparently Seán Finn played only a peripheral role in our promotion challenge (this is Player of the Year Seán Finn we're talking about!).

The jinx of New Player of the Year strikes again! Not one of the winners (Kevin Grogan, Paul Doolin, Robbie Doyle, Mark Rooney, Willie Doyle) is still at the club! Only one Player of the Year winner remains (Micko - Bazza (x2), Clive and Seán are all gone).

This Paul Byrne lad better be good! :p

[joey B]

Do you think these players leaving will make it difficult for you to stay up?

[Roo69]

Do you think these players leaving will make it difficult for you to stay up?

Well from a Bray point of view and having seen them quite a lot over the past few years, with Hughes on the PFAI list and Sully roumered to have gone to Drogs i reckon if these 4 players have gone it will make it extremley tough for UCD to stay up next season, but it really depends on who they can bring in to replace these players - i dont think u21 players will surfice in the premier league, experience is needed big time

[joey B]

Surely they wont be able to bring the required standard of player with their budget limitations?

[Schumi]

Bóllocks anyway. I expected Finn to go (doubt we'll get a fee for him, wasn't he signed as an amateur this year?) but Doyle is a surprise. That said, it's been months since he scored. Byrne and Robbie Martin would be a decent strike force next year but we could have done with some depth. If Batman is gone, we'll be left a bit bare up front.

Do you think these players leaving will make it difficult for you to stay up?More difficult certainly but I'd still expect us to stay up.

[joey B]

Bóllocks anyway. I expected Finn to go (doubt we'll get a fee for him, wasn't he signed as an amateur this year?) but Doyle is a surprise. That said, it's been months since he scored. Byrne and Robbie Martin would be a decent strike force next year but we could have done with some depth. If Batman is gone, we'll be left a bit bare up front.
More difficult certainly but I'd still expect us to stay up.
Stay up ahead of who?

[pineapple stu]

I don't think u21 players will suffice in the premier league, experience is needed big time

I disagree. This isn't the first time has happened to us, and we always pull through. Our U-21s are national champions, don't forget, so there are some decent players there. Paul Byrne, for one, scored 26 goals despite not joining until after the first four games. Even scored five in one match! A lot of the team have first-team experience - Brian Gannon, Declan O'Brien, Damien Kelly, Gary Dicker, Neil Gallagher. And bear in mind that in the last couple of years, we've uncovered Kevin Grogan, Robbie Doyle, Willie Doyle, Seán Finn, Conor Kenna and others. I'd be fairly confident that we'll sign at least two players who could head straight into the first team.


Surely they wont be able to bring the required standard of player with their budget limitations?

We don't go for big transfer fees, don't forget. We also sign younger players who'd settle for smaller wages, and we pay their college fees, which would mean we could reduce their wages a bit more in return. Our youth scouting network seems to be the best in the country (look what it brought in last season!) and will find the players we need.

[Schumi]

Stay up ahead of who? Two from Bray, Harps, Waterford, Pats and Rovers.

[Cosmo]

Is finn the bloke that scored against cork in the cup? :confused:

[Schumi]

That's him, yeah.

[pineapple stu]

Stay up ahead of who?

Bray for one. Either Rovers or Pat's. Either Harps or Derry. Never rated Waterford from 2003 - don't see why we can't finish ahead of them.

Note to all - This should all be preceeded by "I hope" so no bitching if your team name is in there!!

After Pete Mahon took over in 2003, we were fourth in a form table over 16 games. We've strengthened the team a lot since then. Most of the players have Premier experience, which you can't say about Harps and, to a lesser extent, Bray. We didn't lose in 90 minutes in six Cup games against Premier Division oposition last year. I'm still fairly happy with my bet that we'll finish seventh or higher.

[Cosmo]

Thought he was alright

[Schumi]

Thought he was alright
:confused: He was, that's why Waterford have signed him.

[Cosmo]

You've lost a couple of good players now - it'll be hard to see ye finish anywhere bar the bottom 2

[pineapple stu]

Incidentally, is this the first time Waterford have signed anyone off us (bar, I think, Robbie Griffin the first time)? Whatever about the two of them leaving, Waterford just seems very strange! If they were in Europe, I could understand it, but realistically, we're going to be about the same this season I'd say. Seems like a sideways move, unless the two were released.

[pineapple stu]

You've lost a couple of good players now - it'll be hard to see ye finish anywhere bar the bottom 2

Haven't signed anyone yet - guaranteed one or two quality players no-one's ever heard of. Far too soon to write us off. Willie Doyle missed that open goal against youz in the Cup game, and I think Seán Finn was injured. Yet we still managed to draw both games.

[Schumi]

Incidentally, is this the first time Waterford have signed anyone off us (bar, I think, Robbie Griffin the first time)? Whatever about the two of them leaving, Waterford just seems very strange! If they were in Europe, I could understand it, but realistically, we're going to be about the same this season I'd say. Seems like a sideways move, unless the two were released.
€€€€ I'd assume.

[joey B]

Two from Bray, Harps, Waterford, Pats and Rovers.
Dont forget the muckers :p

[pineapple stu]

€€€€ I'd assume.

You're not putting any stock into CTID's post about Waterford not having any money then?

One of the factors in Doyle moving to UCD from Bohs last year was, incidentally, the fact that we were offering more than Bohs! (First-team rate v. U-21 rate)

Anyhoo, I e-mailed his mum about it before I saw the press release, so will let youz know what, if anything, comes back!

[Schumi]

You're not putting any stock into CTID's post about Waterford not having any money then?
I'm sure they still pay wages.

[Cosmo]

'Far too soon to write us off'

Fair enough point - only saw you 3 times last season (all in the cup though) and was very impressed with ye for a 1st division side and i reckon you mightve held your own last season in the El premier, just- (especially against Cork -said afterwards that you'd be the one team I wouldnt like to meet in the next round).

However, this seasons EL premier will be alot stronger and tougher than last season. The majority of teams seem to have or will strengthen their squads - coincide that with you losing key players it looks tough from here - thats all im saying.

[Roo69]

I disagree. This isn't the first time has happened to us, and we always pull through. Our U-21s are national champions, don't forget, so there are some decent players there. Paul Byrne, for one, scored 26 goals despite not joining until after the first four games. Even scored five in one match! A lot of the team have first-team experience - Brian Gannon, Declan O'Brien, Damien Kelly, Gary Dicker, Neil Gallagher. And bear in mind that in the last couple of years, we've uncovered Kevin Grogan, Robbie Doyle, Willie Doyle, Seán Finn, Conor Kenna and others. I'd be fairly confident that we'll sign at least two players who could head straight into the first team.


I think we'll have to agree to disagree on this one. Have seen you 21's a few times this season as well Vs. Bray21's and on each occasion without winning any of the matches Bray were by far the much better side, you are right, your 21's do have some good players but at the moment they are not premier league class, just as i would say the same with our 21's.

[pineapple stu]

However, this seasons EL premier will be alot stronger and tougher than last season. The majority of teams seem to have or will strengthen their squads - coincide that with you losing key players it looks tough from here - that's all im saying.

It's going to be harder, definitely. But especially with the 12-team Premier and only one automatic spot, we should be OK. Add in various clubs' money problems and bottom two seems a bit pessimistic. But then I would say that, wouldn't I? :)

By the way, youz ever hear any more about that Pat Sullivan rumour?



your 21's do have some good players but at the moment they are not premier league class

Watch out for Paul Byrne (three goals in 75 minutes for the first team) and Brian Gannon (had that run from the half-way line to the six-yard box, skinning three or four of your players, on the opening day before getting into a row with Maurice Farrell). Byrne can replace Doyle, Gannon/Sully can replace Finn. Back to where we started. Hopefully!

[Schumi]

A year ago, Willie Doyle was an under 21 player for Bohs.

[pineapple stu]

I think Seán Finn was injured.

I tell a lie. Finn played both Cup games.

Wonder if this has anything to do with Finn being dropped for the last round of games (since Kildare?) Did the same with Robbie Doyle in 2003.

[ilovejam]

doyle has definately definately gone. got an offer to big to turn down after ucd couldnt offer what he thought he deserved...Byrne will be the new fan favourite!! after all he's the only one that celebrates with the fans when he scores... hostile reception for judas doyle i reckon he should take what he's given the hungry savage

[Roo69]

doyle has definately definately gone. got an offer to big to turn down after ucd couldnt offer what he thought he deserved...Byrne will be the new fan favourite!! after all he's the only one that celebrates with the fans when he scores... hostile reception for judas doyle i reckon he should take what he's given the hungry savage

In fairness, he was only signed on a 1 year deal and UCD would probably ot be in the premier today if he had not scored 16 league goals !

[pineapple stu]

15 goals, but the rest is true. Also, he did give thank us at the end of the Kilkenny game. But we move on. Byrne is on an average of 3.6 goals per game at the moment. If he can keep that up... :)

[Roo69]

15 goals, but the rest is true. Also, he did give thank us at the end of the Kilkenny game. But we move on. Byrne is on an average of 3.6 goals per game at the moment. If he can keep that up... :)

I take it this Link (http://www.irishfootballonline.com/scorers.php?division=Division%201) is wrong then ? Was a great move by UCD to bring him in but in the true fashion of the eircom League players have more clubs than clean jocks ! Looking forward to seeing yer man Byrne now after all this hype !

[Schumi]

hostile reception for judas doyle i reckon he should take what he's given the hungry savage
Monopoly money for the first Waterford game anyone? :D

[pineapple stu]

I take it this Link (http://www.irishfootballonline.com/scorers.php?division=Division%201) is wrong then?

It is, yeah. There were all sorts of quare goings-on with his goals - the media gave him a goal in Limerick which wasn't his at all, and gave Micko (Mick O'Donnell) a goal in Dundalk which was Doyle's. Think the programme counted accurately (though, to be honest, I would trust us!), and we ended up with 15. Which still broke our record... Last July, we were wondering if he'd make our top ten scorers of all time list by the end of the season! And now he'll be stuck 8 off it for ever and ever! Unless he comes back!

[pineapple stu]

Extract from to-day's Star:

WATERFORD EYE UCD DUE

Both players are out of contact and won't command a fee if they do move to the RSC. College supremo Pete Mahon is keen to keep Finn and Doyle, but knows he can't offer the same money that Waterford can.



If Finn doesn't command a fee, that can only mean we've let him go surely?

[Schumi]

If Finn doesn't command a fee, that can only mean we've let him go surely?
Amateur contract would mean that he doesn't command a fee wouldn't it?

[pineapple stu]

Feck. Hadn't thought of that. Probably means there was never a contract at all.

[Bald Student]

...in the last couple of years, we've uncovered Kevin Grogan...

To be fair, we signed him from Manchester United.

[pineapple stu]

Ssssssssshhhhhhhh!!!!! :p

We gave him his chance, is what I meant. Doyle was at Bohs, Kenna and Gannon at Shels, but we gave them their breakthrough.

And no "To be fair"ing on this board! :D

[CollegeTillIDie]

Well, CTID said here (http://foot.ie/showthread.php?t=19665) that Doyle was likely under contract for next season; if that's true, then we get a transfer fee. Seán Finn has been with us two years and is 23 as far as I know, which means transfer fee. Wouldn't be to happy to see Doyle in particular leave - some of us aren't as fickle as CTID!

Who're you calling fickle? 24 years supporting the same team counts for nothing does it? :mad:

After a while you get used to players moving on. Willie Doyle is from Gorey, Wateford United are his local EL side in a manner of speaking. We have no money so it looks like the Blues are speculating that Darryl Murphy will be off to Ipswich and that they have Doyle in mind as a replacement.

I even bought his bloody key ring :mad:

Finn signed as an amateur and good luck to him if he is moving on.

[jagman]

no offence but a couple of hundred fans isnt going to make for much of a hostile reception for doyle and why wouldnt he move,
put yourself in his shoes, young lad, more money, closer to home, the list goes on...
if any of you can say you wouldnt move then your lying.
as for judas, he gave 100% for ucd and was made a better offer by a stable prem div club, if anyone here was offered a more suitable job and more money would you turn it down, i dont think so

[CollegeTillIDie]

Waterford United ... STABLE? Don't make me laugh...

The Blues are my second favourite team but I would never describe a club that squandered a £400,000 windfall in 1998/99 from the Share issue as being stable. They are heavily in debt at present which is why I am surprised they are making offers for anyone.

We are one the most stable clubs in the entire League from a financial standpoint.

[Dillo]

Ssssssssshhhhhhhh!!!!! :p

We gave him his chance, is what I meant. Doyle was at Bohs, Kenna and Gannon at Shels, but we gave them their breakthrough.

And no "To be fair"ing on this board! :D

Gannon was at Bohs. Was Bohs 21s player of the year 2 years ago.

[Dillo]

One of the factors in Doyle moving to UCD from Bohs last year was, incidentally, the fact that we were offering more than Bohs! (First-team rate v. U-21 rate)
!

Might be the fact that Bohs wouldn't offer him as much because two centre backs got more goals than him in the 21s :p

Hard legislate for that at any standard. Remember the same fella had barely scratched his john thomas on the bench for Bohs 1st team when he did an article in the S*N dressed in his school uniform. :confused: :D

[pineapple stu]

Who're you calling fickle? 24 years supporting the same team counts for nothing does it? :mad:

Relax!! Jayz, didn't think I needed to put a smiley after that! :)



After a while you get used to players moving on. Willie Doyle is from Gorey, Wateford United are his local EL side in a manner of speaking.
Exactly what I said...relax! :)


as for judas
jagman, a "judas" is just anyone who leaves UCD. There are good Judases (Barry Ryan, Clive Delaney, Willie Doyle, etc.) and bad Judases (Paul Doolin). Most of us are used to players moving on and just look forward to seeing who the next player we uncover is. Your point about the small number of fans is obvious; we try to give former players a bit of stick on the pitch if we can, but will give them a clap when they're being subbed off or will always welcome them back. The way it should be, I suppose.


Gannon was at Bohs.

Doh! Out UCD-ed by a Longford fan! I stand corrected, and not for the first time on this thread! :o

Interesting about Doyle's scoring rate at Bohs. Don't think too many Bohs fans were too upset about losing him when we signed him. Probably aren't too worried now either, I suppose.

Interesting that this thread is now far longer than the one when Doolin left, than any anti-UCD threads and is approaching the length of the record thread, the Cawley one, which dragged on for ages! Bloody close-season is far too quiet! :mad:

[Aberdonian Stu]

Bazza's a bad judas, on the grounds that he's a git!

[Partizan]

Waterford United ... STABLE? Don't make me laugh...

The Blues are my second favourite team but I would never describe a club that squandered a £400,000 windfall in 1998/99 from the Share issue as being stable. They are heavily in debt at present which is why I am surprised they are making offers for anyone.

We are one the most stable clubs in the entire League from a financial standpoint.

College TID, I think that you will find otherwise.

At Waterford's last AGM in October, the Club reported to its shareholders that its debt is now down to €30,000 ( from + €700k in 2000). The previous incumbents left the Club in such a mess that when our current chairman came in that summer people thought he should be carted off to the local lunatic asylum. No businessman in the South East were prepared to touch Waterford with a 40ft barge pole.

In short WUFC nearly went bust in June 2000 with a massive 6 figure debt but our Chairman (I dont like the guy what he did to Jimmy McGeough) steadied the ship and we now have one of the best run clubs administratively in the League. Our finances are very tight but we are sure that the mistakes of the past will never be repeated again.

[pineapple stu]

Bazza's a bad judas, on the grounds that he's a git!

Boo!

Bazza's a legend; always will be.


The previous incumbents left the Club in such a mess

Was that John Delaney did that?

What's this announcement, by the way?!?!?!?! You can't just leave it like that! :p

[Partizan]

What's this announcement, by the way?!?!?!?! You can't just leave it like that! :p

I'm off to beat the living sh1t out of me underpants and resolve to find every single one of ye a job :D